9,000 Dead on Normandy Beaches

[Courtney Mil]

Sand artist, Andy Moss, has done something quite remarkable. Watching on the One Show - not usually a viewer - and found this in the Mail:

Peace Day: Reminder of millions of lives lost in war as artists stencil 9,000 bodies onto Normandy beach | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2429903/Peace-Day-Reminder-millions-lives-lost-war-artists-stencil-9-000-bodies-Normandy-beach.html?ito=feeds-newsxml)

[CoffmanStarter]

Just watched the same piece Courtney ... Very moving ... Especially as my late Dad landed just before H Hour on D-Day to lead beach mine clearing ahead of the main landing on Sword Beach 6th June. He was awarded the MC for this and subsequent actions in the early stages of Op Overlord.

Coff.

[Old-Duffer]

To see the true scale of the losses at Normandy, one has to study the names in the cemeteries at Ranville etc and include the memorials to the missing in that.

The frightening thing about the whole enterprise was that the actual casualties were less less than predicted!

Old Duffer

[Chugalug2]

OD:-
the actual casualties were less less than predicted!

For which we can thank local Allied Air Superiority, Operation Fortitude, Garbo, and the weather.

[Courtney Mil]

Well said,Chugs. And some good deception work by our own operatives, some Lancs further away dropping "window" as a decoy and some very good misdirection by the French Resistance. Some of that may well have been part of Skye or Quicksilver.

[Mk 1]

And the truly sad thing is only a generation a bit earlier a casualty count of 9000 in one day would have seemed a trifle. From memory casualty counts in the 10's of thousands were the order of the day during the great offensives. Wasn't Ypres 58,000 allied dead on day 1? At least D-Day something solid was achieved. Gaining 100m or 1km in WW1 to another stalemate.... Just tragic.

[CoffmanStarter]

And some good deception work by our own operatives ...

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/516px-Rupert-02-800_zps48864cbf.jpg

Yep ... along with "window" the dropping of ...

Dummy Paratroops ... Device, Camouflage, No. 15 for the use of. They were also referred to as a ‘Rupert’ or a ‘Paragon' (thought to have be a play on words, 'Para - Gone'). The dummy was approximately half life sized, about 36 inches in overall length.

One of the most significant deployments of the dummies was on the night of 6 June 1944 in Operation Titanic with elements of 1st SAS, in direct support of Operation Overlord. Which I believe was around the Calais area of Northern France in order to divert attention away from the main Allied Invasion Beaches to the South.

Sorry for the slight side track ... but very clever stuff :ok:

Coff.

[Red Line Entry]

Mk1,

The first day of the Battle of the Somme (1 Jul 16) was the worst ever in terms of Allied dead - approx 20,000 and almost another 40,000 wounded.

[Wensleydale]

The first day of the Battle of the Somme (1 Jul 16) was the worst ever in terms of Allied dead - approx 20,000 and almost another 40,000 wounded.

Not including the Battle of Towton in 1461 during the Wars of the Roses with 28,000 dead (8,000 Yorkists and 20,000 Lancastrians). Not many Lancastrian wounded left on the field though!

[kbrockman]

1812 Battle of Borodin I think is ,up until today, still the worst single-day battle September 7th 1812 (which was a bad year for many places all around the world).
Between 70.000 and 100.000 victims in 1 day without a clear winner.
Battle of Borodino - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Borodino)

And all this in a time when many fights where still man on man or with very primitive fire weapons.

BTW Napoleon also takes second place with the Battle in Waterloo which killed about 55.000 people on June 18th 1815

[dragartist]

Coff, Where is the museum exhibit in your picure? The reason I ask: in 1999 I went to fetch my last job from ABW and bring it to Wyton. I inherited a box of files from St Giles Court. In same was a pile of RAE Farnborough reports (I think it was Farnborough - but could have been Old Sarum. like others I am getting old and memories fade). They were all clasified and some had been declassified. I sent them all to the Air Historical Branch. Never recieved any acknowlegment. I hope they did not bin them.

later versions of the device had chinese fireworks attached and were just hardboard cut out silloutes (all described in the reports)

I would like to think the Airborne Forces Museum at Duxford had duplicates. At the time the home of this collection was uncertain. Aldershot was closing.

Some of the older Air Despatchers around at the time spoke of airdropping Gingerbread men as a training aid. This must have gone out in the 70s or even 80s.

I hope the collection of historical reports at JATE were not destroyed. I know I moved some to the PTS museum as they were more keen to preserve the personal parachute stuff.

[peter we]

The frightening thing about the whole enterprise was that the actual casualties were less less than predicted!

And it wasn't 9000 allied dead, thats including the German and civilians.

Latest estimate is around 4400 allied dead

GuidedTours (http://www.ddaymuseum.co.uk/d-day/d-day-and-the-battle-of-normandy-your-questions-answered#casualities)

[gr4techie]

During the US Marine invasion of Okinawa. On April fools day 1945. Cpl Eugene Sledge (who's exploits were made into Steven Speilberg's and Tom Hanks television series The Pacific) said...

"We were briefed this is expected to be the costliest amphibious operation of the war. We are hitting an island 300 miles from the Jap's home islands. So you can expect them to fight with more determination than ever. We can expect 80% to 85% casualties on the beach.
Buddy next to me leaned over "How's that for boosting troops morale"".

[SOSL]

What a striking image and what an amazing contribution by the locals.

My Mum a was a nurse in the QARANCs (or whatever they were called then), She went over with the first wave of the invasion force, on D Day, and set up a field hospital in a big tent pitched on a groundsheet.

She told me that during the first night and subsequently, half conscious, wounded soldiers would jump off their camp beds when they heard the explosions around them and try vainly to dig through the groundsheet, with their hands, to make foxholes.

It beggars belief what our parents/grandparents went through!

Rgds SOS

[CoffmanStarter]

Dragartist old chap ...

I think this example is in the hands of a private collector. I wanted a pic to add colour to my post as my Dad had mentioned the "mini paratroopers" on a number of occasions and thought it might be of interest given Courtney's post on the various "deceptions" used on D-Day.

More here ...

http://arnhemjim.********.co.uk/2011/07/parachuting-for-dummies-rupert-world.html

PS ... Edit the URL (1) ******** with bl0gspot but spelt with an o and (2) .co.uk to .com

Or just Google Dummy Paratroopers WW2 and follow the link matching the image I've posted .... :ok:

Might be worth dropping the guy a line ?

Best ...

Coff.

[Courtney Mil]

SOSL,

Thank you. Hats off to your mother, as you say we can hardly imagine what our forebears did. Like you, I'm sure, I take enormous pride in what I know about them. :ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Dragartist ...

Ironic we were talking about this topic recently ... a "Rupert" has apparently been sold for c. £900 at auction.

A bit in The Times today ...

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/multimedia/archive/00458/138201402__458223c.jpg

The Times D-Day Rupert (http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3883417.ece)

Sadly behind a PayWall :(

But the piece in the Mirror is a classic :ugh:

They featured in the famous 1962 D-Day movie The Longest Night.

World War 2 D-Day dummy parachutist found in GARDEN SHED - Mirror Online (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/world-war-2-d-day-dummy-2325141#ixzz2gUt6R7VI)


Best ...

Coff.

[dragartist]

Thanks for keeping us posted Coff. I do hope this finishes up on public display somewhere. If only to dispel the myth put out in the Longest Day movie that these things were high fidelity models (with chest mounted reserve parachutes!)

I will have to check out if there is one in the Airborne Museum at Duxford. I know there is a jeep and trailer that was dropped from a Halifax. I just love the Apollo 11 moon lander legs on that thing.

There was a bit of a collection at the Irvin factory at Letchworth that went down to Wales when they merged with GQ. The exhibits were then just put in a shed to be moved from pillar to post and never put on display (even for us visitors). They had a couple of Guardian Angel seat packs. I would like to think these things were preserved. I did suggest to the Airborne Systems management that they were donated to Duxford but was told that there was issues over ownership as some of the former Irvin Collection was on loan from private collectors who could not be traced. I learned that the Caterpillar Club boards went down to a warehouse in Bridgend only to become water damaged beyond repair and skipped. (The cardex from WWII era remains- and works)

I just find it a crying shame when our heritage is lost forever. I am pleased some people can find it in themselves to spend the £900 required to save this from the skip. (or in this case probably the moths!)

[skua]

I was around the beaches and cemeteries last week. We old boys were laying wreaths on the graves of fellow old boys from our school, in the company of their relatives. All very moving.

Although I have been to the area many times, I took a closer look at the scenery this time - you can see how French farmers have recycled Allied equipment: namely the wire mesh that was used to assist vehicles get better purchase on the sand, and also PSP used in the temp airfields (some of which were created in only 48 hours, for goodness sake. I was tempted to return some of it to British hands, but somehow 'er indoors was unkeen on these trophies....

We passed by Café Gondree at Pegasus Bridge, and Mme (who looks v well for her age) dropped a heavy hint that the 70th celebrations next year will be somewhat special (presumably in terms of British personalities).