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er340790
21st May 2014, 17:54
BBC News - Madrid matadors gored by bulls at festival launch (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27507414)

I think a result like this is long overdue...

And I'd also like to see a 'rule-change' which prevents those helpers dashing in to help the bullfighter every time he gets into trouble.

Anyone know if there are there any senorita / senora matadors these days???

stevef
21st May 2014, 18:29
Serve 'em right.
stevef's partner is Spanish. We visited some of her family in Andalucia a few years ago. The local matador, Juan Jose Padilla, had just come off second best against a half-ton bull and ended up in hospital after being gored in the jaw and losing an eye. Said family weren't amused by my lack of sympathy and I was for a time concerned that my multiplication machinery might end up as substitute criadillas.
Chuck them in a ring armed with one of their fancy swords against an African buffalo - that should be worth watching.

cavortingcheetah
21st May 2014, 18:45
I've seen a couple females in the ring and one or two in my movie collection as in Conchita Cintron, Maria Sara and Cristina Sánchez. They have a universal failing manifested in an inability to kill cleanly. This could be because of many reasons not the least of which is that they are, with some justification, afraid of losing their looks. Such a criticism could not be made of Padilla who recovered from his injuries and returned to the ring. Never a great matador he nonetheless won the hearts of the afición who love a brave man even were he as atrocious a matador as was Curro Romero or El Cordobés. There will never be another Manolete or an Antonio Ordonez.

500N
21st May 2014, 19:01
Not sure overdue is the right word but if you play with dangerous animals then occasionally
you are going to get whacked, stomped, horned or even killed !

Expect it, it happens on a monthly basis in the world.

We all know that so I don't know why you get some of these shocked reactions
- and to an extent, expectations of sympathy.

Piper.Classique
21st May 2014, 19:53
Nice one. Good for the bulls

Flash2001
21st May 2014, 21:11
Also see Rudyard Kipling, "The Bull That Thought".

After an excellent landing etc...

Capetonian
21st May 2014, 23:47
Excellent result. If the EU had any cojones it would have outlawed this vile barbarism of torturing animals as a spectator sport.

gingernut
22nd May 2014, 00:09
As it's Jet Blast, I'm trying to find an alternative argument, and am failing.

I've spent a bit of time course fishing, have heard all the arguments.....fish lips don't have nerves, memory span short etc. I enjoy sea fishing, don't see it as a sport, just a nice way to relax watching the sea, and most things I catch, I eat.

Perhaps, worryingly, there is something quite satisfying about capturing a rod full of Cornish Mackerel. Always humanely dispatched, always taste good if eaten within hours.

rotornut
22nd May 2014, 00:12
I wish the bulls had stuck it up his ar**s!

Phalconphixer
22nd May 2014, 02:03
Bullfighting... disgusting, barbaric, bloodlust fuelled entertainment passed off by politicians of both sides as Culture and attracting huge subsidies under the European Common Agricultural Policy. I feel little pity for the matadors, they chose to be there, the bull had no choice. Todays bulls are not bred for aggressiveness but for their looks... details here

Juan Pedro Domecq Solis - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/sport-obituaries/8486827/Juan-Pedro-Domecq-Solis.html)

But as vile as the spectacle is it is topped once a year in a small town called Tordesillas near Valladolid.
Damned by the world with hundreds of petitions, millions of signatures and the physical presence of almost as many protesters as spectators, members of Animal Rights Activists and Animal Welfare Groups worldwide this event goes on regardless and is the high spot of a two week spectacle of animal abuse and torture.:ugh::ugh::ugh:

The Cultural Finale is known as the Toro de la Vega; check it out here...

Toro de la Vega - A Bloody Tradition (http://www.sharkonline.org/index.php/animal-cruelty/bullfighting/81-animal-cruelty/bullfighting/bull-torture-festivals/815-toro-de-la-vega-a-bloody-tradition)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v13/foxbat/417333_404280762959729_1530563248_n_zpsaead729f.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v13/foxbat/1005236_437458399703917_313188587_n_zps3ca60d36.jpg

PLovett
22nd May 2014, 03:33
Even if the bull gores the matador, which happens quite frequently, the bull still winds up dead. Spanish law requires that the bull be killed whatever the outcome in the arena.

The reason behind this law is that the bull learns that the manoeuvres of the matador with the cape are a decoy and by the second or third fight the bull will get the matador every time. The practice of re-using bulls was quite common during the depression of the 1920s-30s when small communities could not afford to keep supplying new bulls for each fight.

For further reading one cannot go past "Death In The Afternoon" by Ernest Hemingway.

david1300
22nd May 2014, 04:57
Go the Bulls!! I'm on your side:ok:

500N
22nd May 2014, 05:02
Phal

That is pretty gruesome.

As much as I kill a lot of animals, making them suffer is not part of the equation.

I can't understand why they prolong it once the animal is on it's knees like in the photo, a spear in the right spot will easily kill a bull and reasonably quickly.

cavortingcheetah
22nd May 2014, 07:23
It's not quite true to say that the bull always ends up dead. A really classic brave bull will from time to time be offered the indultado or pardoned and sent to breeding stock. That is though a relatively rare occurrence.
The spectacle was pretty cruel to the Picadors' horses as well, unpadded until regulations were brought in in 1930. But then the Spanish were historically a cruel people. During the Thirty Years War (1618-1648) the cruellest at extracting information from house holders as to where their few silver crowns were buried were the Spaniards, roasting babies in front of parents and nasty stuff like that. Then while England was basking in the glory of the Beatles and Carnaby Street in the sixties Spain was still a dirt poor peasant country. It had its appropriate time honoured amusements then just as Britain has a thriving cock fighting industry now in spite of its self appointed role as a champion in the great game of animal rights. I expect one can still find dog fights in Britain too although one wouldn't want to go head to head with the sort of chaps that run those. Perhaps pitting animal against animal is rather less sporting than chucking a man in the ring where there is some human attrition to be found? There's more human blood to be found in the corrida so makes it a more sporting event than dog fighting or the other thing with male chickens doesn't it. Equally reprehensible of course but much fairer as the English are wont to say.

probes
22nd May 2014, 08:02
gladiator fights would be more human for sure.

cavortingcheetah
22nd May 2014, 08:10
Human perhaps but still possibly restricted to dumb animals or is that a euphemism for pub closing time and human blood lust unassuaged by war thanks to the self awarded Nobel Prize winning EU? Which means of course that bull fighting is the direct cause of the actions of peaceniks, liberals and greens who have prevented mankind from engaging in his usual genetic predilection for internecine strive.

Capetonian
22nd May 2014, 09:00
As it's Jet Blast, I'm trying to find an alternative argument, and am failing.There are plenty of arguments in favour of bull torturing, as used by its defenders, and having lived in Spain I've heard plenty :


It's art/history/tradition/culture
It provides revenue and employment
It brings tourism
The bulls are well treated during their lives
The meat is given to the poor of the community

The only problem with all those arguments, even if true, is that nothing can change the underlying fact that it's sickeningly cruel and barbaric. There can be no defence for that.


Some regions of Spain (Catalunya and Canarias as far as I know) have banned the practice.

ATNotts
22nd May 2014, 09:16
Excellent result. If the EU had any cojones it would have outlawed this vile barbarism of torturing animals as a spectator sport.

Agreed - excellent result - however...

If the EU did have the courage to ban bullfighting, then it would be reasonable to expect them to also have banned "sports" such as fox hunting (before HMG got around to it). Had they done so, many of the same people who would applaud such a move, were it made against bullfighting, would complain bitterly about EU interference were it to have been done against a UK "traditional" pass time.

Sadly, you can't have your cake and eat it.

acbus1
22nd May 2014, 09:25
Wouldn't fancy being gored in the ring. :ooh: