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garp
20th Jan 2014, 20:47
Just received the green light for a UK-road trip with my two teenage (15 and 17) boys while wife and daughter will be off to Spain. It'll be at the beginning of April for a duration of 6 days. Beside the Cotswolds and a bit of London we haven't seen much of the UK so I gladly take a few tips, starting and ending in Dover.
We probably take our German Pointer (I am familiar with the dog vaccinations etc) with us too, she loves sitting in the car and doesn't mind to be left alone for the duration of a visit to whatever place (eg Duxford).
I also realize that the Lake district and Scotland might be cold but I'm willing to take that risk :)

Shaggy Sheep Driver
20th Jan 2014, 21:09
Must do:

North Wales
Derbyshire Peak District
Yorkshire Dales
Lake District
West coast of Scotland north of the Clyde

ruddman
20th Jan 2014, 21:24
UK road trip
Just received the green light for a UK-road trip with my two teenage (15 and 17) boys while wife and daughter will be off to Spain. It'll be at the beginning of April for a duration of 6 days. Beside the Cotswolds and a bit of London we haven't seen much of the UK so I gladly take a few tips, starting and ending in Dover.
We probably take our German Pointer (I am familiar with the dog vaccinations etc) with us too, she loves sitting in the car and doesn't mind to be left alone for the duration of a visit to whatever place (eg Duxford).
I also realize that the Lake district and Scotland might be cold but I'm willing to take that risk


That's where my concern lies. Who has the c/c?

Capetonian
20th Jan 2014, 21:36
6 days is not much so you will have to do some fairly drastic pruning of the many suggestions you will get.

If you and your boys like railway history, the NRM in York is fantastic, and the city itself attractive too, then there's the Yorkshire Moors and Dales ....

In the NW : Chester and the Wirral
In the SW : Salisbury, Salisbury Plain, Marlborough, Devizes.

I don't envy you making those choices.

G-CPTN
20th Jan 2014, 21:51
duration of 6 days starting and ending in Dover

Must do:

North Wales
Derbyshire Peak District
Yorkshire Dales
Lake District
West coast of Scotland north of the Clyde

You'll be hard pushed to do the west coast of Scotland (there and back) within the six days if you want to include Duxford.
You will be travelling for most of the six days.

I'm not saying that it would be impossible, and there is wonderful scenery (especially higher up beyond Fort William) but the roads are not motorways (many are single track) and so progress is slow.
I adore that part of Britain so much that I have requested that my ashes are scattered off the high ground north of Culkein, just south of the Point of Stoer north of Clashnessie, Lochinver.

gingernut
20th Jan 2014, 22:09
OOer, 6 days 'aint a long time. Shaggy Sheep reflects my opinion, but you'll have to balance time spent the car with time taking in the ambiance.

Whatever you do, pack your clothing well, we can almost guarantee cold rain and wind at this time of year.

Not a frequent visitor, but always found London quite interesting, with a good map, you can see lots in a day.

Here's some of me 'faves....

Cornwall....get to the North Coast for a surf..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0083_zpsc5c61751.jpg






We're an Island, the fishing industry is Fooked, bit if you hunt around, you'll meet some of the old boys. They'll take you at on their boat for about 4 quid, and boy oh boy, can they chat...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0220_zpsbba32719.jpg

National Trust places are usually worth a visit....not sure if they do short term deals though. The Maze, at Tatton, Cheshire.....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0136_zpse4428516.jpg


Madchester.....do I need to say more....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0032.jpg

Enjoy our rules on free speech...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0022-2.jpg

Come and spend a bit of time walking the Peak District...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0099.jpg

Watch famous people discuss model railways...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSCN8731.jpg

Meet the locals....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/dave.jpg

Build a shed....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSCN5667.jpg





But most of all......

ENJOY YOURSELF....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/David/DSC_0159.jpg
Enjoy our fantasic country, ginge and Max :-)

Tankertrashnav
20th Jan 2014, 22:17
Just read Gingernut's recommendations

Going for a little lie-down!

Capetonian
20th Jan 2014, 22:26
What a lovely posting and superb photos by Gingernut. Thanks for sharing. Lovely photos of Max!

A not very good photo of one of my favourite places, Chester.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7593647/CTR.jpg

racedo
20th Jan 2014, 22:26
Day 1...........Dover to Duxford............stay in Cambridge and have a walkaround
Day 2..........York..............National Railway Museum and York.....stay in York
Day 3..........Newcastle and thence to Edinburgh.............stay Edinburgh
Day 4 .........to Lake District and overnight
Day 5.......... Manchester, stay over further south
Day 6...........Stonehenge and Dover Castle.

Gertrude the Wombat
20th Jan 2014, 22:42
Day 1...........Dover to Duxford............stay in Cambridge and have a walkaround
Day 2..........York..............National Railway Museum and York.....stay in York
Day 3..........Newcastle and thence to Edinburgh.............stay Edinburgh
Day 4 .........to Lake District and overnight
Day 5.......... Manchester, stay over further south
Day 6...........Stonehenge and Dover Castle.
That lot does add up to a bit ambitious, unless you actually like sitting in a car for hour after hour after hour.

And Stonehenge is somewhat boring these days, you can't climb around on the stones any more like we did when we were kids.

awblain
20th Jan 2014, 22:45
Dover Castle is a good call.

Duxford's a good museum, as is the Imperial War Museum in Manchester and the Royal Armouries museum in Leeds. Cambridge is nice.

Durham Cathedral is probably the most impressive building in the UK.
Canterbury's old too, and handy for Dover.

For landscape, perhaps Grasmere/Borrowdale in the Lake District or North-West Wales, but chances are it'll be misty and invisible.

For absurd stately-home bling there's Chatsworth House.

If you leave a dog in a car in the UK, there's a chance it might be "liberated".

gingernut
20th Jan 2014, 22:45
thanks Cape, how could I forget our wonderful Chester..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0086_zps1e887479.jpg

ricardian
20th Jan 2014, 22:53
Choral evensong in Durham or York would be an unforgettable experience

con-pilot
20th Jan 2014, 23:02
And Stonehenge is somewhat boring these days, you can't climb around on the stones any more like we did when we were kids.

No kidding, when I lived in England we could drive our car right up to the stones and walk all around inside. My father took a picture of me lying down on the sacrificial stone, with my mother standing over me pretending to have a knife.

I never really quite got over the look on her face. :uhoh:

G-CPTN
20th Jan 2014, 23:14
Good itinerary, racedo - and doable (with a good selection and variety).

Duxford cries out for seeing Cambridge as you suggest, York (heading there myself in July) combines city and railway museum (there's also the city museum which is worth a visit and the Minster church), Newcastle via Durham city (another magnificent cathedral), and Edinburgh (excellent scenery en-route whether you follow the A1 or the more interesting A696/A68 over Carter Bar and Jedburgh, Lake District via A701 through Moffat then A74M/M6 Penrith A66 to Keswick A591 Windermere A592 A590 M6 M5 A417 A419 A346 A338 (or overnight in Bath) then A303 Stonehenge then Dover (castle) and depart.

Personally I would give Manchester a miss, but you need to plan your overnight stay between the Lake District and Stonehenge. I don't know whether you could reach Bath . . .

If you need to shorten the route you could miss Edinburgh (interesting as it is) and Newcastle and include Durham before heading west to Penrith and onwards to the Lakes. Interesting scenery en-route via A689 Stanhope Alston A686 (one of England's most interesting roads) to Penrith.

Gordy
20th Jan 2014, 23:36
I suspect:
two teenage (15 and 17) boys
may not appreciate:
Choral evensong in Durham or York

G-CPTN
20th Jan 2014, 23:43
two teenage (15 and 17) boys

Even at that age, choral evensong in a cathedral is a moving experience. Try Kings College Cambridge (or St John's) if timings for York and Durham are unsuitable. Punting on the Cam at Cambridge (take a guided trip unless you are experienced).

Fox3WheresMyBanana
21st Jan 2014, 00:44
Good points and suggestions raised, but I fear we need a little more info on the boys, Garp.
What are their interests, or career ambitions, if any yet?
Are you trying to satisfy those interests, drag their eyes away from computer screens, or present them with a smorgasbord of things they may turn out to really like? Or all of these?
What places/events from your personal experience would you really like to share with them?

I think Racedo has the right general plot (you can do London anytime from Dover), but the exact stops depend on the boys.

Krystal n chips
21st Jan 2014, 02:09
Garp,

You need to think very carefully about these six days, because, in effect, they will be reduced to four. Lets start with Dover.

What time are you scheduled to arrive ?.....and what time are you scheduled to depart?.....both times will affect your choice(s) of destinations as you will be travelling and if either involve the rush hour periods, they will be slow journeys.

Then there's the dog. Where do you intend to stay and are the overnight stops dog friendly ? You need to check in advance and again, this means planning your itinerary carefully.

So far, non of the wonderfully impractical suggestions have taken the practicalities into consideration, so you can dispense with Scotland, sadly, because by the time you have got there, and North of Perth where the real grandeur begins, it's time to come back. Likewise the Lakes....over priced, over hyped and over saturated with tourists. If you want scenery, try Mid / North Wales , the Wye Valley and the Gower.

Again, much depends on what your boys are interested in as others have said. Duxford for obvious reasons, Cambridge for history and culture, and then where ?. Travelling West -East or the reverse is a nightmare at times in the UK so factor this in please. The Cotswolds, Gloucestershire / Herefordshire are very scenic and Hereford has a nice Cathedral, with an interesting artefact, but it's a pig to drive through and around.

Chester is fine, but the Wirral is nothing special, industrial on the North and views of the Dee on the South.

You could always head West from Dover, towards Devon and Cornwall, by way of a more practical itinerary although I assume London is a "must visit" stop? so this again, will impact on your available time and destinations, because that's another day gone.

You could, conceivably go Dover-London-Duxford-Cambridge-York in the four days you have, but as I say, the ferry times will dictate your stay and what you can, rationally, hope to enjoy in this period.

llondel
21st Jan 2014, 03:04
Punting on the Cam at Cambridge (take a guided trip unless you are experienced).

Half the fun is trying to figure out what you're supposed to do without falling in. Give the locals some entertainment.

I noticed you were planning to leave the dog in the car - that's not necessarily politically correct now, especially if that strange glowing ball in the sky puts in one of its rare appearances. April is unlikely to be a problem but be aware.

cavortingcheetah
21st Jan 2014, 04:28
You can work on averaging 70 to 80 Kms/hr on the motorway system. Every motorway stop will take thirty minutes in the queues for the pumps, cash regosters and the toilets. You will waste most of your driving day going from any A to another B in the appalling conditions that prevail in Britain. The passing vista on the motorways is truly eye shatteringly disgusting.
If you take back roads, A roads or B ones then you'll be more likely to average 50 to 65 Kms/hr and you might see something remotely attractive from time to time.
Petrol stops in some parts of the country will need to be carefully planned and may almost put you back on the motorway or into a major town to find a functioning petrol station. You should also make a note from the internet of agencies with workshops for the type of car you're taking in the area your planning to visit.
In six days you've got five nights and with two days driving from and to Dover you've got four days for sightseeing. The area around Cambridge is an obvious enough possibility with the city itself and the aviation museum Duxford. From there you could get up to York and stay there for a couple of days before returning to Dover.
Whatever is on your hit list just be aware that driving in Britain, for the European traveller, is a primitive, exhausting and unrewarding experience. You can play a road game called 'Spot the Car Foreign Plate'. You'll see the odd Polish car perhaps and here and there a Belgian but on the whole Continental car drivers avoid the place and with good reason. Lorries from anywhere, including the left hand drive ones from Europe, are an altogether different matter and abound in their thousands on all sides of the roads, often with no prior warning.

Gordy
21st Jan 2014, 04:50
Sometimes the end of the road is not the purpose of the journey..... I have more on this thought in bit.....

500N
21st Jan 2014, 04:53
I don't think I could drive in the UK having read Cavorting's post.
I reckon I would go nuts.

cavortingcheetah
21st Jan 2014, 05:08
I am the first to admit to a medium sized dose of UK cynicism so I always try to keep my criticism of that country's facilities well balanced and in proportion to its capabilities.

Gordy
21st Jan 2014, 05:37
I am kinda with 500N on this...

I actually did a road trip last winter with the wife and kids in the UK. We arrived on Christmas Eve around 10 am at Gatwick Airport.... Took about 2 hours to clear customs and immigration.... # 1 daughter arrived in Heathrow and we had planned to meet at Victoria bus station.... long story...huge mess... Needless to say, we had all made it to Lincoln by 11pm and re-united. Hung there for a few days and started our road trip.

Pre road tip day out to Grimsby to visit my former boarding school, (eye opener for the kids....although the cupboard with the bamboo canes was no longer there...)

Day 1 Lincoln to York.. visited museum and stuff

Day 2 York to Edinburgh.. Did the dungeon thingy...

Day 3 did the castle thingy thing and then onto somewhere on the North side of a big bridge.

Day 4 Town North of bridge to Inverness via Forres. Saw a Nimrod, (flew on them in former life), saw old house from former life. (#1 kid born in Inverness, left country when she was 3 months old).

Hogmanay in Inverness---ate at KFC as all restaurants booked or closed.... Note to self....

Day 5 Inverness to Glasgow Saw all of the Loch and lots of scenic stuff....hills, moors, some snow, closed whiskey distilleries.... (What is up with that...? Note to self again)

Day 6 Glasgow to Lincoln--the long way...apparently the UK shuts down with 4 inches of rain and all the rivers flood the roads and make them impassable---in British cars anyways....(note to self again...get an SUV rental)

Day 7 stay in Lincoln

Day 8 Lincoln to London---stay for 3 days see British museum, some big castle thingy from the outside, a palace, some marching dudes playing music with big hats on.. Downing street---when did the whole street get blocked off? seems like I walked on that street as a kid....

We then headed back home to Utah.

My recollection of the trip and also our 3 kids is that we had a lot of fun in a car, we told some bad jokes, we took some goofy pictures, we ate at some great restaurants and also had some shitty food, life was good. It did not matter what we saw.

Only regret was trying to fit too much in.....we all agreed we would have liked to not have to pack our bags every morning....but maybe relax a little more.

For the record.... it was me and SWMBO, #1 kid---23 yr old girl, #2--15 yr old boy, #3---13 yr old girl.... We are planning a "Do-over"...

Like I said before "Sometimes the end of the road is not the purpose of the journey"... Hope this helps.....

Krystal n chips
21st Jan 2014, 05:58
" In six days you've got five nights and with two days driving from and to Dover you've got four days for sightseeing. The area around Cambridge is an obvious enough possibility with the city itself and the aviation museum Duxford. From there you could get up to York and stay there for a couple of days before returning to Dover"

Just wondering if I should sue.....for plagiarism...:p

Fuel can be problematic at times, but again, some basic planning will allow you to fuel up when required, but, do avoid the pumps on the motorway services, they are invariably more expensive. Strangely enough, Cambs Services wasn't during last year.

And we use good old fashioned m.p.h CC old boy.....although I agree, we should use that damned metric stuff...;)

cavortingcheetah
21st Jan 2014, 06:12
Sorry, I knew I'd seen that good idea before!

racedo
21st Jan 2014, 11:27
That lot does add up to a bit ambitious, unless you actually like sitting in a car for hour after hour after hour.


Dover-Duxford is 2 hrs, to York 3, ...................maybe kill Edinburgh bit and head back across Pennines to Lake District and then Manchester,

racedo
21st Jan 2014, 11:33
I don't think I could drive in the UK having read Cavorting's post.
I reckon I would go nuts.

Driving in Uk no worse than in US, less potholes on Motorways than some Interstates.

I've done New York on a Friday afternoon in the rain, LA, Phoenix after a delayed flight, Houston (it smells), Boston, SF and a plethora of US cities plus pretty much all European capitals..............

Some days on roads are good and some bad but thing Cavorting is a bit excessive.

Capetonian
21st Jan 2014, 11:48
You can work on averaging 70 to 80 Kms/hr on the motorway system. Every motorway stop will take thirty minutes
Depends on which m/ways you use and time of days. With a (largely unenforced) speed limit of 70 mph, although the traffic often precludes driving much above that anyway, you can do better than CC says.

How often do you have to stop? A tank will give at least 300 miles in any car, far more in most. You should stop for a rest/stretch overy two hours or so, that only needs to take 10 minutes. I've rarely spent more than 10 minutes at a service station other than by choice, and trust me, that is rare because they are not wonderful places.

You will waste most of your driving day ......... in the appalling conditions that prevail in Britain. The passing vista on the motorways is truly eye shatteringly disgusting.
That's an exaggeration of note. The M40 as it passes through the Chilterns towards Birmingham, is quite scenic. So are parts of the M6 as it passes close to the Lake District and the Borders.
........ just be aware that driving in Britain, for the European traveller, is a primitive, exhausting and unrewarding experience. You can play a road game called 'Spot the Car Foreign Plate'. You'll see the odd Polish car perhaps and here and there a Belgian but on the whole Continental car drivers avoid the place and with good reason.
As is the above!

There are some wonderful drives, Salisbury Plain is one of my favourites, parts of Hampshire, the New Forest, there's plenty more ...........

pvmw
21st Jan 2014, 12:27
Dover-Duxford is 2 hrs...............
Someone's been at the whacky baccy again!!!!:p

If one were to believe Google Maps, then it is possible. However, it doesn't take into account one of the largest serial car parks in the South East - the "Thames Crossing", otherwise known as the Dartford tunnel. Depending on the day of the week and time of day it is quite possible to spend a couple of hours in a queue on the approach. If you are unfortunate enough to be in the "rush" hour (so called because everone is stationary) then the M25 from Dartford to the M11 can be an hour on its own.

If planning to get anywhere in the South East, then it is wise to plan the journey to avoid the worst times (about 2am is usually not bad - tho' you'd be astonished at the number of HGVs queueing to get through the tunnel at midnight)

As for visits. I'd agree Cambridge/Duxford should be high on the list. You could get as far north as York, but if you only have a few days I'd suggest Edinburgh is a trip too far. You'll waste a day just getting there. I'd avoid Manchester, but down through the Peak district with a stop at Chatsworth isn't a bad idea.

dead_pan
21st Jan 2014, 12:51
Swap Avebury for Stonehenge - more impressive IMO, less of a detour, also not as busy. If you're feeling brave, you could always stay at the Red Lion...

Also I'd recommend taking in Oxford if you get a chance- plenty to do in the city (the Ashmolean is worth a visit), also Blenheim is only a few miles to the north. Punting is an option here too, but don't go from Magdalen bridge - head up to the Cherwell boat-house - its quieter and very picturesque, and there's a nice cafe and restaurant right beside the boat hire place.

pvmw
21st Jan 2014, 13:11
The caveat I'd apply to Oxford is its antipathy to the motor vehicle. If you can afford to spend a few hours on a park-and-ride bus (and do they allow dogs on the buses - you won't be able to leave it in the car?) then you could go there - but I'd prefer Cambridge of the two. I've not tried to drive to Oxford (in fact, I've intentionally avoided going anywhere near there) for about 25 years because of the transport problems.

Windy Militant
21st Jan 2014, 13:30
Prepare to be Flexible, a meticulously planned itinerary can soon fall apart if as frequently happens the motorways go TU.
This then knocks back onto the surrounding A and B roads as people try to get round the stoppage.
If you have a good Road Atlas which shows local attractions you can then divert and do something more enjoyable than sit in the traffic and who knows you may find some gems hidden away in the back woods. ;)

Edited to add If you do get Oop North try and fit in a stop at Tebay Services and say hello to the Ducks!
And If you get as far as Moffat don't forget to look for the statue of Robert the Bruce, It's on Well street I think. ;)

garp
21st Jan 2014, 14:07
Many thanks to all for the overwhelming amount of replies. I haven't booked anything yet and I'm probably going to keep it that way. If the weather is really bad than we'll just change course and pick another country on the continent, it doesn't make much sense to be sitting in rain for a week. We have the flexibility so we are going to use it.
I also realize now that a grand tour is too ambitious, better stick to fewer points of interest. As far as the dog is concerned, here also we have the option to take her along or leave her at home (with a dogsitter), still a bit undecided here too.
Thanks again for the suggestions. :D

Shaggy Sheep Driver
21st Jan 2014, 14:20
Consider ditching the car (driving in UK in all but remote areas is truly awful) and taking the train. The journey then become a relaxing part of the holiday and you'll cover distance far more quickly, certainly between city centres (trains out in the sticks may not be so efficient or pleasant).

Curious Pax
21st Jan 2014, 14:40
Probably a good job you have the dog sitter option, as most of the suggestions on here would give him (her?) a boring trip spent looking at the inside of your car!

If you do bring Rover then this website can be quite useful as a guide on eateries - we've stumbled across a few gems as a result: Doggiepubs (http://www.doggiepubs.org.uk) - there's an App too if planning on the hoof.

Of some of the above mentioned places:
Stonehenge: dogs can only walk outside the perimeter of the viewing area, so not as close as dog-free folks are allowed.
National Railway Museum: no dogs allowed. However if steam is your thing then many of the preserved railways allow dogs to travel, and also to walk round the engine sheds. Ours have been on the Lakeside & Haverthwaite Railway at the southern end of Windermere, the East Lancs at Bury and the Keighley & Worth Valley near Haworth. The first and last are obviously near other places of interest too, so you can kill 2 birds etc. They weren't allowed on the Snowdon Mountain Railway, but were on the Llanberis Lakeside railway next door (they liked that one as they got their own tickets!).

It was while waiting outside the shop at the Lakeside railway with my 2 dogs while rs CP and CP jr were looking at souvenirs I had the bizarre experience of being photographed (or more likely it was the dogs) by an entire coach party of Japanese tourists. Some of the braver ones even came (almost) close enough to pat the dogs! I suspect that we make several appearances on the Japanese edition of F*cebook as a result!

And as others have said, with a bit of planning CC's Domesday scenario of UK motorway travel can be largely avoided. Of course an accident at the wrong place/time can screw things up at any time of the day/night, but that is true almost anywhere.

cavortingcheetah
21st Jan 2014, 15:14
France is delightful in April and there are flowers. The péage system of motorways is unbelievable good with wonderful stops and restaurant areas. There is a wealth of sights to see all over the country, especially around Paris. The people are friendly and public drunkenness is most unusual amongst the locals.
Can't recommend it highly enough even if you don't speak the language and believe that von Blücher was the real victor at Waterloo.

Capetonian
21st Jan 2014, 15:40
France ...... the péage system of motorways is unbelievable good with wonderful stops and restaurant areas.It is, and it should be as it's very expensive.
Calais - Paris €21
Calais - Bordeaux : €75
Calais - Nice : €103

The open air roadside stops (aires) are good but toilets often filthy and no facilities above the most basic.

Some of the service station areas have fast food facilities and simple sit down meals which are often worse than those in the UK. Off the autoroutes, if you find the places where the truck drivers eat, you will outstanding value for wholesome simple food.

The people are friendlyIn some parts yes, specifically Brittany (but they don't consider themselves French) and Alsace (ditto), and Normandy and large parts of the South West, and utterly miserable and arrogant in others. Apart from the Brits and the Spanish, they are probably the European nation with the highest percentage of monoglots, but they are very good at understanding when the passage of money - from you to them - is involved.
and public drunkenness is most unusual amongst the locals.True. Children are brought up to understand and respect alcohol from an early age and they grow up with that culture and alcohol abuse is rare. There is no public drunkenness and violence in city centres as is so common in the UK.

ChristiaanJ
21st Jan 2014, 16:21
EU ? Allowed and banned luggage items: animal or plants ? Your Europe (http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/carry/animal-plant/index_en.htm)
My personal experience goes too far back (abt 40 years), but if you take the dog, make sure all the paperwork, etc. is correct, or you may find yourself losing a day arranging quarantine for the dog in (or somewhere near) Dover.....

racedo
21st Jan 2014, 16:26
by an entire coach party of Japanese tourists. Some of the braver ones even came (almost) close enough to pat the dogs! I suspect that we make several appearances on the Japanese edition of F*cebook as a result!

You sure they weren't Koreans in which case the dogs appearing In Korean version of Cookbook...............

racedo
21st Jan 2014, 16:28
Someone's been at the whacky baccy again!!!!http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/tongue.gif

If one were to believe Google Maps, then it is possible. However, it doesn't take into account one of the largest serial car parks in the South East - the "Thames Crossing", otherwise known as the Dartford tunnel. Depending on the day of the week and time of day it is quite possible to spend a couple of hours in a queue on the approach. If you are unfortunate enough to be in the "rush" hour (so called because everone is stationary) then the M25 from Dartford to the M11 can be an hour on its own.

Leisure Traveller hence free to pick times scheduled to be not busy.

racedo
21st Jan 2014, 16:37
Some of the service station areas have fast food facilities and simple sit down meals which are often worse than those in the UK. Off the autoroutes, if you find the places where the truck drivers eat, you will outstanding value for wholesome simple food.


Les Routiers :)

Friend moved to rural France and his dad bought and had loaded a pallet of stuff into the van for use there. Try and he might he couldn't persuade his dad of the folly of it as no one would have a forklift in the hamlet. Evening arrival and empty van of everything but pallet.

Arrving there and first morning his dad suggested some food at a Les Routiers 2 km from hamlet. Question asked of a trucker with forklift attached to back, €20 to a trucker and pallet unloaded from van onto car park for splitting.

They split the pallet down and into the van but much as he was pleased he says he always remembers grin on his dad's face as they drove back......... admits he would never have thought of it.

Krystal n chips
21st Jan 2014, 17:32
:confused: " Dover-Duxford is 2 hrs, to York 3

Erm, with the very best will in the world, and even being a leisure traveller it's got to be about 280 / 290 miles for that trip.....so you may want to revise your estimate by say, another 1.5 hrs ?

As for the pallet, well that really was Euro20 wasted, irrespective of being sans forklift, because if you can break a pallet down in a car park and load the contents into the van.......why use a pallet in the first place ?

dead_pan
21st Jan 2014, 20:00
Whatever is on your hit list just be aware that driving in Britain, for the European traveller, is a primitive, exhausting and unrewarding experience.

Really?? When were you last here, the 1960s? Absolute guff, the roads here are fine. Busy in parts but no worse than many parts of Europe.

TBirdFrank
21st Jan 2014, 20:19
Use TripAdvisor or Trivago or one of the many cheap hotel bookers

Travel after your main day.

We were on a photo shoot in Bury until 21.10 last Friday night in Bury - Bed was a De Vere at £46 inc brekkers at Daventry 130 miles away booked the night before.

If you can get a Brit Rail ticket - especially a first class one - just do it!

That way Dover to York is easy in a day, so providing you ration off railway destinations you can have a great time and not worry about three or even four hundred miles a day before and after your fun!

Shaggy Sheep Driver
21st Jan 2014, 20:51
Really?? When were you last here, the 1960s? Absolute guff, the roads here are fine. Busy in parts but no worse than many parts of Europe.

UK roads were OK in 1960s - that's when I started driving and traffic levels were low.

Today it's hell if you need to cover any distance, even if the motorway isn't blocked by a lorry shedding its load or the thousand other causes of gridlock on a system operating beyond max capacity (so even closure of one lane brings chaos).

That's something really noticeable when you leave the ferry in UK after a continental (or further afield) bike tour, where long distance travelling has been largely stress-free for a few weeks.

Gertrude the Wombat
21st Jan 2014, 21:23
Dover-Duxford is 2 hrs
Maybe, if you're lucky. I'd allow more than that on the way back with a ferry to catch.
York 3
Yes, probably, if nothing goes wrong.

Eg it depends on how many roadworks there are on the A1 (there are never none), and you probably don't want to try it during the Friday afternoon/evening London lemming rush.

Windy Militant
21st Jan 2014, 22:40
Friday afternoon/evening London lemming rush.
As my travels often have me heading in a Southerly direction RTB on Fridays I often find myself pondering, if London is so wonderful why is there such a hell of a rush to get out of it? As I doodle gently past the miles and miles of standing traffic on the Northbound carriageway . :hmm:

cavortingcheetah
21st Jan 2014, 23:01
And, quite apart from all that nausea, Britain is very expensive for someone from the civilised side of the der Kanal.

Krystal n chips
22nd Jan 2014, 05:03
" UK roads were OK in 1960s - that's when I started driving and traffic levels were low."

That's interesting.....you clearly never travelled from Manchester to N.Wales then....the queue usually started at Delamere, and then extended beyond Queensferry.....and the A55, in the 70's was even worse, due to Conwy until the tunnels were finally built.

The roads were also death traps, ever have the "fun" of driving on the old A9 or A74 for example?.....just looking at what remains of these roads is enough to induce a heart attack.

Dan Gerous
22nd Jan 2014, 09:53
If you can only just get into Scotland, then a trip along the A708 from Selkirk to Moffat is a nice drive, and if you go on a weekday, you may catch a little low level action. If you can get further North, then Stirling-Doune-Callander-Lochearnhead-Tyndrum-Glen Coe-Fort William, is a really scenic drive.

Capetonian
22nd Jan 2014, 10:22
CC you do seem to have a somewhat negative view of the UK! I am aware of its many faults but it's not as bad as you make out.

charliegolf
22nd Jan 2014, 10:22
Hope you're not taking 'em out of school!:=

Hat, coat, deep cover witness protection etc.

have a great time.

CG

cavortingcheetah
22nd Jan 2014, 12:36
Those of us fortunate to be able to call ourselves Glaswegian communists must necessarily have a negative view of Britain and a lasting affection for military, all be they benevolent, dictatorships.

Shaggy Sheep Driver
22nd Jan 2014, 15:17
That's interesting.....you clearly never travelled from Manchester to N.Wales then....the queue usually started at Delamere, and then extended beyond Queensferry.....and the A55, in the 70's was even worse, due to Conwy until the tunnels were finally built

If you were daft enough to go that way at peak travel times, that's what you suffered. We always went across mid Wales to Porthmadoc, and avoided the toll queue there by routing via Tremadoc. Options, options. There were always options. Less so today as all the options are packed solid at busy times!

Cpt_Pugwash
22nd Jan 2014, 15:37
" That's interesting.....you clearly never travelled from Manchester to N.Wales then....the queue usually started at Delamere, and then extended beyond Queensferry.....and the A55, in the 70's was even worse, due to Conwy until the tunnels were finally built."

Krystal, it was even worse than that! Remember the Celyn bends just past Holywell, then the Rhuallt Hill down into the Clwyd valley and the queue through St. Asaph, and .......etc.

When I got my first car, to get to the surfing beaches on the Lleyn, I took a similar route to SSD. Over the Denbigh Moors to Pentrefoelas, short blip on the congested A5, then turn off on the back road through Ysbyty Ifan to Ffestiniog, then via Tremadoc ,Pwllheli and Abersoch to Hells Mouth .... Happy Days:ok:

Then the route was designated and signed as a Dragon Holiday Route !:mad:.

racedo
22nd Jan 2014, 16:13
http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/confused.gif " Dover-Duxford is 2 hrs, to York 3

Erm, with the very best will in the world, and even being a leisure traveller it's got to be about 280 / 290 miles for that trip.....so you may want to revise your estimate by say, another 1.5 hrs ?

As for the pallet, well that really was Euro20 wasted, irrespective of being sans forklift, because if you can break a pallet down in a car park and load the contents into the van.......why use a pallet in the first place ?

Dover-Duxford 2 hrs ....yup and then 3 to York yup...

Pallet........massively increased the space avail on route over and by taking it out by forklift avoided the getting it out and back in. Not sure what it contained but he felt best way to have done it was way it was done.

ShyTorque
22nd Jan 2014, 16:44
If you take back roads, A roads or B ones then you'll be more likely to average 50 to 65 Kms/hr and you might see something remotely attractive from time to time.
Petrol stops in some parts of the country will need to be carefully planned and may almost put you back on the motorway or into a major town to find a functioning petrol station. You should also make a note from the internet of agencies with workshops for the type of car you're taking in the area your planning to visit.

Sounds like you desperately need to buy a new car!

G-CPTN
22nd Jan 2014, 16:45
A work colleague from Germany flew into Edinburgh on the Saturday, hired a car and 'did' Scotland before arriving in furthest Cumbria (Workington) for our Monday morning meeting.

I never discovered how far he got (I don't think that he knew . . .).

ShyTorque
22nd Jan 2014, 17:16
On a similar theme, I met an American lady who told me she had done Europe in 36 hours by coach and didn't think much to it!:p

Krystal n chips
22nd Jan 2014, 17:24
" Krystal, it was even worse than that! Remember the Celyn bends just past Holywell, then the Rhuallt Hill down into the Clwyd valley and the queue through St. Asaph, and

In a word..... vividly ! until Rhuallt Hill was widened that is and the A55 became a full dual-carriage way. I have also queued from Llanfairfechan to Llandudno Junction....nice views of the sea and coast...plenty of time to enjoy them after all....

SSD, yes, it makes perfect sense to head for Colwyn Bay and / or Llandudno via......Portmadoc.

Shaggy Sheep Driver
22nd Jan 2014, 20:11
If I was going to Colwyn Bay or LLanduno I'd go by train! In fact, in the heyday of those resorts, that's what the holidaying hoards did!

But in a car why would you stop there when wonderful Lleyn is just along the coast?

Gertrude the Wombat
22nd Jan 2014, 20:19
If I was going to Colwyn Bay or LLanduno I'd go by train! In fact, in the heyday of those resorts, that's what the holidaying hoards did!
When we did Vienna - Prague - Slovakia - Budapest - Vienna in 1992 we did that by train (OK, and the river bit by hydrofoil), so as to give the proper spy movie feel to our first post-wall trip behind the Iron Curtain.

Shaggy Sheep Driver
22nd Jan 2014, 20:52
Last summer we did London - Paris - Stuttgart - Munich - Jenbach - Innsbruck - Verona - Venice - Lake Garda - Milan - Turin - Lyons - Paris - London on first class high speed trains over a couple of weeks, staying in top hotels care of Great Rail Journeys.

What a wonderful way to travel - fast, civilised, comfortable, unforgettable views out the (large) windows, and not a security queue in sight (OK, a tiny one at St Pancras) or any need for 2-hour prior check ins, or to be herded like stupid and inhuman cattle, despised by security jobsworths, photographed by x-ray machines, remove shoes and belts, and all the other discomforts and indignities of modern air travel.

High speed Rail - it's the new flying!

Krystal n chips
23rd Jan 2014, 06:00
"If I was going to Colwyn Bay or LLanduno I'd go by train! In fact, in the heyday of those resorts, that's what the holidaying hoards did!

But in a car why would you stop there when wonderful Lleyn is just along the

Allow me to explain, without massaging your pretentious ego " staying in top hotels" etc

My parents could not afford a car so we travelled by coach to Colwyn Bay / Llandudno, however towards the end of the 60's we did travel by train, ironically via Skelton Junc and Broadheath station....or B n Q as it now is, give or take a few hundred yards.

Thereafter, when I started driving when based at Valley, I got to know the roads of North and Mid Wales rather well.

Capetonian
25th Jan 2014, 09:50
Beautiful York: a city in pictures - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sponsored/travel/visit-york-uk/10575181/york-picture-gallery.html)

Shaggy Sheep Driver
25th Jan 2014, 09:57
Allow me to explain, without massaging your pretentious ego " staying in top hotels" etc

My parents could not afford a car

Ah, bless! I see where your chip comes from now. :E

reynoldsno1
27th Jan 2014, 01:09
Head for Dorset - trip to Brownsea Island in the middle of Poole Harbour to see one of the only places left full of red squirrels, Poole Speedway from end of March on a Wednesday night , Bovington Tank Museum, Monkey World, Jurassic Coast ...

cockney steve
27th Jan 2014, 17:13
I have never"got"the obsession with rushing around , ticking off"places"
Like krystal, we couldn't afford a car either....even if we could, father was blind and braille instruments were in short supply :E

As soon as I got mobile, I started exploring the country...A day spent 16 miles up the road in Colchester.....Castle museum with much Roman stuff(Colchester, AKA Camulodunum, was the roman capital....loads of other stuff,including horse-drawn carriages, Civil War stuff......
Across the road was an old church converted to a Natural history museum....yes, pushing it, you could do both in a day....but what about the half-timbered buildings with red rings around the bullet-holes......then you could go out to hire a rowing-boat and meander the river made famous in Constable's "the hay wain "....Willy Lot's cottage......
Edinburgh....museums, Grassmarket, Royal mile...Castle....Leith walk
yup, spend a couple of days there ,just scratching the surface
As for attempting to rush from one "box-tick" to another, via the motorways, forget it....there's so much variety in the byways, small villages and now-bypassed towns.
The best things I did in my youth , was mobile engineer (Medical equipment) and sales rep. (Pipes and smoker's sundries! ) Medical took me Plymouth to John o' Groats,Swansea to Great Yarmouth and all points between, including a flying visit (literally!) to South Uist and Stornoway, Isle of Lewis. Repping gave in -depth coverage of lancashire, cheshire , Lakes, Scotland and Eire.
So many places, sights and interesting people and I actually got paid to drive around our fantastically varied and scenic country. :)

Take your time, there have been several good suggestions. I'd agree Wales and the Cotswolds for scenery...lakes ditto, but stretching it, they need a week at least...Scotland, a whistle-stop tour in a fortnight!

Making your way to York and back with a few detours en-route, should give a good glimpse of "middle-England" inc a lightning dash through Wales. The West country and North are better left until you have more time.

G-CPTN
27th Jan 2014, 18:17
Stamford (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stamford,_Lincolnshire) is an interesting town (similar in some ways to Chester) and a staging post between Cambridge and York - with Lincoln (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln,_England) in between.

Ely (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ely,_Cambridgeshire) (for the magnificent cathedral) could be squeezed-in too.

Hussar 54
27th Jan 2014, 23:43
When we visit the UK, whatever the season we always find a day to enjoy meandering around in the Cotswolds, ending the evening in Bath - which bills itself as England's Most Elegant City but is also probably England's prettiest city....Small but perfectly formed, as the Brits say....

Stay the night for some of the best restaurants outside of London, and next day it's a short journey to any of Stonehenge, Salisbury, Wells, Lacock, Glastonbury or just back north for another day in the Cotswolds....

We've now been to Bath maybe 15 times and enjoyed every minute of every visit since our first time there a few years ago....

Promise it wouldn't disappoint....

nomorecatering
28th Jan 2014, 03:10
What ever estimate you have for driving time, double it. In any country, toilet stops, photo stops, food........they all add up.

One of the most rewarding driving days I have ever had was in England. Left Newcastle in the very early morning for London to catch the flight home later that night. Had a full day with myself as company, and a 2 litr manual Vauxhall sedan. I decided to head south on B roads rather than the M1.

I was in heaven, quiet roads in the early AM, picture postcard hedge rows, classic English scenery and the occasional tractor. Pure bliss.

Next trip I want to explore the Cotswalds and the the south sown to Lands end.

Krystal n chips
28th Jan 2014, 05:03
" Stay the night for some of the best restaurants outside of London, and next day it's a short journey to any of Stonehenge, Salisbury, Wells, Lacock, Glastonbury or just back north for another day in the Cotswolds....

We've now been to Bath maybe 15 times and enjoyed every minute of every visit since our first time there a few years ago....


if you haven't visited already, then Bristol and the Harbourside is well worth a visit for a day / evening out. As is the Avon gorge viewed from the top and the Clifton suspension bridge. True, the Avon isn't the most, ahem, scenic river and the rest of Bristol is a dump, but you don't actually have to visit these areas to enjoy the above.

And if you are going further afield, then the North Devon coast is certainly worth a visit for scenery and locations......of course, if you really want to add a bit of diversity to your journey there's always.........Porlock Hill.

garp
22nd Mar 2014, 19:17
Many thanks to all who have contributed. I realized that driving all the way up to the North is borderline crazy and as a result I booked a flight to Edinburgh where we will start our trip which will lead us all the way down to Manchester. We will be focusing on (parts of ) the West Highlands Way and the Lake District. All the accommodation is booked since they were becoming very scarce. We will stay in Edinburgh, Crianlarich, Ardgour and Ullswater. We'll be using the train to bring us back from the day walks along the WHW.

http://www.pprune.org/[IMG]http://i59.tinypic.com/2dj5isn.pnghttp://i59.tinypic.com/2dj5isn.png

garp
22nd Mar 2014, 19:29
We've now been to Bath maybe 15 times and enjoyed every minute of every visit since our first time there a few years ago....

Promise it wouldn't disappoint.... BTDT and I agree it is superb...

http://i62.tinypic.com/2ed1dt4.png

http://i59.tinypic.com/30tnn6e.png

G-CPTN
22nd Mar 2014, 19:54
I booked a flight to Edinburgh where we will start our trip which will lead us all the way down to Manchester. We will be focusing on (parts of ) the West Highlands Way and the Lake District.
A wise decision, and I hope that you have time to enjoy the scenery.

There's so much to see around that part of Scotland (the train to Mallaig is worthwhile) and there's Tobermory (by boat?) and Lismore and . . . oh so much!

One of my earliest memories is of Oban - with the pipe band playing whilst they marched to and fro along the quayside(?).
Make sure you get to hear the pipes played en masse.

There are (or were) boat trips from Oban, though I don't think they use steamers nowadays.
Summer timetables & fares (http://www.calmac.co.uk/timetables/calmac-summer-timetables.htm)

Hopefully your tour will whet your appetite for spending future holidays around there.

And there's even more further up (north) but it takes a long time to drive because the roads are (were) mainly single-tracked with passing places.

Krystal n chips
23rd Mar 2014, 07:27
garp,

Nice choice of locations and planning, albeit with one tiny fatal flaw.

The infamous, no prisoners taken or distinctions made.....Scottish midges !
They will introduce themselves in a manner you will remember for years to come....:D....so you have been warned.

On to more practical matters. Will you have a lap top with you at all ?....if so, this site will prove invaluable for factoring in potential delays due to road works / accidents and congestion.....

Road Traffic Reports, Travel Information and Traffic News (http://www.frixo.com/)

Ullswater. This depends entirely on your intended arrival time at Manchester. When you leave the town, you have two choices, either take the A roads and enjoy the meandering scenery and.... traffic.....you won't be going anywhere in a hurry, or, daft as it may seem to some no doubt, simply return to the M6 at Penrith where you will have exited on your journey South, and then continue to Manchester which will be considerably quicker.

To be fair, the M6 is very scenic heading South and, crossing Shap, even on bad wx day is enjoyable, If you do take this option, it's essential you stop at Tebay Services, undoubtedly the best on the Motorway network, or the next one down, Killington Lakes for scenery. If it's a good day. you may well see what's left of the Air Force heading towards you at low level as a bonus.

Traffic starts to build again once you get to Lancaster North and thereafter just keeps increasing. Be aware of the chaos around Preston therefore, if all goes well, you will get through with minimal delay. However, the potential for delays in this area is very high due to the merging of local traffic and Motorways.

Espada III
23rd Mar 2014, 08:08
Pity I will be away from Manchester when you are here, but you should take your boys to one or more of the following museums/attractions: -

National Football Museum
Manchester United (Old Trafford)- and I'm a blue!
Imperial War Museum
The Lowry Arts Centre -for the Lowry's
Manchester Museum of Science and Industry

Plus there will be lots of other places which tell the story of the background to the region's growth.

Democritus
23rd Mar 2014, 11:38
garp,

Nice choice of locations and planning, albeit with one tiny fatal flaw.

The infamous, no prisoners taken or distinctions made.....Scottish midges !
They will introduce themselves in a manner you will remember for years to come....:D....so you have been warned.

Don't worry garp - the midge season usually really only runs from June until September. The earliest I have seen them in any numbers is mid May. However they are horrible wee beasties if you do come across them! http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/scotland-faces-bumper-year-for-bloodsucking-midges-after-exceptionally-wet-winter-9199282.html

You'll have wonderful time with the countryside views in these parts - good to see you have avoided the A83 at the Rest and Be Thankful - repetitive landslips have often closed the road recently and it's a 60 mile detour if they can't send you with a convoy system down the single track Old Military Road - see http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-26497790

On your route on the A828 from Ballachulish to Oban along the shores of Loch Linnhe there is a good hotel near Kentallen - the Holly Tree. It's the old railway station converted to a hotel. On a good day there are superb early morning views on a shoreside walk before breakfast!

Windy Militant
23rd Mar 2014, 11:50
The infamous, no prisoners taken or distinctions made.....Scottish midges !

I quite frequently stop over in Moffat in the Scottish borders, one morning at breakfast the landlady was having a quiet chat with a worried looking lady at the next table when suddenly she burst out laughing and couldn't speak for a few minutes. Later on she explained to me that the concerned woman was worried about being attacked by MIDGETS. She'd been warned about the midgies by a work colleague who was originally from Scotland and I guess misunderstood her friends accent. It became something of a battle cry whenever I left the digs the landlady would warn me "to watch out for the midgets!" :ouch:

garp
23rd Mar 2014, 12:15
Hopefully your tour will whet your appetite for spending future holidays around there.
That's exactly what I'm aiming for, not just for me but more importantly for them.

Ullswater. This depends entirely on your intended arrival time at Manchester. When you leave the town, you have two choices, either take the A roads and enjoy the meandering scenery and.... traffic.....you won't be going anywhere in a hurry, or, daft as it may seem to some no doubt, simply return to the M6 at Penrith where you will have exited on your journey South, and then continue to Manchester which will be considerably quicker.

To be fair, the M6 is very scenic heading South and, crossing Shap, even on bad wx day is enjoyable, If you do take this option, it's essential you stop at Tebay Services, undoubtedly the best on the Motorway network, or the next one down, Killington Lakes for scenery. If it's a good day. you may well see what's left of the Air Force heading towards you at low level as a bonus.

Traffic starts to build again once you get to Lancaster North and thereafter just keeps increasing. Be aware of the chaos around Preston therefore, if all goes well, you will get through with minimal delay. However, the potential for delays in this area is very high due to the merging of local traffic and Motorways. Very nice information. Thank you

National Football Museum
Manchester United (Old Trafford)- and I'm a blue!
Imperial War Museum
The Lowry Arts Centre -for the Lowry's
Manchester Museum of Science and IndustryOne of the kids is big time into football. Tx for the tip.

On your route on the A828 from Ballachulish to Oban along the shores of Loch Linnhe there is a good hotel near Kentallen - the Holly Tree. It's the old railway station converted to a hotel. On a good day there are superb early morning views on a shoreside walk before breakfast! Noted. Our overnight stays are already booked since it was getting very tight but this looks like a fine stop along the way. Tx

I quite frequently stop over in Moffat in the Scottish borders, one morning at breakfast the landlady was having a quiet chat with a worried looking lady at the next table when suddenly she burst out laughing and couldn't speak for a few minutes. Later on she explained to me that the concerned woman was worried about being attacked by MIDGETS. She'd been warned about the midgies by a work colleague who was originally from Scotland and I guess misunderstood her friends accent. It became something of a battle cry whenever I left the digs the landlady would warn me "to watch out for the midgets!" I have to admit that I also was not exactly sure about the name until a few years ago. April should be ok I hope...:)

G-CPTN
23rd Mar 2014, 15:27
I see from your map that your route is planned to leave Glasgow for England via M74/A7M - a fine road south of Abington with great views of the hills as it climbs over Beattock - but beware that speed camera vans lurk on the over-bridges and, using telescopic lenses on the camera they can see you long before you see them! The white vans are marked, but you will be too close before you see the markings and they will have already scoped you.
The predominance of these camera vans seems to be around Moffat, Lockerbie and Gretna - there is a long downhill section which encourages you to 'let the car speed build' and they can see you as you drive down the hill - so it is best to stick to the limit of 70mph and let them catch other drivers.

Don't be tempted to visit Gretna - the Old Smithy is underwhelming and is highly commercialised - you are likely to be crowded by coach-loads of tourists. Visitors are directed to the out-of-town shopping mall which owes nothing to the Smithy.

If you are in need of a rest or something to eat, leave A74M at Junction 15 and drive 5 minutes into Moffat (a typical borders town).
The A701 north of Moffat is very picturesque as it follows the River Tweed (I sometimes drive north from Moffat to Biggar where my daughter lives) but it would involve a lengthy detour for you.

Another recommendation would be to leave A74M at Junction 17 and drive down B7076 to the south of Lockerbie where the PanAm Flight103 fell (http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/sites/default/files/imagecache/article_main_image/2013/12/22970073.jpg) and devastated Sherwood Crescent (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Sherwood+Crescent,+Lockerbie&hl=en&ll=55.117434,-3.356817&spn=0.005436,0.017939&sll=55.117361,-3.370743&sspn=0.010873,0.035877&oq=sherwood+crescent&t=h&hnear=Sherwood+Crescent,+Lockerbie,+Dumfries+and+Galloway,+U nited+Kingdom&z=16) (just off B7076 next to the motorway - you can actually see it from A74M).
Take time to reflect on the devastation that occurred that night of December 21st 1988 when 11 residents were killed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Am_Flight_103#Lockerbie_residents) and several families were wiped-out (in addition to the 259 souls that perished (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Am_Flight_103#Passengers_and_crew) on the aircraft).
Some families lost further members afterwards through trauma:- Sherwood Crescent (http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/27/lockerbie.ameliahill).

There is a memorial window at the Town Hall on the High Street (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=lockerbie+town+hall&ll=55.121386,-3.355186&spn=0.005436,0.017939&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&hnear=Lockerbie+Town+Hall,+High+St,+Lockerbie+DG11+2ES,+Unit ed+Kingdom&gl=uk&t=h&z=16) and a memorial garden on the A709 (http://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/lockerbie/gardenofremembrance/) - just a mile to the west of A74M at Dryfesdale Cemetery (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=lockerbie+memorial+garden&ll=55.117361,-3.370743&spn=0.010873,0.035877&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&t=h&z=15).

Moving south on B7076 (or leaving A74M at Junction 19) you could visit Thomas Carlyle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Carlyle)'s birthplace at Ecclefechan (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=ecclefechan&hl=en&ll=55.06038,-3.263111&spn=0.010888,0.035877&sll=52.8382,-2.327815&sspn=5.88034,18.369141&t=h&hnear=Ecclefechan,+Dumfries+and+Galloway,+United+Kingdom&z=15) before continuing on B7076 and rejoining A74M at Junction 20.

Fuel is not cheap on A74M (and most services are not actually on the motorway - involving time-consuming detours only to find the prices are outrageous), however the services at Todhills (on M6 just after Junction 45 - the first Junction in England southbound - A74M changes to M6 after Junction 22 where it crosses the border into England) sometimes have low prices - you can drive through and check before you commit as they are adjacent to the highway.

garp
16th Apr 2014, 19:43
Thanks again for all the contributions, we had a fantastic trip. Edinburgh was very enjoyable and relaxed, really like it. The Highlands were incredible, we did a lot of hiking sometimes up to 7 hours per day and we really soaked-up the atmosphere. I restricted ourselves to a few selected places rather than rush everything by car. Glencoe was simply amazing.
The biggest surprise was the area around Ullswater, incredible vista's from the top of the hills. This place can rival the Italian Lakes without any doubt. We topped everything up with a visit to Lockerbie (tx for the tip G-CPTN, the old lady inside the small museum was wonderful) and MOSI in Manchester. Will most certainly return.

angels
16th Apr 2014, 19:50
garp - really glad you had a good time. :ok:

G-CPTN
16th Apr 2014, 20:31
a visit to Lockerbie (tx for the tip G-CPTN, the old lady inside the small museum was wonderful)
:ok: . . . . .

Shaggy Sheep Driver
16th Apr 2014, 21:26
Was the steam train running at MoSI when you visited? I'm doing a couple of turns as loco crew this week.

hammer2
17th Apr 2014, 02:04
This thread made my day Thanks everyone!

Krystal n chips
17th Apr 2014, 05:12
" The Highlands were incredible, we did a lot of hiking sometimes up to 7 hours per day and we really soaked-up the atmosphere

This is not uncommon in the Highlands.....although if you really want to soak up the atmosphere, try Capel Curig....:D

TBirdFrank
17th Apr 2014, 11:11
I don't know if you were visiting MOSI last Saturday - but one's daughter was firing Agecroft - Watch out SSD - she'll have your real name for me pdq!

MFC_Fly
17th Apr 2014, 11:42
Watch out SSD - she'll have your real name for me pdq!
Careful, you may get a few of the members very upset and sending threatening PM's with comments like that.

Oh, hang on, nothing for you to worry about, they only ever seem to post on one thread here, or did until that thread was closed by the mods, and haven't been seen or heard of since. They are probably too busy posting their CyberNat drivel on other fora now. :E