BALLOON ACCIDENT IN NZ

[gulfairs]

The pilot of the hot air balloon that was involved in a fatal accident at carterton nz where all pax and the pilot were killed.
The pilot was out of his tree on electric puha.
Having smoked a couple of joints just prior to lift off.

[27/09]

I think you're being a tad dramatic to say The pilot was out of his tree on electric puha.

There's no doubt about it he was probably impaired to some degree but if he was out of his tree as you say I think that might have been noticeable to at least some of the PAX and someone would have raised concerns prior to the flight.

[Pith Helmet]

Don't seem to have a good run of luck with balloons in NZ do they?

[onetrack]

Dope smokers in charge of machines where judgement is critical have been regularly found to be seriously lacking in ability to judge time accurately - and suffer from an inability to respond quickly to dangerous events, where a quick response is needed to avoid disaster.

Marijuana ingestion slows response and reflex times and compresses time for the user. The greatest single public transportation disaster that was sheeted directly home to marijuana use, was the 1987 Maryland Amtrak/Conrail smash.

Two dope-smoking engineers were detailed on Jan 4 1987, to move a consist of three Conrail locomotives from Bayview Yard just east of Baltimore bound for Enola Yard near Harrisburg, PA.
These engineers knew the route well and ignored several red signals, merely trusting on their view of elapsed time to reach a mainline junction at Gunpow Interlocking, just before the Gunpowder River bridge.
However, the engineers use of marijuana compressed the time they thought had elapsed, and they arrived at Gunpow Interlocking well ahead of time.

The engineers braked hard at Gunpow Interlocking junction when they realised they didn't have a green to enter the mainline - but they failed to stop the three locomotives in time and ended up stopped on the mainline, directly in the path of passenger train Amtrak #94, which was doing 125mph.
The engineer in control of Amtrak #94 braked hard in a desperate attempt to avoid a collision and reduced #94's speed to 108mph before #94 collided with the three Conrail locos at that speed.

The collision resulted in a colossal amount of destruction and the deaths of 16 people. The Amtrak engineer was one of those killed, but both Conrail engineers survived.
By sheer good fortune, the cars behind the Amtrak locos were nearly empty, as these car seats were booked by passengers who were to get on further North. It has been estimated the death toll would have been well over 100, otherwise.

One Conrail engineer was jailed for 5 yrs, and one was given immunity from prosecution, on the basis he testified against the other engineer.
This smash was the driver for the introduction of drug and alcohol testing for many industries involved in public transportation.

It seems that NZ is lagging in world standards when it comes to introducing alcohol and drug testing, and strict regulations against drug and alcohol use, for anyone piloting balloons, that are transporting paying members of the public.

Pilot who smoked cannabis before flight caused New Zealand balloon crash that killed 11, investigators say - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-31/pilot-error-cause-of-new-zealand-balloon-crash-that-killed-11/5060266)

Carterton balloon tragedy caused by errors of judgment - National - NZ Herald News (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11149278)

[Sop_Monkey]

Very sad indeed.

Maybe he was so scared of the thing, he felt the need to be "stoked up" before boarding.

[gulfairs]

It gets worse!
He was one of only a few commercial balloon pilots in nz,
apart from being "high" he did not hold a valid medical, so his cpl balloon was invalid.
I can remember clearly the same chap saying to me ,that we were only amatures because in those days there was no pilots licence needed to fly a balloon with an airborne heater.
I only have 150 hours in hot air balloons, but never had an incident nor accident

[Pappa Smurf]

Looks like he wanted to fly a bit higher.

They reckon his "long term use" or "recent use" was the cause ,but the story reads as if he choofed up just before flying.
In the mining sector people have changed from the funny weed to heavier gear as the weed stays in your system for to long.
Actually a person who was puffing away the night before would be more with it than someone who had a hangover from the booze.

But the poor guy made a wrong decision for what ever reason.

And no,im not a drug user,but have worked with them.As they used to say "its my days off and I can do what I want"

[onetrack]

Pappa Smurf - It may be their days off, and it is their desire to do what they want - but as a paying passenger, or as a sharer of the road, air, sea, or the workplace with them - I want to be re-assured that their fine judgement and reaction time, in whatever piece of large machinery they're in control of a little later, isn't affected by something they've ingested during their own time.

The statement reflects the purely self-centred "DILLIGAF" attitude of most drug users. There should be no place for these people in the aforementioned positions.

[Lookleft]

But the poor guy made a wrong decision for what ever reason


Not to mention the other 10 people he killed for his "wrong decision"! :ugh:

[Pappa Smurf]

Onetrack.
Im not supporting it,but was just refering to the fact that someone who was legless at a party the day before and goes to work next day with a zero blood alcohol reading is probably more of a chance to stuff up than someone who had a silly weed the day before.
He may have been out of his tree or maybe not.The report should have the level of THC which could shed further light.
If I had half a beer and got killed in a crash how would my family feel if the report said alcohol was involved in the crash.

[onetrack]

Pappa Smurf - It's well-known in medical circles that weed use slows down response and reaction times, long after it has been smoked.
Amongst chronic weed users, the ability to react swiftly to emergency situations is 100% impaired. They're permanently "chilled out".
THC stays in the bodys' fat cells and brain for up to 30 days, and continues to have an effect on multiple systems within the body.

Small amounts of alcohol also sharply and noticeably affect response and reaction times - even when alcohol consumers are convinced they "feel great".
I can recall a "swerve around the cones at speed" driving test, that was done with alcohol free drivers and those that had a BAC of around .04-.05%.
These imbibers were convinced they felt 100% and had no skills impairment whatsoever. They were stunned to find they had clipped cones on the test, while they were convinced they hadn't.

The major difference between alcohol and weed is that alcohol is cleared from the body at a faster rate than weed and there are no measureable alcohol levels after 12 hrs.

Whether there is still an effect on response and reaction times when one is suffering from an alcohol hangover, I couldn't say, because I've never seen any tests done on that specific basis.

I do know I have seen fatal road accidents where young men were killed on the road in the morning after a night of heavy drinking. In those cases, I'm fairly sure that sleep deprivation had more to do with the fatals than the BAC.

Either way, you're not doing yourself any favours by punishing your body and then promptly hopping into a car, plane, balloon, loco - or whatever you choice of a complex machine is - within 12 hrs, and expect to be able to perform high-intensity tasks, with the same reaction and response times as when you're completely unaffected by any drug.
Both weed and alcohol are drugs, they both have severe effects on the human system, even in small quantities. This has been medically recognised for decades.
My personal choice is to avoid consuming anything that might even slightly affect my performance skills the following day, even after a good sleep.

How Long Does Alcohol Stay in the Body? (http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/drivingissues/1127227453.html#.UnRKknBmgbQ)

How Long Does Marijuana Stay in Your System? (http://www.altamirarecovery.com/marijuana-addiction/how-long-does-marijuana-stay-in-your-system/)

[Weheka]

"Don't seem to have a good run of luck with balloons in NZ do they?"

On 13 August 1989, two hot air balloons collided near Alice Springs, Northern Territory, Australia, causing one to crash to the ground, killing thirteen people.

Don't seem to have a good run of luck with balloons in Australia either!

[waren9]

It seems that NZ is lagging in world standards when it comes to introducing alcohol and drug testing, and strict regulations against drug and alcohol use, for anyone piloting balloons, that are transporting paying members of the public.

what makes you think that?

[spinex]

Shoulda seen the carnage in France around, 1914 - 18, now that was a bad run with balloons. :ugh:

[YPJT]

Weheka, yes mate I'm sure anyone from this side of the pond are also aware of that tragedy as well and therefore treated the offending post by PH above with the contempt it deserved.

Unfortunately it is events like these that result in overreaction by regulators. I may be mistaken but the Hamilton Island crash some years back was probably the main catalyst for the introduction of Part 99 of our regs.

[Lookleft]

I may be mistaken but the Hamilton Island crash some years back was probably the main catalyst for the introduction of Part 99 of our regs.

You are a 100% correct.