View Full Version : Brymon's demise - Gill's rise !

18th Apr 2001, 01:44
Brymon has done it again!

Heard this evening that Brymon are to suspend operation of the Copenhagen and Belfast schedules from Newcastle, only weeks after employing a considerable number of new staff for the base expansion! This will be good news for Gill but must be devastating for some Brymon crews who will be regretting joining the Company.

Apparently Brymon Management shed much of their engineering capability (and treated the Engineers themselves appallingly in the process)! Other 'skimping' in all areas and selling off of spares mean't that sub-chartering costs have escalated to the extent that a spare Dash 8 is required at Bristol therefore depriving Newcastle of half of its workload!

Allegedly a/c have to be flown to Canada for major check as there is no adequate Dash 8 maintenance available in Europe!??

We are all aware of cost-savings, but the absolute incompetence, lack of cohesion and total disregard of employees both long-standing and new, by Management, defies belief! How can you knowingly employ folk, doubling the size of a base only to reduce it again in less than one month?!

I am ashamed to be employed by this company whom it seems have let some of their staff down AGAIN in a very BIG way. "Redundancy and 'natural wastage' will 'cure' the problem," according to the Bristol hierarchy!

Condolences and good luck to the boys and girls at Newcastle and here is hoping that your futures can be somehow secured.

18th Apr 2001, 02:01
This figures

Heard a Brymon plane a couple of Saturday's ago that flew down from NCL to BRS to get an engineer signature, and was then immediately positioning back to NCL..

18th Apr 2001, 02:23
Could this be an early move in the restructuring of Brymon and BRAL? Rationalisation of bases was bound to be one of the the topics high on the integration group's agenda.

If it isn't and is just an internal change then perhaps the reports that we have been getting in BRAL of Brymon's less than perfect management and administration is true. Doesn't augur too well for the new age, does it?
Apres moi le deluge!

18th Apr 2001, 02:32
If this news is true, then I'm sory for the crews, some of whome have joined from Gill over recent times, However I think it was fairly evident that Brymon were only out to screw Gill into the ground at NCL and take their routes. Now that they have failed, they are off with their tails between their legs, and Gill can go from strength to strength!!


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18th Apr 2001, 02:37
As you say, Ballsout, I feel sorry for the crews. They have been badly treated by an organisation that was out to kill off Gill.

I would hope that, if some want to return to the fold, there would be a fatted calf or two under the knife...

Hoof Hearted
18th Apr 2001, 16:05
If true then it is good news indeed for Gill Airways. Having worked for both companies I know which one I preferred. Lets hope that Gill can now move onward and upward. If only they would re open a base down south.......

18th Apr 2001, 16:10
There is a splendid Dash 8 maintenance facility at Exeter. Employs a few former Brymon engineers I'm told!

18th Apr 2001, 16:58
Sorry to be the one bearing tidings of accuracy Huggy. (Again)

Whilst I don't know, and can't comment about Brymon management just yet, I can tell you that there is a plan stretching (currently) to 2004 to take over Brymon Embraer and Dash maintenance on the Isle of Man. Don't know yet about the basing/routing structure involving NCL, but I'll bring you up to date as soon as I do.

Dare I presume that Gill will now cease its petty objections to the joining of Brymon and BRAL? Hey, play your cards right, and you too could be part of a profitable well run operation - could you cope with that ?

Arf, arf, arf!!

18th Apr 2001, 18:55
The aim is supposedly to release an aircraft as another spare, seeing as how there has been some appalling serviceability and lots of replacement aircraft leased in. This will allow a crewed spare at BRS ready to react! Probably not popular with the summer contract pilots who are seemingly to be moved to MAN, leaving a few too many F/O's at NCL but no redundancy (yet). Cabin crew may not be so fortunate. All will face several days a week away from home base. http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/frown.gif

18th Apr 2001, 19:05
Jacksman :)

18th Apr 2001, 21:31
Brit World and Titan must be making a fortune subbing for Brymon!

19th Apr 2001, 01:37
It would seem we all believe that Brymon are quitting NCL? Not true, only giving up on the least profitable route in the schedule! Why? You have already answered it-response to poor performance in the reliability & punctuality area. Most of the problems have been inherited by current management(OK one of them is still there & he has caused all the probs) but as difficult as it seems I believe the decision to be the correct one! The company needs to do what it can to operate properly & produce a reliable product for its BUSINESS PAX!!! At the moment it is doing lots of routes and struggling to achieve an acceptable performance. No I'm not management, I'm a Brymon line captain(not NCL) and I do feel sorry for the NCL fellows, but this will not mean redundencies! No one, to my knowledge has mentioned the NCL base closing!

19th Apr 2001, 14:35
Haven't we been here before with this one. A few weeks back I asked the question why Brymon had made the curious and apparant uneconomic decision to sent aircraft to Canada. Is the reason really that there isn't any adequate maintenance in Europe? I really find this hard to believe, they have a perfectly good maintenance facility an hour down the road, let alone within central europe.

Is this decision therefore with a symptomatic of a management lack of direction or common sense.

20th Apr 2001, 00:25
pruner44. The people who made the decision to send them to canada had all the infor mation available, you dont. Perhaps the maintenance facility up the road had no capacity to do the work, perhaps they priced the job too high, perhaps their were other factors meaning that this wouldnt have worked. It is hardly likely Brymon management wouldnt have thought of it so no doubt they had their reasons.

20th Apr 2001, 00:44
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Basically the BA idiot brought in by BA (as Bryman is a franchise)aspart of their highly unsuccessful placement sytem who thought that they would save a few quid with engineering has holed the vessel somewhat. As a frequent Bryman flyer I am nowdays apalled at their serviceability on the Dash 8 routes. My inside sources tell me that the jet fleet isn't much better! Anyway I also have inside info that once the BRAL issue is sorted Bryman will be a great place to work, so silver lining on horizon. Maybe I should send them my CV. Ta ta 4now.
:) :) :) :) :) :)

No spellcheck but hey who cares if the FMC is out by 700 miles!!!!!!!! :) :)

20th Apr 2001, 11:11
Minogue, you suprise me with your comments. I would have thought that in the light of the above comments made from various people you would not give the Brymon management that amount of credibility. I.e pulling out of NCL to provide a spare aircraft at BRS, lack of spares etc.

Perhaps you should give the guys up the road a little more credibility as they for one seem to be able to get it right.

Is it about time Brymon got out of the Dash 8 altogether as they can't even seem to make this work. the Shed would perhaps be more appropriate for them given their demonstrated level of capability.

Whata was it recently? 73% unavailability and 1.5million on sub-charters.

20th Apr 2001, 14:54
MAXAOB , if you're going to send in a cv , I'd at least get the company name correct , it's BrymOn , and yes it will be a good company to work for. Technically , we're not a franchise , we're a wholly-owned subsidiary of BA.
Ppruner44 , sorry to stoop to abuse , but you're a prat! Brymon made 5.5 million profit this year , 1.4 short of target , this mainly due to servicability problems , which (I'm suprised to say) have been dramatically improved over the last month.
I think that a certain head in engineering should roll , we've been through an appalling patch , but I'm fairly confident that we're out of it~and I'm a line pilot not noted for his enthusiasm for the company. Much as I hate to admit it , most of the current management team do know what they're doing , and to conclude my rant , ladies and gentlemen , NCL as a base is not being closed , Brymon as a company is not on skid-row , and we're well able to operate the Dash8, so stick your shed where the sun doesn't shine.

20th Apr 2001, 15:36
As I have already said, all the Brymon maintenance is the subject of an agreement with BRAL/Manx, and this is expected to continue even should the 'joining' of the Companies hit any (highly unlikely) snags.

Maybe with hindsight, and I speak as a BRAL Line Pilot, Canada wasn't the best option, but that is why the maintenance is going to the Isle of Man at top speed.
Its always difficult to be objective on these pages, but I believe the Brymon/BRAL/Manx transition will be one of huge benefit to all who are involved. It will be slow but sure, and very very profitable. The spinoffs for pilots are expected to be good, with everyone getting to the highest common denominator -in pay, conditions, pensions etc - out of the two organisations. Watch out JEA (or whatever you're called this week) watch out Gill.
Of course, this depends on our joint management, but there are some very solid people on both sides of the merger - lets just hope they're the ones we keep!

Arf, arf, arf!!

22nd Apr 2001, 03:12
To all Brymon crews at NCL. It is really sad to be reading about the dropping of BHD & CPH, and the real threat to your jobs. It is always a terrible thing when this sort of thing happens to anyone in this industry, however to see such a fantastic group of people with whom I have worked be affected like this is not nice at all. My best wishes and hope goes out to all those affected, and I sincerely hope you will be in a secure position ASAP.



Big Nose
22nd Apr 2001, 05:31
Dear MaxAOB

It's Brymon (with an O) how frequently do you fly with us ?

22nd Apr 2001, 10:18

Where did the term 'BA idiot' come from? Rest assured the new GMFO is no idiot. He is already making tough decisions that really need to be made. The Dash 8 fleet was in a very poor state of repair when he arrived with most aircraft carrying far too many defects and he is trying to put that right by giving more time to Brymon engineers to work on aircraft by chartering in etc. Brymon have always been short of someone who can make decisions like this - spending 3 times your budget on subcharters in your first few months means something was wrong before you arrived doesn't it? Best of luck to the NCL crews.

23rd Apr 2001, 13:04
Is it just possible that the shambolic state of affairs at Brymon, particularly the withdrawal of services from Newcastle and possible redundancy of brand new employees, is related to the reported 'goings-on' involving an alleged 1.8 million?

In other words could this sudden change in the route network be a crisis measure to help cover any recently discovered losses?

23rd Apr 2001, 14:44
Fudpucker, I guess we now know where the 1.4 million went and why the aeroplanes go to Canada!!!