Air France

[crewmeal]

With all the losses that the Air France/KLM group are making, it seems they are downgrading their shorthaul services.

Air France plans to restructure short-haul operations - Business Traveller (http://www.businesstraveller.com/news/100781/air-france-plans-to-restructure-short-haul-oper)

I like the bit about lower levels of service:

Passengers will have to get used to a different type of product, one which may lead to lower levels of service. Some routes may be dropped altogether.

How much lower can a national carrier get?

[PAXboy]

... starting in 2015, Air France will hive off non-core routes to low-cost subsidiaries Hop! and Transavia. Passengers will have to get used to a different type of product, one which may lead to lower levels of service. Some routes may be dropped altogether.

A similar development is now seen in Germany where Lufthansa is transferring all non-hub shortish flights (in other words, those flights not serving either Frankfurt or Munich) to low-cost subsidiaries Germanwings and Eurowings.That is the reality of airline life in the 21st century, at least they know they have to change.

But Air France will need agreement from its unions before any changes can be implemented. And, as expected, the unions are not happy. The pilots’ union has already called for a strike next month, on a date yet to be announced. And that is 20th century who do not know that they have to change. No, it's not nice but since the rest of the world has already decided on this, the alternative route is to join Alitalia.

[Heathrow Harry]

"How much lower can a national carrier get?"

when the taxpayer votes with their feet and all move to LCO's and the bill goes through the roof reality sets in

no-one NEEDS a national airline any more - there are dozens of airlines waiting to serve any route that has enough yield

[PAXboy]

no-one NEEDS a national airline any more
Indeed not. But you try convincing the politicians and the men of the national airline who already have their knees under the board room table and don't want to see their toys taken away. :rolleyes:

[ExXB]

no-one NEEDS a national airline any more - there are dozens of airlines waiting to serve any route that has enough yield

Bilateral Air Service agreements still set out who can serve those routes. A Canadian airline cannot fly France-USA without a connection in Canada. A US airline cannot fly France-Canada without a connection in the US, nor can they fly an internal EU sector without the flight continuing to the US.

Swiss and Austrian have continued challenges with Russia about their flights. The Russians do not believe that they are substantially owned and effectively controlled by nationals of their countries. (The respective ASAs require this)

The CEO, senior management and most board members of US airlines must be US citizens.

We are a long way from any airline flying any route it can make money at.

[Metro man]

no-one NEEDS a national airline any more

A national airline is essential for a third world country as a means of transferring taxpayers money into politicians pockets. Over priced contracts, jobs for relatives, free tickets and a status symbol. Can't do without one.:E

[ExXB]

Perhaps put another way, While 'no-one NEEDS a national airline any more' every airline NEEDS a nationality and that will influence where they can fly. It also sets out the regulatory environment they will work in.

I think state ownership of AF (AF/KL parent company) is less that 20%