Longshot - Percy Theodore Carden MC

[Genghis the Engineer]

Is bured at Kirkham churchyard in Lancashire, having died on 12 February 1942 "Killed in Action". He was a Flt.Lt. RAFVR and 57 years old.

It's an unusual combination.


I stumbled across him because I'm slowly researching out of personal interest his brother Alan Douglas Carden [prototype flying boffin, first man I believe to get a pilots licence with only one arm, member of the RE's first flying squadron in 1911, *probably* doing secret stuff at RAE during WW2...], but the little brother (11th of 11 children of Major General George Carden) seems rather interesting as well. Observer then pilot in the RFC during WW1, Barrister, published author (of an ending to Dickens Mystery of Edwin Drood in 1920, but still in print today).



I'm inevitably going to get sidetracked by AD's fascinating younger brother - but one really obvious question, is how did he die?

Does anybody have any ideas? I suspect that I shall end up buying a subscription and scouring the Lancashire newspapers for the period, but any ideas, knowledge or shortcuts appreciated.

G

[Lordflasheart]

WELLINGTON COLLEGE ROLL OF HONOUR 1939 1945
Wellingtonians who entered the School from 1889 to 1904

Flight Lieutenant PERCY THEODORE CARDEN, M.C., Royal Air Force,
Hopetoun 1899 to 1903, took an Honours Degree in Law at Corpus Christi College, Oxford, in 1905, was called to the Bar in 1908 and practised in the Chancery Division till the outbreak of the first world war, when he joined the Public Schools Battalion of the Middlesex Regiment.

Commissioned in the Royal Flying Corps in 1916, he won the Military Cross the following year. He returned to the Bar after the war, ultimately taking up a Civil Service appointment, and was an Assistant Charity Commissioner when he joined the R.A.F.V.R. in April, 1939. Engaged in Intelligence and Administrative duties, and finally, in a special branch of Aerial Defence, he was in charge of an extensive area of Northern England when he succumbed to over-work and strain and died suddenly in an R.A.F. hospital on February 12th, 1942. "He was certainly heart and soul in his work until the end and his death will not only be a loss to us all but to the Service," writes his Commanding Officer.


Page 8 - Wellington-Roll-of-Honour-1939-19145 (http://lib.militaryarchive.co.uk/library/WWII/library/Wellington-Roll-of-Honour-1939-1945/files/assets/basic-html/page8.html)


LFH

[Genghis the Engineer]

My lord, I am in your debt.

But editing to say that having slept on that, Percy sounds even more interesting and mysterious than before. Just what sort of air defence facilities would have a Flt.Lt who was also a barrister in charge of much of the North of England ? At the very least there were some interesting military secrets going on here.

I shall certainly add the little brother to my ongoing Carden studies !

G

[Flap40]

"Killed in Action" does not sound like an epitaph for someone who died of stress, heart failure or similar.

Definitely more digging required!

[Genghis the Engineer]

Indeed so.


Just explaining a little of my interest have a glance at this page...

Major General George CARDEN - I9528 - Individual Information - PhpGedView (http://www.tolliss.com/gedview/individual.php?pid=I9528&ged=Tolliss.ged)

It shows the family of a Major George Carden, who died in 1894 - he had 11 children: most, although sadly not all, made it into adulthood.

The fellow I am really interested in is Alan Douglas Carden, the 6th child. I discovered his existence by accident when a cutlery canteen came up for auction - it has a plaque on the top saying that it was presented to him on his marriage by his brother officers at RE Aldershot. It was made by Aspreys, so he was clearly highly regarded by his colleagues - it must have cost a small fortune (presumably it also contained a silver service, which is sadly long lost).

When I spotted it, I did a bit of digging and discovered that AD Carden, when married in 1913 listed his profession as "aircraft designer", a little more digging showed him as a member of the RE's first aircraft squadron formed in 1911, a test pilot for Dunne's flying wings prior to WW1 (which he gained his RAeC certificate in), and a chap who managed to both start, and end WW1 as a pilot - despite having only one arm (I *think* he probably lost that around 1900 in the Carribean where he was commanding an underwater mining unit). He retired in rom the RAF about 1924 by which time he was commanding a lot of England's coastal searchlight defences. I have no idea what he did between 1924 and 1939, but I *think* that he was probably doing research at RAE during WW2, as he was certainly there (in his 70s) after the war for several years. At one point he was also Cody's deputy at the Royal Aircraft Factory.

I'm not exactly hurrying with the project, but am progressing it. Only very recently came across the little brother Percy - also a pilot during WW1 - his MC citation says...

M.C. London Gazette 25 April 1918: ‘T/Lt. Percy Theodore Carden, Gen. List and R.F.C. For conspicuous gallantry and devotion to duty. When acting as observer he made a successful wire reconnaissance along a corps front at a height of 300 to 800 feet under heavy machine-gun and rifle fire. On another occasion, while observing during a reconnoitring patrol, he and his pilot had four encounters with enemy aeroplanes, in one of which they were attacked at 800 feet by five enemy scouts. He kept up a continuous fire, and drove off the enemy, and completed a valuable reconnaissance. He showed the greatest keenness and determination at his work.’


So, very clearly, he was at-least as interesting as his big brother!


Anybody who ever comes across any interesting history prior to about 1965 therefore, involving anybody called Carden, I'd love to hear it.


Oh yes, the cutlery canteen. I won it at auction, spent a lot of happy evenings last winter polishing it up, and it now sits on my sideboard, where it perfectly fits the cutlery my wife and I got for our wedding presents.

So, no relation to me, but it feels like family business.


At some point this'll all turn into a paper / book / something.

G

[Peter-RB]

Genghis,
This sounds like a really interesting job you have got yourself involved with, I know where the churches are in KIrkham being about 19 miles from me, so if you want anything checking just ask.
Peter R-B

[Genghis the Engineer]

Cheers Peter - purely a personal project rather than a job, but yes, a fascinating family.

There's a remarkable amount from the churchyards on the interweb, and a little about the younger Carden...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Murder-Edwin-Drood-Recounted-Jasper/dp/B008QNFUW6/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1421517377&sr=1-1&keywords=percy+Theodore+Carden


Tollis (http://www.tolliss.com/gedview/family.php?famid=F7240&show_full=1)

Stonechaser (http://stonechaser.********.co.uk/2012/12/kirkham-parish-church-servicemens-graves.html)

Commonwealth war graves commission (http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2699112/CARDEN,%20PERCY%20THEODORE)

But, if you are able to dig up anything about how Percy died and what he was doing locally, I suspect that quite a few of us will be extremely interested in that - not just me.


G

[Peter-RB]

I'll get mi spade and start, :ok:

[creweite]

Some pre-war light aircraft were powered with a converted Ford engine, the Carden Ford. Is that a product of one of these talented people?

[joy ride]

Carden shafts too, any connection?

[Allan Lupton]

Sir John Carden Bt. was the engineer behind the Carden cyclecar, the Carden-Lloyd Tankette and the Carden aviation conversion of the Ford 10 engine. Not sure where the shaft comes from but it's usually spelled Cardan
I've also wondered if there's any connection with P.T. Carden

[Genghis the Engineer]

Another impressive contemporary was Admiral Sir Sackville Carden. .

Sackville Hamilton Carden - The Dreadnought Project (http://www.dreadnoughtproject.org/tfs/index.php/Sackville_Hamilton_Carden)

I've found no connection between him and these aeronautical Cardens, but will keep looking for one.

G

[teeteringhead]

With my (very amateur) genealogist's hat on, I've done a bit of research online and come up with the following:

Percy Theodore Carden was born in 1885 and died - as you know - on 12th February 1942, aged 57.

His death was registered in the Fylde district of the County of Lancashire, in Q1 (Jan-Mar) of 1942 and the death registration is on Page 1224 of Volume 8e of their register.

No further details are available online, but with the emboldened details in the previous paragraph, you will be able to order a copy of the Death Certificate from the General Register Office (GRO) via this link. (https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/most_customers_want_to_know.asp#OrderingCertificates)

The Death Certificate will have cause of death, address at death, name of informant (whoever registered the death) and sometimes other details too.

All yours for a mere £9.25!

Hope this helps. :ok: