Qatar Airways On The Slippery Slope

[A300Man]

Guys,
I've read all of your interesting postings on the subject of QR. Like Taba, I worked on the other side of the door too. The situation at QR now is absolutely terrible, and the worst it has ever been.

The sudden departure of several high profile management (including the GMFOPS and GM Cabin Crew) goes to show the level that the Company has descended to (no pun intended).

The current expansion - whilst encouraging in the current climate - is bound to be the beginning of the end. Crew and staff morale is an an all time low. As posted in the CC Forum, I noted that on almost every flight, there are maximum 2 senior crew, and the remaining 9 are all brand new. Passengers are now starting to notice the difference and complaints are at an all time high.

The Company has some really smashing deck and cabin crew. The remaining cabin crew who were the pioneers and who joined the company back in 1996 are now totally sick and are being treated like children by the CEO (or Poisoned Dwarf as you seem to call him).

Staff turnover is unbelievable - 6 CSD's have resigned and left the company within the last month, along with another 16 crew.

One thing only needs to change to ensure that a company with incredible potential does not shatter into irrecoverable pieces - REPLACE THE CEO IMMEDIATELY. This guy will be the ruin of Qatar Airways.

(Do you know that he has imposed a rule on all staff going on leave that they cannot carry more than 20kgs of hold luggage on a flight. Just imagine going on leave for the first time in 12 months, and only being able to carry 20kgs of luggage. Crew who turn up at the airport with 21kgs or 30kgs are not allowed to submit their luggage, or must pay a fine to be allowed to check-in the same........which other airline in the world treats it's loyal servants with such disdain and filfthy discourtesy.)

Ciao

[themaskofh]

what u have said is toooooo mucccccchhhhh
i think every body who got to say some thing shall say it to the person who think that giving him bad time ,lots of pepole dont like it but they say so to the managment,not here my dear,if i was saying some thing i will be sure it is right,the company is doing so good thanks to the ceo and the goverment,not to u of course,we are expanding ,we are gaining more passengeres,more respect any body who cant stand it shall say so and challenge and do some thing not hide and write here,i wish u got the point,u seem smart a...
our company is better than 10000 company of the west and the east ,i agree some times we are being pushed to work hard but that is true ,but we build it for the past 7 years from scratch ,look at it now and say nothing , and then juge how we turn it like this thanks to our stuff all of them ,the aviation in the whole gulf change to better thing and nicer way to fly,..
look and learn ,our ceo may be strict but look at his complished and be quite ,some thing u cant under stand ,our gmfo,we start with out him he is welcome to stay or leave ,he is one of our stuff , some disagreement he can defend him self he dosent need u his position and power and salary is more than u and his experince ,he is trying to do some thing if he cant he has boss after him will take the decition
once again all of our stuff are trying so good and we thank them from the coffe boy to the ceo ,we are doing better as group
be quite or writre a fact

[MTQatar]

A300Man,

I hope what you said isn't true. I honestly find it too hard to believe. Ever since I have joined this forum I have seen a small group of members (which I don't need to mention) who keep critisizing Qatar Airways and thier management. The reason why I find these allegations too hard to believe is because they keep coming from a select few individuals who can't miss an oppurtunity to to show both Qatar and Qatar Airways in a bad light.

thmaskofh,

Welcome to PPRUNE, what you said is very interesting and I am happy you joined so that you can show any prospective exmployees that QR isn't as bad as some of the members make it out to be. I agree with your post, the CEO Mr. Akbar Al-Baker might be strict but I think he has been an important element to the success of Qatar Airways. Look at Qatar Airways today and look at them before 1997 when Al-Baker became CEO you'll see how he has been beneficial to QR.
QR has increased capacity by 139% since 1997 yet they still managed to increase load-factor. The passenger growth figures are at an un-precedented level not matched by anyone in the Middle East, not even the Gulf's superstar Emirates.
QR are a very customer oriented airline, in the past I always prefered GF over EK but GF is plagued with delays, inconsistent quality of food and terrible Inflight product. Now QR is my prefered airline of travel because they are customer oriented. I have seen the quality of food increase, the inflight product improve (have you seen the interiors of the A330-200 :eek: ) and the Cabin crew getting better (Although I did get a rude british F/A on my way to DXB).
QR should also be making a profit soon and the airline will have an IPO in the next 2-3 years. No company that isn't ready will have an IPO. Anyone who studied some Economics will know that an IPO can make or break a company, and so only airlines that are confident about their success will have IPOs.
Concidering all of these things I mentioned above, hasn't QR been doing something right at least for the past 5 years? If the staff are such "poorly treated" wouldn't the airline be gone ages ago? And doesn't Mr. Al-Baker as well as his staff deserve some credit for the success of the airline?

The CEO may be strict but I think he is definitly not stupid. With him being strict means that the QR staff will always give 100% of what they are capable of doing and the company will always remain an efficient airline without any of the staff "slacking-off" such as in other airlines in Gulf which don't need mentioning.

Regards,
MTQatar

[Gwapo]

When you talk of the CEO being strict and firing people I think you misinterpret what actually happens. The strictness of the CEO in my opinion is not the question, but how he wields his authority.
Mr Al Baker does not follow any procedures or code of conduct when he decides to terminate anyone from Qatar Airways.
(not like other major airlines which have in place procedures to deal with thier staff should they be accused of erring), He makes arbitrary decisions not based on all the facts but what he has been told by a select few persons. In modern society should a person of such power not follow a procedure to determine the following.
1. That the facts are true as they are alleged.
2. That the accused is allowed to have his say.
3. That any punishment fits the crime.

In fact in a good Muslim society is it not expected that both sides are invited to have thier say.

I was at the recieving end of the CEO and was told I had 24 hrs to get out of the country without any recourse to a hearing, interview or disciplinary procedures. It was quite an ordeal for both my family and I. I am of the opinion I did nothing wrong except be honest in my dealings with everybody.

Ther are some very good people in Qatar Airways and the CEO is probably doing a good job in certain respects within the airline but he is the CEO not the personnel manager and should act accordingly. (I know no other major airline where the CEO gets involved in firing people) I have no animosity towards Qatar Airways and wish everyone well, (many are fellow pilots after all) but I will never forgive anyone who defends the dictatorial regime of Mr Baker.

I am sure many of you who work for Qatar know who I am. Thanks for the help when I left. I am working so no probs. As I said in a previous post, nothing wrong with Qatar or Qatar Airways that a little honesty from some of the locals and Mr Baker wouldn't fix.

Good luck to everone but don't get financially committed to the country whilst there.

Best regards

[Tom Cruise]

hey Gwapo

what r u flyiin now? b757/767 or ru still on the 320?
nice to know ur workin and all is well

take care man

[Gwapo]

Hi Tom
B737-800 now.
Regards

[pontius's pa]

What is really sad about all this is that Al Baker genuinely wants the airline to be a great success and genuinely believes that he is going about it the right way.

His commercial instinct is impeccable.

I am told that he was once heard to remark something along the lines that he will continue to turn over management and staff until he gets the team that he wants.

Unfortunately, the way that he seems to be going, he will end up with a team that nobody else wants.

Qatar Airways has the potential to be a great airline, if only it is given the chance. However, until the CEO realises that he must stick to what he does best, and trust professional experienced airline managers do the nitty gritty, and for xxxxx's sake stop meddling in the small things, I am afraid that it has limited attraction as a potential employer.

And that is a terrible shame

[gulf-crew]

MT QATAR

I presume I might be one of the people you are referring to???

Well lets just put a few things straight, I enjoyed my time in qatar and loved the country very much, I always enjoyed returning to Doha after my leave and on long haul flights. My words on qatar airways does not reflect my regard for the country which is very up and coming. However the way in which Snack Bar the Baker (ie Akbar) treats his staff and managers is wholly insane. A Manager at Qatar Airways is not a manager but a puppet on a string and anyone who things different is out of their head and should not hold the position their in.

The way that I was treated was not only disgusting but inhumane. Not only was I demoted with any warning but the words used were "we dont know why he just wants it that way" When I finally resigned after 4 years with the company one of the longest staying europeans at the time I was notified on a thursday evening that the chief wanted me out of the country by sunday. It was totally impossible with it being the weekend but it was also ramadan. Also I would like to see you trying to pack up 4 years in two days as well as sell a car.?????

The remarks we have all made are not about the Country but about Qatar Airways and the Chief and believe me, the airline would do a dam site better if he was not in the picture. It could have been the next EK but they have lost a great deal of good people who could have dont it but for the CHIEF.

Hope this clarifies things.
:) :) :)

[foxtrot]

Hye guys
There is nothing wrong with Qatar Airways, it is a swell company, doing well,expanding and in near future it will end up as the leading airline in the region.

hye Mt Qatar and themaskofh, fully agree with you guys and the others well if you cant take the heat get out of the kitchen.
bye folks.

[gulf-crew]

Hey Foxtrot

So if nothing wrong with the company then why do they have such a big turnover of staff and you are still very short of crews both f/deck and cabin

European crews dont stay that long wonder why???? Just heard 10 british cabin crew left to join b/med

And it would be a even better company if they got rid of the chief.
EK pay better , have better accom and better staff travel.


:D :D :D

[LBMF]

MT QATAR

Please see engineer forum.
FACT No replies to many applicants.
FACT No offers / rejections letters after people have had interviews
FACT Not even a tour around Doha to show prospective employees what the place is like.

Not a good way to advertise QR to prospective employees is it.

No salary or details of terms & conditions for prospective staff at interviews. Is there no pay scale or just offer what you think people will take?

Eventually QR will have to start paying serious money just to get people to even apply.

I am not having a go at you personally but you keep defending a company that treats potential empoyees with contempt.

Maybe you could get some replies to applicants on if they are going to be offered a jo of not.

[MTQatar]

LBMF maybe you should check out QR's website it will answer a lot of your questions.

[sirwa69]

Call me niaeve but what the F@#k has the CEO of a commercial organisation got to do with passport and immigration procedures.

Surely all he can do is have your residence permit cancelled and when that happens doesn't the immigration department give you a standard amount of time to leave the country, I think it is 2 weeks in Bahrain.

If the CEO is however ordering the immigration department to not grant this then maybe that is the problem.

Qatar authorities should not allow him to override procedures. Even in Saudi now this practice is being stopped.

The only people who should have the right to throw you out of a country (deport) should be the courts as it is in Bahrain.

However it does seem that Qatar Airways do need someone strong to be their HR manager, maybe an Al Thani!!

Personally I travel between Bahrain and Qatar a lot and having tried Qatar Airways once I am sticking to Gulf Air and the simple reason is that Gulf Air do not try to do a cabin service on such a short flight. On the Qatar Aircraft it is a total panic and we ended up circling at Bahrain until the Cabin Crew had secured the cabin.

[Fokkerwokker]

DOH-BAH...I remember it well!. Launch off 34 - expect straight in RW 30 BAH.

West Qatar coast FL100 @ VMO then join ILS...don't touch the speedbreak...dont bust any parameters otherwise the 'spy in the sky' would have you in Len's office pdq! I recollect the girlies used to ask us to leave the seatbelts on so they could sit back and have a fag behind the curtain.;) It usually resulted in a 'chocktail' for the boys:D

Moresalami folks

[chainsaw]

MT Qatar,

Get real!!! The Q7 website is NOTHING like what goes on day-to-day with this farce of an airline.

Stop pushing the "glossy apple" image for an outfit that is (and always HAS been) rotten to the core!!!! :mad: The original management style of Hamid bin Ali couldn't have been worse, and the present management probably would have been hard-pressed to reach a similar level of incompetence, but by all accounts from the posts on this thread, they seem to be trying pretty hard to match the previous CEO's level of ineptitude! :(

sirwa69 is right............due process of the law SHOULD apply to those who incur Al-Baker's wrath...........but it doesn't happen in Qatar that way, AS PLENTY OF EVIDENCE SUGGESTS. Where's the decency/democratic processes (that shold apply)/fairness in that sort of a system??? I'll tell you, MT..........NONE!! :eek:

This airline does have a chance I suppose, and maybe COULD be a great airline in its own right.............but I don't think it will ever succeed until the mercurial little SOB who heads it (a.k.a. PD) is removed! :(

I know from bitter experience MT Qatar! You obviously DON'T, so stop the propaganda crap that you're posting.

[MTQatar]

chainsaw,

Hamid bin Ali management style was terrible but is irrelevant. No, I am not spreading propaganda. The most propaganda I have seen comes from the "QR haters". One example is A300Man's other post which says that a South African F/A that was fired for loosing a button. Or the Cabin Crew manager who dissapeared because Al-Baker dissaproved. That is propaganda in its real form because that is not the real reason she was fired and he dissapeared. You guys here twist the facts to suit your argument and to show QR in the worst light.
I have always tried to refrain from personal attacks but I get them all the time, let me tell you those personal attacks do nothing but show that you have to resort to them in your replies.

QR has more than 1800 employees many of them were with the airline from 1997. I don't see a mass exodus from the airline which alone, is enough evidence to suggest that the management knows how to run the airline.

Their have been many who resigned because they can't handle a strict management and in arrogance want to do everything in their way. IMO it is good that they have left the airline because their is no room for mistakes.

And about the website, LBMF has asked about the interview process etc, and I just wanted to say that he kind information about that on their website.

Regards,
MTQatar

[Tom Cruise]

hey MTQatar

Uhave my full support on that one. People here enjoy their time in doha , make a lotta money and then when they get fired talk bad bout the airline. The CEO might have his faults, but if youre human u have to have faults. u cant be perfect.

I think this airline has a lotta potential and in course of time will be right up there.

Everyone talks bout EK and how good they are but let me remind you that when they started they were equally bad for the first 7 - 10 years.

[Bullishit]

Hi Tom Cruise.When i started with EK about 12 years ago they were not as bad as the forums on this post,and are still not to bad now.
:) :)

[A300Man]

Hi MT Qatar and everyone.

Please be assured that I am (or rather was) very passionate about Qatar AW and the success of the company. I have been involved with the company in various external capacities since 1997, and I have always wanted the company to be a success.

However, please clarify the following, since you have chosen to disbelieve my reliable sources quoted in my previous posts:-

- The girl fired for the button incident. If it was not for a missing button, please tell me what it was;

- Cabin Crew manager vanished after his leave and did not return. (I am referring to the gent with the initials EP, and not MB who, as we know, was thrown out for improper financial behaviour.) Why did EP disappear without trace?

- How can you say that the above did not fit with the framework of the airline at present?

- Why is the UK CAA currently investigating QR flightdeck crews who are operating long asian sectors and then onto LHR with minimum rest in between?

- Why are deck and cabin crew now being given days off downroute during layovers, rather than legally at base? During a layover, the crew must abide by strict QR rules and cannot lave the station for any reason. How then can this be classified as a legal off day?

Things at QR are not as good and NOT as legal as they should be. And, MT Qatar, I am speaking from within!!!!!! So, don't patronise me please with your rantings.


Take care all of you and fly safely

[MTQatar]

A300Man

I can answer your first three questions privatly, so give me your email address or email me. The last two I don't know anything about but I will ask for you.


sf340driver

I think they are very strict in the Airbus type rating aspect, because it is cost and time saving. Maybe sometime in the future this will change.


Regards,
MTQatar

[A300Man]

MT Qatar,

Thanks for your offer. I have tried to e-mail you but the administrator has knocked me back 3 times now. It appears that you have selected the private mode. Any other way that I can make contact with you?

By the way, I appreciate your stance regarding the airline and I too really do want QR to succeed. But, not at the cost of compromised safety or low morale amongst the hitherto excellent crews.

I think that U and I have the same aims in mind, bit with a different point of view.

Anyway, let me know how to contact you.

Regards.

[MTQatar]

A300Man,

I have shown my email on my profile, I'll keep it visible for 12 hours so if you are not online by 7pm GMT i'll have to contact you another way. I am sorry if I sounded rude I didn't meant. I was just frustrated but that still doesn't justify me being rude so please accept my apology.

[A300Man]

MT Qatar,

Thanks for your e-mail clarifying the situation. I have tried to reply with some further comments, but the e-mail address given appears to be unreachable just now.

Could you please mail me again with an alternative one, should you have it?

With many thanks.

[MTQatar]

A300Man I have sent you an alternative email.

[A300Man]

Hi MT Qatar,

I will make contact with you re various issues on Saturday / Sunday. Off to London tonight and back in couple of days. Wont have time to type a few words before I go or whilst there.

Thanks for the alt e-mail address and your patience!!!

A300Man

[MTQatar]

A300Man,

I am looking forward to reading your email though I haven't received it yet.

[GULFPILOT76]

Hello expats in QR!
Please don't try to understand the airline business around the gulf because I've learned it's impossible. Maybe if you try to walk and live up side down (and fly ;) ) may be then you will understand the way things are done around this region.

[Fubaar]

Any expats going Qatar way might do well to read something from PPRuNe's past regarding the early days of another airline in the same area. From what I read here, history seems to be repeating itself.

http://www.pprune.org/go.php?go=/pub/fun/caravan.html

[cabin secure]

Can anyone give me an indication as to the oldest CSM's or F/A's that are employed by Qatar at the moment.

[cabin secure]

Are Qatar flight attendants based anywhere outside of Qatar?And if so where?
It seems there may be some interest in ex Ansett employees. However the average age of AN crew was 38 years. According to the website it appears they prefer very early 20's.

[foxtrot]

Gulf Crew
there is no shortage of cockpit crew at Qatar Airways, though new guys are joining due to expansion of the fleet.
well none of the cockpit crew are leaving, a few cabin crew yes,
not because of any thing being wrong with Qatar Airways but most of them are heading homewards.
HOPE THIS PUTS YOUR MIND TO REST.sorry for taking so long to get back to you, just got back home.
take care

[nickmelb]

cabinsecure....qatar airways will be advertising for cabin crew 29 june in sydney papers..i put up a post in the cabin crew section

cheers

[Gnadenburg]

Aussie Girls in Qatar -Hah.Hope they don`t sell themselves short.