New FAA ATP requirements, what happens if I get my written before 1st August?

[Victo]

Hello everybody. I've just learned that the FAA ATP will get much harder to get next 1st of August...:bored: I'm a European pilot, but I've always wanted to get my FAA licence. The thing is I I'm very near of the flight requirements for the FAA ATP, but I see it quite difficult to get them before August. I've learned that if I pass the written test I will have 24 months to fulfill the requirements and pass my checkride, can any one confirm this to me?

[Tinstaafl]

Yes. If you pass the ATP theory exam by 31 July you will have two years to do the ATP checkride under the old rules. The new rules commencing on 01 Aug have a grandfather clause that authorises this.

The ATP exam is very easy however, if you're not familiar with FARs & US procedures, I'd recommend you sit the exam a couple of weeks before the end of July. That will give you a buffer for another try in case you fail it. You get your result as soon as you complete the exam so no waiting for a result to be sent to you. Sitting early in the month doesn't affect the validity period for the exam - it's valid to the end of the month two years hence.

[Victo]

Many thanks Tinstaafl! I'm gonna start with all the process. I know I need a verification letter (I did it once but it was 16 months ago so it must be expired) and the TSA approval renewed (I already did the fingerprints).

Just one question about the ATP exam, is it one "Full exam about everything" or is it as the JAA divided by themes? What happens if I pass some themes but not the others? Must I do again the whole exam or only the themes I failed?

Good night...:)

[zondaracer]

It is one exam covers everything. 80 questions. You either pass with a 70% or you don't pass. If you don't pass, you have to retake a whole exam which will have 80 questions and a whole mix of subjects. The questions are drawn from a database and tests are generated at random from the database.

[MarkerInbound]

More correctly the written is good for 24 months so if you pass it anytime in June you'll have until 30 June 2016 to complete the checkride. And you can sit the written without the TSA background check.

[Victo]

Hello Zondaracer and Markerinbound, thank you very much for your answers. Good to know I do not need the TSA. I did the fingerprints already one year ago, but I think I must "reactivate" the TSA. But my big problem is the Validation Letter of my foreign licence by the FAA. It says it can take til 90 days... I did it 16 months ago but it expired. I've been told this morning by a friend that I do not need it to pass the written (I have to pass it in the USA as the two european locations where ATP written can be passed are complete until 19th of august). Could anyone give me some info about that? I've already faxed all the documents to the FAA, but the waiting is going to be eternal to me... I fly a corporate jet, so the plan is to pass the checkride in a sim session. Do I still need the validation letter or this is only if I need to fly on a real plane to do the checkride?
Again, thanks.

[MarkerInbound]

Yes, you will need the TSA clearance even if you do your training and check in a sim. You will be authorized to fly airplanes after your checkride and they want to know about anyone who can fly a plane.

[Victo]

Thank you very much DEEC and Markerinbound. Everything is going nice, I've already asked for the verification letter but as I do not need it will have plenty of time to pass the exam before the 1st of August (or at least to try it!:}). For the TSA, as I already did my fingerprints, I thing the process to reactivate it may be matter of only a couple of days.
I have a doubt... Which ATP do I want to pass? ATP 135 or ATP121? I'm a European pilot who wishes to get his FAA ATP to be elligible in the future if needed for a job in a N registered aircraft. I'm pretty sure that it's the 121 I want, could you confirm, please?

[MarkerInbound]

It makes 0 difference. You'll have the same ATP at the end. The 135 ATP asks questions about, you guessed it, 135 regs and uses turboprop performance. The 121 test is based on 121 regs and transport jet performance.

I have not used them for the ATP and am not connected with them but everyone says the Sheppard Air online test prep makes the test painless. I think they only do the 121 test.

[zondaracer]

I used Sheppard Air and MarkerInBound is right, they only use 121 because it is supposedly easier test.

[Victo]

Thanks again Zondaracer and Markerinbound!
I'm flying a jet, would I find easier the 135ATP? I'm just on the point to buy Sheppard Air software preparation.

[Victo]

Could anyone tell me where I can find the info where it says I do need or do not need the verification letter of my foreign licence before doing the written test? I'm having some trouble with this as some people are saying to me I do need it, and others don't. I've even spoken with two different examiners of the FAA Airmen Certification Branch and they have given different answers to me. I may have an opportunity to fly in ten days to the USA and do the test, but if I arrive there and have problems with the damned letter...:ugh:

[MarkerInbound]

Actually, you need the verification letter when you start flight training, whether it is in an airplane or sim. It's not required for the written or for ground school. You can dig around on the TSA web site and all the references are to "flight" training.

[Victo]

Hello again Markerinbound and Deec, that's what I thought, and I've contacted some training centers in the US (who offer the "one day ATP written exam course") and they have told me the same than you do. I only need a valid international passport. Thank you very much for your help in this and older threads. It's very useful to get the information from people who know about the thing before calling any training center or Civil Aviation Authorities.
DEEC, by what you say I understand that with the ATP121 I would not be able to fly for a carrier who operates under 135? I work in the corporate aviation, and at least here in Europe not many private jet operatos do have turboprop planes!
As my target market if one day I work with my FAA licence would be most probably a private jet in Middle East or South America (just to give an example as I wouldn't be allowed to work in the USA), the operator will most probably have no turboprops.
Thanks again for the help!

[tali]

Hi Victo.
Im in more or less the same situation,
I pass my written already. But all the schools i contacted with ask for a reduce type rating course. I can not do just a check ride on my challenger and get the type.
Im thinking about doing the atp on a single engine or a Me instead.
But my doubt is if afterwards with ATP SE im not sure if u can go for a type rating on a ME. Maybe someone can clarify.

Thanks

[Victo]

Hi Tali. Could you explain a little bit more that? I'm planning to do the checkride on a recurrent sim of the Glex. Why wouldn't I be able do so? Many friends did it this way. Has it already changed?

[zondaracer]

DEEC, by what you say I understand that with the ATP121 I would not be able to fly for a carrier who operates under 135? I work in the corporate aviation, and at least here in Europe not many private jet operatos do have turboprop planes!

This is not correct. If you take the 121 exam, you can still work in 135 or 91... If you take the 135 exam, you can still work in 121. Corporate aviation usually operates under part 91 or part 91k. An ATP is an ATP, there is no distinction between someone who takes the 121 exam or the 135 exam.

For what it's worth, there are 121 operators who operate turboprop and there are 135 operators who operate jets.

[Victo]

Hello Zondaracer, fully understood now, thank you very much.
Tali, while I wait for more info from your part, I think I understand your problem is you want your Challenger TR on you FAA ATP licence. And you cannot obtain this with only a checkride on the sim. But is there a problem on doing the checkride on a recurrent sim as it was done until now by a lot of people?(without getting the TR, only the «basic» ATP). For the moment I'm only looking for getting an FAA ATP, without transfering my Global licence onto it.

[MarkerInbound]

Tail,

61.157 of the FAA regulations says that for a type rating, you must have a record of ground and flight training. So no training center can just let you fly the sim for the checkride. You can do the the SE or ME ATP without training if you think you'll pass but most people want a few hours warm up for the checkride even in a light twin. Your ATP written tet is good for 24 months. If you pass a ME checkride in those 24 months, you'll have a FAA ME ATP and you can add whatever type ratings you pass the checkride for whenever. If you take the checkride in a SE airplane, if you want to add a ME rating or type rating in a ME airplane after July of this year you'll have to go back and complete an ATP training program and pass a new ME ATP written.

My advise would be to complete the ATP ME checkride within the 24 month window. If you do it as part of recurrent training in the jet and get the type, that's great. If not, do it in a light twin. I have a feeling it's going to become a nightmare starting this August.

[Victo]

MarkerInbound, so if I understand well from your precedent message I can not do the checkride for my ATP on a recurrent sim session? Not for getting the Rating on it, only for obtaining the ATP. I'm trying to understand why some friends of mine have been able to do their checkride on a sim recurrent.

[MarkerInbound]

I've never heard of anyone taking an ATP checkride in an aircraft that requires a type rating without getting the type rating. Does your recurrent training have a day or two of ground school? That would check the box for ground training. Do you have a warm up sim and another sim for the checkride? You had flight training and you should be good to go for the type rating. The training center will need to know your plan in advance so they have the paperwork in order and so the check airman is a full TRE/DE and not just a recurrent check airman.

The regs don't change until August. Talk to your friends who have done, they would be the best source of information. Each training center will have different courses, initial, recurrent, upgrade, etc., with different requirements. Check with the training center you use.

WHATEVER YOU DO, PASS THE ATP WRITTEN BEFORE AUGUST. That starts a 24 month clock to do a checkride.

[Victo]

Hello again Markerinbound, and thank you very much for your time...Yes, that must be the point, the sim recurrents we do have at least one day ground school and a sim session prior to the checkride sim session. I've talked to one of my friends and he's told me that's how he did it, during a checkride in a sim recurrent. So I'm gonna focus on the written test, as you say, and will have plenty of time for the other part.
Again thanks!

[ZenAirman]

Mates, slightly off topic from brother Victo's initial question but related..I am a new member here..a student pilot nearing completion of my Private Pilot. So a long way to go for my ATP however with the coming August 1 scenario, I am considering taking my ATP test before July end. Although at the moment my knowledge of IFR is very limited, I believe I can study from Sheppard and understand the concepts well during this month. My questions, am I allowed to take my test having a student pilot certificate and secondly, would you think it would be a wise decision to do so now? Kindly let me know so I can begin. Thanks.