Check Ride. Not happy with your DPE, what can you do?

[MitchStick]

Hi all,
I recently did my CFII (helicopter) check ride and I wasn't happy at all with the examiner.
First was the fee, $800 for an added rating seemed a little excessive to me, especially cos I never paid or heard someone pay that much for any check ride.

Then we went in to the flight, the PTS clearly states that the examiner has to act as a student for this check ride, when I asked him to take control he said he couldn't because he would only act as an autopilot and ONLY when I would have to load the next approach on the gps, all the rest was up to me, we had a brief discussion where I told him what the pts said, but he would not hear of it so, with frustration, I moved on.
All the flight went by, did a precision and a non precision app. as per pts and the other required tasks, no words from the examiner, we came back, landed, get in to the office and at that point only he started to say something about I went full scale on the glide slope (which I didn't see happening) and that was not within standards, to cut the story short he failed me for that.
The pts states in bold letters that if the applicant fails, the test may be continued ONLY with the consent of the applicant.
Now that clearly did not happen.

So with the questions:
Is there someone that regulate the DPE fees or that is entirely up to them and how they wake up in the morning?
The DPE didn't follow the PTS in my opinion, should I talk to the local FSDO or to who?

FYI: we went up again for a little "extra fee" and completed the check ride with no drama the day after.

[zondaracer]

If you feel that the DPE did not conduct the exam fairly, then you should contact his POI at the FSDO, but since you continued with a retest before contacting the FSDO, you may not have much to stand on. Was this an initial instructor rating?

I have paid $850 before for a checkride, although it is alittle on the high side.

[MitchStick]

No I was adding the instrument instructor to my existing CFI rating.
For the CFI rating I paid $600 with another DPE and in my opinion he was very well prepared.

I'm not familiar with the acronym, what's a POI and how do I find it?

[MarkerInbound]

The Principal Operations Inspector is the Head Fed for an airline. There is a different term for the Fed overseeing a 142 school, I'm not sure what the title is of a Fed overseeing DEs. But there is one.

As to the fee, you knew what it was before the ride, correct? It's whatever the market will bear. There's nothing the Feds can do about that except create another DE for competition.

[morley846]

Hi Mitch,

I had a similar thing happen to me on my Multi-Engine Commercial Checkride. I asked another examiner for advice and he put it in pretty clear terms. If you are doing this as a career and you have 30 years ahead of you do you really want to piss off the FAA and have them scrutinise you for the future by complaining or take it on the chin and be able to explain it at interview with no FAA hassle.

Now the advice didn't sit well with me as he was obviously looking out for the DPE. Fortunately I managed to arrange a compromise on the re-check with regards to the fee. In my opinion it's not worth the hassle complaining and dealing with the FAA. You may think they are fair but if you deal with the wrong person they can make your life and career miserable/impossible. You passed on the re-check, explain the failure at interview and move on. Trust me long term it's the best option. It leaves a sour taste in the mouth but focus on the bigger picture and the end goal.

Just my two cents!

[MitchStick]

That's kind of what I thought as well, hence why I went up the next day to finish the ride off, I didn't wanna embark myself in a quest potentially harmful for my career, and as you morley846 said, it's not worth the hassle.

I kind of care for other people too (I'm a nice guy) and my complain was more like so future applicants wouldn't have to go trough what I've been.

The way I see it is that a check ride is not only a very experienced pilot putting under test a novice pilot, it's also a customer paying top dollar for a service, in my opinion that service has to meet certain standard, and the FAA should control that more closely.

What I can do for now is avoid recommending that DPE to other pilots..

[BigGrecian]

I think your experience is pretty routine.

The FAA has lost complete control of it's examiners and the majority of tests have no regard for the PTS.

[mad_jock]

Sounds like he gave you more of a handling skills test than an instructor test.

[BigGrecian]

And that is exactly why the FAA system is broken. All you have to do on an FAA CFI test is fly a commercial test from the right hand seat.

With no minimum training and poor quality testing this is why the standard of FAA instructors and instruction has plummeted in recent years. They then train the next generation and this has become a spiral to the bottom.

[MitchStick]

That's my problem mad_jock.
I don't have any problems showing my skills or flying at a commercial level, but in my opinion a CFI check ride is not about showing your flying or knowledge skills, it's about showing that you can effectively teach those skills.

[mad_jock]

you have to have some flying skills for demo's also knowledge to pass on to the student.

But the skill of a FI is the transfer of knowledge to the punter.

All sounds a bit horrible to be honest, and makes a the rating worthless if anyone that can pole an aircraft can get it.