TCAA pilot funding program- Tanzania

[LY-MML]

Hello,
Can anyone tell me about TCAA pilot funding program? i heard some news from a news papers that about 5 students have been selected this year for pilot training in SA, Also i would like to know how this selection takes place and for how long the training will take as well as the next selection or planning of another funding
THANKS

[daladaladriver]

Ah yes, you must be refering to the tanzania pilot training fund that the TZ air operators were forced to pay into. Those selected needed to have a degree and being related to a Tanzanian VIP is highly advantageous. Students have been sent to some 43 Air School in SA for 2 years of training. Sounds like some middle-man is cashing-in on this arrangement... from what I heard the training costs at 43 for these five students are way over in-flated... kind of like when TZ bought their Gulfstream... and radar system

[LY-MML]

I read the news and i was so amazing that i left home for training without knowing anything about this and it's clear the selection was not fair, thank you for your information Dalaladriver

[Soap Box Cowboy]

It's been a few decades since selection was "fair" here. As for the radar, what was not published is that the civilian radar used in HTDA is actually the secondary radar, the primary part was for a top of the line Mil spec radar based at another part of the city and only occasionally operational. It's also fully mobile which I'm sure adds to the cost.

[launchpad74]

Daladaladriver is correct in saying that only the well connected of the family of VIP's and such gain access to this fund. Correct me if I am wrong anybody, but the funds are given as "loans" and repayable to the TCAA with interest.
Interesting to note how they get operators to pay into the fund, based on a percentage of the seats and revenue (weird formula), which in the end results in Precision air contributing the least, with the largest fleet and number of seats.

[LY-MML]

Really, i thought that it was the fund from the government

[mkenya]

Ha ha ha, Hangover from the socialist days

[daladaladriver]

Haha... fund from the government..? Ya right. As launchpad said, the government even makes interest on the loans... but i wouldn't be too surprised if the "loans" were forgiven being that they likely go to the VIPs' kids. It would have made more sense to require candidates for the loan to already have a PPL... those are the kids with the true passion to fly. Or better yet, allow each operator to contribute to their own fund and when it has a certain anount $$ in it... sponsor their own exceptional ground staff worker, who is perhaps a dispatcher and has been with the company for a while. And regarding Precision, they oughta be the biggest contributor but they really just giving peanuts compared to operator size. They should be sponsoring local pilots out of the TZ pilot's association (the Kibasa Klub) for their ATR ratings.... thats all those chaps wanna fly anyway... and it's easier to train a freshie into an ATR over a 206... no doubt about it.

[Hawkeye0001]

The whole formula is highly unfair towards small enterprises and really cripples the industry. When we broke it down a while ago we arrived (if I recall the figures correctly now) at $35 / seat / yr that Precision Air is charged (TZ's biggest carrier) while the smallest of companies with one small charter aircraft (4 seat, e.g. 182-equivalent) is charged a whopping $3333 / seat / year. Try to offset that with 200 revenue hours a year!
Yes, there will be candidates trained up to CPL level, but they might not be able to find a job in their home country anymore by the time they graduate because its aviation industry is gonna be non-existant in next three years time if TCAA carries on with their extortionist practices. 20 years asleep on the job and now the operators have to pay for those past mistakes :yuk:
All the while TCAA will just keep minting money on the operator's expenses by making them continuously pay 10-30,000 USD every year while the money that went into the loans will be paid back with an interest on it (or is that perhaps going to be pocketed by someone?) And the best part is that not a shilling of it stays in the Tanzanian aviation industry but gets pumped into one of two South African flight schools through an ominous middleman.

Even their former DG shakes his head over this craziness, saying they will bring this industry to a grinding halt if they carry on with their overinflated fees, levys, taxes and lastly this training fund which he himself calls "nothing but a giant scam". Go figure

[daladaladriver]

So true Hawkeye. TCAA is basically expanding into the banking sector by extorting large sums of money from their vary own customers. Tell me, what good is it adding more members to the productive Kibasa Klub? (NOTE: Kibasa is is a local airport bar where the association members spend their days sitting and waiting for a job). If anything, this fund should go towards sponsoring some of these boys' type ratings for FastJet/Precision... but I don't agree with free rides either. I don't think those boys have even put together a CV since finishing flightschool and joining the Klub. The "If you get your license... a job will come" mentality cracks me UP

[launchpad74]

Yep, the ever incompetent TCAA are killing aviation here, and making the operators pay up. Not a bad idea to divert those funds to individuals within the companies who show aptitude and a good attitude. The new little tanzanian pilot all expect the top jobs to come to them. Hmmm, also a good idea for the candidates to do their PPL first, be interviewed and assed. In south africa the cadet schemes have "previously disadvantaged" crew. here it is "parlimentary advantaged" little brats. Main problem with some, not all, Tanzanian pilots is that they think they are gods once they have a CPL. its a culture thing, to be seen as being better than others. Screw safety ( as we have seen with so many locals crashing planes and keeping their licences). Who knows what will happen here. It aint getting better. . . :ugh:

[LY-MML]

Ha ha ha ha h aha aha you guys you make me happy about Kibasa klub, it means there are people there at home have no JOBS and they have license? why do they fair to get jobs? i heard some good stories from PPL students at Mosswood pilot academy they say that the situation is more than excellent that operators looks for pilots now?

[Hawkeye0001]

it means there are people there at home have no JOBS and they have license?
Half a license and an attitude. Some of them with PPLs only, some with CPLs but no IR, it all seems like half arsed and not thought through attempts in becoming pilots. That's the problem. They could have jobs if they would pay their dues like everyone else did; flying for :mad: salaries in countries that do offer this kind of opportunities for newly minted pilots, e.g. Botswana or Namibia, and start in a little 206 or 210, fly as survey pilot, etc. Just like everyone else did who flies in Tanzania these days.
But the arrogance I have encountered in this 'club' is absolutely staggering. As Launchpad said: with a CPL in hand they think they are gods greatest gift to aviation and demand PIC (!) on a turbine (!!) with 260 hours and no instrument rating (!). Helloohooo, wake-up call! It's just not how things work in this industry. And when I then bump into someone who complains about getting a break in the industry by an operator who did start a cadet training scheme but does not schedule around his busy life, then please, go look for another career. Attitudes like that really make my blood boil.

i heard some good stories from PPL students at Mosswood pilot academy they say that the situation is more than excellent that operators looks for pilots now?
That seems like flight school sales pitch talk. The operators look no more than they usually do, it is still a seasonal business in TZ. And - subtle difference - they don't look for pilots but for 'experienced' pilots - insurance minimums rule this world.

It is a shame how TCAA neglected their own pilots over two decades but kneejerk reactions like this one will not solve the problem and only create more trouble for the the industry and for the few young guys that do have licenses up to a certain qualification level but now even get overtaken by their own fellow countryman that get sponsored.

Look at Kenya's industry (they surely have their share of trouble as well): an almost completely self-sustaining aviation industry with local pilots flying everything from small to widebody. They don't need foreigners to fill the gaps. In fact: there is a whole bunch of Kenyan pilots in Tanzania to fill the gaps that TCAA's ideological declaration of bankruptcy left over time :rolleyes:

[LY-MML]

Special thanks to you for the good understanding of the industry at home, i would like to ask you, what the operators wants so as a pilot can get a JOB?

[Hawkeye0001]

Someone that is more involved with recruiting and ops can probably tell you more, but for expats minimum requirements for Immigration is 1000hrs TT. Most companies require something along the lines of that figure for PIC, 1500hrs for Caravan.
One company recently introduced a cadet scheme for Tanzanians with ( if I recall that correctly now) something like 250-300hrs TT and a valid CPL/IR. That seems to work out well for everyone and is a win-win for everyone.

The rest is down to insurance requirements like anywhere else.

[LY-MML]

great buddy:ok: now i collect more information than i thought, THANKS

[Crashmonster]

Some operators with C206 will need 500 hours for command, so will often start a new pilot at 250 hours if they are Tanzanian citizen, for command on the C208 the minimum is 1000 or 1500 hours depending on the operators insurance.

A few operators have cadet or copilot programs, the main ones are TFC (cadets, will work in the office when not flying) Northern Air (Copilots, 2 crew operation, also work in office when not flying) Regional air (twin otter copilot) and Air Excel (Let 410 copilot)

The main requirements for all will be a valid CPL and IR, without an IR no one is going to get work. Operators are businesses so paying for an IR is not part of their plan, get it first.

Many of the current group seem to be unwilling to start out on the C206, they are only willing to fly Caravan and bigger so they will not get work until they get hours! finally for getting a job in TZ, go talk to operators and please be smartly dressed when you do, shorts and a t-shirt wont get you a job!

[Tanganyika Flying Co]

We launched our Cadet Scheme, last year and I am happy to report that our first two Cadets are now fully fledged First Officers. One is not far away from his Command Training.

We will be advertising, early in January for our 2014 Cadet intake programme. We anticipate taking one Cadet in January and one in June. This scheme is opearated with the full knowledge of the PATP, their executive Secretary sst in on all our interviews for our last intake and will be invited to do so again, next year.

[daladaladriver]

The training fund has doubled from last year... so the small operators are expected to pay even more even though profits haven't exactly soared. In what world should an airline with 2 caravans have to pay $20k like Coastal with its 13 caravans?? And what Precision is paying into the fund is peanuts for their size of company. And guess what... if you can't afford to pay it... your AOC will not be renewed... the word 'extortion' comes to mind.

[Gladness Frank]

Hello,
would anyone please tell me what a high school student would do to gain financial support for aviation and piloting studies?:rolleyes:

[bluesideoops]

This is typical of the corruption endemic in East Africa and not surprising in the least that TCAA has impunity - where else in the world would a regulator be allowed to setup a training fund and blackmail operators into paying into it. Corruption at its worst, especially when they hold the AOC to ransom. Furthermore, imagine the impact on safety from putting comercial pressures onto the operators to pay up. And yes the 'look at me I'm the big Capt.' cultural mentality of the local juniors in Tz is a total joke - anybody can put stripes on their shoulder, its when you get in an aircraft where we find out if you have any talent (which they invariably don't). The biggest problem and across Africa is this mentality that you have to have every pilot from your own country and so long as you can tick that box, nothing else matters. This results in an undermining of the knowledge and skills base that eventually jeaopardises safety. For this reason, I don't fly Air Botswana any more - they took a kid that was rejected by Delta Air who couldn't tie his shoe-lace let alone fly and put him in the right-seat of an ATR just because he was local and held a local licence. Flying should be based around a few key things and race/nationality shouldn't be one of them. Skill, knowledge, attitude, ability, safety-focus etc should be what a pilot is measured by, nothing more, nothing less. Look around the world and you'll see pilots of all colours and races in Emirates, Qatar, Cathay etc.....and they all got their by being competent and meeting the standards. Seems like Africa and particularly corrupt states like Tz will never learn this lesson.

[4runner]

It's not just Africa. But Africa as a continent is the worst when it comes to graft and cronyism. I've worked for an African airline and we were "encouraged" to train some folks to proficiency. 200 hours and still no sign off, thankfully management saw the light and took a certain cadet and future cadets out of the program.

[bluesideoops]

I agree that generic corruption etc. ain't just in Africa but this is the first time I have ever heard of an 'independent' regulator imposing this training cost on operators, as a regulator, the job is to regulate, nothing more - I wonder if ICAO know about this?

[pfvspnf]

Aren't there a few who just got hired on the Q400 going to flight safety for training ?

[carrot123]

bluesideoops, this doesn’t sound very good... Do you think it is possible for someone with 1000hrs to find a job in TZ if that person isn’t a citizen?

[Trim Stab]

I agree that generic corruption etc. ain't just in Africa but this is the first time I have ever heard of an 'independent' regulator imposing this training cost on operators, as a regulator, the job is to regulate, nothing more - I wonder if ICAO know about this?

ICAO only enforce regulations in responsible countries that they know will oblige due to their decent ethical stance like US/EU/ANZAC.

African countries will only oblige if their greasy palms are greased - which ICAO will not do....