View Full Version : Grade 4 students plotted to harm teacher

10th Jan 2015, 14:45
Elba School District probes students’ plot to harm teacher - City & Region - The Buffalo News (http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/police-blotter/elba-school-district-probes-students-plot-to-harm-teacher-20150108)

11th Jan 2015, 12:45
Most of us can probably recall laxatives being put in teacher's drinks, chairs being pulled out from under the teacher as they sat down and children leaning back on chairs and 'accidently' dropping them on teacher's toe. There are some particularly nasty, spiteful children around; often but not always the offspring of equally unpleasant parents.

All that can be done is a very clear, unambiguous warning at the start of each school year that all such activities WILL be treated as assault, the police WILL be called and nobody will be let off with a verbal 'slap on the wrist'. The school is equally, if not more concerned about protecting its teachers from the children as vice versa.

There are teachers with lasting injuries and as a result of student 'pranks'. In this particular case it could be argued that the children were too young to understand the full implications of their actions.

Teachers at school are in their place of work and deserve the same level of protection as any other worker expects. If these acts are not nipped in the bud, children will be continually pushing the boundaries of acceptability to see just where those boundaries are.

11th Jan 2015, 13:11
Wake up and smell the coffee Mechta; it's way past a stern ticking off being necessary.

more than half of teachers in state schools have faced aggression from pupils in the last year, and more than a quarter have experienced it from parents or carers.

Chief schools inspector blasts 'national scandal' that causes 40 per cent of teachers to quit within five years - Education News - Education - The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/chief-schools-inspector-blasts-national-scandal-that-causes-40-per-cent-of-teachers-to-quit-within-five-years-9061790.html)

Sir Michael said the main reason why teachers quit was the lack of discipline in the classroom

More here.

Classroom violence | Education | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/education/classroomviolence)

11th Jan 2015, 13:55
a Wake up and smell the coffee Mechta; it's way past a stern ticking off being necessary.

Errr, hang on F3WMB... We appear to be saying the same thing.

Nowhere was I advocating a 'stern ticking off' after the event. A stern warning of what course of action will be taken should an event take place is something completely different.

11th Jan 2015, 14:01
Well, for a start, you can't prosecute 9 year olds. A stern telling off is your only option.

Secondly, any attempt to take action on older children is liable to be met by false accusations of teacher assault by the miscreant's friends. This is the big stick male teachers especially are afraid of.
28% of teachers have been falsely accused.

How serious can a false allegation be for a teacher?

Just read some of the comments made by teachers who responded to the ATL survey. One secondary schoolteacher said: "Two work colleagues have recently been suspended: one was dismissed despite a police investigation proving innocence." A primary teacher from Wales added: "The police were notified but no action was taken as the child who assaulted me was under the required age. Following this, the child's parent accused me of hitting her child. I have not returned to work in a school place since. I had post traumatic stress and a period of long-term sick."

A third teacher said: "This is a devastating thing to happen, even when all the allegations are found to be totally untrue, it stays on your record and can prejudice any future case. It's terrifying , shocking and very upsetting. It's taken me nearly two years to begin to get over it, and even now I get depressed, and think about giving up work."


Magna Carta does not apply to school teachers. Remember that when you celebrate it this year.

11th Jan 2015, 14:05
What's needed are tougher teachers!


cockney steve
11th Jan 2015, 22:17
@ Mikedreamer love the clip. Reminds me of a friend who went from industry (steel fabrication) to a Technician, assisting in the Woodwork and Metalwork shops......Faced with a particularly unruly young thug one day, (by this time he was a trainee Teacher on Teaching -Practice, at his old school)

He called the brat into the (unlit) stockroom....brat stumbles into the gloom whereupon he is grabbed by the lapels, swung round and slammed against some large steel cupboards......a snarling face, a few inches from his, said, " lucky I was here to catch you when you tripped, this time, Bloggs. - Next time you walk into an unlit room, you may not be so lucky and suffer a serious accident.....Do I make myself clear?" and allowed the winded, trembling youth to drop to the floor.

The lad learned a lesson, he never misbehaved again, as he realised my mate was smart enough to not get caught and vindictive enough to carry out the necessary corrective training.

He still teaches, he still keeps discipline. AFAIK, he doesn't need to demonstrate his willingness to find a way of sidestepping the rules....kids talk, his reputation precedes him.

A A Gruntpuddock
11th Jan 2015, 22:49
Most of my teachers had seen service in WWII so were not going to put up with any nonsense!

Always remember one large bully standing head down whilst my diminutive English teacher (ex bomber tail gunner) gave him a dressing down in public.

One had seen service befire the War, but that was unfortunately at a Waffen SS officer training camp - which explained his particularly nasty tendencies.

12th Jan 2015, 00:44
The first teacher I ever recognized as good was an ex Afrika Korps officer. He had later fought on the eastern front and been captured. I don't recall him ever having any disciplinary problems. He taught science and, as an indication of his quality as a teacher, about 75% of his students joined the science club as opposed to 10 or 15% from classes taught by others.

After an excellent landing etc...

12th Jan 2015, 01:00
Likewise, most of our (male) teachers had seen military service, either during the War or after National Service, so they had experience of discipline and, therefore, were able to enforce it.

12th Jan 2015, 02:12
But in those days, if a student did cause any trouble, they would be punished by the school and then punished harder by their parents.
Today, likely as not, it's a parent starting the problem, never mind backing their delinquent kid.

12th Jan 2015, 04:52
(Sung to tune of Battle Hymn of the Republic).

" We're all cheering now because we're burning down the school,
We've murdered all the teachers and we've broken every rule,
We're coming down the stairs to kill the Principal,
'Cause we ain't gonna take it anymore.

Glory, Glory Hallejulah,
The teacher hit me with a ruler,
The ruler broke in half and we all began to laugh,
And she ain't gonna hit me anymore..."

12th Jan 2015, 11:06
your all talking about ex mil types who brooked no nonsense.

By far the most story's I have heard about scary teachers are from Irish lads who got taught by Nuns.

If you get 4-5 Irish folk of that era together and get them going about the nuns you can get a whole evenings entertainment in the bar out of them.

Even if 25% of what they say is true, its seems it was a pretty scary way of being educated.

Lon More
12th Jan 2015, 11:10
A mate has just retired after 35 years teaching woodwork and metalwork in Lancashire,
He said the first lessons he learned after check out was don;t show them you're scared.and never turn your back on them - and that was just in the stafroom :}

12th Jan 2015, 13:51
Well, if each teacher was armed with an Ak-47 at the beginning of the school year, I bet violence against teachers would ebb quite a bit. :}

12th Jan 2015, 13:52
Or better yet, all teachers should be Nuns. Like these:


12th Jan 2015, 13:54

I'm not Irish but I was taught for 8 years by nuns. (And a further 2 years by Brothers of the cloth.)

And, yes, I can assure you those were some scary times of learning. My knuckles still ache.

12th Jan 2015, 14:08
Any system that involves fear does not produce education, just schooling.
The teacher needs to be able to communicate in an engaging way. Most disruption is as a result of two factors:
Kids who have no interest in learning
Teachers who cannot engage the students

Drastic solution.
Kids are not permitted to attend school until they are willing to learn. Teachers are not social workers or behavioural psychologists. Provide these services outside school until kids are willing to learn. This is generally not done as it's very expensive initially, it might stigmatize the families, and/or it means admitting that the family might be the problem.

Pragmatic solution
Return the right of Principals to exclude, without review.
Ensure teachers are innocent, and anonymous, until proven guilty. The procedures must be shortened drastically. One or two days in the vast majority of cases.
Teachers need to be qualified in the subject, which is the best guarantee of teacher enthusiasm and knowledge, which is the best way to engage the students.
Teachers must be allowed to engage the students in the way they see fit (this is complete anathema to the current tick-box approach of OfSted Inspections).
The exams have to be worth something, and what industry/academia need.

12th Jan 2015, 14:20
Fox3 wrote:

Any system that involves fear does not produce education, just schooling.

I'm not too sure of that Fox3. During grades 1-10 I feared what would be bestowed upon me each and every day. but I certainly became edumacated. Whether I liked it or not. :}:E

"Boy, I'm gonna learn you."

Example. One semester I had the audacity to fail religion. (Which doesn't go over too well in Catholic school, needless to say.) Father Cregan - the school 'enforcer' - had a little "chat" with me about my having failed religion that semester. A rather lengthy, and at times physical, chat. I never did fail religion again. Matter of fact, I got all A's and B's from that point on. I guess his having instilled the fear of himself, and God, Jesus, Mary and Joseph, the Cherubim, the Saints and the Apostles, helped dissuade me from failing ever again.

12th Jan 2015, 14:39
Fear suppresses the higher brain functions, whether that be fear of teachers, of bullies, failure, embarrassment, whatever.
One cannot truly teach a fearful person how to reason, to think for themselves, or to be genuinely creative.

Retention of facts can however sometimes be enhanced by fear, as you know.

This is what I mean about education rather than schooling

12th Jan 2015, 18:15
Bit harsh on the Irish

13th Jan 2015, 04:12

I'm not Irish but I was taught for 8 years by nuns. (And a further 2 years by Brothers of the cloth.)

And, yes, I can assure you those were some scary times of learning. My knuckles still ache.

...you're lucky knuckles only thing aching... around that crew... :suspect:

Solid Rust Twotter
13th Jan 2015, 06:31
Explains the tutu and predilection for pink drinks with umbrellas though...

13th Jan 2015, 13:54

I was being polite by just mentioning my aching knuckles. There are other parts that ache on occasion as well.


My Catholic school learning adventure had nothing to do with my predilection toward pink tutus and girly drinks with umbrellas. I blame that all on Ranger School. :ok: