Free Spirit Planning Burnie RPT?

[Rotor Work]

From todays Advocate Newspaper

Free Spirit planning Burnie air service | The Advocate (http://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/2647624/free-spirit-planning-burnie-air-service/?cs=87)

A new airline is planning a Burnie service.
Melbourne-based Free Spirit Airlines is not saying much about its plans at this stage.

Spokesman Roman Badov yesterday said the plan involved something more complex than a Burnie-Melbourne service.
It is not yet clear what level of competition it would provide to established Burnie-Melbourne carrier Regional Express if Free Spirit did start a Burnie route.
Free Spirit is seeking a liquor licence for the disused western terminal of the Burnie Airport.
According to its application, it wants the ability to sell liquor on the premises to passengers and the people greeting or farewelling passengers.
The Licensing Board will hear the application at a later date.
Mr Badov said he was not prepared to reveal more than was publicly available for "commercial in confidence" reasons."It is intended business activities in the area will be of significant public benefit," he said.
"We . . . look forward to a very long and amicable relationship with the local residents of the area."
He said all would be revealed by a press release "at the appropriate time".
He said Free Spirit was not associated with any other airline - including a similarly named outfit in the US - and was not planning to list on the ASX.
A company website suggests it will target airports serviced by only one other airline and that a lower cost structure would allow a lower fare structure.
"The company will operate scheduled regular public transport services to numerous regional destinations within Australia in turbine-powered aircraft," the website says.
It said the airline would start operations in 2014.

[fanning]

So not affiliated with the free spirit from the usa
What about the elite airways based in the US? (Funningly enough, melbourne in Florida)

Easy Google search - EliteAirways.info WHOIS, DNS, & Domain Info - DomainTools (http://whois.domaintools.com/eliteairways.info)

Code share perhaps :8

[thorn bird]

"A company website suggests it will target airports serviced by only one other airline and that a lower cost structure would allow a lower fare structure."

Wonder if they have had any dealings with CAsA yet?

CAsA and a "Low cost structure" are simply incompatible.

[BNEA320]

they could be doing a virtual airline, so wouldn't have to deal with CASA & could have virtually no staff.


ie. do almost everything online.


There seem to be plenty of under utilised airlines around the country right now. Easy to name a few.


+ maybe not looking at using MEL but rather other Melbourne airports.


Have seen 30+ seaters at Moorabbin & Essendon can take up to 100 seaters.

[BNEA320]

Couple of saabs sitting at tsv for nearly 6 months

[mattyj]

"Free spirit"...."liquor licence"...I think they could be onto a real winner here!!!

[onehitwonder]

I had heard he has a B1900D already painted just awaiting CASA approval

[Duck Pilot]

Wasn't there another proposed Dubbo based operator planning to start up operations utilising a 1900D some time ago? I believe they were planning on using Essendon as well.

[falconx]

Gutsy move taking on another established carrier but hey good luck, more flying for the rest of us. Good choice of aircraft

[wheredidwhogo]

Good choice of plane esp for the day tripper to Melbourne, they will have the advantage operating from Essendon V Tulla. Good luck to them!

[onehitwonder]

How's Roman going? December isnt far away

[onehitwonder]

Little birdy tells me B190 from west wing, arrives next week....

[Koizi]

29 days to go…. I can barely contain my excitement

[onehitwonder]

give us the goss...

Love the aircraft choice!

[PLovett]

If they are planning on using a B1900 then pilots love them and accountants hate them. How long is that going to last then?

Free Spirit is seeking a liquor licence for the disused western terminal of the Burnie Airport.

Well for a start its not disused as the office space is used by an existing airport user. The old terminal waiting area is disused for a very good reason. It leaks like a sieve in any decent rainfall.

Rex do very well on that run and I would imagine not give it up without a fight. How deep are the pockets then?

[red_dirt]

hopefully not another dreamer.

We've seen enough of them over the last 12 months.

Let's hope this one pays his bills

[Southern handler]

I do wonder just how well REX do go out of BWT. A few years ago they would of been going quite well but I would think that loads would be dropping out of BWT, the locals are after something larger than the old Saab's

[Horatio Leafblower]

Handler,

You say in the same breath that loads are decreasing yet the locals are looking for something bigger than a SAAB.

I presume you are aware of the contradiction between those two ideas?

[Capt Claret]

In many a regional town or city around Australia, the locals have wanted larger, and/or a jet but haven't been prepared to pay the entry fee, because of course, they wanted rock bottom fares too.

[Southern handler]

Hi Claret, I am aware of the contradiction. The locals are calling out for a larger aircraft, read that as low cost carrier a large number of the greater burnie populace will drive straight to DPO about a 50 min drive airport to airport or LST at the same time by not supporting the local airport the are of course making the local airport less viable.
Good luck to Free spirit but I can't see it happening. Really not sure why they would be after a grog licence when the airport cafe also sell the product

[Horatio Leafblower]

....Narrabri punters used to drive to TMW rather than gamble on the J32/Metro/J41 too.

The main factors were reliabilty, FF points, reliability, aircraft size and reliability.

I think reliability was a factor too.

Add to that the fact the punters were never guaranteed the aircraft would actually arrive, let alone depart, and overall I guess reliability could be said to be a contibuting factor. :ugh:

[BPA]

West wings 1900 is still in CS, but hasn't flown for almost 2 weeks. So perhaps it's being prepared for a trip down south?

[onehitwonder]

Be good to see him pull it off

[Stationair8]

Any progress yet?

Advertising on the AFAP a website for captains.

[continueapproach737]

lack of captains around?

Seems the 1900's are starting to dominate in the west chewing up the crew

[Eastwest Loco]

I have bitten my tongue until now but enough is enough.

Over the years I have seen Bizjets come and go with a Metro as well as Murray Valley with the Irish schoolbus into and out of Devonport as well as Aus Air out of MBW.

All went West on a smaller market than Wynyard.1

Base line facts are 25% minimum traffic is oncarriage. Write that off going into MEB.

Transport out of MEB is sketchy. When I was a kid the tram went right into the airport. Correct me if it isn't the case but I believe it no longer does.

Anything smaller than 34 seats will not entice the punters and never has, as the Metro Kendell services n the middle of the day didn't after the takeover by the fat butthole from TNT of the EW operations.

All I can see as an obvious is negotiations pending between the Port of Burnie, the Burnie Council and Wynyard/Waratah involving an undisclosed sling to open services that will no doubt fall over. It smacks of Impulse being thrown a big dollar that was never fully disclosed to open Launceston operations.

There is no logic to this so therefore operating to a commercially dead zone must be for reasons of short term financial gain.

The Councils down here aren't clever enough to avoid a spinning propeller.

Best all

EWL

[tauro]

EWL, who says they are going to be operating from Tulla? :ooh:

[Horatio Leafblower]

Nobody says.

...and that's his point. :bored:

[Eastwest Loco]

With all due respect tauro, anyone who has a basic knowledge of commercial airport codings would regognise MEB as Essendon, just as MBW is Moorabbin.

Airline 101.

Best all

EWL

[onehitwonder]

How's free spirit going?

[Mach E Avelli]

In these times of supposed pilot surplus, the fact that they have repeatedly advertised for pilots in what is a very popular base has pegged my bull**** detector.
Possibly an elaborate pay to fly scheme?

[red_dirt]

I love seeing new guys start out but this one is just a dreamer IMHO. I'm happy to eat my hat though.

Starting from nothing to an RPT operation seems to be a common dream and very VERY few actually pull it off.

Viva jet
Vista jet
Connect jet mark 1, 2 & 3
RMA Airways
Gold airways
Stallion Air Cargo
Caribou Air Cargo

[Ramjet555]

Roman is a hell of nice guy, and with lots of courage to take on this challenge that has on statistics, odds against success that I'm sure every one wishes him and anyone else who takes on the challenge of starting another aviation business.

Lets hope their dreams come true.

I remember going to Burnie, I think it was on a vikers vicount when I was too young for even kindergarten but knew my morse code that got me a ride in the cockpit and lots of smiles as they wound the old ADF handle around and got me to identify the aids.

[Wizofoz]

It's a nice thought Ramjet, but remember "There is no-one more dangerous than a fool with good intentions".

Nice guy or not, unless he has a sound business plan and lots os start-up cash (and neither seem to be the case) he has little chance.

That's fine- his funeral and that of anyone unwise enough to extend him credit- but he ALSO seems to be trolling for wannabes to stump up large amounts of cash on a fanciful "Cadet" scheme (anyone remember "AAA Airlines"??) and inevitably, some naive youngster will get caught up in the "Dream" and get well and truly stung.

[TBM-Legend]

vikers vicount

I only ever got to fly on a Vickers Viscount:rolleyes:

[BPA]

Well the rumour of Westwing Aviations B1900 heading south to commence Ops for them looks like it was just a rumour.

[Koizi]

Roman is a hell of nice guy

He may be, but remember, he is a disgruntled ex-REX employee who is probably only doing this to rattle some cages on his way out of aviation.

[mattyj]

sniff, sniff...I think I can smell...camp dog!!

[Al E. Vator]

The naysayers always come out of the woodwork in these cases.

I have been around on PPRuNE long enough to see people say the same thing about Branson's effort at a startup in Australia and another one about Impulse (somebody even saying they'd run naked down the Sydney terminal if the latter lasted more than 6 months)...Impulse is now of course Jetstar. More recently JetGo was the subject of the same negative types and they seem to be doing ok.

So I wish these guys great success. Perhaps expand slowly into say Devonport and Wynyard and also to Albury and Mildura etc and maybe form an alliance with Sharp. A bit of competition is a fine idea.

[Copythisnumberdown]

The naysayers always come out of the woodwork in these cases

Well put Al E. The tall poppy bull**** syndrome on PPRune is shameful. You don't see it in America or Europe, why is it that us Australians seem to have to knock and ridicule anything that is different or new. These new companies are often funded from 2nd mortgages and a vision. Some work some don't, however no one starts these companies with a vision of going broke and leaving a trail of debts. Whilst these new companies are alive, they are providing employment and career path for new pilots. So, wake The F*** up and offer some moral support for the companies that actually do throw open the doors instead of throwing S*** and them.

[Justa Dash]

It's the Aussie way to have a go, and that's great! But when a business case such as this is in the market the knock em down style that is "the Aussie way" is probably a blessing in disguise! Friends,roman and country men "heed it " is advice to consider!

[Eastwest Loco]

Good call Dash

Operating a second string aeroplane into a pretty much ruptured market from a secondary airport with a mainstream feeder incumbent doing reasonably well but not breaking records?

Not a great business decision in my opinion.

There is no perceivable sense in this alleged venture unless someone requires a tax write off.

Best all

EWL

[Koizi]

So, wake The F*** up and offer some moral support for the companies that actually do throw open the doors instead of throwing S*** and them.

So no doubt you would happily sign the $147,500 cheque for your enthusiastic son/daughter to join their cadet program?

(which they have been actively promoting on their website, forums etc for over 6 months now)

[Rotor Work]

There are always arguments between Devonport & Burnie Wynyard Residents re their airports.
Devonport Airport has finally started charging customers for parking, going from $1 (didn't matter how many days or weeks)to $24 for a week.
Burnie / Wynyard are in the process of upgrading the parking & will also charge, it costs nothing to park their at the moment.

Personally at the moment I bypass Devonport & fly out of Launceston, I do like the idea of Burnie / Essendon

Regards R W

From today's Advocate Local Newspaper with some interesting comments.

Unity sought on airline need | The Advocate (http://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/2830004/unity-sought-on-airline-need/?cs=87)

NORTH-WEST councils must come together and form a regional approach to bring budget airlines to the Coast, according to Burnie alderman Ken Dorsey.
Alderman Dorsey will raise a motion at the Burnie City Council at next week's Tuesday meeting for Burnie to work with the Devonport City Council to attract budget airlines to Coastal airports.
All the motion is, is let's look at the possibilities of working with the councils and making something better for the Coast and that makes it better for Burnie," Alderman Dorsey said.
"I think if we work together with a regional approach, then we will have a much greater opportunity to get it [a budget airline] up here."
He said he did not mind whether the budget airline went to Burnie or Devonport airport and was just interested to "start working with people and let things happen".
Alderman Dorsey said he was a "firm believer" that as long as Coasters kept supporting Launceston or small airports that produced minimal numbers, then a budget airline would never come to the Coast.
He accused the Cradle Coast Authority of failing to give a regional approach on this issue.
The Cradle Coast Authority is embarking on an investigation into all access points to the North-West region, according to CCA chief executive officer Brett Smith.
"We've met with Tourism Tasmania and the Department of State Growth and we will be meeting with all various stakeholders as a part of the investigation," Mr Smith said.
"We want to work out how people are getting here and how we might improve that."The Devonport City Council passed a motion last month to remain committed to working with neighbouring councils, the state government and TasPorts to grow Devonport Airport's potential and attract a budget airline.
At the time Alderman Lynn Laycock said she had taken more phone calls from people wanting a budget airline in Devonport than on any other matter.Yesterday Alderman Laycock was open to the idea of the Burnie and Devonport councils joining forces but said Devonport had already began a "process" meeting with TasPorts and Tourism Tasmania.
"The process has started and we're waiting for more information to see if there is a need for a budget airline in the airport," she said.
She said the Devonport council needed to "let the process run its course".
"If we were to do anything different at the moment, we're only reinventing the wheel," Alderman Laycock said.
Burnie City Council general manager Andrew Wardlaw declined to comment.

[Eastwest Loco]

Rotor

I am 1.5 inches from responding to that Alderman generated crap in the Work Experience Daily regarding a low cost carrier into a Coastal airport here.

Rex is doing a good job out of Wynyard as is QFlink out of DPO.

The last thing either port needs is one middle of the day flight from a low cost insurgent dropping in and taking the base load which is all they will get due to timing.

That screws the overall viability for the incumbents and the most likely flights to be lost are the all important overnight operations which are the most important for the now depleted but significant business community and international outbounds.

More to the point if you operated an A320 into Wynyard a turning bay better be built at Flowerdale (ie: turn onto 333 up the Flowerdale gully in a heavy F27-500) and a full load out of DPO would also be interesting. That rules out Tiger and JQ. Virgin with ATRs is a possible. the Jungle jets would do OK.

Now - the big problem.

Assume VA drop an ATR or JJ into DPO. Where are they going to drag a large portion of their market from? Their LST operation. And guess what? The only stuff out of the North West Coast that will be glommed by a LCC is the very low yield base client. From a tourism point of view there is nothing significant to keep passengers in Burnie or Devonport for more than a day or a night. Don't get me wrong. there are great attractions here but to be enjoyed in passing on the way to Cradle Mountain or Stanley, Launceston. Strahan or Hobart or whatever.

Back to thread, I question the logic of a very small market for a start up from a secondary airport with an aeroplane that is relatively expensive per passenger kilometre to operate.

There is a big pocket awaiting with these Council wankers to provide a cash impetus to an alleged new start because they don't have enough brain to see that the light at the end of the tunnel is actually the 4:17 from Frankston.

We still don't know what Impulse was slung by th Labor Government here to service Launceston before they went over to the rat side of the force.

Never quote Tasmanian Aldermen. They are Committee brained individuals who know nothing which is why they stood for the position. No life and unaware of it.

Best all

EWL

[seneca208]

Free Spirit Airlines (http://freespiritairlines.com.au)

[BPA]

And the flights are operated by West Wing.

[De_flieger]

Well they might want to work on their website a little more. It just allowed me to book a flight between Melbourne and Burnie departing on the 1st January this year, and returning on the 18th January 2015 :suspect: I got up to the point that they asked for my credit card details before I stopped the transaction. Either West Wing is operating charter DeLoreans with Marty McFly, or they need to fix that up.

[onehitwonder]

nice to see someone finally get going

[Eastwest Loco]

There is something decidedly dodgy here.

The website is up and allegedly taking bookings for something that hasn't been advertised down here to my knowledge, complete with FOC bus transfers from downtown DPO to Wynyard.

Insurance is offered (Assurance on the site - Americanised?) and when you go into the detail there is no mention of an underwriter.

Do any of you good ladies and gents know anyone who has been employed to fly the Tasmanian and Merimbula routes for them?

The industry is small enough that someone would be aware.

It would be interesting to know where the bank account that the funds from the website go to is in this world. It is allegedly a NAB based account but logos are easy to copy.

I have a very bad feeling about this. I would like to be proved wrong but it stinks of a major scam.

Best all

EWL

[Eastwest Loco]

Interesting.

The website no longer goes to a multi part site including schedules and a booking engine.

Now just opens onto a "coming soon" page.

Why?

Very interesting and it proves someone is watching here and begs the question of why react like that?

Curiouser and curiouser.

Best all

EWL

[Eastwest Loco]

Even more interesting.

The Free Spirit website link now goes to an Administrator login page.

Anyone good at hacking?

The last mention of this alleged operation locally was 23 October 2014.

If it was all going to happen maybe a Company response would be called for.

No?

Maybe?

Beam me up Scotty - there's no intelligent life down here.

Best all

EWL

[BPA]

They are still advertising for pilots. The proposed aicraft (VH-EMK) has been operating out of Cairns with Westwing for the last 2 weeks. Aircraft is painted in Free Sprit colours without the logo and name.

[onehitwonder]

West Wings AOC...Free Spirit crew....whats the arrangement....who do we apply with?

[Eastwest Loco]

Nothing down here in media since late October last year, no advertising, alleged start up date of late last year.

Why am I cynical? Guess I am just an arsehole. It's been said before and will be again.It is probably correct.

A website with a published fare of $149 one way from Wynyard to Essendon does beg questions as Wynyard passengers must be subsidising Devonport passengers and the intermediaries as that bus service which would require a flexible fleet from sedan through 2 seater would not be cheap to run.

It smells of Bizjets and Walkeritis.

Don't like and certainly will no be selling within 24 months of the alleged start-up and maybe prospective crews need to stand back a second and analyse. Too many parallels to be warm and fuzzy. Also no advertising down here. No credible startup date and no media interest.

Your call folks.

Mine is made right or wrong.

Best all

EWL

[iwillmakeitoneday]

I work at essendon and have since november last year and i've seen the beechcraft 1900 here a few times out the front of their building doing endorsement training and even charters.
just an update if anyone was interested.

[Stationair8]

EWL, take it that you didn't like Ron Walker and Bizjets?



Must have been a bit rude when Ron crashed the cosy party that existed between TAA and Ansett back in those days!


Funny how that FCU for a Metro finished up getting lost on the way out from the states , then the second one finished up in Broome.

[onehitwonder]

iwillmakeitoneday

Really? I find that very hard to believe.

1) Their aircraft is in Cairns
2) They're completing training in Townsville
3) There hasnt been a 1900 in Melbourne since Air South last year

Not criticising at all, I just dont believe in BS.

Hopefully they get going and opens up a few more jobs to those turbo prop pilots made redundant more recently

[Eastwest Loco]

Not totally correct Stationair

Ron's late son Ross was a major thorn in my side several times after Bizjets as he was involved peripherally with State Express which was involved with East West Cargo Express as well as with Bizjets in the day.

During one AN and TN pilot outage East West was still flying and I was up in MEL working on load control and checkin. On the cargo side we had Ross. good one - NOT! He was working tarmac and appeared to not understand the concept of load and trim and aeroplane regos. One afternoon after I checked the load and had to totally pull it apart and restow on the F27 500 he was last seen leaving past Block 5 at a speed that was overheating the tarmac after he heard second hand that I wanted a talk with him.

It is a good thing he did a runner as I would almost certainly have been on an assault charge. There was also an instance of junking the Bizjets limo between Essendon and Tulla with passengers on board.

Ron's Bizjets operation did get up the nose a little as their bus connection from DPO to downtown Burnie dropped off outside the TN Burnie office and the passengers expected to be able to store baggage with us. Yeah - right! Got some interesting responses from the refusals too!

Bizjets may have done an awful lot better but I believe they were supplied with incorrect operating parameters for the engines installed on the Metro that caused multiple unserviceabilties including engine fire on at least one occasion.

Jeff Hooley aka "The Pom" was a total greenhorn in the industry and in charge of the DPO operation for them and made an excellent fist of it and after they folded moved to TN DPO and WNY and was a great workmate until we were closed . Then on to TN ADL.

Ross sadly passed away not long after this sadly leaving a wife and young family.

The incidents are still in the memory, but no need for ongoing angst and a father should never ever have to bury their son.

I do wish Spirit well but would like for some things to start to add up and look logical. currently they are not. Currently I would not recommend a client put funds their way.

Best all

EWL

[BPA]

iwillmakeiitoneday,

Perhaps you need to have your eyes checked. Their proposed aircraft has been in Cairns since 13 January and flew there from Perth. Over the last month it's been operating with West Wing.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/VHEMK

[iwillmakeitoneday]

I know "there" plane is in cairns how've there was a 1900 at the northern finger at essendon one day early last week. even my captain was surprised unfortunately i didn't get the rego but he might of ill ask him tomorrow.
also i have seen the passengers go in and out of the free spirit terminal and from the terminal into the king air and also a light twin.

[BPA]

iwillmakeiitoneday,

Initially you said you had seen their 1900 there a few times out the front of their building doing endorsement training and even charters. Now you are saying you saw a 1900 parked on the northern finger. Free Sprit passengers boarding a King Air and a light twin. So which one is it? Was it a C or a D model?
Seeing a 1900 parked on the northern finger doesn't mean they or anyone else are doing endorsement training.

A quick check of flight aware on all the 1900's operating in Australia and I couldn't find any record of them being to YMEN at all this year.

[Koizi]

Ok, so there are many different aircraft coming and going from Essendon using the charter/RPT terminal. Is this new?

The real question is how many of these are actually going to WYY or MER?

[Rotor Work]

Just heard on the local radio that Free Spirit will start operations into Burnie from the second week of April.regards R W

[Eastwest Loco]

April what year Rotor?

Just checked the website - it was down.

Just madness launching anything under 3 months lead time.

If you rely on the local alleged media here you should realise that they will believe it is your Mercedes, that it's only a cold sore and that you won't come in their mouth.

If anyone was thinking and they are starting up, maybe making the local retail Travel community would be the best bet.

Rex don't pay commissions and you have to book on their pain in the butt website to get the better fares where a client needs them so it would be logical if not mandatory to get us on the ride for viability.

If you can't book them, why announce the service?

Time for them to check their marketing management and consider a cull. Some family members obviously in positions they are overwhelmed by within the organisation.

Best regards

EWL

[continueapproach737]

EWL, have to second RW they were plugging it yesterday on local print and radio!

Quick search on flightaware in fact reveals that their 1900 (VH-EMK) has actually arrived in Essendon.

[Stationair8]

Must be getting in early for April fools day!

[Koizi]

I'm with stationair8 and EWL,

With their main website down, and their cadet website last updated in April 2014 and their FB account's last post Aug 2014, they don't strike me as being very active and ready to go.

This would not be the first time they have gone to the media claiming a start date. Last report from Mr Badov was ops before the end of 2014, then silence. Expect the same again.

[TwoFiftyBelowTen]

BE1900C VH-EMK Essendon-Wynyard return today. Crew training/route proving.

[Rotor Work]

There is still no news in the local paper,
Yesterday's radio report also mentioned that they had a liquor licence both at Wynyard & Essendon.
I had a look at the state liquor licence web site & their application for a liquor licence for Wynyard was granted on the 19th November 2014
continueapproach737 thanks for backing me up re the radio reports yesterday :ok:

[Di_Vosh]

With all due respect to RW and continueapproach737...

The point that Eastwest Loco (and others) were making is that regardless of the radio coverage, if you can't access the webpage or haven't told the local travel agents that you're conducting a service, then you're not going to get bookings. Simple as that.

Marketing is king. If you don't get your message out there (and mid-April is only three weeks away) no-one is going to know you're operating. You may have the best service out there at the cheapest prices, but if no-one knows about it, you're still going to go broke.

My 2c.

DIVOSH!

[Eastwest Loco]

That's just my point Di Vosh

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and craps in ponds it's a fair chance it's a duck but if nobody knows there is a duck for sale it in reality doesn't exist.

If I was a shareholder I would be furious at their pathetic attempt at marketing on a ridiculously short lead time.

Considering we are talking early to end of Easter break and on into the 2nd half of April the discretionary dollar has all been spent and the punters are generally set. They won't be thinking of the next holiday rush until after they have enjoyed the trip they booked in January.

Someone needs to take hold of the marketing and another the scheduling. It is not rocket science, but at the moment we have pocket science - hand in rapid motion.

If you are going to do it guys and girls man (and girl if applicable) up - delay launch until June, market properly with a website and inventory system with an active yield management component that has been designed by a professional.

The glass mountain is out there and some direction is needed to avoid it.

Best all

EWL

[continueapproach737]

Noted and I tend to agree, but note where that aircraft has been in just the last 2 days. Talking with a couple of the Captains, proving flights next week, something sure is happening, maybe worth all the secrecy

[Rotor Work]

Front page add in today's local Advocate newspaper.

Something new is landing
Flying to Melbourne daily

Fine print says
Subject to regulatory approvals, all flight services are conducted by West Wing Aviation Pty Ltd

[Stationair8]

Roman holiday?

[Eastwest Loco]

Saw that Rotor

No start date, no phone number, no web address, no mention of destination airport therefore a waste of marketing dollars to tell people basically nothing.

I should start getting an invoice prepared to pay for the calls I am no doubt going to get, along with every other Agency on the Coast flooded with queries I have no way of answering.

All I can figure is that their Marketing "gurus" come cheap and are providing busy work for some dear people from a sheltered workshop.

No professionalism involved there.

Mid April?

They will need deep pockets as the 1st month to 2 months will be shipping air.

Poor form and planning.

Best all

EWL

[Koizi]

Website up again with flights pushed back to 30th April.

Fares to WYY start at 149.00. Looks like only one flight per day, based on a search i did for 15th May to 20th May return trip.

FSA - $149 EW
REX- $159 EW

I think I know my choice, unless you can drink 150 bucks worth of free booze in their lounge first.

[Rotor Work]

Full page story on Free Sirit in today's Advocate Newspaper, complimentary bus service between Devonport & Wynyard, can't see anywhere about the complimentary bus service from Essendon to Melbourne city, it mentions there is a service from Essendon to Tullamarine.

Complimentary alcoholic & non alcoholic beverages with an assortment of snacks in the departure lounges.

East west Loco, have you booked your ticket yet?

Old age service with a new age smile, we are Australian, we are independant. We are proud. We are Free Spirit Airlines:ok:

[Eastwest Loco]

We shall see Rotor.

I wish them no ill will at all - just a little querulous on how they expect to get started with only basic information out there.

They would be a whole lot more attractive to Agents if the were GDS hosted as this takes a tenth the time to create and cost a booking than fighting with a website.

Rex get overlooked by making Agents book via their website to get the cheapest fares and then bill us if we load the booking with passive sectors into the GDS in order to download for accounting purposes.

Not the way to make friends or your Airline a 1st choice.

It will also be interesting to see if they are going to do a milk run with the DPO BWT transfer.

With so many potential pickup points it could become a very long trip!

Best all

EWL

[iwillmakeitoneday]

There is like i said a 1900 at essendon rego VH-EMK and it has free spirit stickers all over it. the plane does move from time to time however i have not yet seen any passengers. it is also parked in the RPT apron which the airport is very strict on who they let park there.

i hope they do well.

[Koizi]

Better make sure you purchase their travel "assurance" before you travel.

That well meaning pat on the back before boarding can really be reassuring.

[BNEA320]

if a charter, only if RPT (Caper decision in Federal court - to protect big boys)

[Rotor Work]

Hey Loco, I see the FSA add is on the local TV,
As of yesterday morning there is no signage or visible changes to the Western Terminal at Wynyard.
There was another Story in yesterday's Advocate. Starting with 2 services a day. There has been strong interest in seat reservations, but Roman says the service would be quite light on to begin with.
He also said there will be an Essendon Merimbula link in June
Koizi, I recon you will pay $149 for a drink & Roman will give you a free flight.
Regards RW

[poonpossum]

It bewilders me that they consider it ok to have designed their website themselves. It looks terrible. You pay for TV ads yet can't even afford web design that isn't stuck in the nineties!

It remind me of the importance of proof reading a job application, but in reverse. If you are expecting to be put at the controls of a $100,000 + or multi million dollar aircraft and have a stupid mistake in a resume or application, then it is not unreasonable to wonder as to the applicant's commitment to their own processes.


So, if they are expecting the traveling public to trust them with their lives, while operating multi million dollar aircraft over Bass Strait, then it is paramount to present yourself as a trustworthy, self respecting entity.

I don't understand how they can expect to compete or maintain any ounce of credibility when they have obviously invested $0 in the FIRST THING any paying passenger will see of the company when considering their service.

[Eastwest Loco]

I have seen their ads in the Advocate and on TV Rotor.

They have been flogging them along daily for a week or so.

Funny thing is that I haven't had one phone enquiry or the normal "know alls" at the RSL in my ear. You know the type - worked at the Pulp for 40 years but know everything about tourism and air transport.

I hate being interrupted when I am rehydrating:E

Normally a new carrier into the Coast would create quite a bit of interest.

This time - nada. Go figure.

Best all

EWL

[Copythisnumberdown]

You can go to their site and still book 10 adults and 8 children from their launch day forward and go right through to their super professional looking credit card portal.

Cant have a single person booked... This isn't an Airline, its a Virtual Airline, CASA wont like this with the company not having the relevant licences.. Cant believe WW would get involved with this

[Koizi]

If you go to make a booking, you will notice there is a number assigned. As of today someone told me it was in the 60s. I know from a few people that at least a dozen are fake, as it keeps counting even if you do not proceed with payment. By the sounds of it others have experimented as well. So who know how many real booking they actually have. Tomorrow is d day, so we shall see.

[Eastwest Loco]

How does one make a booking at the Restaurant at the end of the Universe?

Starting to smell of that a little.

I wish no ill will but haven't seen a thing that smells vaguely professional in the presentation to punters, the forward planning or the communication to the industry.

Hope this all works but I am very glad I don't have any money invested.

Best all

EWL

[BNEA320]

a virtual airlines doesn't need any licences, only the operator does.


Don't even need travel agents licence anymore. They went out 30 June last year.

[BNEA320]

poon what's wrong with their website ?


A website doesn't need to be pretty. Look at Ryanair, the worlds most successful airline by far.


It had the worlds ugliest airline website by far, but it was incredibly successful.


Now it just looks similar to many others.


+ look at the fleets


Free Spirit - 1 x beech 1900 (operated by Westwing of TSV)


Ryanair - hundreds of 738's (so many hard to keep count)


Is anyone going to say, I won't fly them because I don't like their website. No of course not. Ryanair proved that.


Flying into Essendon is a great move. MEL like all other big airports are bloody horrible places.


Question is, how can you make money with a beech 1900. With so few seats, economies of scale working against them, esp cf. Rex Saabs.

[Trent 972]

Flight Plan submitted for VH-EMK Departure at 00.55 z from MEB - BWT / 02.15 z BWT - MEB.

[wishiwasupthere]

Flying into Essendon is a great move. MEL like all other big airports are bloody horrible places.

You keep rolling out this line about how bad the major airport are in Australia, but apart from in Flight Sim, have you actually ever been to most of them.

Have you been to Essendon? The terminal is a miserable, bleak, cold, run down s#!thole. Sorry, but I'd rather go to Melbourne and use my frequent flyer privileges. In fact, apart from Gold Coast airport during school holidays, from a passengers perspective, most of the major airports in Australia are fine.

[BNEA320]

BS.


The big airports are like shopping mauls.


Who wants to walk miles past dozens of very overpriced shops to get in or out of airport ?


Airports like MEB you can get in & out of fast & if aircraft under 20 tonnes, no BS security either.






What ff privileges ?

[wishiwasupthere]

What ff privileges ?

Priority check-in, priority security screening, priority boarding, lounge access, free food, free drinks, free wifi, points, complimentary upgrades, need I go on?

What can you get at Essendon? A 6 hour old luke warm chicko roll and a chocolate milk.

[BNEA320]

think you mean Qantas club or equivalent.


If flying out of MEB (under 20 tonnes) you don't need to go through security, you don't need to park miles away & you only need to be there a few minutes before flight.


Who wants to spend 1 second more at a bloody airport than you have to ?


Have much better things to do.

[Trevor the lover]

wishiwasupthere
What a load of tripe. Sounds like you go to airports for a day out - a jolly occasion of scarf shopping and soy latte-ing.


Me? I go to an airport to get on an aeroplane. YMEN offers quick in and out, free parking, no security, no traffic issues, no goons on the sidewalk pushing you around, - totally hassle free. IT WORKS. Particularly not having to pay $56 for 3 minutes parking.




EWL - mate, your rantings are boring now in my view. Just because they aren't using your services you just haven't let up. Sure, it may all be done on a budget, but just because its not done how YOU'D do it, you become vitriolic. And spare me the "oh I wish them well, I'm just pointing out......................"


I for one hope they do bloody well and fill a niche out of YMEN like Sharpe's have done.

[BNEA320]

there are a number of projects going on right now for flights out of MEB both intrastate & interstate.


All aircraft under 20 tonnes so no B/S security.

[Rotor Work]

+1, I hope they do well also,

I called into Wynyard Thursday late afternoon, still no changes to the Western terminal.

From today's Advocate Newspaper + a photo of Roman on the tarmac

Free Spirit makes first NW landing | The Advocate (http://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/3048881/free-spirit-makes-first-nw-landing/?cs=87)

IT flew into an easterly breeze and landed without a hitch at Wynyard Airport, touching down in Tasmania after its first commercial flight.
Free Spirit Airlines began its service for the North-West, flying from Essendon Airport and landing only three minutes late at 11.53am.Managing director Roman Badov and four other passengers exited the airline's small two-engine Beechcraft 1900 onto the tarmac after the flight.
Onboard passengers have to stoop while standing, but sitting there is room enough on the 19-seat aircraft.
Mr Badov hoped bookings would increase after people knew the airline had begun flying to Burnie. We have been experiencing a steady rate of bookings and it has been increasing daily," he said.
In the next week 50 per cent of seats on Free Spirit Airline flights to and from Melbourne are booked, he said.
"We are experiencing a very high level of public interest.
"Today is really a defining moment because it's proved to the public we are a functional airline."
Flights on the Burnie to Melbourne route cost from $149 one way.

Four kilograms of carry-on luggage and 16 kg of checked luggage are included in the flight cost.
The airline will offer up to two return flights to Melbourne from Burnie each day until June, when it will begin to have up to three daily services.
It will soon operate a second plane.
Mr Badov expected the business to become profitable within six months.
He said passengers would benefit from lower congestion, ample parking and easy access to Melbourne at Essendon Airport compared to Tullamarine.
Mr Badov hoped Free Spirit Airlines' presence would lower flight costs for North-West residents using Jetstar in Launceston, Regional Express in Burnie and QantasLink in Devonport.Free Spirit Airlines also plans to expand by adding a service from Melbourne to Merimbula, NSW, in June.
Valerie Norton, a Heybridge-based passenger on the airline's first flight into Wynyard, said she would use it travelling with her husband Brendon for his Melbourne medical appointments.
Free Spirit Airlines has passed regulatory approvals tests, Mr Badov said.

[Under Dog]

Hope it's not just a Dream ...They are talking it up on local radio and papers here on the Far south coast.

Under Dog

[BNEA320]

in USA the www.surfair.com (http://www.surfair.com) is being cloned in Texas ( www.1flyrise.com (http://www.1flyrise.com) & www.txairshuttle (http://www.txairshuttle) ).


Business types who pay the highest airfares want convenience.


Perhaps Free Spirit should sell some seats on the basis of a monthly subscription ? Maybe 4-6.


It would give them free PR, as never been done in OZ before AFAIK & it would give them cash flow.


They might need an app, but could also be done, by very simple email or SMS from phones.




Surf Air now charge USD$1750 for unlimited travel on their Californian network for a month, from smaller airports in Pilatus 7 or 8 seaters.
(they have a 3 month minimum)


They have a waiting list for "MEMBERSHIP".


Think you can only have booked 4 sectors, so once flown one, can book another. Guess this stops people booking heaps of flights & doing no shows.


No security BS at check in(prescreening is done), free parking at terminal, no hassles, no stress.


Surfair are planning to fly to Vegas once they get approval to fly interstate.


At present it's virtually faster to drive from LAX to LAS. Think about it. Need to be at LAX hours before flight, park miles away, get a shuttle, q at check in, bend over (here comes the rubber gloves) security handled by people on minimum wages, walk km to gate, wait due to congestion delays, taxi, more delays, actually fly (block time is probably only 20 mins) taxi at other end, deplane, wait for bags, get taxi/rental car etc.


From getting to LAX to departing LAS is probably 4.5 hours.


You can drive from most parts of LA to Vegas, door to door, in less than 4 hours in normal weather/traffic.


Surfair will probably cut the 4.5 hours down to 2 hours or less with absolutely no stress. Actual block time will be longer, but such a short sector, it would probably only be 5-10 minutes longer, far less than more security q's at U.S. airports.


Surfair wins hands down on time over all of it's other sectors as well & the last thing we all need is stress.


USD$1750/month is really nothing for a regular business flyer, who would fly 4 or more times a month.




Surprised to learn that full Y class BNE/MEL on QF or VA one way is now AUD$975.


Think regular flyers are really getting sick of the BS at big airports.


Who has time or wants to sit in a lounge. The only reason many sit in a lounge, is they have to get to airport long before their flight, due to ever increasing q's. We seem to be heading down the disasterous U.S. path at big airports.


Back to Free Spirit ...................


Hardest thing they will face, is convincing media that they are a success.


Full flights in the eyes of the media = success. The media would have no idea, if flights given away free to fill aircraft or not.


A media story like, every Free Spirit full for 1st 3 weeks, would seem to indicate success in the public eyes.

[Rotor Work]

Over the past month when in the area I have been looking at the Wynyard Western terminal & noticed no changes. (press releases said Western terminal)

Today I went into the main terminal & behold, Free Spirit have a nice seperate lounge area next to the kiosk. Their passenger check in is beside Rex & Sharp.

Not related
But also nice to see an Alliance F 27 mark 50 VH-FKW on the tarmac
Regards RW

[Eastwest Loco]

Trevor - get over your self.

If they do or don't use my services I do not give an obese rodent's backside.

Two people flying return Essendon would nett me a total of $40.00 in service fees.

That is not worth the effort bucko considering the time it burns to do so and lose up to 3% of the total including airfare on eftpos/credit card fees.

My comments were regarding the lead time and choice of origin and destination.

I don't give a bugger about them on a monetary return for me basis as I mainly deal with North Island corporate traffic but would put good money on having more years involved in scheduling and senior Airline management than your good self.

Sounds like a Planet Burnie rant.

EWL

[PLovett]

Free Spirit have a nice seperate lounge area next to the kiosk

What used to be the separate lounge area where there were desks for working at and coffee tables one could sit around. It was always there.

For all those who think an airline is going to succeed with one aircraft on one run with opposition that is running 4 or 5 times a day, then you must also believe there are fairies at the bottom of your garden.

Compliance costs are major in RPT and West Wing won't run a charity. They will want to be paid and 50% loads won't cut it.

[Duck Pilot]

Maybe the F50 is the backup and they were doing a proving flight today. F50 can carry more than a Saab.

[BNEA320]

most F50's (all those in OZ now) are over 20 tonnes & require security. MEB is fantastic compared with awful MEL but security is a major pain & expensive.

[Eastwest Loco]

The F50 would hold much more passenger appeal.

Much more appeal than the Saab.

EWL

[BNEA320]

could only be done with F50's under 20 tonnes MTOW. Apparently there are some around, but most seem to be over 20 tonnes, which for a few flights a day makes security incredibly expensive & that makes the whole idea of using a F50 not viable (it's crazy that a 50 seat Dash 8, that comes in just under 20 tonne MTOW does not need security, but an F50, that comes in just over 20 tonnes & carries same number of pax, needs security)

[continueapproach737]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxYxTBeQiEQ&feature=youtu.be


I wish them all the best of luck - its a tough game, but they have the right bit of machinery...

Where the safety of the ground crew? Glasses? Earmuffs?

[BNEA320]

good video.


They should do another from passenger perspective, ie.


driving into MEB, parking right at terminal, walk in get straight onto aircraft & go.


No BUA bs.


BUA=big ugly airport


The only good thing about BUA's these days, is the 20 mins plus exercise you get walking from car park to terminal through bs security & then walk another km or more to gate (to then wait for delays)


Guess free spirit are trying to pick up a few types of passengers:-


1) small business types(who effectively pay their own fares), who don't want to pay Rex's last minute high fares


2) people who otherwise wouldn't go due to higher Rex fares


3) not forgetting the people who hate all the bs at MEL

[Stationair8]

Looking at Flightaware, it shows a return flight on Sunday, a flight down on Monday morning and a return later that afternoon, some training flights on Tuesday.

Slow week, finding our feet, light loadings?

[Koizi]

No RPT service to WYY on tues, wed or thurs.

[Rotor Work]

Add in todays Advocate
Hurry! Limited Seats
Burnie to Melbourne 72 Hour $72 Sale
Conditions: Travel must be completed by 25th July 2015.

Regards RW

[BNEA320]

$72 is too cheap. They would be better off giving away day or 2 car hire at MEB.

[TBM-Legend]

As they say in the movie business, you cannot sell $10 seats for $9 and stay in business!

[BNEA320]

ah but $72 is only in one direction !!!!!!!


They just need to convert a few regular Rex passengers to how much better it is flying into MEB than MEL, which is just another BUA.

[wishiwasupthere]

They just need to convert a few regular Rex passengers to how much better it is flying into MEB than MEL, which is just another BUA.

Not if they're flying to Wynyard from somewhere other than Melbourne. Why would you collect your bag, catch a cab to Essendon to check in again, when if you're on another Rex flight or Virgin, your bag is checked all the way through, and you walk a couple of hundred metres on you're on your connecting flight.

From what I've heard about pax numbers, I give it 6 months, if that.

[BNEA320]

most passengers are not connecting at MEL.


Who wants to go thru all that BS security at MEL.


Who wants to have to walk miles just to get to the aircraft.


Who wants to have to go past 100 extremely overpriced shops/takeways just to get to your gate.


If you're originating in Melbourne, believe parking, right beside the terminal is still free at MEB.


It's really a no brainer.


No one wants to go to BUA's anymore, ANYWHERE.

[wishiwasupthere]

Who wants to go thru all that BS security at MEL.

Adds 2 minutes to your day at most.

Who wants to have to walk miles just to get to the aircraft.

The walk from check in to any gate at Melbourne is 200m max!

Who wants to have to go past 100 extremely overpriced shops/takeways just to get to your gate.

There'd be lucky to be more than 100 shops total at Melbourne airport let alone in one terminal.

If you're originating in Melbourne, believe parking, right beside the terminal is still free at MEB.

The pay parking machines at Essendon must be for show.

You're a bit of a drama queen BNEA320. Exaggerating must be your forte.

[BNEA320]

no BUA's are very time consuming & have much better things to do.


Do you work for a BUA ?

[wishiwasupthere]

Do you work for a BUA ?

No, but considering this is a Professional PILOT'S Rumour Network, I do spend quite a bit of time in them. Your irrational and over exaggerated points don't really do much to add to your argument.

[BNEA320]

then you have a vested interest in BUA's.


The business market is looking for ways to avoid these extremely time wasting "toilets".