How low can you go

[racedo]

Pentagon Withholding Death Benefits for Fallen Soldiers' Families (http://www.breitbart.com/InstaBlog/2013/10/08/Pentagon-Confirms-Obama-s-Obstinence-Withholding-Death-Benefits-for-Fallen-Soldiers-Families)

Requiring families to pay to meet repatriated bodies at Dover......:ugh::ugh::ugh:

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

but, it was commented elsewhere, the military golf course Obama uses is still open.

(please tell me it ain't so)

[NutLoose]

Yes, Andrews course remains open because it is paid for by fees not the State. That is just the opposition using it as a cheap shot.
They will never win over this, it's got to be costing the Senators thousands of votes.

They have now closed parts of the Ocean :ugh:

Obama Administration Closes Ocean over Government Shutdown (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/politics/obama-administration-closes-ocean-over-government-shutdown)

I believe a bill is going through to pay the families, and the likes of Trump has offered to pay in the meantime...
That is a sickening thing to do to these people, I just hope the country remembers next election time what these Senators have done, senators who incidentally ARE still being paid, whilst those that can least afford it are not. This will put people into bankruptcy and ruin them.

[500N]

Pedantic.

Petty.


Someone needs to take a sledge hammer to all sides of the issue !!!

[SASless]

I have said it elsewhere.....this is the right time and reason to fire General Martin Dempsey.....tie a can to his tail and send him down the road.

You tell me in the entire DOD Budget....the Joint Chiefs cannot find the money to take care of this?

The ass kissers need to be shown the door.

[racedo]

Yes, Andrews course remains open because it is paid for by fees not the State. That is just the opposition using it as a cheap shot.
They will never win over this, it's got to be costing the Senators thousands of votes.


You mean like using armed guards to keep people away from memorials ?
Is that cheap ?

[TBM-Legend]

How about an "American Spring" and rid the nation of these free-loading a$$holes who call them representatives of the people??

Our brothers and sister in arms are being treated with disdain...

[Robert Cooper]

Catholic priests have been told by the Obama Administration that they will be arrested if they attempt to minister to soldiers during the partial Government shutdown. Police dogs were deployed by at the Vietnam Memorial the other day to prevent veterans from visiting, and elderly Vets were arrested, plastic tied, and thrown into paddy wagons in New York for visiting the memorial there.

Many of our nation’s truckers are planning a truckers’ strike/demonstration in Washington D.C. beginning 11 October and US citizens are now beginning to remove the barriers to our national monuments. They belong to us…NOT to the now absolutely abusive federal government. Veterans are also planning their own Million Vets March on D.C. beginning 13 October beginning 9:00 a.m. at the WWII Memorial.

Acting more and more like a cheap version of Josef Stalin or even Hugo Chavez and, increasingly, drunk on his personally perceived absolute power over US citizens, Obama is now openly attacking we Americans and all of our institutions.

Bob C

[500N]

The more I hear, the worse it gets.

Thank god you lot are doing something about it
instead of meekly taking it up the arse.

Send a message loud and strong to the White House
because he really does need it.

:ok:

[goudie]

It saddens me to see, a once great nation, come to this.

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

Thanks Nutloose.
At some stage in history, the jerks may realise that false reporting damages their case as much as they were trying to damage their opposition's.
I guess it'll be"Government bayonets nuns" next. That seems to be a favorite in most conflicts.

Update: As of yesterday
There was a brief moment of unity when the House voted 425-0 to let the Pentagon pay death benefits to the families of fallen U.S. troops.

[Martin the Martian]

At the risk of being shot down in flames, isn't it all because a group of rich senators feel that poor people should not have free or subsidised healthcare that all this is happening? Just because it seems a little too much like (whisper it) socialism, apparently. In the meantime the country can go to pieces, and hopefully the voters will recognise it the next time their representatives come up for re-election.

Obama will not go down in history as one of the USA's best presidents, but enabling those who cannot pay for it to receive good medical treatment can't be a bad thing surely?

Hand on the ripcord...

[Ramshornvortex]

There's me thinking we were in for another thread of photos of aircraft flying at about 3' above the ground.....

[Wander00]

I am with M the M. And I don't think Obama has been a "bad" President, but earned and has justified in full being the first black President. About time these "Tea Party" people got life in perspective

[teeteringhead]

Catholic priests have been told by the Obama Administration that they will be arrested if they attempt to minister to soldiers during the partial Government shutdown. ... hmmmmm ... not quite.

As ever, Snopes (http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/shutdown.asp) is your friend.

But that said, what IS happening is bad enough, without the need to invent or embellish stories. Particularly bad IMO is that the pollies are still getting paid but the pensioners ain't.

Why that would be like our MPs voting themselves a 9.3% pay rise while the military get 1% ......

...... oh, ...... hang on ........ :ugh:

Edited to add:


Mention above of the Tea Party reminded me of Ian Hislop's excellent remark on HIGNFY last week:

"The Tea Party? That's like UKIP ..... but with guns!" :ok:

[Whenurhappy]

This whole business is like some Greek Tragedy, where two brothers are constantly fighting and agreed that if they didn't stop fighting by a certain date, they'd kill each other's first-born. [I didn't think of this analogy myself, but I think it's a pretty good analogy].

Re Obamacare - over the last few years I've worked closely with a number of senior American civilians and military officers - like many other PPruners. These otherwise sane people had, almost to a man, believed the bonkers US Right Wing propaganda about the NHS - that there are State Death Boards that determine if patients get live-saving treatment, and that 'everyone' had private healthcare in 'England' because the NHS was means-tested. I'd point out that some people have private healthcare (often as part of their employment package) but most people see their NHS doctor; NHS prescriptions were heavily subsidised (who pays for private prescriptions?); NHS emergency treament is always available; if you need an urgent & immediate lifesaving operation, the NHS was the place to go. Yes, there are problems with the NHS (and I hope that Obamacare would take note of these) but, ultiamtely, the UK would be a much more miserable place for many, many people if the NHS wasn't there.

[SASless]

MM and others that think you understand the situation......you do not.

My view of it....as I am having to endure what is going on....is a bit different than yours.

The Situation is both far simpler and at the same time far more complex than can be explained in a few paragraphs.

Basic problem.....we are at a point in this country where we have to decide if we are going to "Dependents" or "Independents", "Free Men" or "Subjects", and the real divide goes right down to whether we shall accept the Progressive Agenda that started back in the 1930's under FDR and has been pushed by every Democrat Administration and every time the Democrats have held Majorities in Congress.

The latest Administration is just the most aggressive of those that are pushing us towards European Socialism. About half the Nation rejects that and the other half either support it or have other agendas that cause them to support the first Black President in our Nation's History.

Progressive Policies have pushed an ever larger, more costly, more intrusive Centralization of power in the Federal Government. We have started electing Senators instead of having them appointed by the State Legislatures and they now represent the People rather than the State Government that sent them to the Senate. We have allowed far too much money to flow into our politics and politicians. Special Interests have far too much sway with Politicians, Partisan Politics has priority over the People's Business. Our Media pushes the Progressive Agenda rather than fulfilling their assigned role of being the purveyors of the truth to the People.

Then, we get a corrupt administration, a Senate that will not debate a Budget and has not for over five years. We are forced to fund the Federal Government by Continuing Resolutions and do not ever have a real Budget fight that assigns priorities and examines actual government spending.

The Federal Government is spending twice as much money as it takes in....thus running up annual deficits averaging a Billion Dollars each year. That debt is killing the country.

We have an administration that has made horrible decisions regarding the Economy, decisions that have killed Job Growth and stalled the growth of the economy, and worse yet have lied, manipulated, and covered up any news that reports those sad facts.

Then......finally we see Obamacare become Law. A Bill that was pushed through Congress when the Democrats had a Majority in each House and held the White House. Commonsense measures were ignored. Republicans were not allowed to add Amendments, the Bill was the result of secret back room deals with Special Interests, Congressional Representatives in the Majority Party were bought off by bribes given in the form of Tax Money for pet projects in their Districts or States. The Bill was not posted for review by the Public and not one single person voting on the Bill in Congress read the 2,000 page Bill. Even the Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi said Congress had to pass the Bill to find out what was in the Bill.

The Obama Administration has purely screwed up the implementation of the Law, Obama himself has granted thousands of exemptions to the law to Unions, and others that supported him. He has made 19 changes to the Law when it suited him. He granted a special exemption to Congress and its Staff.

The 700 Million Dollar computer Web Site done by a Canadian outfit is a total failure.

Yet, when those of us who would be considered "Tea Party Members" speak out about what we see wrong with all this.....we are said to be "Whacko's", "Terrorists", and all sorts of ugly names.

We object to a government that refuses to cut spending, a government that does not comply with Constitutional requirements to do a Budget each year, a government that corruptly grants special treatment under a Law, a government that ignores those laws it does not want to enforce, and most importantly, a government that seems intent upon creating a permanent class dependent upon the government for their every need and want.

Our Nation was founded upon individualism, small government, government being subservient to the People, self responsibility, and the ability of each of us being able to succeed based upon our own merit and ability.

The current administration stands firmly against those notions.

That is where we are at today.

Watch the News this weekend.....beginning tomorrow morning there are going to be numerous Protests all across the country.....some have the potential of turning ugly if the government over reacts.

I am going to Washington to join in two of those protests.....along with a few Million others it would appear.

I am a Vietnam Veteran.....I am going to the Vietnam Memorial.....and the Park Rangers best stand aside as I fully intend to exercise my First Amendment Rights.....alongside the WWII Veterans and the Korean War Veterans.

One short explanation of the situation......


Democrats to America: We Own the Government! - Ann Coulter - Page full (http://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2013/10/09/democrats-to-america-we-own-the-government-n1720481/page/full)

[melmothtw]

My view of it....as I am having to endure what is going on....is a bit different than yours


Remembering the invective diatribe you posted at Obama's re-election SASless, I didn't have to read any further than this to guess what your view on the situation might be.

Whatever Obama does or says, you'll be opposed to it.

No offence, but as a Brit who has a lot of time for America and Americans it depresses me to see you all tearing yourselves apart along sectarian party political lines like this.

BTW, we have universal healthcare in this country - it's really not a communist conspiracy.

[SASless]

Melm,

It would appear I was right then....and remain right today.

If you cannot grasp the Economic data, Job Data, the scandals, and corruption that has been exposed.....then it is you that has the blinders on.

Are you keeping up on the IRS Scandal.....that one alone should be the downfall of the Obama Administration. Had we an honest media....it would be.

How do you confuse Socialism with Communism? Can you not tell the difference?

If your NHS is so good....how do the private insurers survive?

If the Canadian system is so good....why did their Premier come south for privately funded heart surgery?

We saw the "Death Panel" concept in action but it was in the form of the HHS Secretary Sebelius if you remember the Ten Year old girl that she denied a Lung Transplant....who is still alive today after she got her Lungs following a Federal Judge intervening.

You crackwise.....but just show your own bias and close mindedness when all you do is attack rather than debate.

[melmothtw]

How do you confuse Socialism with Communism? Can you not tell the difference?

If your NHS is so good....how do the private insurers survive?

Socialist or communist, it's NOT a conspiracy to emasculate Americans. It's really not.

I'm reminded of the last time that the American right tired to draw parallels between Obamacare and the NHS. Fox News came out and said that if Stephen Hawking had been British, the NHS would have let him die. To which he issued a response pointing out that he is British, and that the NHS is the only reason he's still alive!

[SASless]

One small victory for private enterprise after being shutdown by the Park Service.....who posted Police Officers to prevent customers from using the business.

Funny....a Federal law suit gets filed....and the Park Service folds its tent and orders the Cops to cease and desist!

Welfare Man's "Make'em Miserable" Campaign is coming apart at the seams.

Blue Ridge Parkway Inn Reopens With Federal Approval | digtriad.com (http://www.digtriad.com/news/local/article/301786/57/Blue-Ridge-Parkway-Inn-Reopens-With-Federal-Approval)


Meanwhile back to the topic of the thread....

Fisher House is going to fund any payments and assistance needed by the Families of those killed in Afghanistan. The House voted unanimously on a Bill that would fund all such payments but it appears the Senate is dragging its feet.....and playing politics yet. Democrats must be so prould!

[Airborne Aircrew]

SASless:

He has made 19 changes to the Law when it suited him.Something that he has no authority to do. Congress makes the laws, Congress amends the laws, the President merely signs the laws. To be "tweaking" the law by arbitrarily granting delays and exceptions is overstepping his Constitutional authority... Not that he cares...

Melmoth:

BTW, we have universal healthcare in this country - it's really not a communist conspiracy. As a Brit who has spent approximately equal parts of my 55 years in the USA I can tell you I know which I prefer. I do not wait 45 minutes for an ambulance to arrive in the USA because the Ambulance Service has been so cut that a town of 36,000 is serviced from another town 9 miles away. I wouldn't have lost my stepmother to colon cancer because they don't screen for it until you show symptoms in the Oxford District...

All O'BummerCare has done is taken a system that 85% were happy with that had some 30M people uninsured mainly because they didn't want to be and replaced it with a system that is having the following effects:-



70% of all jobs created this year are part time because the Act allows employers to not provide insurance for part time workers.
A large number of workers are having their hours cut from greater than 30 to less than 30. So they lose money and health insurance benefits - double whammy.
Despite the promise of $2500/annum savings men are facing a 119% average increase in cost and women 69%(?).
Deductibles are going up too so the out of pockets costs hit the average family too.
Due to requirements of the Act many major insurance companies are pulling their service from entire states leaving millions of people they previously insured without insurance.
In Mississippi there are 36 counties that have only a single provider of health insurance because of the withdrawal of so many insurers. The remaining insurer is upping it's rates.
Around 70% of the population here do not want O'Bummercare, but the Senate won't listen. They keep saying "The ACA has been law for three years, quit trying to change it" without noticing the irony of the fact that the Second Amendment has been law for over 200 years yet, almost annually, they try to change that.

That's just a few of the consequences of this crappy piece of legislation. Oh, did I mention that the ACA will leave 30M people uninsured? :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Tell me, where is the benefit????

[SASless]

AA....you are cheating.....MM will do a runner rather than debate the issues. He likes to make the comments like he did....and swear he holds the high ground.

Facts only destroy his position if he responds to them so we shall hear very little from him if I remember his MO properly.

He is much akin to a pick pocket....sneaks up does a brush pass....and makes off to see what he scored.

[melmothtw]

O'Bummercare? Really AA?!

You're quite right SASLess, with that level of debate I have nothing further to contribute to this discussion so will bow out.

Like I said, I actually like America and have some very close Americans friends. Hope you all manage to get your **** together sooner rather than later.

[Airborne Aircrew]

O'Bummercare? Really AA?!
Yes, I'm merely acknowledging his self professed Irish roots :rolleyes: It's no different to you of the unright persuasion referring to the last President as "Shrub".

Like I said, I actually like America and have some very close Americans friendsI bet you say the same about gays and blacks... :E

[melmothtw]

I bet you say the same about gays and blacks...

I bet you don't.

[SASless]

Dang.....I thought you were outta here Melm......yet you linger after promising to depart. Are you a Liberal Democrat?:E

[NutLoose]

He can't be, he hasn't hinted he will swop sides.

[Whenurhappy]

I've seen up close - and recently, too - the arbitrary nature of Tricare offered to US SP and their families. There would be a justifiable outcry if the decisions that I was privy to concerning cancer treatment for the spouse of a US-A Colonel were made by the NHS. Care is rationed, medication is rationed, care is withheld... Not good, in anyone's book.

I understand the genuine abhorance of 'big government' in the US, however this doesn't square with recent ambitions of the US to be a global interventionist - especially with the Neocons. This approach arguably stopped before the Syria debacle, however, the US ability to project influence is melting away by the second, as it is showing itself as weak, indecisive and genuinely decepid...which it shouldn't be.

[NutLoose]

Trouble with America is they have stood on what they did well for so long, that they never saw the rest of the world catching up with them, 30 years ago everyone bought US helicopters and the flow of money was one way, these days America buys the likes of European Helicopters and the flow is reversed.. Same with their passenger jets, they have for so long simply updated their old designs without developing new aircraft to find their market being eroded by the likes of Airbus. Of late they have tried to be correcting it, but the debt and cashflow that used to be kept in country has now spread out globally, China could cripple them if they dumped their Dollar holdings on the market and it's all down to greed.
That as I see it has been part of their downfall, along with political greed, it's a shame that US Senators are not required as with their President to only be able to stand for two terms.

Regardless of whether Obamacare is good or bad for the country, their politicians should not be playing with people's lives and the countries future just to make a point. If you think he is tampering with laws etc illegally, impeach him

[500N]

"If you think he is tampering with laws etc illegally, impeach him"

That's not going to happen.

[SASless]

Nutty,

Two things stand in the way of Impeachment.

The Constitutional requirements for Impeachable Offenses.

Political Will by the Republicans to go that route as they fully understand they CAN Impeach Obama but the Trial would have to take place in the Senate. The Republicans have the majority in the House and thus could easily bring forth the Articles of Impeachment. The Trial would then take place in the Senate and the Democrats hold a majority.

The third factor that should always act to prevent such a move is Joe "Walter" Biden would step to the Big Chair if Obama got convicted in the Senate.

Right now the IRS Scandal is beginning to look like very bad news for Obama.

What was billed by the Obama Regime as being a couple of rogue IRS Agents in Ohio.....has now morphed to the current head of the IRS Obamacare Implementation Office...having illegally divulged citizen's Tax Data to the White House Staff. Even the Democrats will have very deep second thoughts about standing up for the Administration over this once it is proved very senior White House Staff and Advisors to the President were in the Loop in this.

As that news drips out.....the Tea Party and other Conservative movements are going to get very involved in the coming 2014 elections and if you recall what happened in 2010.....this has surely got the Democrats shivering in their sea boots!

[goudie]

From what I read, here and elsewhere, American politics and politicians really are corrupt and pathetic, in my view. More so than in the UK and Europe and that's saying something!

[racedo]

In UK in 1984-85 the Govt spent 11p out of every pound spent on Health service or £290 per person
In UK in 2013-14 the Govt will spend 18p out of every pound spent or £2,029.

Now allowing for inflation and a bit extra for Capital items you would be spending £800-900 per person.

NHS is a black hole that sucks billions out of economy and is it really that much better than it was in 1985 ?

SAS called it right between a nation of Independents or a nation of Dependents.
UK like US are rapidly becoming nations where others especially immigrants are expected to do the low paying jobs while others live off the back of them.

In 2012, 90% of all income tax was paid by half the working population.

Unemployed family-of-12 to get 6-bedroom council house | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2450754/Unemployed-family-12-6-bedroom-council-house.html)

Then again it will only take all the tax paid by 20 people earning £20k a year to pay for their welfare bill.

[Biggus]

racedo,

According to a figure in one of todays papers, 29.8% of UK income tax is pay by the top 1% of earners....

Interesting statistic, especially when you consider that the Lib Dems and Labour are always going on about the wealthy contributing more, or "more fairly"....


As for the NHS, I thought its basic remit was to preserve life, maintain health, etc. So why is fertility treatment available on the NHS?

[NutLoose]

What happened to the capping of benefits?

Same with housing

Now one council house in ten goes to migrants as Tories blame Labour for allowing locals 'to be pushed out of waiting list' | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2445072/Now-council-house-goes-migrants-Tories-blame-Labour-allowing-locals-pushed-waiting-list.html)

No wonder they fall over themselves to get here and the Syrians who were offered asylum in France turned it down and went on protest to come here.

Personally I would cap all child benefits at 4 children and cap the size of available social housing at 5 bedrooms.

As someone I read succinctly out it, "I cannot afford to have children and work all hours God sends to keep a roof over my and my wife's head, why should I pay for Children I and my wife cannot afford to have."

[Royalistflyer]

There is a HUGE difference between the health "care" that is proposed in America and the NHS style systems in the UK, Canada and Australia. The latter three are all more or less paid for out of tax. The Australians seem to have the best mix, and perhaps if their style of system was inaugurated in America there would be a workable system. As it is the system proposed is stupid beyond belief.

[500N]

I'm no expert but the Australian system does seem to work.

Public hospitals require more funding though, waiting times a bit long
but overall, people can get looked at by a doctor virtually anytime
and a hospital at some point.

Others may have different views.

And then if you want more cover, you can buy it.

[woptb]

'Obamacare' is the law of the land, the president was reelected and elections have consequences.
The Republicans (being led around by the nose by the Teabagggers) are only in charge of one branch of government.
It would appear the Republicans don't understand the concept of democracy:ugh:

Incidentally,apart from some on the lunatic fringe of the Republicans, you can't get a fag paper between the donkeys & the elephants political agendas,they both stink up the place pretty bad:p

[500N]

Woptb

And Obama (and Holder) don't understand that the law is the law
and selling weapons to the Drug cartel is illegal.

[Airborne Aircrew]

Wop:

The Republicans (being led around by the nose by the Teabagggers) are only in charge of one branch of government.

The bit that holds the purse strings... Quit making me ashamed of my coutrymen's lack of understanding of the way other countries work since it's one of the biggest criticisms you make of Americans... :ugh:

[SASless]

The roll out of the healthcare.gov web site has been a huge failure.

It cost 670 Million Dollars which is more than Facebook, twitter,instagram, and google combined.....and it does not work, is full of security issues, and simply does not work.

I started trying to log on the day it started.....Tuesday a week ago.

To date I have accomplished creating a User name, a password, entered my address, email addy, phone number, and did the three security questions.

The site sent me an email link to confirm my data and I responded.

At that point the site refused to verify my data but failed to send me a request for a confirmation number and did not issue me a confirmation number.

Live chat can not handle that problem.

One is referred to the Phone Number for service.

Finally, after going through a voice recognition automated menu....that did not recognize anything I said.....I punched "0" and eventually got a real live person.

She was not able to handle the problem and forwarded my help request on up the line and I was promised both an email and telephone contact confirming the problem had been fixed.

Guess what happened? No email....no phone call....problem still not fixed.


Odumbo said Apple had glitches in its last phone's software and after a few days they fixed it.

Odumbo should have had Apple do the web site and not the Canadians he hired.

BREAKING: Obamacare Flops, Receives Just 51k Applications (http://www.capitalisminstitute.org/obamacare-flopped/)

[TheWestCoast]

So, wait, parts of the very government that the GOP obsessively wants to be made smaller are shut down, thereby making said government "smaller", and this is now suddenly a "bad" thing?

Or is it really the case that the GOP just wants the government made "smaller" in just the areas that its supremely wealthy donors want made smaller - for example, welfare, gun control, healthcare, education - so they can get richer?

I'm not sure how Boehner and the rest of his white, fat, rich buddies look themselves in the mirror in the morning.

[SASless]

It would appear the Republicans don't understand the concept of democracy

It is plain you don't know squat about the American system of government.

We have a Representative Republic not a Democracy.

Now what is it you were trying to say?

[woptb]

Pah,semantics - by your deffinition no country is a democracy.

Popular usage has come to mean a representative democracy,even 'some' Republicans believe this; "Government of the people, by the people".
Do you really believe you don't live in a democracy ?
Of course it is said we get the the goverment we deserve :cool:

[gr4techie]

I was going to write something about the US and democracy.

But then a black saloon car pulled up, with two guys inside wearing black suits and black sunglasses.

[Alber Ratman]

This thread really has left "Military Aircrew".. It's in "anything goes"..

[Robert Cooper]

woptb

It's not semantics. The distinction between our Republic and a democracy is not an idle one. It has great legal significance.

A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.

 In a republic the group only has advisory powers; the sovereign individual is free to reject the majority group-think.

Bob C

[melmothtw]

RC, it is semantics.

Bush and the neocons didn't make such distinctions in their zeal to spread 'democracy' throughout the Arab world.

As woptb said, by your definitions there are no democracies anywhere in the world.

[SOSL]

Low Spitfire Pass - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=T8_5Qc1mK54)

That's low

Rgds SOS

[Robert Cooper]

Good one SOSL :D

Bob C

[pontifex]

Robert Cooper

Your definition of a republic sounds like anarchy to me.

[Robert Cooper]

Our Constitution guarantees to every state a Republican form of government (Art. 4, Sec. 4). No state may join the United States unless it is a Republic. Our Republic is one dedicated to "liberty and justice for all." Minority individual rights are the priority. The people have natural rights instead of civil rights. The people are protected by the Bill of Rights from the majority.

Bob C

[Alber Ratman]

A moderator needs to move this thread..:ok:

[814man]

SASless, I follow the partisan political points you make, which is of course what politics is all about. But surely when you say:

Then......finally we see Obamacare become Law. A Bill that was pushed through Congress when the Democrats had a Majority in each House and held the White House.

This simply proves that in a democracy the will of the people as expressed through the ballot box must prevail.

[Chugalug2]

AR:-
A moderator needs to move this thread
Agreed. There is a Spitfire in it, so how about History & Nostalgia?

[Pontius]

A moderator needs to move this thread

A moderator needed to move this thread ages ago. This is supposed to be a military aircrew forum, not an American politics pissing match :mad:

[500N]

How about USA Politics - Hamster Wheel in JetBlast

[Tankertrashnav]

Another vote for a move to hamsterwheel here - this is a wheel that will never stop turning. We over this side of the Atlantic will never really understand the Americans' aversion to state health care - but it's their country, let them do what they like.

[Alber Ratman]

I liked going to the States, but thank the lord I don't have to live there and hope I have enough money to pay insurance or get picked up off the street if I have an accident/health scare.. I have met hard working Americans who don't earn the cash to pay for it. Please American Vets, do your mudsligning where it belongs that isn't here.

British Vet.

[steamchicken]

It cost 670 Million Dollars which is more than Facebook, PPRuNe,instagram, and google combined

Google has on occasion spent more than that on capital expenditure in one quarter.

[Heathrow Harry]

"Obamacare become Law. A Bill that was pushed through Congress when the Democrats had a Majority in each House and held the White House."

isn't that democracy????

[Robert Cooper]

No Harry, that is not democracy.

Democracy is when all eligible parties participate equally in the proposal, development, and creation of a law through debate and negotiation.

In the case of the Affordable Care Act, or Obamcare, it was developed behind closed doors by one political party with no input from any other party. Other political parties were specifically excluded.

It was also rammed through without being read by anyone in the House or Senate, on an inappropriate procedure by Democrats to ensure they got the party line votes they needed.

That is not democracy, and that is why we are seeing increasing civil disobedience against this tyrannical government.

Now people are seeing it for what it is, there is growing dissatisfaction amongst citizens. Reports are now coming in that a family of 4 applying for insurance through the Obamacare exchanges are receiving quotes of $1000 per month with $12,000 deductible. And that is for the basic coverage.

That is ridiculous.

Bob C

[SASless]

This is supposed to be a military aircrew forum

Military Aircrew A forum for the professionals who fly the non-civilian hardware, and the backroom boys and girls without whom nothing would leave the ground. Army, Navy and Airforces of the World, all equally welcome here.



Everyone of us posting here qualify as "Military Aircrew".

The real complaint is we are not "British Military Aircrew" as I see it.

If we were arguing RAF PVR policies you would have no whine about the argument would you?

Did I or any Non-Brit ever suggest you take it to Jet Blast UK Politics?

[Alber Ratman]

The real complaint by people like myself is that this thread has no links to military avaition bar indirect funding issues. Most of its content has nothing to do with avaition whatsoever.

How plain is that?

[Piggies]

Yup. Willy waving by a bunch of neocons. Talk about how this affects US military aviation, or can it as irrelevant.

Bringing back the Clangers is more relevant to an aviation website

[500N]

"Bringing back the Clangers"

I haven't seen them mentioned in years.

[Biggus]

BBC News - Clangers to make TV return (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-24523203)

[500N]

OMG

I don't believe it.

[thunderbird7]

At last! A program I can relate to :)

[Wensleydale]

Bring back the Clangers


I thought that all the clangers had all been dropped by the previous Government?

[woptb]

Everyone of us posting here qualify as "Military Aircrew".

The real complaint is we are not "British Military Aircrew" as I see it.

If we were arguing RAF PVR policies you would have no whine about the argument would you?

Did I or any Non-Brit ever suggest you take it to Jet Blast UK Politics?

Hear,hear SASless.

[SOSL]

This morning Baroness Hayman tabled a question in the House.

"to ask Her Majesty’s Government what measures they are taking to support the introduction of "golden rice" to help alleviate childhood blindness caused by vitamin A deficiency."

This is a very pressing health issue and sadly some of those poor children will not develop good enough eyesight to become military aircrew.

[teeteringhead]

At last! A program I can relate to ... progamme please!! ;);)

[500N]

SOSL

Talking of UK Politics, I see everyone is up in arms over the heavily pregnant EQUALITIES minister having to stand in Parliament and that no MALE MP offered her a seat :rolleyes:

[Alber Ratman]

BTW didn't the houses and Obama open up the federal government for a few months? Thread finished until next time then.......:E

[Wander00]

How apposite that this and the Cranwell Flypast threads should be adjacent.....................

[SOSL]

My point was that this thread has, so far, got FA to do with military aviation.

I guess the spams may not be able to appreciate the irony of my last 2 posts, even though I had, so I thought, stuffed them under their noses with lots of clues.

Maybe subtlety isn't their strength.

Rgds SOS