Future of AOPA ??

[triadic]

I have just seen the financial statement for AOPA (Oz) for the year ending Dec 2013 and it seems to tell a very sad tale.

A significant loss from the previous year and member numbers down from 2588 (2012) to 2315 (2013).

At a time when GA needs a strong representative organisation, what is going on with the financials?? As I see it, unless spending is cut and the membership/income increased the future does not look too flash.

Very sad situation, especially when in the mid 90's there were over 10,000 members. I guess many have just given up.

It would be good to know what the Directors plans are to resolve this situation?

:sad::sad:

[TBM-Legend]

So is it a loss or just lower than last equivalent period?

Have you helped recruit a new member or two to arrest the apparent decline in numbers?

[VH-XXX]

Similar story for RA-Aus. I heard 2nd hand (to be verified) that they had a $500k loss for the FY and can only sustain that for a maximum of 2 years. Membership is down significantly too.

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

So what has AOPA done for GA in the last five years to warrant my membership?

[T28D]

Absolutely nothing of any value

[TBM-Legend]

"What has AOPA done for me!"...Good old Australian way asking to propagate the nanny state....

Ever heard of JFK's speech?

"Ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for the country!"

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

"What has AOPA done for me!"...Good old Australian way asking to propagate the nanny state....
Ever heard of JFK's speech?
"Ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for the country!"If that was directed at me TBM-L then, with respect, what a load of crap!

I asked, "What has AOPA done for GA in the last five years", NOT what has AOPA done for me!

I have been flying for 40+ yrs. Not a member of AOPA. Never have been. Can't say that I have ever felt the need or desire to be! I seem to have gotten along just fine without AOPA - so tell me, "What have I missed out on"?

Dr :8

[OZBUSDRIVER]

Oh dear, this was where I came in in 2001.

Before everyone starts shooting from the hip...check out your local aeroclub first and see how healthy they are. Mine is still running pretty good. So GA, in my neck of the woods, is doing OK.

AOPA suffers from the same issues as any peak body in this country....no one has time to participate at the level required to maintain critical mass. Volunteerism requires free hours freely given. Hence, the health of your local club. I will probably get shot down for saying this....AOPA isn't a union, so stop running it like a closed shop. There are issues that affect every pilot not just AOPA members. If the benefit is for everyone then just maybe, more than a few would join up to help out.

If you want to get into politics, join a political party!

[Rotor Work]

I was a proud member of AOPA for a number of years but lost interest when it became political / unionized, Not sure what year that was. maybe late 80's early 90's. I never renewed that interest.
Fly Safe
R W

[gerry111]

FTDK wrote:" What have I missed out on?"

The AGMs used to be a hoot, Forkie. I'll never forget the one in 2000 at Moree and the one at Murray Bridge in (I think) 2001. I dropped out later as in those days, there were just so many competing egos. :eek:

Not something to be seen on PPRuNE though.. :oh:

[LeadSled]

So what has AOPA done for GA in the last five years to warrant my membership?

Absolutely nothing of any value

TBM Legend in particular, note:

I would suggest, based on first hand observation, that AOPA in very recent years has been, probably (hopefully) unknowingly, working against the interests of members, and GA in general.
Letting CASA emasculated the PIFR, an AOPA initiative that took a lot of bloody work, (as T-28D can attest) and has achieved considerable benefits for GA, is a sad thing.
AOPA's apparent failure to support the AMROB's initiative on GA maintenance is inexplicable, (even John McCormick supports this, the "Iron Ring" doesn't) I wonder do they even understand the problem.
I could go on at great length, but I won't!!

[Checklist Charlie]

Talk about revisiting history.

These same questions and apparent problems were the reason I never bothered to renew my at that time, 25 year plus membership of AOPA in the mid nineties. Too much personal politicing (read ego) by a noisy individual threatening members with legal ramifications if anyone that dared to disagree.

I seem to remember that the Board elections were highly entertaining at that time as well.

None of which of course had anything to do with improving the future of GA or the Members.

[gerry111]

At the Murray Bridge AGM, the power / ego game sure was in full swing. A female pilot lawyer (perhaps from Townsville?) trying to obtain possession of the microphone from a male pilot lawyer (perhaps from Canberra?), IIRC..

The entertainment value was well worth the membership fee... :p

[Jabawocky]

not enough folk getting off their arse but expecting others to do so.

Welcome to Australian GA.

[compressor stall]

http://www.pprune.org/pacific-general-aviation-questions/88458-aopa-what-do-you-want.html

Blast from the past.

Plus ca change plus ca meme chose (sorry can't find the accents :sad:)

[VH-MLE]

IMHO far too many ego's (in all likelihood with disproportionally small appendages) from past efforts that I've seen...

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

What Stallie said - 11 years ago! :E

Dr :8

[CHAIRMAN]

I'm with you Jaba - easy to bleat but who puts their hand up to help carry the load?
I've been a AOPA member through those political times and was disgusted as were many others. I believe AOPA is over those political problems of the past and have been for a long time.
The magazine alone is worth the subscription:D
There are bugger all representative bodies for GA, AOPA is one of the few.
We are all being slowly steamrollered, but it's outfits like AOPA that help put the handbrake on, and the speed of the roller down.
How do you guys that aren't members of one of the groups help stop the sh*t from flowing down the hill?
Apologies for the crook metaphors.

[TBM-Legend]

Only members can change things. That's my point. Those on the footpath can only throw barbs. [bit like not voting and complaining about the result I'd say!] I agree that AOPA certainly went through some 'dark' times and frankly disgusting behaviour on the part of some. Change was needed and change has happened - like all groups , never to everyone's liking..

This is about supporting all aspects of GA from ownership, piloting, airport access, costs etc...

[Wally Mk2]

I've not followed AOPA for many years now (30) but gave it away as the subs went thru the roof if I recall.


Wmk2

[Bevan666]

I left AOPA as a member in the mid/late nineties again because of the political bickering going on at the time. I rejoined again a few years back after meeting the new president at the time. The efforts that he and the current president put in quietly behind the scene is well worth supporting.

Did you know how much effort that AOPA (in both Australia and NZ) are putting into getting WAAS implemented here? As GA pilots we need to get behind that initiative!

As for membership - $160 isn't a lot to pay.

Bevan..

[Jabawocky]

Bevan :D

CHAIRMAN
I'm with you Jaba - easy to bleat but who puts their hand up to help carry the load?
I've been a AOPA member through those political times and was disgusted as were many others. I believe AOPA is over those political problems of the past and have been for a long time.
The magazine alone is worth the subscription
There are bugger all representative bodies for GA, AOPA is one of the few.
We are all being slowly steamrollered, but it's outfits like AOPA that help put the handbrake on, and the speed of the roller down.
How do you guys that aren't members of one of the groups help stop the sh*t from flowing down the hill?
Apologies for the crook metaphors.


And my favourite saying, all it takes for the forces of evil to rule the world is for enough good men to do nothing! Same applies here. It is a thankless task. I am sure Philip Reiss and previously Andrew Andersen could confirm that a 40 hour week of unpaid work on top of their normal working week is a heavy burden to bare.

Those of us who donate similar, although not quite as heavily certainly understand. What AOPA, Warbirds, AMROBA, SAAA, and the list goes on needs is for a few, just a few more folk who are capable and talented in various areas, to man up and do something rather than whinge, whine and complain from the sidelines.

In most cases all it needs is the donation of the subscription, to help fund it all. I am a member (fully paid) of 5 or maybe more aviation orgs, because I believe it is worth it. Surely all of Australia's pilots could help fund AOPA at $165 a year or whatever it is. Plus whatever other specialist group you are affiliated with.

Get on board and quit the apathy or you get exactly what you deserve. Apply some of the Anzac spirit. :ok:

[Old Akro]

Did you know how much effort that AOPA (in both Australia and NZ) are putting into getting WAAS implemented here? As GA pilots we need to get behind that initiative!


Now more than ever its important that we have a body pushing the cause of general aviation. CASA are on the eve of imposing ridiculous new imposts on GA that are unique in the world. The Australian government really only listens to peak bodies. We need an active, engaged body representing pilots - and in particular pilots flying IFR and using their aircraft as a business tool. There are many bodies supporting the interests of recreational pilots - RA(Aus), SAAA, Antique Aircraft Association, Australian Aerobatic Club, RFAC, etc.

But, who are the people speaking best on what is going on? The single best piece I've read in years has come from Jeff Boyd when he was president of the Regional Aviation Association.

A Bridge Too Far | Pro Aviation (http://proaviation.com.au/2013/09/26/a-bridge-too-far/)

The most succinct piece I have read on the troubles affecting general aviation has come from an airline association!!


I first joined AOPA in the late seventies, but like Bevan, dropped out in the era of the political in-fighting. Sometime later I re-joined, but again dropped out during the phase when they mistakenly thought they could achieve more by being friends with CASA.

Recently, I have been through the website and read the current magazine and I just can't figure out what they stand for.

I think its pretty easy to figure out the hot topics. All you need to do is look through pprune. They are all here. If I had any confidence at all that the AOPA was stridently representing a view on these topics, I'd join again.

The latest copy of the magazine trumpets some minor progress towards GP issued medicals. Big deal! If we don't do something about ADS-B for IFR, the new licensing regs, the new maintenance regs, it will all be academic. We won't have pilots who need medicals.

My last comment can be seen as parochial, but frankly, I can't see how you can hope to have any understanding of GA based in Bankstown. It might be the least active , least progressive GA airport in the country, not to mention probably the hardest to get to for visiting interstate members.

By my count (and using Google), 5 out of 9 directors are NSW based. Seriously??

[Jenna Talia]

Absolutely nothing of any value

So what has AOPA done for GA in the last five years to warrant my membership?

How about the $500 free of fees negotiated with AirServices under the GA option plan?

How about the creation of the recreational pilot licence for those who have lost their licence on medical grounds?

How about the real possibility of future Class 3 medicals being able to be issued by DAME's?

I am sure there are other issues being looked at as well.

The latest copy of the magazine trumpets some minor progress towards GP issued medicals. Big deal!

It is a big deal for those who are affected by this. It could even be you one day.

By my count (and using Google), 5 out of 9 directors are NSW based. Seriously??

Then apply for a directorship and stop whinging from the sidelines.

[T28D]

From personal experience in the past 6 months I can assure you all this is smoke and mirrors, CLARC medical still apply the Class 2 medical standards irrespective of what the so called Recreational Licence may be, I have lost my Class 1 Class 2 and there is no way the DAME or any other practicioner will give a positive endorsement to fly even though I still hold a Heavy Commercial Vehicle drivers licence.


At the end of the day it is who is going to carry the responsibility for issuing the license, not the DAME, nor the GP , nor AOPA, Nor CLARC.


AOPA may have had a hollow victory, but that is all it is !!!!!!

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

Surely all of Australia's pilots could help fund AOPA at $165 a year or whatever it is.

Why?

Dr :8

[LeadSled]

Folks,
Fact is, CASA AvMed have made it clear that they reserve issues to all but simple straightforward medicals. I have a Class 2 now, annual only, due some pre-existing problems, a DAME WILL NOT be able to issue me a RPL medical.
The RPL medical is NOT the same standard as the medical standard for an RAOz pilot certificate.
All the AOPA (and the others involved) have achieved, if they have achieved anything, is a nominal reduction in the time to issue a medical.
There is NO REFORM of medical standards of any significance.

Dear Jenna,
The original pilot option was agreed with ASA many years ago, and it was a lot less than $500.

Big deal! If we don't do something about ADS-B for IFR, the new licensing regs, the new maintenance regs, it will all be academic. We won't have pilots who need medicals.

Old Akro has just about got the present AOPA sized up.

AOPA of the present day support the ADS-B program, and seem to be as resolutely opposed to cost/benefit justification of any CASA regulation, as CASA itself.

As of the last SCC, AOPA does not seem to even be aware that the CASA "iron ring" wants to impose PART 42/145 on GA maintenance, or what that would mean, they did NOT support the AMROBA presentation for sustainable GA maintenance.

Tootle pip!!

[poteroo]

AOPA member from 1963 to 2013......yes, 50 years! But, finally called it a day.
Too subservient to the regulator. Seemingly oblivious to why pilot numbers are declining.
Now focused on supporting SAAA and RAAus.

[Bevan666]

Surely all of Australia's pilots could help fund AOPA at $165 a year or whatever it is.

Why?

Well if you want a voice with CASA and AirServices then you want to be an AOPA member. If you aren't, then your interests are not being put forward.

CASA and AsA are heavily focussed at the big end of town - thats where the money is.

If you want GA to have a voice, join AOPA. If you don't like the sound of the voice, get involved. Don't just whinge on the sidelines.

Bevan..

[tecman]

Think you're right about the critical mass aspect, CM. That seems to be the killer of so many potentially better paths.

My story is much like some of the others here. Was an AOPA member for many years. Bailed during the egos era. Supported other organizations thereafter and haven't seen the particular value of getting back to AOPA. Admire the incremental change like the faster medicals but, like LS, the exclusions work against me so it's either my current Class 2 or the RA Aus driver's licence.

I'd like to think that RA Aus had a shot at long-term success but the critical mass issue surfaces again: the CASA RPL licence will almost certainly fragment the recreational community, making RA Aus even less viable than it now is.

Having been a volunteer in several organizations, I have great respect for people who give their time and effort to AOPA. But I just don't see the organization being particularly relevant and, for my particular branch of recreational aviation, I'll chart the same long-term path as Poteroo, trepidation notwithstanding.

I do agree, it'd be great to realize the dream of one Australian GA organization, encompassing all recreational and sports flying. With critical mass such an issue, it's surely the goal.