My interview exp at DragonAir

[Turkpilot]

Background, from USA. 7700 TT 7400 PIC of which over 5000 PIC turbine. Current B737NG in China last 5 years. 8 type ratings.

Met with 2 woman from HR. I wore what i considered a very nice looking suit. However it wasn't the standard navy blue, white shirt, red tie....

Walked into the conference room, they sat across from me with a small table separating us. I have to say the atmosphere was a bit cold and felt a little bit artificial.

1. Tell us about yourself.
2. When did you know you want to be a pilot
3. How did you fund your training. Why 2 different schools?
While being asked these things the other lady is going through my logbooks (i brought 3 which go back 17 years, i lost the first one during a move)

From her body language i knew something was amiss. She asks me back in 2004 how i was able to fly all these different planes (hawker, King Air, Cessna 172, Great Lakes, etc) while working for someone.

I explained to her (i used to fly bizjets) that when the owner didn't have a trip (they were ALWAYS scheduled WEEKS in advance) we were allowed to do contract. Either she thought i was lying or just couldnt wrap her head around the idea that pilots in america can fly MANY types when and how they wish.

For example the 737 rating. In USA it covers the 100 all the way to the 900. So legally i could fly a 200, and go hop into an NG the next day without any more training and fly it.

Then she asks me how i did my line training on the BBJ. I explained to her there WAS none. Its a part 91 ac, you hop in and go. There is no line training.

4. Have you applied anywhere else? Yes i was honest

5. What BAD things did you hear about DragonAir? I told them i heard they dont like to hire americans. And with 500 pilots and ONLY TWO yanks i guess thats true.

6. She asked me about my college degree, why am i doing it? I said its a goal of mine (doing online now)

7. Asked me what i knew about Dragon.

8. Asked me how i would feel being an FO for possibly a long time after having been a Captain for such a long time. I said no problem. And thats the truth.

9. Asked alot about my wife (she is chinese)

10. Finally asked me what would i do if i was unsuccesful today. Actually i thought that was a very weird question. What am i supposed to say? Ill kill myself???? I said ill just continue to move forward.

I came out of there feeling like they didn't really want me there. Didn't feel warm fuzzies at all and i am a VERY nice guy and get along with everyone.

Less than 24 hours later got the TBNT letter. So i was right. And if your wondering yes i do know a current pilot there (not from the states)

So who knows, i hate wondering why i didnt get a job. But this was my experience.

[swh]

Don't think KA give a toss what travel document their crew hold.

Don't know you from a bar of soap, however in your post you have referred to yourself 50 times. Might be a red flag for a position where teamwork is required.

[Defered item]

Dude this is life, hiring processes are not 100% fair.
Hope you get something good.:ok:

[Yeager]

Yeah a "wrong" match is often meant to be - just that - a wrong match. Most likely you're better of somewhere else in that case - it's a two way street after all. You don't "have" to have done anything "wrong" at all - I wouldn't speculate about that. If not fitting into one place - you'll fit in somewhere else.

Best of luck with the path. :ok:

[boocs]

That's a real shame. I'm guessing you know that KA are going on a huge pilot expansion phase at the moment & are screaming for pilots. And across the road our "Brothers" are screaming even louder!

As mentioned above interviews can be extremely unforgiving in that whenever you thought Candidate A was a sure thing , he/she missed out and then Joe "no idea" bloggs got in , sometimes we question why oh why!!

If you are keen, and I mean really keen - apply again! They can only say No.(And then keep applying!! It has helped candidates in the past) Perhaps this may have been an answer they were looking for to their question. Regardless, good luck.

b.

[bringbackthe80s]

Thanks for your feedback and good luck with all!

On a separate note, don't mean it directly to you Turkpilot, why do I often hear/read that it is no problem going back to the right hand seat...if I'm honest that would be a BIG problem and would definetly not take a right hand seat job unless I really really had to..am I missing something??

[Basil]

I wouldn't worry about it.
Recollect being interviewed for a VVIP B757. I was current on type with a respected major.
The sim check was in a B737; twitchy little b'staad cf the B757 and I was not at all happy with my flying.
Interview went OK (for some reason I seem to interview well :confused:) right up to the end when the man bowled a googly clearly, with hindsight, intended to needle me. I fell for it :(

I received the standard GTF and went to Cathay instead.

I think they were perfectly right to see how I'd react to a wind up. They needed to know how I'd react to a powerful but irritating passenger.

[Basil]

would definetly not take a right hand seat job
I did for a few years when I was over sixty.
Pretty much like being in the RHS first time around except that there are fewer occasions when you ask yourself "Is there something wrong with me, or is it him?" ;)

[Turkpilot]

Thanks for the replies guys. SWH, i have heard from numerous people that KA is very anglo saxon oriented and does not like to hire us yanks. BTW folks the reason my name is turkpilot is only because i was living in Turkey for a few years when i joined pprune. I have no turkish features at all! (:

My purpose of posting my interview experience was simply to let others know in case they have one in the future. SWH, i wrote this in first person view and didn't see where i reffered to myself FIFTY times.

Having flown in China last 5 years trust me i KNOW about teamwork/CRM and did not come across as one from the entitlement generation when i did my interview but was as humble as possible.

Some people say i am better off since it would have been a pay cut, dealing with very demanding training, and long upgrade possibly. Plus i am a Captain now why go back to FO.

They actually asked me that question at the interview, my response was if i went to UAL, DAL, AAL i would start as FO regardless of my level of exp.

Anyway, does anyone know if KA would consider doing another interview? To be quite honest maybe i was TOO honest about whom i applied, and those sorts of things. I just do not know what on earth they are looking for?

[Gnadenburg]

dealing with very demanding training

Standards are similar to other airlines with strengths and weaknesses in different areas.

Of course, how you play the game will be different to other airlines and that's what you need to pick up on pretty quick.

HR has complicated airlines recruiting. KA needs experienced bums in seats to counter the pig in the python problem of excessive MPL & Cadet recruitment a few years back.

If I were Chief Pilot:

SIM ride with a briefing! Can he fly? Does he improve?

Interview questions based around aviation general knowledge as FCOM only educated pilots have gaping holes in their knowledge base and don't have a continual thirst for aviation knowledge .

Would you go sick on Christmas or a Red Eye to Korea? See if you're an asshole to those around you and create an expectation of some unwritten rules of conduct.

Drinks? IS the guy normal.

Welcome to Dragonair!

[swh]

Turkpilot,

I think your are trying to deflect blame to suggest that they don't hire North Americans, history has shown they do. The relative number would be more to do with the low percentage that apply, rather than any perceived bias. Your nationality and travel document would have no bearing on the application.

The KA interview is what is known as a "behavioral", in short I think you talked yourself out of a job. Pilots are some of the worst people in interviews, and very few of them get interview technique preparation. When it comes to talking about themselves, they are very good at digging holes.

Your first post made 50 references to yourself, and this most recent one 25, I have a simple bit of software that does statistical word counting on me, myself, my, I etc. If I were to "cast" you as a pilot based upon your posts alone, you would be the single seat fighter type, rather than then multi-crew transport type.

The other answer which does not fit is to the question if you were unsuccessful, what you would do. A pilot with your bucket of experience should be very competitive for similar position in North America with a job that has better benefits, closer to your home, and a better lifestyle. What is it about your application that is selling yourself short of those opportunities ?

[Turkpilot]

I agree with you 100 percent Gnadenburg

[Turkpilot]

SWH,

ironically thats what i wanted to do, fly fighters. The L39 and lots of acro experience in other AC is about the extent of coming anywhere near fighters. But yes, in some regards thats spot on.

Having said that, they are interviewing me, and we are discussing me at the interview so how else does one talk about ones self if they cannot use I or any other references to themself?

Its not like this is the first time i ever did an interview, and i have normally been very successful at past ones.

IMHO it should be PILOTS interviewing PILOTS for a flying job. Not some lady from HR whose never even heard of the book Stick and Rudder....

Aside from that, yes i would LOVE to get a job back home. I am one year out from finishing my BS degree and i hope thats the only thing holding me up

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Your first post made 50 references to yourself, and this most recent one 25, I have a simple bit of software that does statistical word counting on me, myself, my, I etc. If I were to "cast" you as a pilot based upon your posts alone, you would be the single seat fighter type, rather than then multi-crew transport type.



A post, about a particular subject or subject's experience, will generally refer to the subject. If a post is about an individual or their experience I'd expect the individual to be mentioned.

Interestingly in your last post about Turkpilot you refer to yourself 4 times.

[nike]

Download Frozen

[Turkpilot]

Thanks CR, one interesting thing i was told. Apparently they have an A, B and C scale. There are a few guys still on the A scale and are making 500,000 HKD per month? That is a ridiculous amount of money if true. Man did they strike it rich!

Well, i do hate failing interviews. Its one thing to fail in the sim, or written test, oral exam, atleast there you KNOW why. But to come in with what i thought was a good amount of experience and not even make it past the first part!!!!

I wish i was a fly on the wall in that room after i left. Maybe they thought i would get the type rating and leave? Afterall i do have 8 types, maybe they thought i was a collector! But i have never screwed anyone over. I stick to my contract.

Speaking of which they asked about that too. i told them if i gave less than 90 days then i would need to pay 6000 USD and that i would. Whats fair is fair. They seemed a bit shocked about that. Don't know why.

Well i am still curious, do they let people re interview there?

[Turkpilot]

Download Frozen??

[spleener]

Quote " I am one year out from finishing my BS degree and i hope thats the only thing holding me up "
Well said.

[de facto]

A little fly tells me SWH is spot on.

[Turkpilot]

Ok, would you please care to elaborate? If you don't feel comfortable you can tell me via PM thats fine. thx!

[Yonosoy Marinero]

I told them i heard they dont like to hire brash, obnoxious americans.

Fixed that for you...
:}

[Turkpilot]

No, you put your own spin on it. So i take it your anti american huh?

[Yonosoy Marinero]

*you're

How's that degree going?

[Turkpilot]

Thank you spelling police. It's going fine, why do you ask? 3.7 GPA so far

[WallyBallbearing]

Turk.

Don't worry about it bro. "You's pay's your money and take's your chances" (hows that for SPEAAALLLing?).

Interviews nowdays are so focused on trying to make you doubt yourself and step on your own #$%^ that I think they miss the mark in actually looking at your experince and background (ie. the CV)


I would take some time and think about how you would answered the interview questions differently. You might not have changed anything in retrospect or you might see where you might have played the game a bit better.

And for Chissake, dont listen to people busting your hump about how many times you've refered to yourself in your post, and then tell you that YOU'VE got a problem, ("Be a single seat fighter jock") whaaa?

Boy's and Girl's, please tone down on the Anti American thing. I'm lucky to have flown with many Nationalities, lots of great hands, feet and minds. Not once have I ever felt uneasy about taking my rest in the bunk with an American Pilot upfront. Experinced, practical and mature in their profession for the most part.

Turk. You not only could probably teach this lot a thing or two about flying but maybe manners as well.

I'm not on PPRUNE much anymore (without a rumsicle or two in me) but I couldnt resist responding to this post.

Good Luck Turk!

[Turkpilot]

Thanks a lot Wally. Yea, i have been thinking about this daily as to how i could have answered, well lets just say more appropriately to ease their minds. When they asked them what negative things did i hear, i should have never told them what i actually heard. Guess i was just too honest.

I have been fortunate enough to fly with all types of people from many diff cultures and so forth. I can understand the anti american sentiment sometimes, but as a whole i don't think that outside of Canadians that you will find a group that is more practical and relaxed. Then again, i have also seen some that are not so i guess it really depends on the person...

From what i was told from current employees at Dragon that the training and checking as well as what they want you to know is quite a lot. Whether that is good or bad is open for dispute, but i do not think i would want most of my flights to feel like i have to be under the gun and have an oral on each one.

Maybe things did work out for the best, who knows. Anyway hopefully others can better prepare then i did if they do get a chance to interview there.

Thanks Again Wally

[Turkpilot]

CR, appreciate your optimism. I just hate failure. Was thinking of calling them to ask how i could have done better but doubtful they will give out that info.

[Lowkoon]

As for "have an oral on each one", that was Cathay, not Dragon! :}

[PoppaJo]

There used to be quite a few Americans and a tonne of Aussies at KA, they all started leaving 2007/8 when all the LCC's needed experienced pilots for their Aussie and Singapore operations.

Interesting no Pilot was in the interview. I did the same interview 10 years ago and was interviewed by 1xHr and two senior Expat Pilots.

Don't take it too seriously, a few others who had 5x the stick time as I did also applied any had no luck. Needless to say I saw some strange things whilst working in China.

[Turkpilot]

Where did you work in China? Yea I've seen a lot of crazy stuff here. Yea just 2 HR woman. No pilots. I would have felt MUCH more comfortable with a pilot in the loop.

Wonder if I should call them to see if they will tell me what I did or said wrong.

[Stone_cold]

Turk , let it go . Most companies do not provide any interview feedback especial
y on this side of the Pacific ! Just move on like many have suggested . S..t happens .

[rodney rude]

Hi Turk

I havent read all the way thru these posts yet - but, here is something to consider. I lost my job 6 months ago and have done a number of behavioral interviews since. For all these interviews I have done enormous preparation. In a very competitive market, I have been just that, very competitive. My interview prep involved 6 or so hours a day, for up to a month, looking at very good youtube clips about behavioral interviews (highly recommended), practicing answers, even paying for an online interview prep course.

Now to get to my point. Clearly THE most important thing I learned relates to this earlier quote from you.

"Having said that, they are interviewing me, and we are discussing me at the interview so how else does one talk about ones self if they cannot use I or any other references to themself?"

In fact, it IS NOT about you. The interview, from their perspective, is all about THEM. You will find a multitude of these interview gurus online telling you this. KA or anyone else is not hiring you for YOUR benefit, it is for their's. And that is why your answers must all be about THEM, how THEY will benefit from giving you the nod.

You are a salesman selling yourself. A car salesman sells a car. As a seller, the car salesman doesn't give a fig about what the car does for you, he cares about himself, his bonus for instance. But he must convince YOU why the car is good for YOU. And as a buyer (ie KA) you dont give a fig about his bonus, all you care about is why the car will be best for you as the buyer. So think of this - if you asked the salesman why should I buy your product, if he said because I will get a bonus, win emloyee of the month and win a free trip to Ugadoogoo - what do you care. You want a good car. What do you care about him??

Likewise, when KA, as the buyer, asks you why they should buy your product (ie you), Think like a car salesman, tell them why its good for THEM. When they ask, so why this job? They do not give a rats about "oh its good financially, lifestyle seems great, my friends are happy there, good benefits." No, you wouldnt buy from a car salesman if you asked why buy from him if he prattled on about why its good for him.

Tell them, when they ask, "so why this job?" - "well, I believe this company is moving forward in the right direction, and I believe the experience and skillset I can bring to you can contribute to the company's future success. In looking at where the company operates, and the type of personnel working hard to achive success in these areas, I believe I am a good fit for KA and its operations. And if I'm a good fit for you, and can rapidly build on what I can bring to this operation, then I believe its a mutually win win situation for both KA and myself."

Sorry about the long ramble - But youtube is your friend, never do an interview without a youtube search of behavioral interviews.

ITS NEVER ABOUT YOU !!!

[rodney rude]

And while I'm on the subject of how HR has screwed the world over with their f...cked up views on recruting - next time I do an interview for a job I am not really interested in, I swear, when they ask

"so Rod, what would you say is your biggest weakness?"

I'm gunna reply
"Well I think I masturbate too much."

And then when they ask
"so what would you say your biggest strength is, I'm gunna answer

"I can masturbate 15 times a day."

Yep, that'll work.

[Hugo Peroni the IV]

Wow, a real wan***.....you'd be perfect in CX!

[haejangkuk]

Wow, this bunch must be the cream of the lot! They cream much.:ok:

[Turkpilot]

Thanks Rodney, ill def brush up on my interview skills.