Getting the First type on an easa license

[peteport]

Hi guys,


Just planning ahead for when I finally get all the modules passed and its time to get a type on my license. I hear that for your first type rating along with the manufacturers theory and practical you now need 6months on the job training ??? where I am working at the moment doesn't have approval for OJT so does that mean I will have to go elsewhere just to tick that box to get the type on my license or are there other ways to get around that part?


Thanks

[BluFin]

Pete,
Here is the requirement from the consolidated Part 66 (Post 1149 Changes)

Basically there is a new section in the MOE 3.15 to cover OJT that needs to be in place for anywhere that offers OJT. (Theres a 3.16 addition as well)

Extract Below

AMC to Section 6 of Appendix III to Part-66 “Aircraft Type Training and Examination Standard. On-the-Job Training” On-the-Job Training (OJT)

1. “A maintenance organisation appropriately approved for the maintenance of the particular aircraft type” means a Part-145 or M.A. Subpart F approved maintenance organisation holding an A rating for such aircraft.
2. The OJT should include one to one supervision and should involve actual work task performance on aircraft/components, covering line and/or base maintenance tasks.
3. The use of simulators for OJT should not be allowed.
4. The OJT should cover at least 50% of the tasks contained in Appendix II to AMC to Part-66. Some tasks should be selected from each paragraph of the Appendix II list. Tasks should be selected among those applicable to the type of aircraft and licence (sub)category applied for. Other tasks than those in the Appendix II may be considered as a replacement when they are relevant. Typically, in addition to the variety and the complexity, the OJT tasks should be selected because of their frequency, safety, novelty, etc.
5. Up to 50% of the required OJT may be undertaken before the aircraft theoretical type training starts.
6. The organisation providing the on-the-job training should provide trainees a schedule or plan indicating the list of tasks to be performed under supervision. A record of the tasks completed should be entered into a logbook which should be designed such that each task or group of tasks is countersigned by the corresponding supervisor. The logbook format and its use should be clearly defined.
7. Regarding the day-to-day supervision of the OJT programme in the approved maintenance organisation and the role of the supervisor(s), the following should be considered:
• It is sufficient that the completion of individual OJT tasks is confirmed by the direct
supervisor(s), without being necessary the direct evaluation of the assessor.
• During the day-to-day OJT performance, the supervision aims at overseeing the complete
process, including task completion, use of manuals and procedures, observance of safety
measures, warnings and recommendations and adequate behaviour in the maintenance
environment.
• The supervisor(s) should personally observe the work being performed to ensure the safe
completeness and should be readily available for consultation, if needed during the OJT
performance.
• The supervisor(s) should countersign the tasks and release the maintenance tasks as the
trainee is still not qualified to do so.
• The supervisor(s) should therefore:
o have certifying staff or support staff privileges relevant to the OJT tasks;
o be competent for the selected tasks;
o be safety-orientated;
o be capable to coach (setting objectives, giving training, performing supervision, evaluating, handling trainee’s reactions and cultural issues, managing objectively and positively debriefing sessions, determining the need for extra training or reorientate the
training, reporting, etc.);
o Be designated by the approved maintenance organisation to carry out the supervision.
8. Regarding the assessor, the following should be considered:
• The function of the assessor, as described in Section 6 of Appendix III to Part-66, is to con

duct the final assessment of the completed OJT. This assessment should include confirmation of the completion of the required diversity and quantity of OJT and should be based on the supervisor(s) reports and feedback.
• In Section 6 of Appendix III to Part-66, the term “designated assessor appropriately quali

fied” means that the assessor should demonstrate training and experience on the assessment process being undertaken and should be authorised to do so by the organisation. Further guidance about the assessment and the designated assessors is provided in Appendix III to AMC to Part-66.
9. The procedures for OJT should be included into the Exposition Manual of the approved maintenance organisation (chapter 3.15, as indicated in AMC 145.A.70(a)).
However, since these procedures in the Exposition Manual are approved by the competent
authority of the maintenance organisation, and providing training is not one of the privileges of a maintenance organisation, they can only be used when the licensing authority is the same as the competent authority of the maintenance organisation. In other cases, it is up to the licensing authority to decide whether it accepts such procedures for the purpose of approving the OJT
(refer to AMC 66.B.115)

END

Hope that answers most of your questions
Point 9 can be a discussion topic in its own right, genrally looking for 4-6 months depending on your NAA

[flame_bringer]

A couple of weeks ago I contacted the UKCAA
All you need is a 147 ojt certificate from an approved 147 organization in order to endorse. (which is a 10 days long ojt that follows your theory part on live a/c)
No more months of experience required.
So in your case just find a 147 school approved to issue 147 certificates for that aircraft and register at their ojt program.

[BluFin]

A part 147 cannot issue a OJT certificate, The OJT is a function of a part 145.

A Part 147 can issue a Practical Training Certificate which is appox 10 days duration as you say. This along with your theroy certificate will be sufficent for the type to added providing you already have a type in that sub-group.

For your first type rating you will require
A Theory Cert
A Practical Cert
(Both from a 147)
+ your OJT (from a 145)


A lot of people are confusing Practical Training & OJT, they are two seperate things.

Hope that make sense

[flame_bringer]

Blu fin
Ojt worksheets are no longer required even for the first
type,The practical ojt certificate is all you need for any endorsement.
This has been the case since august 2012.
I know many people who endorsed their first type with the practical ojt certificate only.
And it is 147 ojt certificate it even mentions this on it.

[Exup]

Taken from the CAA website.

Application for Initial Issue, Amendment or Renewal of an Engineer Licence (Form 19)
Certified true copy of your valid passport, EAA/EU National Identity Card or full Photographic Driving Licence certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copy of your current Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copies of the JAR/Part 147 Certificate of Recognition(s) (applicable to the type(s) applied for) covering theoretical and practical elements certified by your Quality Manager.
If this is the first type rating applied for then 4 months worth of approved OJT must be submitted certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copies of the logbook/worksheets showing evidence of the practical maintenance experience gained (if Practical elements not completed) certified by your Quality Manager.
The Recommendation attachment ensuring that it has been completed by your Quality Manager in support of your application.
If applying for change of name and or nationality a certified true copy by your Quality Manager of the supporting document e.g your valid passport/change of name deed poll/marriage certificate.

So 4 months of OJT required for first type.

[matkat]

If you got that from the CAA website then there is a problem because for an amendment the original license is required.

This is the requirement on the form 19

Documents Submitted:
1. Original EASA Part-66 aircraft maintenance licence (if existing Part-66 licence holder)
2. Certified true copy of your Passport, EAA/EU National Identity Card or Full Photographic Driving Licence (for Initial Issue)
3. Certified true copies of Exam Certificates
4. Certified true copies of Approved Part-147 (or CAA) Certificates of Recognition
5. Certified true copies of Logbook/Work records
6. Certified true copy of Company Authorisation for Category 'C' issue
Should the need arise the CAA retains the right to request the original document if it is deemed necessary in order to complete the
application.

[cedgz]

Hello,
I have a bit different question but it is related.
So i finished my easa b1.1 modules and will submit my modules,expereince sheets, task records, school diplomas etc to the aviation authority to have my b1.1 issued.
I hold already an a&p and have type ratings.
If i do an easa 147 typre rating(with already a lot of experience on it under faa and 2 cents faa qualification) with practical in 147. Will i still need to do the 4 months OJT or will my taskrecords on that type of a/c be ok(tasks performed under faa and not easa)?

[Exup]

Matkat taken from the Caa website yesterday. Here is the complete page.
Look under section YOU NEED TO PROVIDE.
Clearly states Certified true copy of you licence, certified by Quality Manager

Description

The Licence entities you to exercise certification privileges on a specific aircraft type(s).

Who can apply

You must hold an existing Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence and have met the full requirements as per Commission Regulation (EU) No 1149/2011, Annex III, Part 66, 66.A.45.
Pre-Requisites

Ensure that the relevant theoretical type rating training has been conducted within an approved JAR/Part 147 training organisation.

Ensure that the relevant practical type rating training has been conducted within either an approved Part 147 training organisation or an approved Part 145 organisation.

If however you applying for your first type rating to be endorsed onto your Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence, then you must ensure that the structured approved OJT has been completed within an approved EASA 145 organisation in support of your theoretical and practical Certificates of Recognition(s).

Currently for the addition of type rating(s) we can accept both JAR and Part 147 Certificates of Recognition.

NB: If you are applying for a change of name and or nationality you will be required to supply evidence in support of your request, e.g. change of name deed poll/marriage certificate/valid passport.

Cost

The current fee for this service is £131.00 per Type Rating.
The above service will also incur a Rolling Renewal fee which in order to calculate this fee you will need to have the expiry date of your current Licence to hand when completing the online application form. The expiry date is normally found on page 6 of 8 of your current Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence depending on the size of your Licence.

If you are applying for any other additional services the appropriate fee will also apply.

An additional fee will be payable if you wish your documents to be returned by secure courier.

£6.00 (UK)
£14.00 (European)
£22.00 (Overseas)
Full details are available in the Scheme of Charges.

Processing time (On receipt of all required information)

We endeavour to process applications in 10 working days from date of receipt.
Incomplete applications are not subject to the 10 working day turnaround time until all application requirements are met.
Validity period

The EASA Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence is valid for 5 years from the date of issue.

Associated Rules, Regulations and Forms

Application for Initial Issue, Amendment or Renewal of an Engineer Licence (Form 19)
Recommendation attachment
Commission Regulation (EU) 1149/2011
Scheme of Charges
Part 147 Approved Type Training Organisations Document No.50, Version 99
CAA Refund Policy
Code of Practice
SRG 1014

You will need to provide

Application for Initial Issue, Amendment or Renewal of an Engineer Licence (Form 19)
Certified true copy of your valid passport, EAA/EU National Identity Card or full Photographic Driving Licence certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copy of your current Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copies of the JAR/Part 147 Certificate of Recognition(s) (applicable to the type(s) applied for) covering theoretical and practical elements certified by your Quality Manager.
If this is the first type rating applied for then 4 months worth of approved OJT must be submitted certified by your Quality Manager.
Certified true copies of the logbook/worksheets showing evidence of the practical maintenance experience gained (if Practical elements not completed) certified by your Quality Manager.
The Recommendation attachment ensuring that it has been completed by your Quality Manager in support of your application.
If applying for change of name and or nationality a certified true copy by your Quality Manager of the supporting document e.g your valid passport/change of name deed poll/marriage certificate.
Note - The CAA has the right to request the return of the original Part 66 Aircraft Maintenance Licence at any point of your application.

How to apply

Once all of the requirements have been met, the Application for Initial Issue, Amendment or Renewal of an Engineer Licence (Form 19) should be submitted online with the requested documents scanned, or they can be delivered in person or post to the address at the bottom of the page.

What to expect

The initial assessment of your application is completed by a Licensing Assistant or Officer
The application is sent to our Approvals team for a technical assessment which is conducted by one of our Standards Surveyors.
If the application is successful the Licence is then processed, signed and dispatched to you.
If you apply with the theoretical JAR/Part 147 Certificate of Recognition and are providing work records/logbook to support the practical element then the application is sent to our Approvals team for a technical assessment which is conducted by one of our Standards Surveyors.

If the application is successful through both assessments the licence is then processed, signed and dispatched to the individual.

If the application is unsuccessful at any point of the assessment, you will be contacted by letter or email. At this stage the application can either be cancelled or be placed in pending for 30 working days awaiting additional documentation to be submitted.
An assessment and refund fee may be charged if the assessment results in the rejection of your application. This will also be applied if you choose cancel your application.

Contact us

[email protected]

Licensing Department
CAA
Aviation House
Gatwick Airport South
Gatwick
RH6 0YR

[matkat]

Will contact our 147 surveyor to point this out as it is clearly inconsistant, and as a QAM I always send the original license.

[matkat]

Exuo, I now what is wrong the form on their own website is outdated have several guy's sent me that but it is no good why they have not updated it is anybodies guess this is the updated form 19 that should now be used.

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/srg1014issue09final.pdf

[Exup]

Could be that it was changed because you can do online applications now, which seem to work well. They do say that they withhold the right to see the original of any docs if they want to.

[BluFin]

Can I suggest you all go and read the new updated Part 66
Reg 1149/2011 and the appendix releases
CAA web site is not fully updated as there is a lot to change

EDIT: QCM have some nice downloads FOC, Yes is a boring read but it will clarify things here is the link to the publications page
http://www.qcm.ch/en/publications/ See the one on part 66 and 147 if you not sleeping

EASA dont help themselves by using Poor English and grammer but if you wanted how the new reg looks at OJT (not Practical experience as they title it) see http://easa.europa.eu/system/files/dfu/Annex%20to%20ED%20Decision%202012-004-R.pdf Page 18 onwards of the pdf and a really good chart on page 20 shows what boxes you need to tick


Another good link to 66 & amendmets is http://easa.europa.eu/acceptable-means-compliance-and-guidance-materials-group/part-66


I'm staying away from anything with refrence to a part 145 that holds a "Direct Course Approval" as it would confuse the issue even more, dont go there as it will really turn in a can or worms real fast

[BluFin]

As this ones been quiet for a week, Take it that the supplied refs cleared the muddy waters a little

[henry.clark]

Hello guys,

It's an old subject, but still a mess thing..

Got my EASA B2 license, and now I'm struggling to find a company that provides the Part-145 for B2 on Helicopters..

Any hint?

Thanks!