View Full Version : Where do the EK pilots leave for a job
JammedStab
16th Feb 2015, 17:16
Aside from American pilots that obviously have some good options, where are pilots typically leaving EK for in terms of captains and FO's. CX only hires cadets, Can't stay in the gulf, European majors not hiring. China quite risky and polluted., Koreans kind of nasty. Not much in Australia.....
HVYMETAL
16th Feb 2015, 18:01
I would imagine mostly China, Vietnam, or Korea? They definitely fly aircraft whose type ratings are highly desirable. Pollution in China is bad, but remember a lot of these place have commutable contracts and are very flexible with schedules. The ME is not.
fatbus
16th Feb 2015, 18:14
Are the US carries hiring at this moment? If so how many US pilots have left EK for US legacy carries? Not how many are planning on going. But how many have left and are now with US legacy airlines, let's say in the last 12 months.
de facto
16th Feb 2015, 20:51
China for sure...
Wh1sper
16th Feb 2015, 22:43
BA is hiring. 777, 787 etc etc.
Turkish hiring, 777.
Emma Royds
16th Feb 2015, 23:36
There is a wide mix. Some go to another wide body job and then you have those that go back to a narrow body type and a few go to corporate.
kungfu panda
17th Feb 2015, 01:09
The only reason I can see that more have not left for China is due to interview or medical failures because if you are selected for pretty much any Chinese job it is clearly many fold better than working for this mob.
Fatigue is considered a serious issue in China and it will be rare that you have less than 3 days off per week and normally contracts will give a block of days off as well, leave will be correctly honoured. A typical contract will pay 18k USD and that would be a flat rate up to about 78 hours flying. Cost of living and accommodation is not more than about 50% of costs in Dubai. Education is expensive in China but Hainan for example will meet those costs, other Airlines won't. On balance however for Captains aged 52 or below China is the place to be, not the UAE or Qatar.
Kapitanleutnant
17th Feb 2015, 07:45
Ethiopian Airlines as well….
120 days vacation per year!! 25 on/12 off, 3 times what ME carriers give. And you don't live in Addis, you commute home with a hotel stay while on a day off at base…. ala KAL. Guaranteed biz class upgradeable to first home each 12 days off. Some Asian carriers don't offer that arrangement.
K
Emma Royds
17th Feb 2015, 09:29
Guaranteed biz class upgradeable to first home each 12 days off.
ET dont have First on their aircraft. Hope it's not Economy upgradable to Business! :eek:
fatbus
17th Feb 2015, 10:53
What's the pay? Are travel to and from on your 12 days off or 25 work day including rest.
I was surprised to see EK guys looking at Saudia :) That is such a situation reversal from 10 years ago that someone in EK should hang their heads in shame !
Airmann
17th Feb 2015, 17:11
Believe it or not the cultural differences are far greater in China than the UAE. So you may be flying around the world but your wife and kids have to be in China which is a much bigger cultural shock than the Gulf. Except for Shanghai and Beijing the other metropolisis in China are not expat friendly.
As a result people leave their wife and kids at home, hence the desire for commuting contracts, but communiting is a whole other ball game and many would prefer to have their families with them which is ultimately much much easier in the Gulf than it is in China.
P.S. I am not Emirates management. Just being real here. I know that pilots are being treated like muck out here but China throws up a whole set of other issues.
Payscale
17th Feb 2015, 19:12
This is just another bla bla BS for fact thread.
Luke SkyToddler
18th Feb 2015, 00:29
Here in Vietnam we've interviewed a number of EK pilots in recent weeks, captains and FO's, including at least one A380 skipper applying for an A330 position.
We've always had a steady flow of QR guys but the numbers leaving EK and the-other-one is really noticeable the last 6 months.
The Dominican
18th Feb 2015, 02:00
As a result people leave their wife and kids at home, hence the desire for commuting contracts, but communiting is a whole other ball game and many would prefer to have their families with them which is ultimately much much easier in the Gulf than it is in China
I've been on a commuting contract for the past 8 years and I'm looking at staying with this arrangement for the long haul..., it has turned out to be pretty easy actually, guaranteed business class commute and 14 days in a row (12-13 at home) get to keep the miles and use them on vacations etc...! Not as bad as it may sound.
Where about are you at Dom? Asia or the gulf?
Kapitanleutnant
18th Feb 2015, 03:41
Well, according to the advert from FCI, Ethiopian does seem to have First class. Just passing along what it says...
B777 Captains - Great Pay! Commuting Roster! with Flight Crew International (FCI) | 1401411741 (http://jobs.flightglobal.com/job/1401411741/b777-captains-great-pay-commuting-roster-/)
The Dominican
18th Feb 2015, 04:48
@22K...., Japan
AJX on the contract with the ANA group
Ah great,
Sounds like it must be ok if you've been there for 8 years.
Def sounds like a better option that the middle east.
The Dominican
18th Feb 2015, 11:37
It has it's issues that are annoying like everywhere else of course.., but thus far the issues want to make you shake your head, not start filling out resumes:ugh:
It's sad that things at EK have gone the way they have..., the place has such potential to be a great place to work at.., it seems that all it would take is a change of attitude towards the employees..., sad really!
falconeasydriver
18th Feb 2015, 12:00
it seems that all it would take is a change of attitude towards the employees..., sad really!
Which will never happen with the present friend of the friend of the cousin of the friend.
nolimitholdem
18th Feb 2015, 15:48
Not all that are leaving are even going to flying jobs. There are more than one or two that are retiring from aviation, but not from working life. It always pays to keep your interests diversified and options open.
Also two FO's (that I know of) that quit with nothing to go back to. Anecdotal, yes, but was interesting to me that NO job was preferable to staying. Of course, most don't have that option, with family/kids/mortgage, (which EK exploits), hence probably why - presumably - younger joiners.
Machspeed
24th Feb 2015, 21:39
Two FOs I know left for Regionals on RJs back in the US. Not just several but many guys are leaving going back to Europe to the lost costs there. Better pay and pick of base back at RyanAir than when they left. One guy just left two days ago. He's very excited.
Guys from southern and eastern half of the EU can go to Turkish and are leaving for there in high numbers. Half of the guys I know are or have interviews there. Turkish has 21on /10 off but the 777 is mostly all ULR there and they get 3-4 days off between. Commute home two hours and treat it like a commuting job at AA in the US. We're looking at that too. Live in Italy and commute the 21 on. Oh, for 78hrs and same pay as EK. I'll take it.
90 hrs a month is wearing us out.
Payscale
25th Feb 2015, 10:43
Machspeed...
Half the guys you know have interview in THY? How many guys do you know?
Please elaborate on "the same salary as EK"?
halas
25th Feb 2015, 11:46
"He's very excited."
Am sure he was when he came here too.
"Not just several but many..."
What does that mean?
halas
fatbus
25th Feb 2015, 13:09
Not including cadets joining but someone that joined last July has moved up @70 numbers
Eau de Boeing
25th Feb 2015, 13:29
So I'll start off:-
reasons why working for McDonalds is better than Emirates?
1) You get all your leave each year
2) You get awards,recognition and training that actually means something
3) There's no McDonalds in (choose your favourite).....
4) You only work for one clown
Any more?
OnceBitten
25th Feb 2015, 13:50
The food is better................ :E
Sorry, even I don't believe that! :p
Payscale
25th Feb 2015, 14:05
Eau de Boeing....
Seriously dude....!!???
Good luck with your new job.
Machspeed
27th Feb 2015, 09:08
Payscale it's in their ads. Apples to apples if you were doing 90+ hrs there you would make more money. Now I'm sure I'm going to get those guys that say what about housing, what about provident, what about, what about, what about.... Being home, which is achievable at THY, is intangible if you live in Europe. It's all about what make your QoL what you want it to be.
As far as Half the guys I know. These are Capts, EU even Americans that are or have interviewed. Three I know are leaving in March for THY and two have interviews in March, four had interviews in Feb. (is that enough for ya)
It's very interesting here (pprune) how people whine and complain and even makes statements about policies that effect them. However, some of what is said are rumors only and not Fact. But when someone says "half of the guys", that is what is "checked".
Now I know why I only visit forum once every 6 months or so.
LowPassGliderA330
2nd Mar 2015, 02:29
I went to a european LCC. Very happy with the decision. Base is near home.
sluggums
2nd Mar 2015, 02:36
No, you were correct Oncebitten, the food is better.
Payscale
2nd Mar 2015, 02:36
Machspeed.
See you in 6 months then.
Time for a global awareness campaign to convince the public not to use EK..maybe same with Cx..both guilty of gross unethical conduct and HR malpractice..
nolimitholdem
2nd Mar 2015, 07:40
Speaking of CX, here's a quote from their part of PPRune by poster DropKnee:
The tighter they squeeze their fists. The more of us will slip away. This management will be responsible for the destruction of our airline.
Sometimes that's just the way it has to be.
I cannot think of a more prescient description of the way things are currently at EK. The parallels are striking.
Mister Geezer
2nd Mar 2015, 09:00
Time for a global awareness campaign to convince the public not to use EK..maybe same with Cx..both guilty of gross unethical conduct and HR malpractice..
Sadly the vast majority of passengers care about two things - service and price.
QR still fill their aircraft despite all we see in the press concerning the working conditions in the country and in the airline to a lesser extent as well.
Geezer and Nolimit..absolutely correct..parallels AND pax comment..but the latter is now beginning to change..maybe its a wedge but with MH and Air Asia, the more astute members of the paying public are beginning to make choices based on safety and not service geared to price…again, and this is where ALPA etc can step up to the plate…where grossly unethical practice has impacted on labour laws/human rights/ safe practice, then they should be outed.
Very interesting Luke SkyToddler, could you please point out the advantages of leaving QR for VN? Not sure you are directly involved on the interview process, but if you could give us any idea on what is attracting Qatar pilots to Vietnam I'd appreciate.
Thanks!
PS: Just can't find the "QUOTE BUTTON"
The best job in the world!!!
Job Description
Position B777 Captain
Job Description
Position B777 Captain
Base of Operation: Addis Ababa Ethiopia Africa
License Requirements: Valid JAA/EASA/ICAO Licence and First Class Medical
Commencement Date: Early 2015
Contract Duration: Three year renewable
Salary Competitive gross salary plus per diems
Overtime per month (pro-rata thereof)
Travel Captain Pilot Africa will receive travel benefits on the network
Working Rotations: 0 days on and 10 off 25 days on 12 off
Accommodation & Transportation: Hotac will be provided by the airline first 30 days. Single room hotel accommodation will be provided for the night stops outside home base.
fatbus
7th Mar 2015, 12:20
QCM what's the pay?
Payscale
7th Mar 2015, 12:34
TIA....:rolleyes:
paokara
7th Mar 2015, 21:06
I thought Emirates was the bread and butter in the industry
What happen ?
LowPassGliderA330
8th Mar 2015, 00:36
92 Hours, no pay increase but a lot of inflation, crappy management and so on.
paokara
8th Mar 2015, 15:19
Whoaaaa 92 hrs month after month?
I flew 723 hrs for 2014 and I was paid for 1096 hrs with our trip rigs and rules per our union contract
US Legacy airline
BigGeordie
8th Mar 2015, 15:26
92 hours is pretty average. Over 100 is common. And yes, that is month after month after month. We get paid for scheduled block hours so if the flight is longer we don't get any extra money- although the way the company is going I suppose we should be grateful they don't take cash away for shorter than scheduled sectors.
GA Button
8th Mar 2015, 16:59
Don't give them ideas for Christs sake!
airbusgirl66
8th Mar 2015, 18:02
I'm aware of at least one leaving for absolutely no job. And several others leaving for American, Delta, and another one leaving for a corporate job. The pay and benefits are no longer enough to keep pilots here who wish to return home. Hoping things will change.
Plastic787
8th Mar 2015, 18:06
15 people at the Heathrow roadshow. Heard rumours of 5 in Lisbon.
Sorry fatbus I just found this add about Ethiopian and highlighted the error...
0 days on 10 days off!!!
777Goose
7th Apr 2015, 09:48
Will be in Dubai this Wednesday to Friday.
Go to
Longreach Aviation China (http://www.longreachchina.com/)
Asia, both in China (China Southern, Hainan etc) and also other carriers (Fiji Airlines etc). discuss everything from what RSPs are available worldwide, for which aircraft types, what commuting contracts are on offer, and where things going over the next 18 months - 2 years.
will be able to explain what is available for A380 guys, A330 guys, and B777 guys, and also for guys with not much command / heavy time. will be able to talk about the imminent opening of Auckland, the possibility of LAX opening on the B777, possibility of Perth opening up on the B787, and other opportunities.
thatwasclose
7th Apr 2015, 11:48
Hey,
Went on their page really quick, did not see where and when. So, where and when ?
777Goose
9th Apr 2015, 04:23
Contact them, it's a closed session by bookings.
New thread started.
Taylor01
10th Apr 2015, 01:20
Fatbus and anyone who is interested. The base is 9k plus 1200 per diem plus another 1200 for housing. The housing is paid in local currency into my local bank each month. You can exchange but you will loose a little on the black market because they can not exchange more than 1000USD per month at the bank. We also get overtime at around 115USD for anything over 80. Last month for example I got around 97 pay hours. Pretty nice people to work for all together. Obviously being a lot smaller than EK it is not as organized but when I go to work I don't have much to worry about and all the 777 are new which is nice. We do a lot of cargo now because we are getting more freighters. Also they tell us we will be trained on the 787 this year which will add some more destinations. Anyway it is a fresh change from the pit and I really enjoy the 12 days home each month. Good luck to everybody wherever you go.
fourgolds
10th Apr 2015, 05:28
Hi Taylor01 , please check your PM's , tks.
Kapitanleutnant
10th Apr 2015, 06:49
Good Brief, Taylor….
Can now add this one to the mix of other T7 operators to consider….
Kap
Buford
10th Apr 2015, 08:08
Anyone else get an email about Hainan? The recruiters seem to have found me via LinkedIn.
BANANASBANANAS
10th Apr 2015, 09:49
Yes, I got an email, a linkedin message and they even found me on facebook.
The deal doesn't suit my personal circumstances but for young, single, experienced it could be a good move for a few years.
falconeasydriver
11th Apr 2015, 10:17
Anyone else get an email about Hainan? The recruiters seem to have found me via LinkedIn.
You mean to tell me I'm missing out on job offers as Im listed as being based in Timbuktu and working for a shady bunch of A rabs?
Damn it all to heck!
pilotguy1222
16th Apr 2015, 21:00
"Whoaaaa 92 hrs month after month?
I flew 723 hrs for 2014 and I was paid for 1096 hrs with our trip rigs and rules per our union contract
US Legacy airline"
And THAT is probably will drag my rear back to one of the U.S. big3.... Unless I can score a good gig that is commutable from Cebu. :cool:
polax52
17th Apr 2015, 17:12
A recent development as of yesterday: Air China Cargo have increased their Salary by 2000 USD per month to an average (including housing, travel allowance and year end bonus) of 20,200 USD. This salary is payable however much you fly up to 78 hours i.e. fly 0 hours or 78 you receive the same. Above 78 hours they pay overtime. This is for 777 Captains based in Shanghai.