Thomas Cook

[Cliff Secord]

Hi Folks. Interested in latest gen on TC. Are they doing better these days? Any recruitment other than that talked about in the Feb thread?

[macdo]

Just so you have a reply. Not that I have heard, although I suspect that some thing may happen in the Autumn.

[Cliff Secord]

Thank you macdo, I appreciate the reply.

[MrHorgy]

All,

Any updates on TCX? Just merely for interests sake more than anything.

[Bernoulli]

Plenty of talk on the line but nothing from the 'Management'. That's not unusual: the shags at the pointy end are always the last to be told. Someone on the outside trying to get in is more likely to hear of expansion and recruitment before the inmates. That all said, there's a feeling of cautious optimism in TCX just now and the 'sausage machine' is creaking into life with more new commands rumored over the next year and therefore a need for additional pilots overall.

[Superpilot]

Joined the company recently along with over 40 others who have been hired since around Christmas 2014. Largest recruitment into TCX in a very long time. Lots of internal rumours doing the rounds that between 30 and 50 FOs are lined up for BA (50 seems a bit high to me though). The retirement bulge is returning but an increasing number of old boys are wanting part time well before that. It would be difficult and wrong for anyone to give a precise number and indication of recruitment for 2016 but most of the guys I fly with reckon easily 50 more. Most people seem to get an interview based on internal recommendation, however I didn't know anyone.

...and before the PMs start, I take Bitcoin and Paypal :ok:

[Iver]

Superpilot,


Congrats on the job! Some questions:


1. Which bases are open to newhires?
2. What are the schedules like these days? How many days off per month likely?
3. Where are newhires typically coming from?


Cheers

[Superpilot]

1.) For the last round of recruitment, all bases were open. The vast majority got what they wanted.

2.) I fly from an airport in the south and am engaged only 3 times a week. 85 hours per month over the summer doing charters can come very quickly. A couple of Canaries, several Turkeys and a few Greek Island trips has you up to 85 hours in no time.

3.) Everywhere. Most I believe are ex EZY Flexi or Aer Lingus. Only about 15 cadets.

[Harry palmer]

Any chance they will ever look at non rated candidates again?

[frozenpilot]

Career breakers being asked if they are interested returning early..... Due to a 'significant' number being recruited for next summer.

Ba need 350 next year
Thomson need around 60.......
At last the pilot may just have a little leverage!

[Twiglet1]

Frozen
What sort of leverage are you talking?
Maybe choices but leverage?
If a crew member leaves the airline I work for I'm either extremely happy if he causes me grief (I've never had a she that caused me grief) or I'm extremely happy if he/she is leaving for pastures new / better and I've been part of that journey. e.g. A cadet moving to BA
Airline life is full if cycles, the last cycle was movement to the Middle East - not sure that worked out that well judging by the moans and groans on Middle East.

[Superpilot]

A couple of guys have joined with the agreement they part fund/are bonded for the TR (Don't know exact details but it's very rare from what I've heard)

[frozenpilot]

@ Twiglet

Indeed Airline life is cycles.... It's supply and demand! I suffered its effect at 3 of the UK's biggest charter operators. The point being, right now unlike anytime in the past 8-10 years the industry is buoyant. We have had years of Airline management driving down T's and C's whilst scooping up healthy bonuses for themselves. Ba now on the hunt for a huge number of pilots and this starting to filter down to other operators with sizeable recruitment programs being planned. We are now in demand and as a group have the opportunity pressure for better terms and conditions for our industry.... However, I do remain sceptical!

[Harry palmer]

It would be nice to see TCX start to recruit experienced pilots again rather than recruit fully from the Likes of CTC. Then again its all about what the accountants want these days.

[ShotOne]

They have done, Harry. The intake has been a mix of experience levels; some 200 hr (ish) guys (nothing to do with ctc as far as I know)up,to few thousand hrs inc, as Super pilot says a few non-TR who were billed £12k (paid off over four yrs) for the privilege. The non rated guys started on a 7/5 contract (7on 5 months off) with the salary payments divided by 12

[Harry palmer]

Was this intake recent? I've not seen cooks advertise for some time. I'm registered for job alerts with them too.

Cheers

[planedrive]

CTC and Oxford cadet pilots made up some of the last intake, which, as shotone said, was made up of a mixture of backgrounds and experience levels. They took over the winter with type ratings etc up until late spring/early summer.

Good to see that Thomas Cook don't share the same view as Harry Palmer and will give EVERYONE a chance.

[macdo]

The last recruitment went on far longer than it seems that it was planned for and a wide variety of candidates were taken on, as stated above. There is currently lots of informed comments about this years intake being around 40 to,in part, compensate for commands courses forthcoming this Autumn.
I'd say that this would be a good time to join as the airline is enjoying a bit of a growth spurt. And when all is said and done, its a pretty good place to work compared to many of the other jobs available to new FO's.

[michaela74]

Morning ppruners,

Anybody know if a guy with a couple of thousand hours on the 330 could get a Manchester basing, flying the 330, or would one have to start down the bottom on the 320?

[macdo]

Bearing in mind the current direction of travel, I'd think that would be very attractive to TCX, but you would probably still start on the 320. Base choice (and everything else) is done on seniority.

[MrHorgy]

Any idea on time to command / CCQ to 330? Always wanted to fly the 330, and now they have a few more routes i'd figure there'd be some movement onto the big toy!

[Superpilot]

Time to command, as much publicised and historically speaking very high. With the turbulence we've undergone, some folks have been waiting 15+ years and those on the low end of captain seniority have been demoted/promoted. It's reasonably safe to assume the days of 10 years to command are slowly coming back. That is of course, if the current stability/momentum continues.

CCQ, if the A330 is what you want, you'll have to choose MAN as your base, 3-4 years (regardless of past experience) most likely. Currently time to A330 at LGW is high. Once (if) we get rid of Air Tanker I would imagine things would change very quickly with LH looking like it has been very successful out of both GLA and STN.

Major internal leadership shuffle and a "significant" recruitment campaign starting this winter have just been announced. So glad that this time next year I'll be 50 places up! :ok:

[MrHorgy]

And just like that...

https://thomascook.taleo.net/careersection/4/moresearch.ftl?lang=en&portal=4370450322

[nick14]

Are there any TCXers who can give an idea of time to command and possible training positions on the 75?

[A330ETOPS]

Time to command around 10 years. Seniority based. I'm really happy here - no complaints at all

[Hiltonharry]

Damn, so close. I hope they looked at non rated. I'm on a wide body Boeing but the wrong rating.

[nick14]

What about the 76, is that senior guys only?

Many training opportunities or anything else you can get into?

[763 jock]

Time to command is based on seniority, not fleet. I would plan on 10 years as things stand at present. If you want the 76 (or indeed the 75) then MAN is your only choice. The 75's are on the way out, with GLA moving to the A321 this winter. I'm not sure what is happening to the two 753's or how long the 767's will stay. The 767's fly for Condor during the winter and TCX pilots cover the flying.

There is talk of some training opportunities for F/O's. Quite a lot of the tech/CRM stuff is delivered over the winter and during ground transition courses by very capable and knowledgable F/O's. I'm not sure if there are any plans for F/O's to take up TRI roles, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it happening soon.

[Jay_solo]

Correct me if Im wrong, but I'm assuming contracts such as 7 months on/5 months off means you have no duties to fly during the off peak winter months. If that is correct, what do pilots do during that time? get assigned desk jobs?

[Capt Scribble]

Do as you wish as you are not being paid.

[amark16]

Joined easyjet a couple years ago as flexi with a few thousand hours, now second officer and looking at two years of part time with low pay before the contract gets any decent. Working my a** off all summer, lots of four sector days, call out from standby the rule rather than the exception. How does TC compare to EZY salary wise, roster, stability etc? Any feedback from MAN-based guys would be very appreciated

[amark16]

Also, what contract can initially be expexted for an FO with around 3500 hrs on airbus? Do you still have to start at the bottom as SO?

[Easy Glider]

More like 14 years to command. Pal of mine joined Nov. 2000. Just been told he's been penciled in for a command course at some point between Oct. and next Apr.

[schooner]

A lot lower now. Big retirement bulge coming. Sub 10 years.

[amark16]

any TC guys can give as an insight on roster, pay and general working conditions?

[TRY2FLY]

I think at the moment beatings are to continue until morale improves

[Easy Glider]

A lot lower now. Big retirement bulge coming. Sub 10 years.

Do you know when I first heard about this "Big retirement Bulge" ??

1988 !!! Still hasn't arrived----can only assume it isn't going to!

[Threethirty]

TRY2FLY, do you work for Thomas Cook, if so is it that bad?

[schooner]

I'd call it a retirement bulge. Goes from 5ish retirements a year now to 20-25 a year quite quickly. Almost 200 retirements in the next 10 years plus plenty of senior guys wanting part time due to taxation issues etc. Sub 10 years is about right IMO.

[Deeply Concerned]

There's not really a retirement 'bulge'. I have a copy of the age demographics which I have no intention of publishing here. However I does show 130 captains reaching 65 in the next ten years. Remember there already 230+ F/Os so you can make your own judgement.

[schooner]

Looks kinda "bulgey" to me but fair enough. The flight crew retirements as a whole (not just captains) are closer to 200 in 10 years and for somebody just joined that's more relevant. Either way it's looking better than it has done for some years. Cheers.

[macdo]

I would not join TCX if you are heavily into the idea of an early command. When I joined there were folk who got a command in 18 months, between then and now, I have seen people wait any number up to 15 years. A lot of this is purely luck, being on the list in right place and right time when the company does one of its periodic expansions. Right now is great for a number of SFO's. Next year, who knows what world event will blow the company finances of course again and down the snake the new commanders might come. TCX is prone to that sort of instability.
All I'm saying is choose tcx for the lifestyle of charter and holiday long haul, if that is your thing. Personally, having looked at all the options globally, there is nothing else which is so much better that is was worth leaving for.

[amark16]

Hi guys, any existing Thomas Cook pilots especially on the A320 fleet? I'm already working for a UK airline but considering if TC is a better option for me. I would really appreciate it if you could PM me, need to find out a little bit more about the company before applying. It would be a great help to talk to an insider. cheers

[Easy Glider]

Can anyone confirm that new joiners now will go onto the far less attractive "B Scale" salary increments ??