Wait 3-6 months and you won't have to scab

[Doctor J]

Why join now and end up on a scab list with no friends? All forces are conspiring to have this dispute over in 3-6 months. Not long to wait when you think about a 25 year career....

[shortly]

I understand the sentiment in your post, but, 3-6 months is a long time when unemployed and bills to pay and mouths to feed. I understand their position too.

[Wizofoz]

Dr J,

Will you undertake to stop supporting the ban if it is still in place in 6 months time?

[BMM389EC]

Wait 3-6 months? This has already been going on for how long?!The ban is already coming up 8 months old! In 3-6 months are you going to ask for another 3-6 months? Which seems likely because the HKAOA does not appear to be doing anything else except this ineffective ban! Then when it is lifted you are not going offer me any assistance to get the job that I said no to!?
Asking for alot without offering anything.
By the way I find the statement that I would come to Hong Kong without any friends insulting. I have numerous friends there now( all members of the AOA and who are recommending that I break the ban) and they would not be so fickle to suddenely not be my friend when they would all have done the same.
Your statement reflects on the calibre of the people involved.
If you are so convinced it'll ONLY take another 3-6months then please e-mail me and let me know why. I'd love to hear something positive for a change and why I should not phone in the next few days and change my no to a yes.

[Truth Seekers Int'nl]

i think in six months time there will be some 100 pilots that won't really care what they are called but are at least they will be in their chosen career with a good airline. just ask the young pilots in 1989 that followed the union down the pied piper path and never worked in the industry again. you should talk to my brother for a couple of hours it was a terrible time. I have NO REGRETS. i am not being smug because i have my job but i really think the AOA should reassess its situation and give us new hires a fair go.

[Geddy]

When you give the 49er's a fair go. You are in for the ride of your life. Have you heard how difficult it is for the AN scabs to get work?

[shortly]

Actually no I haven't, and anyway they were physically taking the jobs of legitimate union supporters who had naively believed their union committee - sound familiar? As far as I can see there are plenty of Ozzie strike breakers around the place aiyah even here at CX. That sort of rationale is going to take you to a very hard place.

[Boeing Belly]

Geddy, there seems to be a common misconception that the Ansett scabs are having difficulty finding work. I can assure you that is not the case. The ones having the most difficulty are those caught in the middle. As I type I can think of at least 25 scabs that I know personally who have been offered either 777 or 747 positions with SQ. All of the Captains on contract with QF in NZ. Qantas itself has employed dozens on a full-time basis in Australia. There are 767 scabs on contract out of London at the moment, any ex AN guy will know "Stormboy". A couple have recently gotten jobs in Korea. Many have jobs in Japan. The new Fleet Manager 737 at Air Pacific is one. The ONLY A320 Captains that got interviews with Qatar Airways were scabs. Hainan Airlines is interviewing some of them off the 737. Air Atlantique has them on both the 747 and 767. One of them has even joined SouthWest in the States!! Qantas have them as Sim Instuctors in Melbourne. No Geddy, they're doing all right, it's the rest of us who are being "made an example of". At the moment CX is the best, and only, option. I've got a feeling the training school is going to be very busy.

[Dale Harris]

I spose 3 to 6 months ain't that long, unless of course you're already 37 1/2 years old.............

[SeldomFixit]

"Stormboy" - Gawd - you could write a book about that alone, but wait............there would still be more !!!!!!!!
:D

[BMM389EC]

Well, what now? Six months is up and no where near to being resolved? Another 3-6 months? Probably more like 3-6 years with the current level of activity.

[sidewalk]

Geddy
You better geddy-up.
If anybody were to stick their face anywhere near mine with that sort of snide advice be advised that there would be a price exacted at a level that would/will be more than a little unsettling.
I find it astounding that some lowlifes believe they can deliver veiled threats and engage in mafia-like intimidation of others and believe they can simply retire unscathed to their local bar for a bit of a chuckle.

[Wizofoz]

6 months ago I asked the starter of this topic what I believed was a legitimate question. i got no answer then and don't expect one now.

Do ANY AOA members still believe the ban is going to achieve ANY of it's stated aims?

You may want a moral victory, but I'm sure CX management will settle for an ACTUAL one.

[BusyB]

Wizofoz, As I recall you don't give answers either!!!

[fire wall]

Ah Geddy, poking your head up again to make more thinly vieled threats. Stand up and be counted, vote to go on strike or wind your neck in.....it's simple. Then you will have some credibility. Until then yours and others use of the term scab is neither warranted nor accepted by the aviation community and only serves to make you (and by default the AOA) naive, weak and ineffectual.
A point obviously lost on all who regurgitate this rubbish is that the Australian pilots had the backbone to go on strike in support of their demands.....regardless of whether it was the correct move tactically......no soft cOck option like asking for veryone to please stay away from our sandpit.
Furthermore, IFALPA acknowledged the call for a recruitment ban in the first/second week of October which makes it now approaching 14 months in duration.........and what has been achieved?

[shortly]

Just a little point of order fire wall. Those intimately involved on the wrong end of the Ozzie dispute get quite apoplectic when the word 'strike' is used to describe their actions. Work to rule, withdrawal of labour et al and then resignation. But not a strike -not that it made a figs worth of difference to the travelling public or the Ozzie economy. Or the eventual outcomes.

[Wizofoz]

BusyB,

Depends on the question I suppose. Fire away and I'll see what I can do.

[BlunderBus]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Those 'Lists' Again!!!!
Ladies and Gentlemen,
I have just deleted a couple of posts as they referred to that taboo subject, 'scab lists'.

Just a reminder that, since its inception, seven years ago, PPRuNe has not allowed, "Reference to, details of or links to" such lists, the primary reason is that since the people on these lists are hardly likely to have agreed to their names being put into the public domain they may have recourse to the law and even if Danny were to only finish up with a bill for his defence it would probably cause the BB to close. If other sites wish to display them then be it on their own head.

Please would you be kind enough to cease putting any details of, references to, or links to any such lists on PPRuNe.
Failure to comply will result in the offending posters having their posting ability stopped.

Your cooperation will be much appreciated.

BlueEagle - Moderator.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The original text of this post has been deleted, it was offensive and inflamatory. For those that may not have seen it already, or forgotten about it, I repeat a 'sticky' post made some months ago that refers.

[BMM389EC]

Doctor J, why so quiet? Coming up for 18 months now and still no resolve. Seriously, this can't go on for ever?! How long is this still going to draw on for? Anyone heard anything?

[shortly]

This is actually becoming quite farsical. But a true Greek tragedy for the 49ers. The AOA will unfortunately never publicly admit that it got this whole thing completely wrong. Who should be compensating the 49ers? The AOA of course, not just providing them with 'living expenses'. But, fully paying them out. After all it was the inept decisions by the AOA that led to the martyrdom of the 49ers in the first place. Years of ineffective and annoying petty industrial action, a refusal to assist the company when asked for help during the grounding of the Airbii, a campaign of slander against the company in the media, work to rule, cowardly sickouts, maximum safety bull**** and then the increased industrial action that led to the company terminating our colleagues (not necessarily in chronological order). The 49ers could be back at work by now, or most of them, once again union ineptitude stopped that. It will take largesse of the grandest order from the new DFO to get any 49ers back at all now. And the ban, wow. A litany of profligate incompetence. Lets have them for another term.

[Wizofoz]

Nice one BB,

So we have effectivley turned the argument away from management and onto the new joiners. Lists, vilification and a few good punch-ups should serve the companies aims nicely.

Let's get a real good war going between pilots, and that should nicely help us all by allowing management to play one against the other.

[mjbow2]

So folks....lets see if I have this one right!

Half the industry would consider me a scab if I turned up at cx and the other half wouldnt!

I know v.little about the situation at cx as I have just started to entertain the idea of working in asia, but it seems quite controversial to say the least.

[BMM389EC]

Points regarding the AOAs failures and discussions on blacklisting aside. Seriously- how long is this still going to go on for? We have all been making the same sort of posts for a year and a half already. How much longer?

[Traffic]

Longer than War & Peace but without the happy ending....

[BMM389EC]

Approaching 11 months,almost double the time asked, since the original post and 1yr9mnths since the start. How much longer would the AOA like? Indefinately? This has no credibility anymore.

[SOPS]

:confused: I would also like an answer on this, Just how long is it that we have to wait?

[Harbour Rat]

Things not good out here right now. Suggest you sit tight until the loads pick up again. We could be in for the long haul on this one before it gets better.:(

[HotDog]

Fire wall, I didn't realise the Australian pilots went on strike. I thought they were advised to resign en masse. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Traffic]

SOPS

20-25% of schedule cancelled. Empty a/c. Schools closed. Families leaving town.

How long is a piece of string????

You may have to wait a whole while longer.

[SOPS]

With respect...so? War in Middle East, Share market falls, Petrol prices up, this all happens around the world each day....but, people HAVE, RIGHT NOW, TODAY, offers for interviews with CX. For almost two years, people have been told not to accept a job at CX, not to have an interview, not to apply. Just to wait. But to wait for what? With all of everything going on, CX HAVE continued to advertise for pilots AND continued to upgrade pilots internally, so it seems, there is a need.

So, I ask again, how long must people wait?

[Harbour Rat]

SOPS,

If I were you I would lie down in a cool dark room. Things are VERY serious out here and I think you will find recruiting, upgrading and fleet transfers somewhat on hold for a while. As and when things get better you will hear about it. In the meantime suggest you pour yourself a frosty and chill out.

Rgds

HR

[Avago]

SOPS,

The global overreaction to the SARS outbreak has decimated the airline - 40% of flights cancelled, the average load factor for those flights that are left is hovering around the 35% mark and forward bookings are disappearing fast. Aircraft have been parked, all recruitment has stopped, no new training courses are going ahead and all other training is under review. The company is doing everything it can to cut costs in order to survive the massive downturn. You aint going to be hearing anything anytime soon buddy!

[Truth Seekers Int'nl]

sops, i have been in 18 months now. no regrets, good job and plenty of mates to drink with in honkers and down route. i put my foot on the throttle when the guys here started getting up graded. they had no concern for the 49's so why should i give up a career path if the 49's pals wouldn't !! you may have missed the boat but if you get an interview and job offer my advice is take it. you gotta take control of your own life at some stage. :D