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View Full Version : Obesity - a good thing?


Thomas coupling
29th Oct 2013, 11:27
Just read on the medical forum about an airline pilot who had a MI. He died. He weighed 300lbs.

Which got me thinking. Much ado is made about being Obese in the UK (no doubt the world). About the costs to the NHS etc. But what is not often advertised is that obese people statistically die between 10 and 17 yrs earlier than everyone else who is 'normal' [<30 BMI?].
Surely, therefore this is very good news for the NHS because they don't have to fork out for fatties when they try to get old - no?
Has there been a study on the financial delta between supporting obese persons when they are alive and kicking (not much kicking!!) and when they snuff it prematurely?
Two sugars please.....................:E

RequestPidgeons
29th Oct 2013, 11:33
In small quantities....

:ok:

MagnusP
29th Oct 2013, 11:46
The NHS should promote base jumping as a hobby for fat, alcoholic, 40-a-day smokers. Save a fortune, it would.

thegypsy
29th Oct 2013, 11:51
Would be interesting to know whether the cost of these fatties and smokers whilst alive costs more or less than having to pay them far fewer years of pensions and housing benefit etc etc??

Buster Hyman
29th Oct 2013, 11:52
Protection workers closed books on boy who died of obesity, court told (http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/protection-workers-closed-books-on-boy-who-died-of-obesity-court-told-20130930-2uoqt.html)

Lord Spandex Masher
29th Oct 2013, 11:52
But Magnus, what aboot all the tax from fags you'd lose?

Circa 10 billion quid income from smokers. Circa 1.7 billion cost of smokers to NHS.

thegypsy
29th Oct 2013, 11:55
L S M

Most of the low life smokers don't use UK tax paid ciggies or baccy:(

Worrals in the wilds
29th Oct 2013, 11:57
The NHS should promote base jumping as a hobby for fat, alcoholic, 40-a-day smokers. Save a fortune, it would.
Funnily enough BASE jumpers tend to be skinny little vegans. :hmm:

MagnusP
29th Oct 2013, 11:58
low life smokers don't use UK tax paid ciggies or baccy

Correct, and they DO use UK tax-funded services to deal with the additional problems caused by all the crap that passes for the baccy you buy from a bloke down the pub. :*

Lord Spandex Masher
29th Oct 2013, 12:00
Still 10 billion quid of income that'll be lost.

cockney steve
29th Oct 2013, 12:06
^^^^^^ That's because the lazy , thick, feckwits in Whitehall decide to increase the taxes to a greater level than the "point of diminishing returns".

At a certain tipping-point, even the most upright citizen realises that they would be doing a disservice to "bank of self and family" if they continued to ignore readily- available "alternative" sources of supplies of high tax and Duty consumables.

A good tax regime maximises returns for the Authority,- that means balancing revenue-rates against the viability of circumvention.

We have a p155-poortax-regime.

Dan_Brown
29th Oct 2013, 12:55
Yes, governments just love tobacco. Kills off a lot of the population and massive revenue is generated in the form of taxes.

In a lot of countries now, if you are diagnosed with lung cancer for e.g., will not operate until the patient has given up smoking for a "reasonable" period of time. Too late then of course. However as the blood of a smoker is poisoned, with tar, arsenic to name just 2, any part of the body is at risk.

How does one calculate their BMI?

500N
29th Oct 2013, 13:01
"The NHS should promote base jumping as a hobby for fat, alcoholic, 40-a-day smokers. Save a fortune, it would."

Then you will end up with a whole load of ankle, knee and god knows what else problems !!!


"Two sugars please.....................http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif"
That will make you obese.

Thomas coupling
29th Oct 2013, 13:48
500N - I never knew that about sugar - :ugh: :rolleyes:

In fact I think the government are responsible for all of this. They have a secret department of "HARM" (Health and remedial Meddling) which propagates the myth that eating, smoking, slimming and drinking alcohol....is good for people in general. Because this department certainly hasn't reported back to the government to insist that any of these should be banned?

All of the above are a massive tax generator for the government. All of the above kill thousands and thousands of unsuspecting people as they imbibe, oblivious to the simple fact that the real reason for them legally participating is stealth tax on a massive scale. Another huge spin off is reduction in the rate of demographics which would normally demand NHS and associated support mechanisms when normal people grow old, get ill and eventually fall over and die. A win win all the way for the government of the day. Bravo.

Perhaps we should export the idea.....................oh.....................it seems we have.....globally.

500N
29th Oct 2013, 13:52
Thomas

It was more a ref to me and the effect two sugars had on me and my waistline :rolleyes:

Lightning Mate
29th Oct 2013, 15:21
Who cares ?

I'm 66 with a BMI of 23.

I eat full fry brekkies and drink lossa scotch.

Very partial to pasta as well.

fujii
29th Oct 2013, 18:13
Dan, BMI = weight in KG divided by your height in metres squared. E.g. My height is 1.8 metres. That squared is 3.24. Weight is 76 kg.

76 divided by 3.24 equals BMI equals BMI 23.45.

Loose rivets
29th Oct 2013, 18:33
Mmm, in American. 200 lbs, c 6' (and subsiding with age), 27.7 Is that bad?

Thomas coupling
30th Oct 2013, 13:04
http://img.webmd.com/dtmcms/live/webmd/consumer_assets/site_images/tools/bmi_plus/healthy_weight_chart.png

500N
30th Oct 2013, 13:10
I lost it once when told by a Capt Doc at my last Army medical
that I was bordering on Obese. 5, 11, 86 - 90kg and was fit.

Doesn't take into account type of build.

Lord Spandex Masher
30th Oct 2013, 13:12
Isn't Jonny Wilkinson technically obese?

Fat bastard.

Thomas coupling
30th Oct 2013, 14:50
500: No, you are right. BMI is losing favour in some camps. The latest in the UK is the "girth" measurement which is the perimeter in inches around your midrif. (half way between your waist and lower end of rib cage).
Pass a tape measure around your middle (passing over your belly button) and measure the circumference.
37" or more for men: CAD (Cardio Arterial Disease).
31.5" for women.

But again, I find this difficult to believe in at times as a big, fit guy surely can't be expected to have a midrif below 37"?????

The best assessor for this level of fitness that I have stumbled across is the
Ormron Body Composition Monitor. Electric weighing scales for want of a better description!

You stand naked on this and hold onto the handle and a tiny electrical voltage passes thru your body (:eek:) and measures:
Body Fat
BMI
Visceral Fat.

The latter is the killer.

It's all in the instructions and easy to use.

Now this can make a difference to your attitude to health.

500N
30th Oct 2013, 14:55
Health ?

Yes, well I do need to give up smoking and do more exercise.

The good thing is, my GF made me get a full medical and thank god,
all came back clear. She was pissed off as she was sure I would have
high cholesterol and sugar levels !!!

Re BMI, I trained soldiers of all shapes and sizes and to be honest,
fitness had a lot more to do with everything than BMI. In fact, with
what we did, having a bit of extra on you kept you from getting
Hypothermia !!!

rgbrock1
30th Oct 2013, 17:32
500N wrote:

Re BMI, I trained soldiers of all shapes and sizes and to be honest,
fitness had a lot more to do with everything than BMI. In fact, with
what we did, having a bit of extra on you kept you from getting
Hypothermia !!!

I hear ya bro! BMI is a very rough gauge of one's physical appearance. Several friends of mine are considered obese by the BMI "standard". However, their obesity enables them to pick up people like you and I and eat us for breakfast and then launch us against the wall when finished!

Also, I had the "distinction" of attending a cold weather course, many moons ago, at the US Army's Northern Warfare Training Center (NWTC) based out of Fort Wainwright in Alaska. Although the course I attended was only 15 days in duration I'm very glad I brought along a couple of extra pounds at the time. Or I would have frozen to death for sure.

tony draper
30th Oct 2013, 17:45
That's true,if you drop a fat person and a thin person into the freezing cold sea the thin person will be the first person to visit fiddlers green,not so if you drop a thin person and a fat person into a lifeboat,thin people are sneakier and there's more good eating on a fat person.
:rolleyes:

Thomas coupling
30th Oct 2013, 19:05
If you dropped a dimensionally challenged (large variety) and a dimensionally challenged (small variety) out of the space landing module whilst it was orbiting the moon, would they fall at the same time?

tony draper
30th Oct 2013, 19:20
If it were orbiting the Moon and you threw them out of the vehicle they would not be dropping anywhere they would remain in orbit floating alongside you.:=
Unless this is a Hollywood filum of course.:rolleyes:

OFSO
30th Oct 2013, 20:27
they would remain in orbit floating alongside you

Not quite, Mr D, since you did use that word "throw" which suggests you are imparting some velocity to the throwee.

Only if you very slowly and carefully PUT them out the door would they remain alongside. Otherwise what would happen would depend on the direction and force imparted when they were thrown.


Sorry, I'm being pedantic this evening. The chill air has gotton to me.

tony draper
30th Oct 2013, 20:50
Well to be equally pedantic Mr Coupling used the word drop,which implies holding a person above a height and simply letting go of them,twere my poor choice of the word 'throw' rather than word 'drop' that caused the confusion,my apologies.
:rolleyes:

radarman
30th Oct 2013, 21:49
Didn't old Isaac establish that a body (the moon eg) in orbit is continually falling towards the Earth, but centrifugal force exactly balances this, resulting in the body maintaining a circular or elliptical orbit. Well, something like that. Rioja dulls the mind.

tony draper
30th Oct 2013, 22:01
Nowt to do wi centrifugal force,yon Moon is rolling around a dint in spacetime caused by the mass of the Earth curving spacetime around it.
Buggah! we was taught that before we did adding up sums and filling in our crayoning book at Missus Miggins Academy for the Children of Ragged Folk Gateshead.
:uhoh:

gingernut
30th Oct 2013, 22:11
That's true,if you drop a fat person and a thin person into the freezing cold sea the thin person will be the first person to visit fiddlers green,not so if you drop a thin person and a fat person into a lifeboat,thin people are sneakier and there's more good eating on a fat person. :D

Wanna avoid having a heart attack? Stop smoking and choose better parents.

tony draper
30th Oct 2013, 22:21
Found this story about a fat personage many years ago and posted it and it has the benefit unlike most sea stories of being true.:)

Just read a interesting tale on another website that has some bearing,twas about a event that occured in the first world war, a Ships Captain of vast girth called Arthur Smith,or Muckle Ertie as he was known by all and sundry.
Ertie's vessel is intercepted by one of those sausage side Uboats and in those more civilised times the crew were allowed to disembark in her life boats before said sausage sider pops a fish into her ass as they would say nowadays,and down she goes, they all board the submarine as captives, POW's as was the custom then, the U boat prepared to get the **** out of dodge before something Grey flying the white ensign makes the scene,the captive merchantman crew are hastily thrust down below until they come to Muckle Ertie,down the conning tower and through the hatch he would not fit,nor could his vast girth be persuded down the forard torpedo hatch,there is only one answer, Herr Kapitan of the U Boat casts poor Captain Ertie adrift all alone in a vast ocean in one of his own lifeboats and dissapears under the ogan in a cloud of bubbles.
Fortunatly Muckle Ertie is aspied a few days later by a passing vessel and is rescued,before he has had a chance to try out his new diet of sea biscuit and salt water and possibly shed some of his Muckleness.
Of course his rescuers see this empty life boat and look upon the plump well fed chap ensconsed alone within same,and ask suspiciously,
"Where are the rest of yer crew Captain"
You have been warned.

And for those prooner who heaven forbid thinks Drapes is spinning a yarn here, look below.
Here in all his glory is the man himself in later years with his family twas said he had lost a lot of weight by this time.

visibility3miles
30th Oct 2013, 22:29
would they fall at the same time?

Only if you threw them at the same time.

OFSO
31st Oct 2013, 11:19
Gravity, space warps, centrifugal force - all rubbish. It's like this:

http://i656.photobucket.com/albums/uu287/ROBIN_100/wiltall_und_menschheit.gif

er340790
31st Oct 2013, 18:30
But, conversely, what the BMI fails to explain is why people in the 'overweight' category of 25-30 BMI live significantly longer than those in the 20-25 'normal' range.

Also, within the normal range, 25% of those examined were medically 'very unhealthy'.

Force-feeding of skinnies, anyone????? :E

angels
31st Oct 2013, 19:26
What you should do with your heart is what I have done. Have a bypass at 53. The surgeon told me, "Come back in 80 years and I'll do another for free."

Trouble is, my electrics were up the spout as well. Hopefully this is all cured now. :}

reynoldsno1
1st Nov 2013, 01:36
BMI was devised some 150 years ago, pretty much before fridges, cans, telly & Tesco's. People were a lot smaller then, and would probably be considered malnourished by today's standards, so the BMI index probably fitted quite nicely in 1860.
My grandad's entry medical to the Machine Gun Corps in 1916 lists his height as 5'5", and chest as 32" - no weight recorded. He was 38 years of age at the time. Lugging a 2 gallon can of water (20lb) around with another 100lb of Vickers gun accessories must have been a challenge ....especially in Gaza where he ended up.:sad: