The outcome of self funding type ratings

[Above The Clouds]

Over the years there has been a great deal of discussion, both good and bad regarding buying your own type rating. However the threads seem to end without showing if the outcome was ever successful for the individuals concerned.

So, is there anyone out there who went down the route of paying for a rating that resulted in securing a succesful job at the end of it ?

[papazulu]

So, is there anyone out there who went down the route of paying for a rating that resulted in securing a successful job at the end of it ?

I can offer 3 example with the purchase of 2 GA types and 2 airliners, one each by the same guy!

Guy A bought an A320 rating with a doggy LoCo, got couple of contracts (those where you pay them 100 to secure a job and they give you back 30 or 40...) then off to Eurabia and another semi-bankrupt EU-member state with some agency. He's now flying in the sandbox on A330/40.
Well, he was craving for the pristine uniform, the standard-issue RayBan, a 5-lbs Breitling and an high-mx bird. He got it all with the bonus of a lot of grey hair and no fingernails left. I bet if you ask him, he will tell you he's happy and doing great. But I wouldn't go even for a circuit, in a C152 with him...

Guy B bought a B200 TR but just after he had reasonable reassurance from the a/c owner that the job was his. Still clocking those light TP hrs as FO, job security is uncertain and family has grown in size, thus limiting the options to head for greener pastures...or spend more dosh!

Guy C bought a DA10, with a family-run doggy operator of a 3rd world euro-country. It was during the dark ages, when TR course could be completed on the a/c. He flew the thing on and off for 2 years when not busy with his mon-fri job and (I think) for free. Then the bird got sold and guess what? Yep...he had to make room for the new young guns, included the son of the reigning lead-pilot. But wait, the story is not over yet: he did not had enough and off he went shopping again, this time for a popular airliner made in Seattle. Unfortunately once done with the base-training, then next item on the menu would had been line training...

Are you having 2nd thought...yet?

PZ :E

[Deep and fast]

Livin the dream baby :}

D and F :8

[winkwink]

I bought two in total. Together they cost me $20,000 and I earned about £150,000 on those types, so a reasonable return. However, both opened other doors and led to three type ratings which were paid for by others, so for me it worked.
It is something of a gamble though, especially during what seems to me to be a buyers' market for pilots.

[flydive1]

Well, $20,000 for 2 types is a bargain(but what types?)

[Grum]

There is a big difference between being offered a job where it is agreed that you will finance the rating, and just buying a rating and then going job hunting. Has the latter ever worked?

[winkwink]

Types were C500 and C525. The latter is still serving me

[ericthepilot]

You buy, You Die.

You have just given your future employer and your next employer when he finds out even more leverage on your salary, QOL and many more things related to your private life. They will own you. and your career will always reflect that step. Each employer will know eventually.

And personally I would never wanna be in a plane with a scab like that.
Continuously I will have to worry of how your career choice will affect the owner's thinking on his next aircraft purchase.
Thank you, good luck but you will never fly with those who work hard in this industry to achieve an aviation career and family life.

Paid for training pilots are like the sleeper cells that will kill off any stable market development. They have apparent lack of skills which come forward during the interview, and they can only circumvent the hiring process to secure a job in Aviation with a type purchase.
An industry you clearly shouldn't be in in the first place.

You have to pass the medical exam to become a doctor, don't buy your ticket if you wanna be a commercial pilot.

[goaround737]

Paying for a TR yourself in the Biz jet world is quite rare in my experience.

I've never heard of anyone who did it, and why would you? Its not like (and i'm by no means excusing it!) buying a 320 rating where there are thousands of potential employers world wide who you can simply post a CV off to.

Biz jets are quite hard to get into unless you know someone, simply having a type rating wont get you a foot in the door.

[Klimax]

To add to the statistics. I've done 8 initial type ratings and paid for only one of them (C525), on the promises of a job/income. It worked out well and did ultimately secure me a job and onto another company/owner sponsored type rating on bigger gear. I'm not sure if or how long it would have taken to switch from the airlines to corporate/managed jets, if I had not made the investment.

As a matter of opinion. A bare minimum for self sponsoring (and I'm not engaging in that discussion) is some sort of guarantee of a job.

[McDoo]

I agree with Klimax, don't buy a rating unless you have entered into a written agreement with your new employer. It is worth mentioning that these days, recurrent simulator checks at the likes of FSI and CAE are only 20% or so less than initial courses. I would point that out at interview and maybe try to get your new employer to deduct at least the recurrent cost as they will need to be paying that anyway.

There is no point in just buying yourself a rating with no job to go to. Read the adverts. If an operator is asking for rated crew, they almost always require significant time on type too.

Happy job hunting in 2015

McD :ok:

[BizJetJockey]

It seems that having a type rating and time on type is no good either!! So to sum up...??!!

[Cecco]

Nowadays, paying your TR is (unfortunately) a common thing in Germany in order to get a job. Either you pay the whole amount upfront or they deduct the TR costs from your salary.

Cecco

[Job-Seeker]

If it gets paid then you will average a salary of something like 2000€ gross on light jets.
But other offers were, fund the rating for 15k yourself and earn 2000€ gross.

That were FO positions in Germany but I kindly refused.

[papazulu]

Nowadays, paying your TR is (unfortunately) a common thing in Germany in order to get a job.

Bottom line is do not apply/accept job-offers in Germany! :E
Also, I think speaking the lingo is kind of mandatory as you'd need to "fit in the team"...

With or without a job-offer at the end, financing your own TR is just another yard towards the race to the bottom, imho. Surely enough there are 100s of "success" stories out there but like it or not it's how everything started. Then someone with a more original idea came along and he/she was keen to bypass the cue buying hours-packages etc, etc. Heard this from a chief-pilot's mouth myself, no kidding.

PZ :hmm:

[Above The Clouds]

Interesting replies, so it seems that maybe sometimes it works but its definitely the way the market is heading :ooh: for me never done it and never will would rather give up flying.

[what next]

If it gets paid then you will average a salary of something like 2000€ gross on light jets.

Maybe, if you are lucky. Lots of bizjets in Germany are flown for free by people like dentists and lawyers who are bored to sit at home on their day off... Really, no kidding! They pay their own ratings and checkrides and still save money because otherwise they would have to rent a Pa28 for 350 Euros/hr (or whatever the current rate is) in order to get some air time. With this kind of competition on the job market, having to pay for your type rating is your least worry, believe me.

But we've had this discussion hundreds of times already. Everybody pays for his typetating one way or another. Even Lufthansa cadets, because they pay back their training cost through a lower salary during the first years.

[Klimax]

Above the Clouds,

Like most other things in life - you gotta be smart about how you do it!
I think that most pilots who, even against their own moral set, have accepted to self finance t/r's and have been smart about it, as in had some sort of a guaranteed job/income to follow it, have had an successful outcome. Others who have not been smart about it and blindly spend daddy's money on a shiny jet rating - would have hit their heads.

Kmax.