View Full Version : Flight Time to America 1954

Victor 102
6th Jan 2015, 21:07
When on sentry duty at Windsor Castle in the fifties up on the ramparts on clear nights one could see the lights of LHR & here the the piston engines growling as A/C taxied out for take off not very many of course perhaps two or three an hour the time being around midnight or the early hours,one A/C sticks in my memory the Stratocruiser it would pass the Castle at 3000 or 4000 feet heading due west they were well loaded & climbing very slowly I assumed they were going non stop too the USA. If they were re-fueling at Shannon would they be so heavy passing over Windsor? And so to my Question flight time too America in the early fifties.

6th Jan 2015, 21:35
Was LHR still LAP back then?

6th Jan 2015, 21:54
From the June 1953 schedule. All times are Local time.


6th Jan 2015, 22:08

7th Jan 2015, 08:30
Could a fully loaded Strat make anything like 3000 feet by Windsor?

7th Jan 2015, 20:37
Would You be able to find the schedule for the first non-stops by Pan Am in '59?

Related to the subject it should be noted that Lufthansa flew Berlin-New York non-stop with the FockeWulf Condor before the war, carrying aprox. same pax as the first 707-flight (wich was via Gander) :-o

7th Jan 2015, 21:12

7th Jan 2015, 21:25
Re: 1938 German CONDOR trans-Atlantic Berlin-New York flight: Carried no pax, just a huge fuel tank and a crew of four.
Seventy-five years later, a Boeing 747-400 will complete the westbound sector in around eight hours and thirty minutes.


On August 10-11, 1938, a Lufthansa Focke-Wulf 200 Condor airliner made a record-breaking nonstop flight across the Atlantic from Berlin to Floyd Bennett field in Brooklyn, New York.

The aircraft was a Fw 200 VI, registered as D-ACON and named “Brandenburg.”

The 4,075 miles flight (6,437 km) took 24 hours and 57 minutes against strong headwinds, at an average speed of 164 MPH (263 km/h). The return flight to Germany took 19 hours and 47 minutes at an average speed of 205 MPH (330 km/h) on August 13, 1938.

In November, 1938 the same aircraft flew from Berlin to Basra, Karachi, Hanoi, and Tokyo in only 46 hours 18 minutes, but on the return flight an in-flight fuel transfer malfunction forced D-ACON to ditch in the ocean near Manila.

Interestingly, it proves the Germans had the potential to bomb New York in WW2 as a one-off propaganda mission, but because the Condor wouldn't have had enough fuel to get back to Europe it'd have had to ditch at a pre-arranged spot partway back across the Atlantic for the crew to be picked up by a U-Boat.

The sad end of D-ACON:

On 6 December 1938, the four-engined German built Focke-Wulf Fw-200 Condor, registration D-ACON, ditched in shallow waters off of Cavite, just a few miles SSW of Manilla, Philippines, due to a double engine failure, apparently caused by faulty switching of fuel tanks.

It was on a promotional tour, on it's first return leg back to Germany from Tokyo. It was not originally planned to fly to Manila but was invited by the German Consul in Manila to show off to the Filipinos and other foreigners.

All the crew safely escaped. The constabulary and policemen guarded the aircraft. The aircraft was also inspected by 10th US Navy district, the commander of the Cavite Naval yard and the PC provincial commander.

The Germans complained and (could read "concerned about the") lost three briefcases "with very important documents on board.".

Two small girls drowned when they went on a raft to visit the wreckage. Ultimately, their bodies were found by local fishermen. Despite the security measures, people flocked to see the German plane, paying 1 peso each to fishermen to row them to and from the airplane.

The aircraft was a total loss due to salt water and the many souvenir hunters removing whatever they could. The Atlantic Gulf and Pacific Company salvaged the aircraft and carried it to safe harbour. It was eventually dismantled and put aboard a ship back to Germany.

The accident may have helped influence Goering's critical decision to discard plans for a four engine long-range bomber, and thus sorely restrict the range of the Luftwaffe's bomber forces.



8th Jan 2015, 18:58
The crew of D-ACON: (Notice the crew member on the far right has a different style of cap band and badge than the rest of the crew, including the officers behind them) I'll guess the crew member on the far right is the wireless operator.

8th Jan 2015, 19:01
Is the officer third from the left, (above photograph), Blofeld's twin brother?

8th Jan 2015, 22:15
Is the officer third from the left, (above photograph), Blofeld's twin brother?An interesting comparison Brian, but....

Your Ernst Stavro Blofeld photo shows an imposter! His scar should be on the right side!

Another comparison to consider. I have always maintained this is Joseph Goebbels at Northolt Airport Customs circa 1950...
(I dunno who the creepy dude with the dark eyes in the foreground is - but I don't like the look of him!)


8th Jan 2015, 22:39
I read it as a little more than 15 hours for the fast eastbound trip!
As i read the Stratocruiser to use about 16 hour for the same trip, I'm puzzled: the gain by the 707 jet shouldnt be just one hour :-/

8th Jan 2015, 23:37
Ah yes.. Northolt, that den of Nazi refugees..Goebbels wearing a bow-tie and smoking a pipe. Now that I think about it... Yes! Quite possible...!

Regarding enroute times, the flights occasionally performed an unadvertised fuel stop at Gander or Reykjavik.

For a brand new 2015 Ford Fiesta, what was the name of Blofeld's cat?

9th Jan 2015, 07:04
For a brand new 2015 Ford Fiesta, what was the name of Blofeld's cat?A trick question I suspect - the cat had no movie name!
How and where do I collect my new car mate?! :)

And the cat did not enjoy working in the movie industry...


9th Jan 2015, 08:31
I read it as a little more than 15 hours for the fast eastbound trip!
As i read the Stratocruiser to use about 16 hour for the same trip, I'm puzzled: the gain by the 707 jet shouldnt be just one hour

What timetable are you reading? On the Pan Am timetable the times are:- depart New York 20.00, arrive London 07.35. With 5-hour time difference (ie 20.00 in NY is 01.00 in London) that gives a journey time of 6hr 35m.

Similarly, for the BA510 (BOAC Strat) the flying time is 12hr 45min.

9th Jan 2015, 13:36
Even though You clearly wrote LOCAL time for the Stratocruiser I couldn't manage to put tha t into the calculation :-(
TNX for the calc. ;-)

The two timetables shows that the jets had the same impact on traveltime as the Concorde had a decade later, wich is commonly forgotten!

Shaggy Sheep Driver
9th Jan 2015, 14:54
It didn't always go to plan. The book 'The Water Jump' gives a detailed record of trans-Atlantic flight. I think the inaugural BOAC Strat flight Heathrow to NY took a couple of days with some unscheduled stops en route!

9th Jan 2015, 22:10
I think Gander kept itself desirable through low fuelprices.
My wifes first airtravel was CPH - MIA and even though it was about 25 years ago the actual DC10 should be able to do that distance, but had a refuelling-stopover in Gander each way!

9th Jan 2015, 22:15
The guy in the middle got himself a so called mensur scar wich have been high fashion in Germanys upper class!