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superq7
28th Jan 2015, 11:04
Two people made 8,000 noise complaints about Heathrow some exactly one hour before the plane took off.

The 8,000 Heathrow noise complaints from just TWO people | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2929347/The-8-000-Heathrow-noise-complaints-just-TWO-people-Pair-caught-forgetting-change-automated-software-used-file-protests-clocks-changed.html)

Flying Lawyer
28th Jan 2015, 11:43
Officials at the airport caught them out when they failed to take into account the clocks going back in October leading to complaints being made about flights which were still on the ground.


John Stewart, Chairman of the HACAN protest group, said: 'I think its unfortunate that many residents felt they had to resort to these kinds of machines, but unfortunately they have been left with no choice but to have them.'


No choice but to be dishonest?



(Edit)


The same John Stewart who has previously said: "I have learned that you have to fight dirty and clever."

parabellum
28th Jan 2015, 12:00
Spent a very happy day at Bristol once. Weather not good so had an interesting chat with Brian Trubshore.


There were a known group who lived along the west coast of Wales and England, where some of the Concord test flights took place. Regularly the complaints came in, date, time, location etc. Even on days when the Concord never left the ground!

meadowrun
28th Jan 2015, 12:11
Arghh, the same old story.
Don't like aircraft noise, don't choose to live near aircraft operations.
Have trouble with modern life, there are a few homesteads on the northern coast of Newfoundland available.

G-CPTN
28th Jan 2015, 12:13
On a slightly altered approach, I was surprised to hear the aircraft carrying my daughter and her husband from Glasgow to Dubai passing directly overhead my house way back last year.
The B777 has a different sound to the other 'local' aircraft that pass overhead to and from nearby Newcastle Airport, and I find myself noticing it as it stands out from the background noise of the other aircraft.

It is in no way intrusive, and I have absolutely no intention of complaining, though I do notice its passing most days (sometimes it routes differently) - even when it is delayed (quite frequently).

I suppose that I could develop this into a complaint 'phobia' (we are on a military low-flying corridor leading to a tactical training area that excites me much more - I rarely see them as they are 'gone' before I hear them coming if you see what I mean). I once had cause to telephone the 'low-flying contact' number and the operator was puzzled that I wasn't wanting to register a complaint (I was enquiring about the minimum altitude that Chinook helicopters could operate as I had been 'surprised' by the sudden appearance of one at 'hedge height' (!) as I was in my garden). I was told that helicopters were cleared down to ground level rather than 250 feet due to their modus operandi - though typically maintain above 100 feet.

ExXB
28th Jan 2015, 12:54
It's a pity they didn't post said complainers' e-mail addresses here on PPRuNe. I'm sure that they would receive a couple of messages or so explaining, in the nicest possible way, why it isn't nice to do what they are doing.

I suppose we could even find an automated e-mail system that would assist us in our efforts. I'd be happy to help them in their education with a few thousand automated e-mails.

Oh, wait. That wouldn't be nice or honest would it? :ugh:

charliegolf
28th Jan 2015, 13:38
FL will know: isn't it illegal to claim (noise) harassment by lying about the extent of the cause?

CG

Lon More
28th Jan 2015, 14:09
Same thing happened at Maastricht Aachen. Well co-ordinated group of protesters eventually stopped all night flights and virtually killed the place off. The protest group, few of whom had lived nearby before the airport started night ops., were well organised. For a laugh we phoned their president one night when nothing was moving due fog, Presumeably he phoned around all his gang because there were more than 300 protests that night.

radeng
28th Jan 2015, 22:41
Shut the airport and publish the names and addresses and email addresses of the complainants to all those put out of work as a result.......and tell the police and fire brigade to stay away from the area for the next 6 weeks...

Fubaar
28th Jan 2015, 22:59
We colonials can out do you. Sydney has some of the most restrictive and just plain silly curfew restrictions in this world, to the point where it damn near strangles the whole of Australian aviation because of the kick-on effects of the curfew on the rest of the country. Back in the 1970s, the main protest group (complaining about the noise at every opportunity) was led by... a Sydney Air Traffic Controller.

I suppose there was a certain logic there - the **** didn't want to work back of the clock shifts!!!!

I have to admit that I've been part of an 'anti aircraft noise conspiracy' myself, if many years ago. When we did night flying (military helicopter squadron, based very near a major city), one of our number, if programmed for second period that night would always brief his wife to ring in repeatedly complaining about the noise. The second period would always be cut short after the complaints and we'd all retire to the back bar. Not one of us ever complained about his antics and I don't think he ever had to buy a beer himself in the back bar.

ExSp33db1rd
28th Jan 2015, 23:20
I have a bumper sticker gleaned from Santa Monica, California ( where the do-gooders are trying to close the airport) it reads ...

I LOVE airplane noise. and features a line drawing of an old biplane.

Better not display it around Heathrow ( or Santa Monica ! )

Super VC-10
29th Jan 2015, 11:16
Question is, which was there first, the complainants, or the airport?

There was a local councillor in Norwich, UK, that was vociferous about noise from the airport, which was there before she moved in.
Unfortunately for her, she was recognised on a holiday flight out of Norwich, and the story appeared in the local press. Come the next local election, she wasn't a councillor any more. :ok:

DType
29th Jan 2015, 11:30
Used to be a useful midnight flight from London to Edinburgh. If I had been working in London then I could take in a show and get home with a 2 standby ticket (even when on business). Or if I had been working on the continent, then I could take the last plane out to Heathrow and still be sure (!) of sleeping in my own bed that night.
Then they stopped the midnight flight "because of noise restrictions".
So I missed the London shows, not the end of the world, but if I had been working abroad for a full day then it was the overnight rail sleeper to Edinburgh or a Heathrow hotel.
However, since our house is under the flight path, I was bamboozled to hear a plane go over every midnight, so I rang Turnhouse. Ah, the lady said, that's the mail plane. Do you want to complain about it? No, I replied, I was just curious why my plane is banned but not others. I see, she said, but are you sure you don't want to complain?
Presume she was an airport employee.

Mr Chips
29th Jan 2015, 11:34
Question is, which was there first, the complainants, or the airport?
As a resident of the Heathrow area I think its worth remembering that although the airport has been there a long time, many people moved into the area before the noise and volume of flights increased - my parents moved to the area in the very late 60s.

Having said that - back in the days when I worked the back desk at LATCC the noise complaints tended to be from the Borough of Richmond rather than Borough of Hounslow - further away and therefore less noisy! The good people of Hounslow tend to simply ignore the noise, possibly because the airport provides so much employment!

I also always found it fascinating that the Council would complain about the noise (as did the MP, Expenses King Alan Keen, regardless of his constituents views) but happily took community funding from the airport....

cattletruck
29th Jan 2015, 11:35
I've always thought that most of these people who complain about aircraft noise have another agenda.

The only time I've ever found aircraft noise irritating was when I've been sitting on the front veranda reading the newspaper and I catch the conversation of these the dumb blow-ins that are pretending to befriend my asset rich recalcitrant neighbour, who has lost it upstairs, with a view of inheriting his properties.

High altitude aircraft noise is no different to the tyre noise of a passing vehicle, in fact if you really focus on it road traffic noise is extremely intrusive, but most of us have learnt to block it out.

Personally I really do not mind the sound of those Gypsy Majors that regularly fly overhead, sometimes we even get a few radials to colour the sky so to speak.

radeng
29th Jan 2015, 12:49
I find the helicopters the most annoying, and we get a lot of those going into Kemble. The occasional Herc doing some low level stuff is always interesting - they do SEEM extremely low!

But the nicest ones to my mind are the sounds of the Merlins on the odd occasions when the BoB flight goes by........although I suppose they weren't so popular over the Ruhr.....

hiflymk3
29th Jan 2015, 18:28
In the 70s/80s I live in Fulham right under the inbound flightpath. In them good ol days I could tell the difference between a 727 and a Trident, a DC8 and a 707 as they made their noisy, smoky way to Heathrow.. Considering the noise and pollution at street level I don't think their passing overhead made much difference.


And Concorde? Great noise, great plane and many looked up to witness its grace.

cockney steve
29th Jan 2015, 20:07
Back in the sixties/70's, when Bac 111 and Viscount were about, yes, they were extremely loud and somewhat smoky on takeoff (overfuelled?)
Of course they were intrusive, that's why houses under the flightpath were about 25% cheaper than similar stock in a quieter suburb.
jets improved dramatically, just compare the din of a Lanc, with a modern Jumbo. although the traffic is much denser, the total noise level is a lot lower.

Perhaps the airport Authorities should play recordings of "then" and "now" to complainants and give them a choice...."You knew there was an airport in earshot, If you didn't, sue your Conveyancer. If you want to complain officially, the airport will take YOU to court for malicious and vexatious disruption of it's business....Oh, we'll also make sure your card is marked so you will NOT BE ALLOWED to buy a property within 10 miles of any airport and 20 miles from any flightpath."
That would weed out a few!

T

Flying Lawyer
29th Jan 2015, 20:44
I have no sympathy for people who buy houses near airports, or under the flight path, and then complain about aircraft noise.

I've lived under or near the flight path for 40 years - South Kensington, Putney, Fulham and now Chelsea. Aircraft noise can be heard, but it's not intrusive.

I've never once heard a neighbour mentioning aircraft noise, far less complain about it, yet when I read HACAN and the other antis' propaganda, I read that our sleep is disturbed by early morning flights. :rolleyes:

racedo
29th Jan 2015, 23:10
There were a known group who lived along the west coast of Wales and England, where some of the Concord test flights took place. Regularly the complaints came in, date, time, location etc. Even on days when the Concord never left the ground!

Friend lived on east coast of Ireland, says when he young the testing of Concorde in Irish Sea one Saturday morning cracked huge main window in his home. They didn't realise what it was until news that Thunder they heard was Sonic boom from Concorde. Window frame was metal one's beloved of post war era.

He said his dad never complained about it and was a story told and retold over the years. Often told me as well when I was in conversation with him.

ChristiaanJ
29th Jan 2015, 23:45
parabellum,

Sorry to nit-pick, but his name was Trubshaw, not Trubshore, and the 'plane was called Concorde. Concord is the name of a place somewhere across the pond.

But the tale of false reports from "Boom Alley" is true, just the same.

treadigraph
30th Jan 2015, 00:45
For eighteen years my bedroom window has been six feet or so from a major A road. The double glazing needs replacing, I have a dairy nearly opposite me, yet I have mostly enjoyed good sleep, despite the near constant traffic. The odd siren, a few loud-mouthed drunkards and a car crash or six have occasionally disturbed my slumbers in the wee hours.

I now have a neighbour with two terriers. Their uncontrolled and regular nocturnal barking habits clearly audible through the walls knock early morning jet arrivals into a cocked hat. (The council has already dealt with it once, round two is about to kick off.)

ExSp33db1rd
30th Jan 2015, 01:22
Used to live just down the Gt. West Road from Heathrow, I recall the York freighters taking off in the evening - not only noise, but the whole house SHOOK as they passed a few feet above the roof.

Heard of a UK Council who were being plagued by residents wanting to close their airport, somewhere. At a public meeting a Council rep. posted a WW II photograph of the airfield when it was a USAAF base in the middle of green fields, and invited members of the audience to come up and point out exactly which was THEIR house ! Well done.

parabellum
30th Jan 2015, 02:14
Sorry to nit-pick, but his name was Trubshaw, not Trubshore, and the 'plane was called Concorde. Concord is the name of a place somewhere across the pond.


Ok ChristianJ, I'll give you the spelling of Trubshaw but, as far as I am concerned, it is Concord, I'm not French, (the Brits originally spelt it without the e on the end but caved to the French). :)

Ancient Observer
30th Jan 2015, 06:50
I would close it NOW.

All this crap about London needing more flights is purely BA spin for its hub and spoke model. That will go out of fashion.
If BA really needs more slots to China, then stop flying to 3rd rate European destinations. A 319 to Prague or a 380 to Beijing?

It is and always has been economic drivel to expand Heathrow. So close it and use the space for Real Development and real jobs.

Put the planes in to Boris Island.

John Eacott
30th Jan 2015, 06:59
Those Buccaneers tooling off on night flights out of Lossiemouth used to be quite loud, but the landlord of the old huts weren't too interested in noise complaints.

And as for the F4Ks in reheat departing the roof of our Grey Funnel Cruise liner: speak up, what was that?

:p