Jetgo - have they gone? [Archive]

TWOTBAGS

8th Jun 2014, 10:10

Awww Chocks, you do try hard there don't you son.

With only 3 sentences in one post you you get all three wrong. 100% strike rate there buttercup.

If you had any idea of their business plan you would understand the move to RPT and where the market is.

If you even bothered to look properly you would see you dont even have the correct model aircraft.

If you were able to remove your cranium from your posterior you would know that "don't have long to last" has been said of and debunked by the team at JETGO from day 1, and guess what not only have they surpassed every single point that some expert here as said they wont make, they have done it quietly, profitably and professionally and gotten on with the job.

The excrement that you spew forth only serves to display your complete and utter lack of comprehension of fact or it confirms that you feel threatened by them as a competitor in the market (and probably rightly so) either way your only way to react to this potential threat to your own miserable existence, your are a poltroon of extraordinary proportion. So petal, crawl back under your rock where you came from and let the adults get on with the job at hand.

I would not normally play the man, as opposed the ball. However in this case Chocks, you have no balls to play..... so the man it must be.

hiwaytohell

9th Jun 2014, 01:03

I think you are full of it Chocks. l'll bet you don't even know the Townsville refueller!

Obviously nobody has told Jetgo they have "not long to last"... take a look at FlightAware:

History ? VH-JZG ? FlightAware (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/VHJZG/history)

History ? VH-JTG ? FlightAware (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/VHJTG/history)

History ? VH-JGB ? FlightAware (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/VHJGB/history)

Jetgo have they gone?... Gone flying!!!

Actually what I hear is all positive and that Jetgo is one of the only operators who actually pay their bills on time.... maybe you should give JR a call and give him some business advice!

As for the security charges XPT I don't think it is quite as big a deal as you think... an extra $12 or so for inbound pax is realistically just part of the price these days for flying into SYD or BNE. Although the whole security requirements are BS they are a fact of life we have to deal with... Jetgo could have bought cheaper ERs and avoided some security screening requirements, but I reckon having the extra MTOW on the LR allows their ERJs to tanker fuel which would save them a lot more money not having to pay the ridiculous fuel prices and call out fees at country airports.

XPT

9th Jun 2014, 04:34

You'd avoid the mess at SYD, BNE & MEL like the plague.

With 36 seats you could only offer a service comparable in prices to QF & VA, but without all the delays, parking hassles, security, +DELAYS, DELAYS DELAYS etc.

Perhaps Essendon or Moorabbin to Bankstown ?

Getting to western Sydney, which think I read is now the 4th biggest metropolis in Australia, is very time consuming.

Security charges from these airports though would be very high as they would be the only ones paying for it & so would need lots of flights everyday to spread the cost.

If on the other hand they somehow had their aircraft "recertified" by manufacturer at under 20,000 kg, they would not require any security.

GADRIVR

9th Jun 2014, 11:06

Interesting to sit here and watch what the naysayers had to say about Jetgo at the start...... and they are STILL here. One doesn't hear any real negative about them out in the marketplace as a rule..... no bitter employees bagging the people that that pay them, no disgruntled creditors.... squat, nada.... not a sausage.
On the other hand, they are going into a tough market and won't be getting too much help. One would hope they have low overheads, management that have industry experience, an aggressive attitude and a workforce that is onside.
They mightn't get as big as Ben Hur but one thinks they might do a Cobham and if so, that makes sense and gives security to all involved. A good story for once..... not often that happens. Take note Allan!!!

BNEA320

9th Jun 2014, 22:47

if getting a new office in Sydney, then where will there routes be ?

Out of Sydney ?

Bankstown to ?

Essendon or Moorabbin ?

Archerfield maybe ?

Anyone have any clues ?

Trojan1981

10th Jun 2014, 03:45

Neck deep in a SAR tender using the Embraers? :ugh: How did I know that was going to go ahead...

Some people really should listen to those who know what they are talking about, and I'm not talking about the owners of Jetgo...

XPT

11th Jun 2014, 02:54

surely Skytrans TWB/SYD services will be "taken over" by a jet service from Wellcamp/SYD ?

Although won't be cheaper, will be much quicker, although Wellcamp might be able to support a local based jet that's bigger than anything Jetgo have.

You'd think that with all the future FIFO to Wellcamp, this could be combined with RPT to justify a 737 type regular service, ie up to twice a day.

BNEA320

11th Jun 2014, 06:58

yes Wellcamp (called Brisbane West) makes sense. When does Wellcamp expect to open ?

falconx

11th Jun 2014, 07:24

October 2014

Chocks Away

11th Jun 2014, 13:00

TEABAGS- ...3 sentences in one post you you get all three wrong. :mad:sh#t!

Security DOES "add extra cost" even by your mates' admittance mentioned below your vitriol! So correct comment.:ok:

My "ER" to your "LR"...:ugh: splitting hairs. You knew what was being said.

Tough market in Australia? Correct! :ok:
The "Townsville Refueller's" take on it? The jury is still out :E
...and for your information I knew the "Townsville Refueller" very well and where/how the actual saying started, for many years back when you were still in yuh dad's bag!

Your vitriol and venom is testament as to why a very experienced; highly qualified & respected ex-chief pilot of yours couldn't get away from you fast enough! :rolleyes:

Oh... by the way, don't you even call me your son, talking down to me like that again, I'm NOT your son!

Good luck in your efforts anyway.

wotajoke

12th Jun 2014, 04:37

......as to why a very experienced; highly qualified & respected ex-chief pilot of yours.......

To my knowledge the company has only ever had one Chief Pilot and he's still in the role. You should really get your facts straight fella. Doesn't paint your cynicism in a very good light when your 'facts' aren't.

:rolleyes:

Chocks Away

12th Jun 2014, 05:58

To my knowledge ... wotajoke :} DO YOUR research before you start trying to take people down.
Makes you look like a real amateur sounding like you came down in the last rain shower otherwise :ugh:
(Bye bye, much better things to do.)

Jetgo Management

12th Jun 2014, 07:00

Speaking of Amateurs Here's a fact for you from the horse's mouth, JETGO has only ever had one Chief Pilot...

Cop that

wotajoke

12th Jun 2014, 07:44

What was that you were saying Chocks?

:ugh:

Cactusjack

12th Jun 2014, 07:46

To get back on track, JetGo are still around and have been busy chipping away behind the scenes. There are a number of routes and contracts out there that would sit perfectly within the JetGo model and I have no doubt they will have some additional news in coming months.
Keep in mind that JetGo have a decent aircraft type when compared to some of the other charter operators out there with 30 year old dinosaurs. JetGo have a better airline structure and a good focus on safety, compliance and aviation skills, again unlike some of their crappy competition who have done very little to impress the regulator with their continued issues, endless non conformances and pathetic due diligence.

Let's give JetGo a go :ok:

Jetgo Management

12th Jun 2014, 09:17

Let's give JetGo a go

Best post Iv'e seen in the two years Cactus, thats all we ask. We are having a go and not just talking about it. Also spot on about a company update soon. New website live in a couple of weeks will tell all..

thanks others for your support... still hiring BTW!

Global Aviator

12th Jun 2014, 10:45

It's fcuking awesome that an Aussie company can move forward in aviation.

Australia as we know just love to kick the successful entrepreneur.

Chocks Away

12th Jun 2014, 12:04

:ugh: My mistake, Check & Training Manager, (not Jason).

Kharon

12th Jun 2014, 21:08

GA It's fcuking awesome that an Aussie company can move forward in aviation.

Personally, I wouldn't have phrased quite like that, but I can agree with the sentiment. What Jetgo have achieved is remarkable – any where in the world; but even more so to have done it in Australia. The blood, sweat and tears alone needed to achieve finance credibility and finding a financier with the "vision" to back an Australian aviation enterprise, speaks of remarkable abilities and a rock solid business plan. Having managed to find the dollars, next comes the AOC challenge; the costs are staggering, the difficulties even with a realistic CASA team, first class "library" and even with all the ducks in a neat row it's no easy task; definitely not one for the feint hearted or amateur dreamer.

Having achieved so much they still have to survive and prosper in a tough environment. I'm with Jack – put envy and the tall poppy clippers aside. Credit where it's due and a Fair go for Jetgo.

Sponsor: IOS chapter for the prevention of Hair pulling, Bitch slapping, Hissy fits and the curling up of toes to prevent socks being put on.

SHVC

16th Jun 2014, 11:06

Jet-Go have an ad on AFAP looking for DEC and FO spots. They must be doing well, does anyone know what the conditions are like?

BPA

16th Jun 2014, 11:14

The add says you have to be willing to fund your own endorsement with Jetgo paying the cost back to you over 2 years.

Cactusjack

16th Jun 2014, 12:58

Jet-Go have an ad on AFAP looking for DEC and FO spots. They must be doing well, does anyone know what the conditions are like?
Yep, they are doing very well. Got some good stuff in the pipeline :ok:
A couple of pilots I drink with reckon the pay is ok, the morale is really good and the people in management roles aren't dimwitted entrepreneurs like some of their opposition! Best thing is that they don't have CASA breathing down their necks, plus they are safe, compliant and tick all the right boxes.

Captain Biggles84

17th Jun 2014, 08:16

Can anyone divulge what Capt and F/O salaries are??

Mach E Avelli

17th Jun 2014, 08:30

If CASA are not currently breathing down their necks, give them time! They will be looking for someone to trial their new Part 121 rules.

With this type of pay-for-training arrangement, if the operator does go belly-up half way through the payback period, the employee would be an unsecured creditor at the back of the pack. It could prove to be a very expensive rating on a type which would offer few employment opportunities elsewhere.

Bonding is the way to go, but for that the operator needs sufficient funds to be able to pay for crew training. The bond is held in escrow and is only released to the operator if the employee does a runner before time. If the operator fails, the bond is released back to the employee.

Not saying for one minute that they WILL go bust - it would be great to see a small player finally succeed at RPT in this country - but simply 'caveat emptor'.

puff

17th Jun 2014, 08:39

Didn't a lot of Brindy guys get burned by the 'we'll pay back your endorsement' arrangement when they went under?

I don't want to be negative but whats the economics of those EMB-135/145s when nearly all of them are being parked up around the world due to the price of fuel and such a small capacity?

bagthrower

17th Jun 2014, 08:56

Can anyone divulge what Capt and F/O salaries are?

Have a mate that works there. Says its a great operation,

FO's $75K plus Super plus allowances
CPT $130 plus above

NoN1

17th Jun 2014, 10:46

What is the cost of the rating? :eek:

onehitwonder

17th Jun 2014, 10:52

Where's Jetgo RPT flying to?

jet1st

17th Jun 2014, 23:45

yes that would be interesting to know.

wotajoke

18th Jun 2014, 04:13

A quick look online shows $40k with FlightSafety. I reckon you could throw on another $5-6k for hotel, airfares and food.

The pay for your endorsement business model started enmasse (in AU) with Virgin some years ago now. It's hardly JetGo's fault to be following what many others have since adopted. They do however purport to recover the cost of the rating to the individual which in essence I suppose is a sign of goodwill.

They really should have someone proof read the ads that go to the AFAP website though. The one that went up recently is a bit of a mess.

More power to them for having a go.

:ok:

BPA

18th Jun 2014, 09:38

Pay for endorsements started with Impulse in the 90's with the requirement to pay for the B1900 endorsement.

No pay for endorsement anymore at Virgin.

wotajoke

18th Jun 2014, 10:13

Agreed BPA. Key word there 'enmasse'. Should Jetgo sink significant roots I hope they'll follow VA with reduced salaries until prescribed experience is achieved in lieu of paying for your rating.

bagthrower

18th Jun 2014, 10:26

Holding Group Interviews in BNE next week. Type rating is around 30K. Word is they have 5 aircraft arriving before end of the year so a lot of crew ramp up. I hope they do well and prosper. As someone else said here, its just awesome that there is another jet operator that can give people a go...

Cactusjack

18th Jun 2014, 12:11

Holding Group Interviews in BNE next week. Type rating is around 30K. Word is they have 5 aircraft arriving before end of the year so a lot of crew ramp up. I hope they do well and prosper.
Baggy, I believe you are correct about the 5 aircraft :E
These guys have good backers, good plans and are putting things together rather succinctly. Watch this space.....

Nulli Secundus

18th Jun 2014, 12:51

I think the type is an ideal RPT choice given its first to market in Aus with no direct jet competitor (at present). A hub busting model will more than likely be their unique operational advantage (don't be tempted to pull in to a port en route!), but that won't make it a walk in the park.

A qantaslink Q400 operating say Bundaberg Sydney would be only around 20 mins slower so they could be challenged to some extent.

The day to day operations will be relatively the easy part. Knowing some of the management people from years back, I do hope they've honed their marketing skills or have some really sharp people on the team to drive their sales programme. A very substantial sales & marketing budget does certainly need to be on hand from the outset.

Jet vs prop won't count for much if the prop price is more attractive, particularly ex regional centres. The incumbents' loyalty programmes alone will prove challenging.

James Strong proclaimed many years ago that when you initiate a new route, it must make money from day one. Planning to wear losses in a start - up phase is death. The message is hit the ground running and fill that machine from the first departure.

That's really where these games are mostly won or lost. The opposition doesn’t need to annihilate you, just keep you one seat below the break even load factor and its Korda Mentha to the rescue.

All that said, I think they can be successful. Who knows what success may mean to the founders (around for 20 years as an independent, sell out to VB/ QF/ Rex or maybe a code share/ feeder arrangement).

If the plan is not to play the long game, it would be wise to establish and maintain a dialogue with other prominent airline people as early as possible.

jet1st

18th Jun 2014, 22:17

it would make a lot of sense if some of the new aircraft were under 20k.

They could then operate routes such as Essendon/Bankstown on a corporate jet basis, but at commercial fares very similar to QF/VA.

With no B/S security & free or close to free car parking & no time wasting at either ends routes like this could be a real winner.

Wouldn't need a QF Club just something basic at each end.

JustJoinedToSearch

19th Jun 2014, 01:44

Shame about the lack of facilities/space (thanks to corporate development) and NIMBYs otherwise MB would be perfect for something like that.

There's a huge catchment area in the SE that would benefit from services to SY or BK. It would probably quarter the door to door travel time for the residents in that area.

XPT

19th Jun 2014, 06:16

Saw a Dornier 328 jet land there after flying over from Avalon airshow. Must have been 12 or 13 years ago.

traveler1982

19th Jun 2014, 13:21

Holding Group Interviews in BNE next week. Type rating is around 30K. Word is they have 5 aircraft arriving before end of the year so a lot of crew ramp up. I hope they do well and prosper.

So are all interviews from their hold file or are they interviewing from new applicants from recent job ad as well?

OneFlightWonder

19th Jun 2014, 13:53

Noticed the 'second officer operations cadet' position on afap too, anyone have more info on this? More curious than anything...

Mach E Avelli

20th Jun 2014, 03:35

Despite the awful grammar, their advert spelled it out clearly enough, I thought.

Instead of asking other probable competitors for these jobs to post here (with the high probability of a bum steer!), why not get off your own bum and whack in an application? Then you will REALLY know what the score is.
Just because you apply, nothing says you have to take the job - or even attend the interview - if it doesn't appeal.

If you were just curious you could even apply under a carefully disguised alias.

OneFlightWonder

20th Jun 2014, 06:10

I guess I was more interested in the discussion as to what would motivate the company to combine pilot recruitment and operations together, difficulty finding young talent for its operations perhaps? As I say, just curious. I don't meet the requirements so won't be pursuing an application even under a carefully disguised alias. Feeling that warm inviting pprune love already!

jet1st

20th Jun 2014, 06:45

think most of above, rather than the ERJ-135LR's, have MTOW of less than 20,000 kgs, which would mean no security & enormous sayings in costs for any RPT operation.

bagthrower

20th Jun 2014, 11:00

which would mean no security & enormous sayings in costs for any RPT operation

What Bull****! the cost of $4.69 or so dollars a head for screening ( Dubbo example only source Dubbo airport website) x 36 pax ( $ 168.84 ) is minuscale compared to an ER having to take on fuel at Dubbo or any country airport, with fuel close to $2.00 litre VS a bit over a dollar at hub airports.

1500 litres @ even .60c difference is $900 ! How could an ER be cheaper. It appears that the owners of JG have done a little more research hence their all LR fleet than that of the "Expert" PPrunNers

apacau

20th Jun 2014, 11:15

I believe the 20k MTOW rule applies to non-jet aircraft. The E135 being a jet I believe would therefore need to be screened if running an RPT operation. Happily stand corrected though.

BNEA320

20th Jun 2014, 23:34

if.they flew essendon to bankstown

under 20k no security .

20k or over need security whether 1 flight a day or 10

full time security amortized over only few flights incredibly expensive

Jetdream

26th Jun 2014, 09:53

If they were interviewing this week did anyone get the call up for one?

PPRuNeUser0161

26th Jun 2014, 12:33

Isn't the 20K security screening only if terminating at a primary control airport???

SN

HappyBandit

26th Jun 2014, 20:28

Jet dream

I believe it will now be in 2 weeks time in Sydney

traveler1982

26th Jun 2014, 20:39

Hi Bandit,
Do you have any idea if they are still calling guys/girls for interview or do they have their quota for this round of interviews?

HappyBandit

26th Jun 2014, 21:11

Not sure I believe they are still sifting through apps. Sounds like a pretty good outfit overall and would probably more suit guys/gals looking at slowing down their careers than those wanting to progress. Then again, a job is a job. Biggest concern I see is contractual based around mining. Who knows though they may have some solid contracts. Would be good to know more about them.

BNEA320

27th Jun 2014, 00:39

bagthrower you seem to have no idea.

If under 20k MTOW, no need to use terminals.

Eg. at BNE if using terminals then it costs around $11/passenger departing & around $10/passenger arriving that's $21/passenger. If similar at airport at other end, that's $42/passenger just to use the airport terminal, which is why alternative terminals are popping up.

Alliance Airlines has there own terminal at BNE for FIFO where none of these charges apply & could be used if under 20k MTOW.

If at an airport that doesn't existing security, eg, Bankstown, then equipment has to be sourced & workers found on minimum number of hours. Huge costs !!!

Vpilot53

27th Jun 2014, 01:40

Does anyone know if they have contacted guys regarding interviews yet?

romeocharlie

29th Jun 2014, 12:07

Mach, had a look at the advert and admittedly I'm a couple of reds in… Where was the bad grammar? Drift I know, but after you point it out isn't there some irony in the fact they're asking 'Have a very high degree of English literacy??'

Mach E Avelli

29th Jun 2014, 12:42

Tautology is bad grammar.
e.g. Police- speak "the body of a deceased male person" when "dead man" would suffice.

ANCPER

1st Jul 2014, 05:32

Okay, re the grammar, I'll bite!

JETGO AUSTRALIA, (I'd get rid of the comma, it flows better) IN ANTICIPATION OF RPT SERVICES COMMENCING IN SEPTEMBER ARE LOOKING (for) EXCEPTIONAL PEOPLE TO JOIN US IN 2014 FROM (and not keen on the 'join us in 2014 'FROM') OUR SYDNEY BASE. ALL CANDIDATES MUST ( BE PREPARED TO BE PREPARED......really?? How about just ...'must be prepared to'... ), TO FUND THEIR OWN TYPE RATING WHICH WILL BE REIMBURSED OVER A 2 YEAR TENURE. Tenure?? How about period?

tenure
ˈtɛnjə/
noun
noun: tenure; noun: security of tenure; plural noun: securities of tenure

1.
the conditions under which land or buildings are held or occupied.
synonyms:tenancy (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+tenancy&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CB8Q_SowAA), occupancy (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+occupancy&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCAQ_SowAA), holding (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+holding&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCEQ_SowAA), occupation (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+occupation&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCIQ_SowAA), residence (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+residence&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCMQ_SowAA); Morepossession (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+possession&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCUQ_SowAA), title (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+title&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCYQ_SowAA), ownership (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+ownership&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCcQ_SowAA), proprietorship
"they have a right to a fair rent and security of tenure"

2.
the holding of an office.
"his tenure of the premiership would be threatened"
synonyms:incumbency (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+incumbency&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCgQ_SowAA), term of office, term (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+term&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCkQ_SowAA), period of/in office, time (https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-a&hs=BlC&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&q=define+time&sa=X&ei=vkKyU-iwC83TkQWx7YGQCA&ved=0CCoQ_SowAA), time in office More"his tenure as Secretary of State for Industry"

a period for which an office is held.
plural noun: tenures

3.
guaranteed permanent employment, especially as a teacher or lecturer, after a probationary period.
"tenure for university staff has been abolished"

Cactusjack

1st Jul 2014, 06:51

Really - Bad grammar? Typos? Spelling mistakes? Who gives monkeys nuts!
JetGo have some excellent plans lined up including growing the company, adding aircraft and pilots, and they are meeting regulatory requirements. They have solid financial backing and have more announcements to come this year :ok:

ANCPER

1st Jul 2014, 07:38

Hey cactus, it's "who gives a monkey's nuts":O. Lighten up, I'm sure 99% of pilots wish them the best :O

Jetgo Management

1st Jul 2014, 09:25

My Bad,

I wasn't very well edumacated.. But we try hard.. As per earlier questions in the thread, a final list of applicants for the first round of interviews has been compiled. Requests for interviews will go out shortly. Many experienced people out there, shame we can only take a few. Interviews for Crew will be in BNE. Operation Cadets in Sydney. Thanks to all whom have applied. Overall over 500 applicants for all positions. Also looking for experienced flight attendants for Sydney based positions for all of you whom may know someone interested.

overnight

2nd Jul 2014, 01:10

Jetgo Management,

How nice it is to hear something positive from someone in head office. All we get these days from the usual culprits is "The world is falling in."

I have not applied for a job and don't know your business plan but I do remember when airlines in Australia actually flew their own branded aircraft and were proud of it. Now all the talk about is codeshares, subsidiaries and partnerships and how far a passenger can travel on someone else's network.

I only wish you well and hope you charge an appropriate fee for the services rendered in order to survive. It's a race to the top not the bottom.

Hopefully your initiative and success may make others wake up to themselves and begin trying to work out how to make a dollar instead of saving fifty cents.

Good Luck to you.

romeocharlie

2nd Jul 2014, 11:59

Clearly was the red:ouch: ....and that's why they only trust me with boxes.

Good luck JetGo! As stated, nice to hear a good word in this place.

Jetdream

4th Jul 2014, 01:17

Can we assume successful applicants have been contacted?

wheredidwhogo

4th Jul 2014, 10:12

Firstly its great to see Jetgo prosper a breath of fresh air to Australian aviation. Secondly why hasn't the moderator jumped onto the thread it has read " have they gone" its damaging clearly. I see their aircraft about not sure how they are travelling unlike most of these pretends on pprune i actually fly for a living. To all the public who read this thread9/10s are not pilots or actually never will be mostly the guys i fly over when im 100ft above mins with 20 across my nose good luck jetgo us pilots wish you all the best

Hempy

4th Jul 2014, 11:38

Defenestrator

4th Jul 2014, 11:57

I'm with Wheredidwhogo (I think). Whatever he said.....now where's my beer.

polaris79

7th Jul 2014, 22:17

Gentlemen,
Is anyone from management or otherwise able to shed some light on the following please:

1. How solid are the current contracts for JetGo and what are the contract lengths like for the foreseeable future?

2. What is the main reason for the move from BNE to SYD given the cost of housing a base in SYD as opposed to BNE?

3. As of Sept 1 what will the RPT route network look like?

4. Are you able to give us an idea about the remuneration package details for Captains and FOs?

Info for others:
Current price on an EMB135/145 rating at Flight Safety in St Louis is USD $39,600. This endorsement also provides the option to conduct a differences course to cover the Legacy 600/650 as well.

Sincere thanks!

Seaeagle109

8th Jul 2014, 01:17

Polaris79,

I'm not from JetGo management, or employed by them, but OK, I'll bite:

1/ You're either kidding with that question or you're very naïve about business. Do do really expect any company to give out confidential business details over an open internet forum just because you want to know how their business is, or will be, performing in the future? You'll see those details when you either join the JetGo management team or are a shareholder. If these types of details aren't provided by the JetGo management, then they'll just be speculation.

As for your other questions,

2/ Probably because that'll be where they actually started, and that's where the answer to your 3rd question will be using as a hub, and where they believe their future plans will be best served. The costs will be factored into their plans, and contrary to what was the overwhelming initial Pprune expert opinion on JetGo, they seem to have gotten their sums right so far.

3/ I'll guess Sydney to regional centers that have a mining base or new/ expanded manufacturing industries that have poor air connections to either their management, finance, suppliers and/ or workforce. Think Qld towns like Emerald, Gladstone, Roma, etc., with their proximity to mines or new/ expanded industrial manufacturing that have to connect through Brisbane, and therefore add lots of travel time/ overnights and costs for people needing to do business in those locations, and who don't want to overnight in either the country center, or Sydney, if they're coming to do business in the big smoke. The people who have speculated about Bankstown/ Morrabin/ Essendon/ Archerfield connections will, IMHO, be proved to be way off the mark, that's never going to happen for many reasons. Security costs won't be a major factor in where they serve.

4/ Look at post 47 on this thread. Nobody has called 'Bullsh*t' on those figures, I think you'll find they're either accurate or certainly within the ballpark.

Just my best guesses on your Q's 2-4.

Jetgo Management

8th Jul 2014, 09:06

Nailed It

SeaEagle109 you should apply to work in our commercial department.

Skystar320

15th Jul 2014, 12:56

So... Subject to regulatory approval and 'negotiations' it seems JETGO wants to fly from Roma to Sydney.

Western Star 15th July paper.

Nulli Secundus

15th Jul 2014, 13:01

A town of 7000 people - is that viable for RPT?

What about Syd - HBA, GLA or BUD?

XPT

16th Jul 2014, 03:19

Roma/BNE is a big FIFO route, so presume Roma/SYD is the same maybe.

So you combine FIFO & the public into RPT flights.

Massive gas mining projects out Roma way.

Think this is main reason for Wellcamp airport, which can take 747 freighters when it opens in October. Think that runway is going to be 2870m.

Pearly White

16th Jul 2014, 03:27

could a Jetgo ERJ get in & out of Moorabbin ?
Saw a Dornier 328 jet land there after flying over from Avalon airshow. Must have been 12 or 13 years ago.Indeed it did. Think you will find though the ERJ is a far more runway-hungry aircraft than the 328Jet.

In fact according to www.aircraftcompare.com, the 328 Jet has Minimum Take Off Distance 993.65 metres (3,260.00 feet) and Minimum Landing Distance -
789.43 metres (2,590.00 feet) while an ERJ135 has Minimum Take Off Distance - 1,759.92 metres (5,774.00 feet) Minimum Landing Distance - 1,360.02 metres (4,462.00 feet).

Don't have ERSA open in front of me but fairly certain Moorabbin LDA 1190m so the ERJ would be sitting on Lloyd's golf course by now.

Cactusjack

16th Jul 2014, 03:29

JetGo are on the ball, and has been pointed out, there is a lot of mining development out and around Roma, with more to come. A lot of miners and mining executives live in Sydney, and prefer Sydney over Brisbane. If you were a miner why drive from your mine to Roma, then catch a flight from Roma to Toowoomba, and then drive back to Brisbane from Toowoomba in gridlock? Instead, drive from your mine site into Roma and catch a nice comfy Embraer from Roma direct to Sydney.
Sounds logical :ok:

Nulli Secundus

16th Jul 2014, 08:06

Hang on a sec, if the idea is to conduct RPT because there's mining operations at the destination, wouldn't you simply continue to offer a FIFO service.

How does a local pop. of just 7000 now make RPT more viable for the speculated Roma-Sydney?

If you haven't secured FIFO contracts already, why would RPT to the same destination, carrying the same pax be a more robust business model? As soon as mining contracts, so too will the 'RPT' operation. How's that a long term RPT strategy?

If in fact you tried to secure FIFO and failed, well, logic says don't start an RPT operation.

As far as I can summise, new route RPT operations often aim to build/ create markets from what initially appear to be quite marginal customer bases.

Is that Roma-Sydney? Not sure it is.

Cactusjack

16th Jul 2014, 08:16

There is a massive amount of mining in the region planned for the next decade. The RPT side of things is ramping up and will continue to do so as there will be a huge business traveller demand into the region. Mining executives, planners, material suppliers, pre setup exploratory and mapping work, safety suppliers, bean counters and shhhhhhh Hookers..........
Lots of bums on limited seats. 'If you build it they will come'. Well they're building it and JetGo are going to reap a windfall :ok:

HappyBandit

16th Jul 2014, 08:30

Goodluck to those doing interviews this week. I think its got merit bit of a shame it is only Sydney base and upfront endo.

jet1st

16th Jul 2014, 09:35

surely you can have a FIFO contract with miners flying on RPT services with the general public filling the aircraft.

Maybe the mining co. wants high frequency say 25 miners per flight, so Jetgo can then sell the extra 11 seats for a profit.

Only catch is you can't avoid the security nonscience, that can be avoided with pure FIFO ops.

What about a route like MEL/WOL that was abandoned by QF link 5 or so years ago. Think QF did 2 flights a day every day using an old Dash 8-100.

onehitwonder

16th Jul 2014, 13:59

Bhp isn't in wol anymore so no FIFO

Skystar320

17th Jul 2014, 04:34

Well I wish them good luck if that is the case!

One can only imagine and hope that Jetgo has already got an underwriting for the route or have a contract in place to guarantee a % of seats on a FIFO contract.

An Embraer 135 is an expensive aircraft to operate though lets hope they get to carry all the bags!

Any consulting jobs going Jetgo?

Nulli Secundus

17th Jul 2014, 11:17

I'm of the opinion the 'world' may very well be their oyster.

Having gone to the trouble of importing the micro-jet hardware, how many city pairs are there for the taking. You'd have to smack the turbo-prop opposition provided ground & pax services are of a very high quality.

Why not Syd to -

Broken Hill?
Tamworth?
Bundaberg?
Gladstone?
Rockhampton?
Toowoomba?
Essendon?

Others?

Skystar320

17th Jul 2014, 11:19

Email just popped in from one of my 'associates' in America.

G'day Mate!

Firstly well done mate on getting the sale/leaseback on those 757's you drove a hard bargain which ultimately beat us! you owe me a beer next time your in the US

Anyway - can't you do deals in your hood instead of poaching ours?

Just in Republic will lease x 3 Embraer EMB140LR to Jetgo in Australia. CN: 145522, 145513 & 145535. Y44 seats and will be delivered in August / September and October

Anyway talk to you later

chimbu warrior

17th Jul 2014, 11:33

JetGo Australia to lease three ERJ-140s from Republic - ch-aviation.com (http://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/29619-jetgo-australia-to-lease-three-erj-140s-from-republic)

Looks like they are expanding again.

Nulli Secundus

17th Jul 2014, 11:39

Here's very interesting commentary in light of the Republic presser just out. Granted Australia is a different dynamic, but it won't be beer and skittles either, regardless of the choice of airframe:

Aviation Week Nov 2011
Many regional carriers are having a difficult time with 50-seat aircraft, which have become unsuitable for many markets because of high fuel costs and the limited number of seats over which to spread the higher costs, but Republic appears to be the first to have reached the breaking point.

“It's difficult to see how we can continue to operate these aircraft for our major airline partners unless we significantly reduce the operating costs,” says Bryan Bedford, Republic's CEO.

Bedford has blamed some of the problem on escalating maintenance costs, above-market lease rates and uneconomical fixed-fee reimbursement rates. But there also is something else at work, he says: Fixed-fee flying for major airlines is not producing the historical level of returns because automatic rate increases in those fixed-fee contracts are tied to the Consumer Price Index, which has not risen much in recent years—certainly not enough to keep pace with regional airline costs for labor, health care and maintenance.

That makes 50-seater economics even more difficult to overcome, he says. Concurrently, major airline downsizing of their “marginal hubs” has lessened demand for the aircraft. For Republic, even cutting its 50-seat aircraft fleet by nearly half since the end of 2007 has not been enough. Nor is having 11 of the ERJ 145s subleased offshore, as was the case as of Sept. 30.
The tough question is: What can Republic do about it? Republic says it plans to negotiate lower costs with stakeholders, but there is a problem. Not only does Chautauqua own 22 of its ERJ 145s, but 22 of them are leased from General Electric (http://awin.aviationweek.com/OrganizationProfiles.aspx?orgId=31624) Capital Aviation Services (Gecas). Gecas also is leasing six ERJ 145s to Aeromexico, seven to SkyWest subsidiary ExpressJet and six to Trans States Airlines in the U.S., and nine to Passaredo Transportes Aereos in Brazil. If Gecas lowers lease rates for Republic in mid-contract, you can bet other carriers also will be knocking at its door. That might limit the leasing company's desire to cut a deal.
Other regionals will be paying attention, especially since 50-seat aircraft still accounted for nearly half the U.S. regional airline fleet as of July, and the fuel prices that have made many routes uneconomical for them are not likely to fall. As reported in Aviation Week in May, over the rest of this decade more than 70% of those 50-seaters will reach the end of their capacity purchase contracts.

Earlier this year, SkyWest Airlines COO Chip Childs told me the widely predicted demise of the 50-seater has been overstated because operators will be able to negotiate new, lower-cost rates when their current leases expire. Republic's attempt to do so even earlier could provide an early indication of what is really possible.

Copythisnumberdown

17th Jul 2014, 12:06

Earlier this year, SkyWest Airlines COO Chip Childs told me the widely predicted demise of the 50-seater has been overstated because operators will be able to negotiate new, lower-cost rates when their current leases expire. Republic's attempt to do so even earlier could provide an early indication of what is really possible.

I think that quote alone ( even though this article was in 2011) says Jetgo know their market. back in Sky Air World Days they paid well over $400 000 a month for a EMB170 which can be leased now for $160 000 month. ERJ's being parked and retired by ACMI operators such as Republic, whom no longer can make a living out of such low rates to the majors are a bonus to operators like Jetgo that can pick these airframes up for way under market rates... All Jetgos fleet are still only 10 years old and one of their fleet only has 5000 TT hours VS some of the 20 yr old plus 40 000 hr plus hours of their " supposed opposition" turbo props.... know who Id prefer to fly for and with if I were the travelling public

bagthrower

17th Jul 2014, 21:16

jetgo dot com looks as though its new web is up, still no ports listed however. Damm!

jet1st

18th Jul 2014, 00:06

jetgo.com ?

Doesn't look any different.

Maybe was pulled from 2 hours ago.

bagthrower

18th Jul 2014, 00:10

Try opening it in a fresh browser or clearing your internet cache

AIRTAM

18th Jul 2014, 04:35

Watch the Sydney - Tamworth route. Paul Bredereck, listed as Managing Director Airlines within Jetgo, is a local who owned Tamair and is still well thought of in Tamworth by residents. Tamworth Regional Council has been endevouring to interest another airline like Skytrans to serve the city and give some competition to Qantaslink. Rex is the ideal airline, more so with their new Armidale service and reportedly lower fares which is being noted in Tamworth but the Tamworth R. C. will not accept Rex's conditions on not paying for passenger screening which they don't require. Dubbo could be another contender with Rex waring with the local Council and their recent loss of a court battle with the Council, again over paying for security charges.
Interesting period ahead - maybe Wellcamp - Sydney could be a goer as a number of new routes from Newcastle.

tail wheel

18th Jul 2014, 09:19

https://scontent-a-lax.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/t1.0-9/10527538_10152986077087067_8214238579173649949_n.jpg

Skystar320

18th Jul 2014, 09:54

Bit slow on the uptake Tailwheel! see above posts.

Does anyone know the operating costs / fuel burn of the EMB135/145 type aircraft?

Nulli Secundus

18th Jul 2014, 09:57

Western Star front page:

"Roma to Sydney in one hour" ............ in Alliance's Fokker 70/ Cobham's 717.

Why didn't Jetgo make sure their own airframe made it onto the front page.

C'mon............ marketing!!!!

TWOTBAGS

18th Jul 2014, 10:24

MD-80 actually, so no not a 717 (engine is a JT8) and not a Fokker (slats) and given there is no quote from the company I would hazard to bet that it was not a company release.

My bet is stock photo and someone at the Roma end who has leaked the info:} So jetgo probably knew nothing about it until it happened.

But only if I was a betting man.:E

Dingowalkabout

18th Jul 2014, 10:40

That's funny Hempy, my first laugh on PP:O

Section28- BE

21st Jul 2014, 21:40

Anybody know, how much 'strength' went into Roma (&/or Miles-Condamine) when the runway was (/wasn't) 'reworked'....????

How hard is the EMB- ACN/PCN wise.....???

Rgds
S28- BE

Fieldmouse

22nd Jul 2014, 05:08

From a little bit of looking. Emb145 15C 130psi , Roma 18C 141psi. So all good.

Going Nowhere

22nd Jul 2014, 05:28

The 12 Q400 flights per day will do more damage to the runway over time than the occasional E135 will

traveler1982

25th Jul 2014, 12:35

Anyone who interviewed recently hear anything back?

Horatio Leafblower

25th Jul 2014, 13:41

Here, Traveller 1982?

....or There?

I hope they didn't make you do a speling teste.

...than again, if they don't like old guys, maybe spelin isnt impoartent.

traveler1982

25th Jul 2014, 13:50

Thanks mate always great to get a hand from someone more edumacated than myself:ok:

Horatio Leafblower

25th Jul 2014, 14:16

Sorry mate :D

Long week :ugh: :{

Ozdork

27th Jul 2014, 23:20

JetGo Australia (Brisbane Int'l) will lease three ERJ-140LR aircraft from US operator, Republic Airlines (YX, Chicago O'Hare) SkyWorld Aviation has revealed. The aircraft in question - N297SK (cn 145522), N295SK (cn 145513) and N371SK (cn 145535) - are configured with 44 Economy class seats and due to be delivered in August, September and October this year.

The Australian corporate shuttle and ad-hoc charter specialist also operates three ERJ-135s with one ERJ-145 on order.

XPT

1st Aug 2014, 01:58

just found this porky when having a quick look at new jetgo website

"Our ERJs are so quiet that they are the only commercial jet aircraft permitted to operate into Sydney Airport during the curfew period."

For a start all BAE146's can land at SYD during curfew & plenty of them still in Australia.

Think also a Dornier 328 jet can land at SYD during curfew.

There are probably other commercial jets that can also.

Seaeagle109

1st Aug 2014, 06:41

"just found this porky when having a quick look at new jetgo website

"Our ERJs are so quiet that they are the only commercial jet aircraft permitted to operate into Sydney Airport during the curfew period."

For a start all BAE146's can land at SYD during curfew & plenty of them still in Australia.

Think also a Dornier 328 jet can land at SYD during curfew.

There are probably other commercial jets that can also."

Sorry XPT but I just looked up the groups of aircraft that are allowed to operate at YSSY during the curfew as I didn't recall either of your nominated types as being on the list and neither the 146 or 328 are included.

You might want to refer to either the AIP DAP or Jeps about the aircraft types permitted to operate during curfew.

B772

1st Aug 2014, 06:55

The former National Jet B737-300QC was approved for SYD during curfew hours.

nig&nog

1st Aug 2014, 07:08

I dont think you can really call the BAe146 or Doriner 328 a jet they are more like good impersonators.

Seaeagle109

1st Aug 2014, 07:09

B772,

I'd be interested to know how they got that approval, as I'd made some enquires about another type that isn't listed and was told "No way", as it isn't on the list and it wouldn't be allowed. That was only 18 months ago.

Snakecharma

1st Aug 2014, 08:57

The 146 is most definitely approved for Sydney curfew operations, having done a kazillion night freighters into their in the dead of night!

Seaeagle109

1st Aug 2014, 09:28

Snakecharma,

Well I stand corrected.

Is the 146 freighter covered by the paragraph in DAP regarding the curfew provisions saying, some operations have concessions against the curfew?

Was the approval only for freight ops or did it include pax ops?

ivan ellerbai

1st Aug 2014, 10:20

"The 146 is most definitely approved for Sydney curfew operations"

With 4 APU's and a hair dryer, hardly makes much noise!!!! Would've made a good jet option for Entebbe.

Ozdork

12th Aug 2014, 05:45

Just wondering how the recent recruitment drive went - did any one get a call, and if so, what's the deal? Or are they already in the USA doing endorsements?

bagthrower

12th Aug 2014, 12:25

Just wondering how the recent recruitment drive went

I have a mate of a mate whom was doing Indoc in BNE with a class of others recently.. 2 more in St Louis Flight Safety now and more going next month. Mate says they will hire another 15 to 20 this year mostly Sydney based

Cactusjack

13th Aug 2014, 04:02

Bagthrower is on the money. The company has deep pockets and also a well structured plan. They will service a number of regions and service them well....no prehistoric dinosaur aircraft with this mob :ok:

BPA

13th Aug 2014, 06:28

I guess Fitztroy Aviation and Tamair didn't have deep enough pockets.

scavengepump

13th Aug 2014, 07:51

Well played BPA!
History you exciteable lot - due diligence anyone??

wotajoke

13th Aug 2014, 09:12

I guess Fitzroy Aviation and Tamair didn't have deep enough pockets.

Or lessons learnt...;)

Hugh Jarse

13th Aug 2014, 13:06

I guess Fitzroy Aviation and Tamair didn't have deep enough pockets.

Hopefully they won't be doing V1 cuts at night in the aeroplane, either....

hiwaytohell

13th Aug 2014, 21:37

A bit of a stretch Hugh!

As far as I know Jetgo has only one ex Tamair person and he is not involved in flight operations. Hmmmm! Last I looked Virgin and Qantas had heaps of ex Tamair people in flight operational roles...... would you make the same comment about them?

As for JR & PB, there has been an awful lot of water under the bridge since Fitzroy & Tamair.

Defenestrator

13th Aug 2014, 22:49

That's low Jarse. You should delete that comment. Very poor form.

D :hmm:

Ascend Charlie

29th Aug 2014, 10:40

I heard that too.

Is there a "smiley" that goes "nyah nyah nya nyahhh nyahhhhhhh!!!" to Spike and his mates?:ok::ok::ok:

missy

29th Aug 2014, 13:57

SACL apron procedures were updated earlier in the week, parking for Jetgo on DOM6...

prm1

30th Aug 2014, 00:53

Hear they are doing hub busting routes GLA/BUD/ROK/ROM/EML/Wellcamp to SYD in their ERJ's.. noted their proving run yesterday they did ROMA SYD in under an hour and twenty minutes... the dirty old dash would still be going round the holding pattern getting into BNE when these guys are on short final at SYD, That would have to save a Shirtload of time transiting through that 'holding megaplace' they call an airport at Brisbane.. Smart move, hope they bring there machines into NSW and give REX a hurry up, Dubbo Melbourne maybe or Dubbo Brisbane all for the taking

megle2

30th Aug 2014, 02:18

Do you mean ROM / SY in 1 hour 20 rather than ROM / BN

flying-spike

30th Aug 2014, 06:25

The smiley ngarr ngarr crap is indicative of the level of maturity of the poster. My posts regarding Jet Go are only targeted at the ill informed that blather on about them being an airline or RPT when they were a charter organization an the unethical "consultant" that revealed how much he has overcharged the operator. In another area I have congratulated the operator on their achievements because they should be congratulated. I continue to wish them every success. No, I don't have a job application in with them. I don't need to. Thank you.

Cactusjack

30th Aug 2014, 10:02

noted their proving run yesterday they did ROMA SYD in under an hour and twenty minutes... the dirty old dash would still be going round the holding pattern getting into BNE when these guys are on short
Agree. The Embraer is a nice clean machine, especially compared to some of QLink's Dash's (the ageing ones) and particularly when compared to Skytrans 30 year old clunkers, not to mention their not so stellar levels of reliability and OTP.
As has been said before JetGo have been methodical in their set up, have good financial backing and the right aircraft type for their business model. It's going to be great watching them shake things up when they hit full swing :ok:

BPA

30th Aug 2014, 10:39

The problem with their business model is their future completion. If Qantas and Virgin notice they are carrying full loads on the SYD -ROM, SYD-BUD etc, Qantas will put a Q400 on the route and Virgin will put a Ejet or F100 on the route. If you think back about 8 years, Alliance was operating RPT on the TVL-BNE route, however once Jetstar and Virgin ramped up there services, Allisnce couldn't compete and reverted back to charter and they currently only operate one RPT route.

Remember the US regionals tried to use the E135/140/145 etc on bypass routes in the states and look how well it turned out. Within 10 years most of the aircraft have been retired from service, hence Jetgo has been able to pick them up at a good price.

So yes it good to see another operate gve it a go, but in the last 10 years there have been far two many airlines who stepped up from charter to RPT and failed.

Ascend Charlie

30th Aug 2014, 11:24

If Quaintarse or Virgin had any brains (yes, I know there is an irishman at the helm of one of the biggest loss-making airlines), they would quietly hop into bed with Jetgo on a codeshare basis, or just buy some capacity off them. Both Q and V know they haven't got the right aircraft for those routes, and rather than watch Jetgo take their potential customers, they should at least get a bite out of the business.

slim pickings

30th Aug 2014, 11:40

From the outside in:

Looks like a great product. The struggle will be when QLink dump seats on any and all routes. And they will. They definitely will. If Jetgo can achieve hosting in the VA system they'll go well.

JetA_OK

30th Aug 2014, 22:10

Maybe they'll be the first operator in the world to make a stand alone buck using E135/140 in RPT..........

TBM-Legend

30th Aug 2014, 23:20

If Jetgo can achieve hosting in the VA system they'll go well.

Being hosted in the VA or QF res systems is not a guarantee of financial success. Just ask Brindabella. Hosting is not a code share. I doubt if VA/QF will publish through fares with them which would help given the proposed routes.

The ERJ/CRJ aircraft types need high yielding fares to survive. In the USA the airlines that flew them mostly had a deal to provide the aircraft on an ACMI basis to the majors. Cobham do that here for QFLink...

slim pickings

31st Aug 2014, 00:02

Reckon you're a bit off the mark there TBM. I think you'll find the leases Jetgo has make it the most affordable jet in the marketplace.

TBM-Legend

31st Aug 2014, 01:33

I'm aware of that however the DOC's are not low..

Recent news:
http://aviationweek.com/awin/erj-operators-face-engine-overhaul-bill-excess-14bn

Copythisnumberdown

31st Aug 2014, 04:17

I'm aware of that however the DOC's are not low..

Thats Why operators have Rolls Royce MSP plans, as JG do....

deadcut

31st Aug 2014, 04:46

This guy did a trip report on a test RPT flight that Jetgo did.

http://cqplanespotting.********.com.au/2014/08/a-trip-report-and-photos-from-jetgo.html

Edit: Ok I don't know how to insert links in this Vbulletin board from the 90s. So just copy and paste the link.
Edit 2: So for some reason the link just won't work so I have posted the shortened version. If you think its dodgy then follow this tweet. That's where I got it from. https://twitter.com/cqplanespotting/status/505605157691084800

http://t.co/ztdZXYLQkV

Nulli Secundus

31st Aug 2014, 13:01

It seems from the US, at least anecdotally, that ERJ operations have shown to be vulnerable. The right airframe, whilst a very important component to success in aviation, is only part of the recipe. What can these guys do that will safeguard them from the majors' potentially aggressive counter attack? After all, when you want a piece of the on carriage action via a new-start hub bust operation, expect more than just a little heat!

The founder of one of Australia's most successful and significant regional airlines told me some years ago, you can't start a regional these days - the majors just won't let you! This guy was shrewd, he was influential and he grew his fleet to what I recall was 28 aircraft prior to sale.

They can be a success for sure, but as a long term independent operation they had better have a plan which keeps the majors at bay or, be prepared to grow quickly (beyond just 5 airframes!) to the point where it is simply not economical for the majors to try to shut you down/ contain your growth. If they can expand existing markets instead of poaching, they may just be left alone. For how long is a whole other question.

The timing could not be better as both majors reportedly retreat from dumping capacity into the market but I still don't see their point of difference. What will Jetgo do which the majors can't?

For mine, they need to form an alliance very fast with whomever they can.

TBM-Legend

31st Aug 2014, 13:29

NS makes good points. A network affiliation is critical for a long term success. Point to point route pickings is fine however the support beyond a point like Sydney is essential. Pax from other parts of Australia do not like changing carriers therefore some form of through fare structure becomes necessary. The other issue is the fact that 80% of the population live around the Golden Triangle.

MaxFL360

1st Sep 2014, 06:33

QLINK gave the GLA-SY route a go for quite some time and that is not working out and will end in the near future. Why would routes such as ROMA-SY etc be any different? I am not aware of the demand but is there a large number of passengers that currently transit through BN from SY for regional QLD?

BNEA320

1st Sep 2014, 08:12

you seem to have forgotten about FIFO's. FIFO's can go on RPT services, which can be underwritten by mining companies, just as charters are.

Being RPT allows the public access to these flights as well.

Maybe mining companies guarantee a certain % of seats & the rest Jetgo can sell to public.

Nulli Secundus

1st Sep 2014, 12:08

My view remains, what business are they in? Trying to be everything to everyone doesn't work. Mining is reportedly on the decline and so the last few years for Jetgo's FIFO/ charter ops have been a great foundation for what's about to be their transition to RPT.

But if there's talk of a 'hybrid' RPT where the miners say cover the base operating cost and the public delivers the bonus/ profit - dud model! Getting creative in any industry to circumvent the true realities of the ruthless, unforgiving market forces is simply death.

Just do the basics really well, identify your point of difference and market and sell like no other and you'll have a chance. But number one, know what business you should be in, and what you should not.

From experience saying no in business is vastly more challenging than saying yes.

RPT operators don't make charter their core business. To win a marathon you don't concentrate on sprint training. Point is, with all the operational experience built up from charter & FIFO the flying bit will be easy. The hard part as always in aviation is getting enough seats 'bummed' (if I may use a little poetic licence) to make a profit.

From the website, every key person is an operations person. Not a head of sales and marketing to be seen. That's a key position to omit in a multi-million dollar venture. Granted, the person may in fact exist, but for mine it is a significant ommission and one they would be wise to promote.

hiwaytohell

1st Sep 2014, 21:47

Although it would appear nearly all successful regionals started in charter. Rex, Eastern, Air North.....

BPA

1st Sep 2014, 22:37

REX was formed from the ashes of Hazelton and Kendell airlines. And yes they did start out as charter companies, but that was 40 plus years ago. Some with Eastern and Air North. The cost of doing business back then was cheaper and they started with piston aircraft, not jets.

Also for them to survive and grow they required help from the two domestic airlines (Ansett and TAA/Australian). Has the two domestic airlines withdrew their F27s they were replaced with the smaller (mostly piston aircraft initially) from Hazo's Kendell and Eastern/Sunstate/Southern.

In the case of Airnorth they have been hosted in the QF system for years and their recent expansion of routes has come about due to QF withdrawing from the routes and handing them over to Airnorth.

So history has shown that in order for a regional airline to survive and grow (in Australia, the USA and Europe) they need the backing/assistance of a larger domestic airline.

BPA

4th Sep 2014, 11:07

This is what happens when you aren't connected with one of the majors.

Skytrans cancels Toowoomba-Sydney route following Qantas announcement (http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/travel/travel-planning/travel-news/skytrans-cancels-toowoombasydney-route-following-qantas-announcement-20140904-10c9bd.html)

BNEA320

5th Sep 2014, 01:03

yes but how long will QF last on this route once concessions & underwriting of flights ends ?

Then some smaller & cheaper operator will come & fill in.

TBM-Legend

5th Sep 2014, 02:55

Who's underwriting QFLink then? What concessions are there?

What's you authenticated source then?:confused:

hiwaytohell

5th Sep 2014, 06:47

BPA

There is a bit more to Skytrans' success at Toowoomba than major affiliation. Very poorly marketed, a lack of visibility in the community and by all accounts less than stellar performance.

Not being connected to one of the majors can work Rex is Australia's most profitable passenger airline |ETB Travel News Australia (http://australia.etbnews.com/223712/rex-australias-profitable-passenger-airline/)

However I do agree a tie-up with a major is a significant advantage in most markets.

BPA

5th Sep 2014, 09:10

hiwaytohell,

Agree about REX at the moment, however currently their only competition is Qlink, however as more ATRs arrive expansion into places such as Wagga, Dubbo and the like will happen and REX won't be able to compete against the big 2.

Regarding Skytrans performance, given the number of aircraft Jetgo have (including the ones on the way) there is no guarantee their performance will be any better.

Look back a few years when Tiger started. With their fleet of 5-6 aircraft they had trouble covering breakdowns and were always cancelling flights. Even Virgin has been caught short of aircraft and crews during major weather disrupts.

Country folk will only take so many delays/cancellations before they start looking for more reliable service.

BNEA320

11th Sep 2014, 03:51

just heard rumour that Jetgo are abandoning RPT plan.

Jetgo Management

11th Sep 2014, 04:49

just heard rumour that Jetgo are abandoning RPT plan.

Sorry BNEA320 far from the truth.... Another week or so will see company announcements.. Keep tuned

slim pickings

11th Sep 2014, 05:21

just heard rumour that Jetgo are abandoning RPT plan.

More like, " just made up rumour that Jetgo are abandoning RPT plan".

:rolleyes:

Killer Loop

11th Sep 2014, 08:05

Saw them in Moresby on the 8th and Tokua on the 9th. Looked good.

wheredidwhogo

11th Sep 2014, 09:46

BNEA320 when does your school holidays end?

falconx

11th Sep 2014, 10:00

wheredidwhogo: The king of the one liners!

BNEA320

11th Sep 2014, 23:39

great news, but hurry up (we know CASA are incredibly slow & inefficient-they are public servants)

BNEA320

11th Sep 2014, 23:40

we're on permanent holiday & you're paying for it !!!!!!!

AirWest

12th Sep 2014, 04:59

Have they not just announced the route? Gladstone to Sydney the one that's been recently vacated by Qantaslink?

Nulli Secundus

12th Sep 2014, 10:26

Ah no, just annoucing they are commencing negotiations.

On August 22:
JETGO's new 44 passenger 140LR awaits delivery in Republic Airlines facility in Louisville Kentucky. Expected to leave America at the end of the month the aircraft will be ferried back to Australia by the Company CEO Captain Jason Ryder and Head Of Training Captain Chad Tracy. This ferry flight unlike the others is expected to travel west and visit Alaska, Russia, Japan, Manilla, then Australia, where it will hopefully commence work in airline services.

And if not?

Mmmmmmmmm, I get nervous when sales and marketing doesn't keep up with the ops dept.

Fuel-Off

12th Sep 2014, 13:40

when sales and marketing doesn't keep up with the ops dept

That's ops normal for any airline isn't it?

Fuel-Off :ok:

slim pickings

12th Sep 2014, 23:36

Nulli Secundus. You get nervous about what's written in the media?? You better not read these. You'll be very nervous. http://www.buzzfeed.com/alexfinnis/19-completely-outrageous-headlines-you-could-only-hmn8?s=mobile . Dig a little deeper muscles. And stop shaking.

Nulli Secundus

13th Sep 2014, 03:23

Sorry, lost me. How does a post on the Jetgo Facebook page constitute a media headline?
Very odd comment slim pickings.

slim pickings

13th Sep 2014, 11:04

I'll give you that Nulli Secondus. Didn't realise your grab was from their FB page. Regardless, the sentence that you refer to goes to the issuing of the revised AOC allowing RPT. Your propensity for negativity with all matters Jetgo easily explains your grab on that post. From MY observations they pay their bills, pay their staff, and intend to offer the the paying public another option. My support rests with any company having a go. Knock them as hard as your keyboard will allow. Find fault. Your stand point is gutless unlike the backers of Jetgo. Outside of the positive aspects of what the owners are hoping to achieve I truly hope they break some ground just to prove naysayers like you wrong.

Nulli Secundus

13th Sep 2014, 12:32

Hang on a sec. What's with the personal attack?

By all means disagree with my view, identify my inaccuracies or refute my substantiations.

I have no problem with your views. Why not consider that an opinion expressed on how something is being handled does not equal a wish for failure or a desire to denigrate a person's character.

slim pickings

13th Sep 2014, 21:43

Nothing personal about it. I suspect your issue is with factual information.

Nulli Secundus

14th Sep 2014, 04:01

Bizarre comment slim pickings...... 'dig a little deeper muscles', 'gutless', 'naysayer'.

Provided its not a personal attack, anybody should say what they think should be said. I think that's the idea here.

Cactusjack

14th Sep 2014, 08:28

C'mon boys, time out. Agree to disagree and move on. Cheers

I spoke to a solid source on Friday, JetGo is still 'go' and some of the delay on announcing firm routes etc is quite simply due to waiting on contracts to be sines off. For example if any of you have dealt with DTMR etc in relation to government contracts you will understand that the process is long and they announce the successful contractors name around the same time each year.
So in regards to JetGo they are still all systems go and have been very busily engaged with the behind the scenes component of setting up and operating a business. As cannot be denied, they have good aircraft and good financial backing with a bag full of contracts to be announced soon.

Safe flying

Des Dimona

16th Sep 2014, 08:51

.........and good financial backing with a bag full of contracts to be announced soon.

How many times have we heard that type of "wishful thinking" statement before !:E

Ascend Charlie

16th Sep 2014, 11:31

The best "Wishful Thinking" would be that the naysayers and Tall-Poppy-Cutters would STFU and let a company get on with its business.

And Cactus is spot on, there are some serious things happening that the unwashed public doesn't know about yet.

morno

16th Sep 2014, 12:48

God there's some aggressive people who work at this Jetgo place. Glad I'm not working with them. :rolleyes:

feenix

16th Sep 2014, 22:49

You had better get a good PR person because calling your customers "unwashed" doesn't bode too well. Better hope the press don't grab that or Ascend Charlie may turn into Descend Charlie

Defenestrator

16th Sep 2014, 23:41

I always thought the term 'unwashed' referred to the common people or the public en masse. Nothing derogatory in it unless specifically used in that way which someone with an elitist view might take offence. I'd have thought the common people, indeed en masse, is exactly who Jetgo are hoping to attract to their services.

D:ok:

ANCPER

17th Sep 2014, 04:57

How is anyone on this thread interfering with Jetgo going about it's business? I doubt their "customers or financiers" are here reading this thread and there is no reason why Jetgo need waste any of their time responding if they don't wish to, do you see J*, QF, VB here at all? So, maybe it's you who should STFU:mad:

Btw, are you management? If not htf would know "there are some serious things happening" and if you are, fo, and get on with your job!:ugh:

What's said here will make naught difference to Jetgo's doings.

Ascend Charlie

17th Sep 2014, 09:12

What's said here will make naught difference to Jetgo's doings.

You hit that right on the head.

But the "people who know better than JetGo management" keep popping up with derogatory comments about how they are doing things wrong.

If an aviation company can go from Startup and straight away be turning over some pretty darn impressive POSITIVE figures, they could be said to be doing the right thing. And no, I am not part of the company, but I wouldn't mind if they adopted me.:ok:

ANCPER

17th Sep 2014, 11:14

Re your last para, maybe so. However lots of companies start out looking really good and fall flat on their face when reality comes knocking.

I'd say doing SYD to BOB (back of beyond)isn't going to be easy, regardless of how well they have planned this. RPT is going to be a different game to closed charter and with the mining boom looking like a balloon at a kids b/day party FIFO supported RPT may end up a bit iffy, imo.

I'd say your confusing those who are pointing out pitfalls as anti JG, I wouldn't agree, though none of us commenting here would have any real idea. But history would indicate it will be a pretty hard row and the odds would be against success. That aside I'm sure most wish them the best, especially coz knocking around in a 30+ seater jet sure beats the pants of doing the same in a TP.

BNEA320

4th Oct 2014, 00:23

So what's happening with Jetgo RPT services ?

No news for many weeks.

Issues with good ol CASA ?

onehitwonder

4th Oct 2014, 02:27

Approved yesterday SYD-ROM with the 135's. No Gladstone? Hervey bay? No E140's?

seneca208

4th Oct 2014, 02:39

Approved yesterday SYD-ROM with the 135's. No Gladstone? Hervey bay? No E140's?

They do have an E135KL, which I think is the technically correct name for the E140LR.

PaulBredereck

4th Oct 2014, 05:45

Issues with good ol CASA ? BNEA320... In this case we cannot speak more highly of the CASA team from the Sydney Region office that processed our RPT AOC upgrade. Whilst they were extremely thorough, they were fair, knowledgeable and thoroughly professional.

They do have an E135KL, which I think is the technically correct name for the E140LR. You are correct seneca. We hope to see them start arriving in Australia in December, unfortunately this is a little later than we would have liked, because Honeywell have been slow supplying the necessary boxes for the Australian required ADS-B upgrade.

For those interested in knowing what is involved these days in getting a new high capacity jet RPT AOC = a great team to work with + 2 years and 8 days of hard work!

Thank you to all that have supported us and even to those for the business advice.

BNEA320

5th Oct 2014, 02:52

so when do you start taking bookings ?

Surely 2 months out is about right time to start ?

& which reservations system are you using ?

Have heard that the big boys (CRS's/GDS's) are extremely expensive.

PaulBredereck

5th Oct 2014, 23:51

so when do you start taking bookings ?RMA should go live on Wednesday
There will also be some more announcements this week, but we would like to let the local councils release these.

& which reservations system are you using ?VeRSE (Vedaleon) (QQ, ZL, FQ) is a Melbourne company set up by Mac Smith after Ansett collapsed. Basically it is the 2014 version of the Ansett Merlin system. Reliable, same time zone, nice people, and a local supplier. It might not have all the bells and whistles of some American systems, but it does not have the associate price tags, plus our data is stored on servers in Melbourne & Sydney... and the bonus is we can/have hired ex Ansett people proficient on the system (recently made redundant by another airline).

Have heard that the big boys (CRS's/GDS's) are extremely expensive. You heard correct. But we do not require that sort of volume. The GDS we use allows agents to book our inventory anyway.

Cactusjack

8th Oct 2014, 00:47

A wee article below;

New airline considers Gladstone to Sydney route | Gladstone Observer (http://m.gladstoneobserver.com.au/news/service-set-for-take-off-jetgo/2411096/)

This would be a well supported service. Lots of LNG work happening in the region and there is a number of years work that lay ahead. I hope they commence operating, it would be an improvement over some of the current services, and it might help keep some of the other 'not so reputable' operators who operate old an inferior aircraft out of the region :ok:

BNEA320

8th Oct 2014, 02:43

didn't QF link just drop this recently using A Dash 8-400 ?

Hope Jetgo can make it work, but imagine with only approx. 36 seats cf. 74 ish on QF, that average fares maybe higher than QF.

Still faster I guess. As long as business types who aren't paying their own fares, it could work.

onehitwonder

8th Oct 2014, 02:57

That they did...it'd have to be $300+ each way

Now eyeing ASX listing and codeshare with VA/QF?

hutchisg

8th Oct 2014, 06:24

Jetgo received their AOC from CASA yesterday for Jet RPT services, using Embraer EMB-135LR aircraft. The airlines first route will be Roma in Queensland direct to Sydney, eliminating the current need for a stop over and change of aircraft in Brisbane. Jetgo is also interested in the Gladstone to Sydney route now that Qantas Link have withdrawn their services. A promotional tour of Roma and Gladstone will be conducted on Friday 10th October 2014, where further announcements are expected.

Image of VH-JTG (www.16Right.com)

Cactusjack

8th Oct 2014, 06:38

Nice!! SYD-ROM released to the public on the JetGo website today. Airfares from $249 one way. This should shut up some of the doubters, but obviously not all!
Gotta be better than travelling on an unreliable OTP lacking dinosaur Dash 8 :ok:
More good news to follow, probably on Friday this week :ok:

Good work JetGo, you certainly are giving it a fair crack. And from what my CASA source tells me some of the approval process was very straight forward and JetGo passed with high marks :ok:

BNEA320

8th Oct 2014, 08:51

smart move. Take the cheapest QF fare RMA/BNE/SYD of $240, add $9 & offer a nonstop service of 90 min (probably way less than this flying time) compared to fastest QF via BNE of 195 min, which is Dash 8, connecting to jet (which will probably suffer a congestion delay at BNE most of time)

Based purely on distance alone GLT/SYD should start at around $327 when compared to RMA/SYD, but $299 is a much better pricepoint, but unlike RMA/SYD, VA also does GLT/BNE/SYD from $155 with very few jets BNE/GLT, while QF fares start at $173.

Now they just have to fill aircraft & find other city/town pairs that don't have too much service via a big city like BNE, SYD & MEL & have some activity like FIFO.