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racedo
10th Apr 2014, 17:26
Today's Earthquakes in Oklahoma, United States (http://earthquaketrack.com/p/united-states/oklahoma/recent)

What is it with Oklahoma ?

Seems state is become almost like Earthquake Central with continual quakes.

Is it the result of frackin ?

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 17:44
Better to have a lot of small ones every week than one huge one every fifty years.
:uhoh:

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 17:58
Is it the result of frackin ?

That was believed or thought was causing the earthquakes, but after checking, it was discovered that the number and frequency of the earthquakes could not be assoicated with fracing as a cause of the earthquakes.

All the earthquakes are in one general area, north and northeast of Oklahoma City, running along a line that is parallel to Interstate Highway I-35. The city of Guthrie seems to be the primary center for this outbreak of earthquakes.

Now, of the 500 plus earthquakes in the past year, I've felt one, my wife felt one additional one that I slept through. No damage to our home at all. In fact, what damage that has been casued state wide has been very minor and only one injury, minor, has happened.

So what is going on, nobody has a clue.

So it must be man caused global warming. :p

BenThere
10th Apr 2014, 17:59
The relationship between seismic and fracking activity has been under investigation but so far as I know, no conclusions have been reached.

North Dakota, West Texas and other shales have been also fracked heavily with no apparent increase or change in seismic activity.

I'm sure those who oppose free world energy development and capitalism will be keeping a close eye on the matter.

Lonewolf_50
10th Apr 2014, 18:02
FYI:

4.1 isn't an "earthquake" it's a tremor. You feel it, but it rarely causes any problems.

We got mid 4 to 5 shakes (mostly aftershocks) from the Landers quake in 1992 down in San Diego county. Shook the house a bit, no damage. The quake itself, which went off at about 0500 local at its epicenter, shook me awake when the shockwave reached our area. It surely got my attention.

angels
10th Apr 2014, 18:06
Blimey, Oklahoma is known for tornados as well isn't it?

Can you get insurance there? :}

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 18:11
4.1 isn't an "earthquake" it's a tremor. You feel it, but it rarely causes any problems.

Hey, in Oklahoma a 1.5 is considered an earthquake. This stuff is brand new to Okies and a sign that the world is coming to an end. :p

racedo
10th Apr 2014, 18:15
The relationship between seismic and fracking activity has been under investigation but so far as I know, no conclusions have been reached.

North Dakota, West Texas and other shales have been also fracked heavily with no apparent increase or change in seismic activity.

I'm sure those who oppose free world energy development and capitalism will be keeping a close eye on the matter.

Pumping high pressure water into areas where there are already fault lines will cause quakes, kind of hard not to see that.
Problem is that those who making billions from fracking will pay whatever is required to dissaude anybody against that view point.

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 18:19
Blimey, Oklahoma is known for tornados as well isn't it?

Can you get insurance there?

Yes and we are just at the start of tornado season, so we got that working for us. So if a tornado doesn't get you, a earthquake will. :p

And yes, there is full insurance coverage for both. I think our earthquake insurance costs five dollars ($5,00) a year. Tornado is considerably higher, but how much I don't know, because it is not a separate ridder on the policy, it is inculded for all home insurance, state law.

Buy the way, I've felt more earthquakes (1) in Oklahoma than I've seen tornadoes on the ground.

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 18:26
Pumping high pressure water into areas where there are already fault lines will cause quakes, kind of hard not to see that.
Problem is that those who making billions from fracking will pay whatever is required to dissaude anybody against that view point.

Problem with your point of view is that you have zero evidence/proof to back up your theory.

Fracing, no 'k', has been going on in Oklahoma since 1947 and there has been no earthquakes here unil the last year and a half. Also fracing activity is no where the level as it was twenty years and farther back, as it is today.

So I'm sorry, I'm not going to pay attention to what anybody that cannot spell the word fracing correctly says. :rolleyes:

BenThere
10th Apr 2014, 18:28
The best salesmen in the world make a living selling mobile homes in Oklahoma.

racedo
10th Apr 2014, 18:40
Problem with your point of view is that you have zero evidence/proof to back up your theory.

Fracing, no 'k', has been going on in Oklahoma since 1947 and there has been no earthquakes here unil the last year and a half. Also fracing activity is no where the level as it was twenty years and farther back, as it is today.

So I'm sorry, I'm not going to pay attention to what anybody that cannot spell the word fracing correctly says. :rolleyes:

Not my fault you Yankees can't spell, Fracking is how it is spelt in UK.

There is Zero evidence that putting a Nuclear storage facility in an area of high earthquake activity is dangerous BUT amazingly people won't do it.

The levels of Fracking have risen considerably since 2005.
Of course they may not be connected but seems Oil companies are doing everything to fund research which says its not, kind of like Tobacco companies years ago.

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 19:16
Not my fault you Yankees can't spell, Fracking is how it is spelt in UK.


Ah, I love the arrogancy.

We, Americans, in the United States, United State's citizens invented the fracing process, by using a fracturing, for fracture, process to release oil and natural gas from the ground in 1947. So it is correctly spelled the way we spell it.

Please note that the words fracture and fracturing has no friggin' 'k' in the spelling of those words, not even using the screwed up UK way of spelling.

The word frack was orginated in a United States/American TV comedy show called "Laugh In". As in the US back then and still to this day, the word fu<k is banned on broadcast TV. So the producers of the show came up with the word 'frack' as a subsitute, as in "Well frack me!".

About ten years ago or less, liberals here in the US suddenly discovered the fracing process, a process that had been ongoing since 1947, and decided that if it was good for the evil big oil companies*, it just had to be bad as far as they were concerned.

Of course they knew that fracing was spelled without a 'k', but they also were very aware of the word 'frack'. which everybody who had a TV, really meant fu<k.

Thus the word fracking was invented to add the connotation that the process called fracing, must be bad and something evil by "big oil".

And you fell for it hook. line and sinker. :=




* Actually the fracing process benefits the small 'mom and pop' oil and natrual gas drilling/producing companies in the US more than "Big Oil", as those 'mom and pop' drillng/producing companies produce the majority of oil and natrual gas in the United States.

awblain
10th Apr 2014, 19:23
Lordy… the wingnutbudgets have a new hobbyhorse.

No change in OK earthquake activity, right?

What the frack? | Stats Chat (http://www.statschat.org.nz/2011/11/09/what-the-frack/)

https://www.stat.auckland.ac.nz/~curran/statschat/quakes.df.txt

Fracking itself is associated with minor earthquakes, as is wastewater disposal injection. In fact, careless injection is more serious, since fracking is done in a planned and thought-out way, within just the reservoir strata, while waste injection is a bit more free form.

Sensible jurisdictions tend to restrict disposal activities, so it all gets trucked to OK.

Sailor Vee
10th Apr 2014, 19:27
You may well have invented 'fracin', but we invented the fracking language! :p

G-CPTN
10th Apr 2014, 19:30
Two of the remaining deep coal mines in England will be closed down next year.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-26969266
It is not economic to mine coal in England as supplies from Russia and the USA can be imported for less money than locally-produced coal.

One reason is the USA now has so much gas from oil-wells that it has an excess of coal. Another is that England has exhausted the 'easy fat seams' and the remaining thin seams are expensive to harvest.

There is still many millions of tonnes under the North Sea and there are plans to drill down and gassify this.


Drilling date set for North Sea?s vast coal reserves - The Journal (http://www.thejournal.co.uk/news/north-east-news/drilling-date-set-north-seas-6896191)

Firm to drill for gas in coal seams under the North Sea - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/10746700/Firm-to-drill-for-gas-in-coal-seams-under-the-North-Sea.html)

samusi01
10th Apr 2014, 19:40
Buy the way, I've felt more earthquakes (1) in Oklahoma than I've seen tornadoes on the ground.

Same here. Haven't seen any funnel clouds but I have felt some quakes here.

Having briefly perused the USGS quake site moments ago, I found nine (9) quakes listed. Of those nine, one was at 3.9km depth, one at 2.8, one at 1.3, and one at 3.4. Using 4000 meters as a max depth for a well... I just browsed through a copy of Permits & Players from August of last year and the deepest OK permits were less than that depth. In my opinion, it's highly unlikely that a frac job will penetrate an additional 2-6 km of depth (deepest quake listed was 9.8km).

Can a frac job cause a quake, or a microquake? I'm sure... but I am also not worried about it kicking off a big one at all.

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 19:42
hee hee! ten points Sailor Vee.:ok:

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 20:10
AW

Are you incapable of posting without using insults? Doesn't appear to be so. :rolleyes:

No change in OK earthquake activity, right?

Now who in the hell said that? I sure didn't.

As for this;

What the frack? | Stats Chat



Did you actually read the entire article? Becasue, in fact, he does not conclude positivitly that fracing is responsible for the earthquakes in Oklahoma, he just says it should be explored further.

Now, as for this one;

https://www.stat.auckland.ac.nz/~cur.../quakes.df.txt

A bunch of numbers that could mean anything, in other words, worthless.


Fracking itself is associated with minor earthquakes

Really, prove it, saying it does not make it so. Fracing can show up as an earthquake, just as can a heavy truck going by a seismometer/graph site.

The US has set off over a thousand underground nuclear explosions* and never casued a single earthquake, now you're going to tell me that 3,000 psi frac jobs have. :p


* All of which shows up on seismometers. Or seismographs if you prefer.

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 20:20
You may well have invented 'fracin', but we invented the fracking language!

I like that I do. :ok:

But, the Apollo landing craft that landed on the moon had English wrtting on them, does that mean the English landed on the moon, not Americans. :p

The word is still spelled correctly; fracing. No stinkin' 'k'. ;)

Lightning Mate
10th Apr 2014, 20:23
In fact, what dammage that has been casued state wide has been very minor


Please translate that please.

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 20:36
Please translate that please.

Sorry, big hands, small keyboard and a lack of proof reading. :O

I'll go back and correct that. I admit my mistakes, unlike others here. ;)

DX Wombat
10th Apr 2014, 20:36
Suvverners! :rolleyes: Over the state as a whole any damage which has occurred has been minor. At least that is how I read it. ;)

racedo
10th Apr 2014, 20:41
The US has set off over a thousand underground nuclear explosions* and never casued a single earthquake, now you're going to tell me that 3,000 psi frac jobs have. :p

Nuclear Bomb Tests and their relationship to Earthquakes planetwide (http://www.ratical.org/radiation/inetSeries/testsNquakes.html)

Not strictly true

"On June 19, 1992, the United States conducted an underground nuclear bomb test in Nevada. Another test was conducted only four days afterwards. Three days later, a series of heavy earthquakes as high as 7.6 on the Richter scale rocked the Mojave desert 176 miles to the south"

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 20:43
Suvverners! Over the state as a whole any damage which has occurred has been minor. At least that is how I read it.

I do beleive that he was taking me to task for accidently spelling 'damage' with two 'm's in my earlier post, a typo.

No harm, no foul.

500N
10th Apr 2014, 20:43
Racedo

You beat me to it !

West Coast
10th Apr 2014, 20:44
Lordy… the wingnutbudgets have a new hobbyhorse.

Andrew, calm yourself. Also, change your location back to the UK since you no longer live in Pasadena.

500N
10th Apr 2014, 20:46
"Also, change your location back to the UK since you no longer live in Pasadena."


Ah, so a real troll ?????? :O

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 20:47
Wasn't there some suggestion or experiment carried out some time in the past long before the frack wars to actually pump water down on on plate boundaries in areas at risk from earthquake? the idea being that it may relieve the pressure in small increments rather than have them let go in a serious quake.
I'm sure I watched a Horizon prog or something similar many years ago.
:uhoh:

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 20:47
Not strictly true


Okay, I'll buy off on that in over a thousand underground nuclear explosions, at least one caused a earthquake. :p

But still, a 3,000 psi frac job compared to a underground nuclear explosion...

500N
10th Apr 2014, 20:48
"Wasn't there some suggestion or experiment carried out some time in the past long before the frack wars to actually pump water down on on plate boundaries in areas at risk from earthquake? the idea being that it may relieve the pressure in small increments rather than have them let go in a serious quake.
I'm sure I watched a Horizon prog or something similar many years ago.
:uhoh:"



I think it was in California that they tried it or wanted to.

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 21:01
Remember reading with some surprise that the hollow spherical cavity left by a underground nuclear test detonation was only a hundred feet across, here was me thinking there would be a huge round cavern a mile wide or summat.
Rather disappointed I was.
:uhoh:

con-pilot
10th Apr 2014, 21:03
I think it was in California that they tried it or wanted to.

I remember something about that as well. From what I recall they were going to use or did use oil field fracing equiptment to do the testing with, but it seems like the fracing pressure that the oil field equiptment could produce, was too low to cause any sort of reaction that they were lookng for.

I just remember the test theory/method was dropped.

But, I've drank a lot of Scotch since then. :p

500N
10th Apr 2014, 21:04
Yes, not that large and I think it collapses over time.

I like all the depressions in the desert in Nevada, interesting patterns.

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 21:07
Apparently some of them bore holes still have a live nuke sitting at the bottom of them,the fuse probably spluttered out.
:uhoh:

500N
10th Apr 2014, 21:11
Are you serious ?

I have never read that is the case.

Most "lost" nuclear weapons of the US have been listed - or buried :O

Dushan
10th Apr 2014, 21:20
Thus the word fracking was invented to add the connotation that the process called fracing, must be bad and something evil by "big oil".




Similar to how Alberta oil sands are called "Tar Sands" by those that Ben There already identified as "those who oppose free world energy development and capitalism".

tony draper
10th Apr 2014, 21:46
Well technically they are buried,how deep did they drill those holes?:uhoh:
I reckon what happened was they had two or three nukes failed to pop at the bottom of those holes,so to save embarrassing questions a cunning plan was hatched
Message from Pentagon to Mr President
We suggest that to be rid of nukes now surplus to requirements due to new treaties, a simple way to progress this would be to bury them deep in the desert.
Message from Presidents office,
Great idea, make it so
Message from Pentagon to Mr President.
Thank you Mr President we shall get right on it and can safely say we shall have three buried by the end of the day.
Right chaps fill those feckin bore holes up.
Only being Amurican he probably would not have used the word chaps
:rolleyes:

G-CPTN
10th Apr 2014, 22:04
Underground nuclear testing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_nuclear_testing#Early_history_of_underground_tes ting)

The Sultan
11th Apr 2014, 01:05
Okies should frack away. I believe God is sending the F5's and the quakes to correct a mistake in the human gene pool. Just look at how their reps in Washington voted to support Sandy victims. Okies want to go it alone, the majority of the US agree!

Do not call the American people when the big one comes, run to th Kochs and I am sure they will pick up the Bill.:O

The Sultan

con-pilot
11th Apr 2014, 01:34
I believe God is sending the F5's and the quakes to correct a mistake in the human gene pool

I'm sure that the parents of the seven children killed in the Moore F-5 tornado really appreciate your comments. I guess you were jumping for joy when those 19 little children were killed in the Oklahoma City bombing.

Using the deaths of seven children to promote your progressive, so-called liberal Democratic agenda is despicable.

What a complete and total piece of shit you are.

If I'm banned for that, so be it.

500N
11th Apr 2014, 01:49
AW Blain, calling AW Blain, of an old city in the UK.

Are you around or are you "soar"ing higher and higher and
we are too "midlands" for you ?


Better change your location while you are at it !

West Coast
11th Apr 2014, 02:21
Amen Con. The only good thing is the poster isn't representative of the good folks in Texas who I'm sure share in the grief of those poor parents.

fleigle
11th Apr 2014, 02:54
On a small tangent.
Back in the 70's (1970's), it was discovered that numerous earthquakes were showing up in the Sierra Nevada foothills of California, far enough away from the usual locations.
Further research pointed the causes to the apparent affects of loading and unloading of surface pressure caused by the seasonal filling and lowering of water levels of recently completed dams. The phenomena were called Reservoir-induced seismicity (RIS), wiki may have some info on that.
f
(Further browsing reveals that this is/was an internationally observed phenomena)

jolihokistix
11th Apr 2014, 04:12
With or without the earthquakes, *fraccing in Holland has caused massive cracking in houses from subsidence.

*We don't say frige, from refrigerator; everyone adds a 'd' to get fridge. Grammatically necessary. If you don't use a K, then you would have to double the C to get close to the correct sound in English. (Grammatically c+ing goes well in Chinese, though.)

awblain
11th Apr 2014, 05:00
I'm glad to see that the idea that unregulated and ill-thoughtout wastewater disposal injection in OK shows a remarkable correlation with earthquake activity has sent Con into a conniption.

Quite what a modest number of underground nuclear explosions has to do with releasing stress energy in faulting isn't clear. The only thing thats relevant between nuclear explosions and earthquakes is the approximate match between the amount of energy released.

The mag 5.7 earthquake in OK in 2011 triggered by wastewater injection rather exceeds the approximate limit of 4 found in shale or reservoir fracking worldwide, owing to it being a very different process and one that needs more care.

I assume that concerns about liability will rein in operators in states where the rule of law and public protection may be lax, but physical law still operates; unless their legislators choose to shield the injectors from liability, I guess.

Matari
11th Apr 2014, 05:21
What happened to the "sciolist" warning that used to appear somewhere on these pages?

racedo
12th Apr 2014, 13:27
Ohio geologists link small quakes to fracking (http://bigstory.ap.org/article/ohio-regulators-link-seismic-activity-fracking)

Seems they have been able to connect some earthquakes to fracking.

Lonewolf_50
14th Apr 2014, 16:48
What happened to the "sciolist" warning that used to appear somewhere on these pages?
Methnks the mods have looked at the MH 370 thread and tossed up their hands in despair. :E Can't say as I blame them.

racedo
14th Apr 2014, 20:50
Methnks the mods have looked at the MH 370 thread and tossed up their hands in despair. :E Can't say as I blame them.

Read first page on 1st day and thought will let this one pass..................

B Fraser
14th Apr 2014, 21:27
" the Apollo landing craft that landed on the moon had English writing on them, does that mean the English landed on the moon, not Americans"


Armstrong was a Scot, Collins was Irish and Aldrin was a Swede.

Lonewolf_50
14th Apr 2014, 21:43
Nope. All three were Americans.


Armstrong may have had Scots ancestry, but he was born in Auglaize County, Ohio.
Collins may have had Irish Ancestry, but he was born in Rome Italy, the child of an American Major General.
Aldrin may have had Swedish ancestry, but he was born in Glen Ridge, NJ.

con-pilot
14th Apr 2014, 22:38
Thanks Wolf! :ok:

You beat me to it.

Besides that Fraser, on my father's side I'm Scotish/Swedish/French stock and on my mother's, English/German/American Indian stock.

In other words, an American.

Oh, my home town is/was Roswell, New Mexico and I was born in 1947. So watch it buddy. :suspect:

Dushan
15th Apr 2014, 00:06
Do you know Demi Moore?

con-pilot
15th Apr 2014, 00:25
Do you know Demi Moore?

Biblically????? :eek:






Sadly no. :(

LowNSlow
15th Apr 2014, 12:39
Con, ExxonMobil seem to disagree with you.... Facts on the hydraulic fracturing process | ExxonMobil's Perspectives Blog (http://www.exxonmobilperspectives.com/2011/06/17/facts-hydraulic-fracturing-process/?gclid=CN3H-Myz4r0CFdShtAodAkEAjA&gclsrc=aw.ds)

con-pilot
15th Apr 2014, 18:35
LnS

Huh, did you bother to read the link you posted?

If you did, please point out just where they, ExxonMobile, disagrees with me*?

Thank you! :ok:


* Well actually not me, but with what the geologist I know have told me.