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alwayzinit
6th Sep 2013, 01:21
Now Mrs Alwayz and me are now empty nesters as our little ones have flown the coup off to Uni in the UK.

The other night/early morning yours truly was abruptly woken up at 0500 by No1 son shaking my shoulder, just like he used to when he was small and feeling poorly.

I sit up sharpish saying "whats up buddy" all bleary eyed expecting to see small boy, blankey and the need of a cuddle, drink of water etc etc.

Now of course No1 son is no longer that small boy but a 6'3" bloody monster and he's not in the sandpit he's in the UK.

So after Mrs says whats up? etc we role over and conk out again.

Now during the day we are in comms via BBM with wee Laddee and his Mum asks if all is ok.

He says yup but he had got the fright of his life last night at 0200 bst when the fire alarm went off and his flat mate crashed in his room.

0200 bst = 0500 dxb!!!

Theories anyone?

mikedreamer787
6th Sep 2013, 03:03
The brain's a funny thing in that limbo between sleep
and awake so I wouldn't assume your son was shaking
you. And there is no proof whatsoever that we of the
talking monkey specie can communicate this way.

I'd put it down to coincidence. But if it happens again
Let us know!

500N
6th Sep 2013, 03:08
A bit of both.

You see news articles of mothers who get a chill and know something
has happened to their son, daughter etc. Especially the last 10 years
with the wars.

It shows you are still "in tune" with your kids - which is good.

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 03:14
do you have a cat ?

probes
6th Sep 2013, 06:35
ESP.
And it is scary sometimes.
Years ago a person I know felt desperately thirsty, she was in a schoolhouse, for an adult training course, and all the taps she found were dry somehow.
Her little son (3yr) had got drowned that afternoon. Had decided to take a walk alone and found a spring before his father found him.

Mostly we tell ourselves: Can't be! of course.

bcgallacher
6th Sep 2013, 06:42
Some years back while operating as Flight Mech on a 747 freighter I was sound asleep in a crew bunk,suddenly woke up and thought we had a hydraulic failure.I went to the flight deck,checked the pressure and quantity gauges which were normal. Felt stupid and started to tell the F/E why I was there when # 3 hyd. low pressure light came on and both quantity and pressure fell to zero.There is no explanation except coincidence.

probes
6th Sep 2013, 06:56
yeah. I was overtaking in a not very complicated situation when I felt as if someone had put a hand on my head and said: Not now. So I didn't, got back behind the car that was extra slow, maybe a technical problem, and some madman appeared from the bend ahead, way over any speed limits. I (and probably he) would have been dead for sure.

Captivep
6th Sep 2013, 09:58
Complete and utter coincidence...

There will have been many times when your son woke with a start and you had no idea. I've no doubt there are thousands of times when he's thinking of you and you have no idea.

The one occasion he woke with a start and it coincided with a dream you were having doesn't make it ESP.

The late XV105
6th Sep 2013, 10:24
Back in the late eighties a group of friends I was (and still am!) part of set off to the Motor Show at the NEC.
Although we all lived in the same neck of the woods, we took three cars for the six people as we each needed to depart from different locations at different times, and had different times by when we needed to be back home.

For the return, I left first in my car, followed by the two other cars several hours later and half an hour apart.

At 01:03am I woke up from a deep sleep, heart pounding at a crazy rate, and worrying about something but I couldn't think what.
It was over half an hour before I could calm down and go back to sleep; the last time I remember looking at the clock it was 01:36am.

I learned the next day that the driver of Car Two had fallen asleep at the wheel and rolled over and over down the motorway embankment and out of sight - at 01:03am.

I also learned that Car Three drove past the unlit scene in the middle of nowhere and his passenger saw a woman standing on the hard shoulder in a state of distress.
"I think that was so-and-so" said the driver's wife, so they came off the motorway at the next junction and retraced the loop to check.
Sure enough it was so-and-so and they were able to adminster first aid to her and her boyfriend trapped in his very mangled Vauxhall Cavalier and call the emergency services via hard shoulder phone.
The emergency services arrived at... 01:36am - when I last looked at the clock, relaxed, and soon after drifted off to sleep.

Since then I have always wondered if there really is another sense yet to be fully explored and understood and several other events have reinforced this view.

cattletruck
6th Sep 2013, 11:00
Your subconcious deserves more credit than you give it.

I remember sitting on a park bench then suddenly felt an unexplained urge to stand up. I stood up and a few seconds later a bird shat a tub of yoghourt exactly where I was sitting.

suddenly woke up and thought we had a hydraulic failure

I bet Mr bcgallacher's ears subconciously heard what only a well trained 747 engineer would recognise, a sound peculiar to a hydraulic line bursting or pumps wheezing, then woke up.

some madman appeared from the bend ahead, way over any speed limits.

I experienced something similar like that once. While stopped at an intersection where the road turned away on both left and right sides, I just had this feeling that something was wrong. Looking left and right, I could easily cross this empty road if cars are doing the normal limit, but something felt wrong. I couldn't just sit there forever with this irrational feeling so I went for it. When I just got to the other side I saw in my rear view mirror a muscle car whizz past at about 160 kph. My subconcious could hear the increasing engine noise of that car through the windows and stereo, but conciously I was completely deaf to it.

But I do believe in that sixth sense stuff, I call it having good reception. People in distress are able to project brainwaves or something similar, possibly bouncing them off the beam, and with all that malstrom of brainwave flux bouncing around the planet, people who truly bond with each other are able to tune into that familiar frequency regardless of distance and be heard. Well, it's just a theory anyway.

Loose rivets
6th Sep 2013, 11:22
In my novel I make extensive use of a fifth force, though humans are not supposed to be aware of it, let alone make use of it. From time to time things happen between humans that surprises the watching super-scientists.

I don't totally believe my notions, but I have experienced things that truly nudge at the old credulity-boundaries. I hear myself say, 'has to be coincidence.' but sometimes I wonder if fact is at least as strange as fiction.

Captivep
6th Sep 2013, 11:25
Cattletruck - I agree with your view about the unconscious being able to process information that we're not consciously aware of.

It's also capable of processing stuff and we don't know we're doing it. It's precisely the reason we sometimes wake up with an answer to the problem that was troubling us the previous night.

Re the car accident example. Why do you think you relaxed at 1:36 when the emergency services got there? Why not when the call was made? Why not when they'd all got out of the car? Why not when the paramedics had certified everyone was ok?

And you conveniently forget the other nights when you've woken up and then gone back to sleep and nothing out of the ordinary happened. That's not a criticism, it's just the way our minds work!

What is spooky though is that I share my birthday with Sam Warburton (who I'd like to be!) and Kate Winslet (who I'd like to be with...)

Actually, no it isn't; merely coincidence.

Just as my wife's birthday is shared with Lindsay Wagner (who my wife thought was great in the Bionic Woman) and Meryl Street (who my wife loved in Mamma Mia). Furthermore, Lindsay and Meryl are the same age and if you reverse the number in their age you get my wife's age...

onetrack
6th Sep 2013, 12:26
Not coincidence - and psychic contact between humans and premonition of events that later occurred, has been recorded for centuries.

Who's had "deja vu" moments? - that time when you know exactly what the person is going to say in the next couple of sentences - or a pre-existing knowledge of seeing a train of events unfold, that you're now watching?
I would have these experiences all the time, as a younger person - not so much as I got older. How can we know beforehand what a person is going to say or do?

There are plenty of stories from WW2 when sweethearts and soldiers made psychic connections. One I recall, involved an Australian sailor and his wife.
The sailors ship was torpedoed in the Pacific and he ended up clinging to a makeshift raft for days.
Several times he slipped into semi-consciousness and was preparing to let go of his raft, when he said he saw a vision of his wifes face, telling him to hang on. He did so, at her urging.

Meanwhile, back in Australia, his wife woke up in the wee small hours from a vivid dream, that her husband was clinging to some wreckage and drowning in the ocean. She couldn't go back to sleep, such was the vividness and intensity of her dream.
The sailor was rescued, just as he was about to slip under. Neither found out about the others experiences until many months later, when they were re-united. They checked the dates and times of their psychic experiences, and they coincided.

To call us talking monkeys is to discredit the incredible power of the human mind, the human brain, and its barely-understood potential - and shows a very shallow examination of the huge differences in ability between us and monkeys.

Who recalls the woman who had to be forced on board a 'plane (in the 1950's) - because she didn't want to board, telling everyone it was going to crash? She was eventually forced on board - and the 'plane crashed, killing everyone on board.

What about Abraham Lincoln who dreamed of his own death? Two weeks before he was shot, he dreamed he saw a coffin in the White House, and asked a bystander whose it was.
The bystander said, "the President of the United States". He told his wife, and they both dismissed the dream as of no consequence - even to the point whereby Lincoln gave his bodyguard the night off, on the night he was assassinated.

probes
6th Sep 2013, 12:33
Funny how we dismiss invisible transmission of information between remote people as being preposterous, but accept television as being normal.
it's like if someone says they've got a headache - either you believe it or not.

onetrack - add to it the books about events that occurred much later, like the Titan (http://www.omg-facts.com/History/In-1898-14-Years-Before-The-Titanic-Sank/6457)by Roberts.

ExRAFRadar
6th Sep 2013, 12:35
It's all just 'Spooky action at a distance' to borrow from Einstein

603DX
6th Sep 2013, 13:30
As the brightest members of the hominidae family, our incredible brain functions are a thing of constant wonder. Consciously or subconsciously, our mind keeps on plugging away at a perceived intangible problem. If that results in a "solution unobtainable" conclusion due to total lack of adequate data such as hard facts or archived information, it merrily continues by using its highly creative functions. In other words, it postulates, hypothesizes, and downright "makes it up". Any answer, real or fabricated, is sensed as being better than the defeatist "no answer".

I suspect that many of the bewildering variety of the world's major and minor religions, faiths, creeds and spiritual practices have sprung up over the centuries as a result of such a "default" function of the human brain. The frequent statement by the nay-sayers, atheists, agnostics and their fellow travellers , that "it's all in the mind" may have a germ of truth in it.

And this question of "ESP or Coincidence?" could also be a feature of a stubborn reluctance of our ever-active brains to accept the plain, simpler conclusion of "Coincidence" as an answer. So our powerful creative processes come up with the more nebulous concept of Extra-Sensory Perception as a valid alternative explanation. With no provable basis at all!

If my poor amateur philosophising makes any sense at all (a very moot point!), it rather begs the question of who is in charge of our so-clever brain functions, then? A rather unsettling thought ... :uhoh:

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 13:47
It's real

ESP = Electrified Sh*t Particles

Cacophonix
6th Sep 2013, 13:58
The human brain has evolved to see patterns and to make links between different phenomena. These traits are hard wired in us and are mostly desirable in the sense that they enable us to survive, innovate and thrive. Sometimes we allow these traits to trick us into seeing causation where in fact all we are dealing with is co-incidence or mere chance.

Thus we encounter many stories where some seemingly significant incident occurs in our immediate locale (e.g. a clock stopping) at exactly the moment something significant is happening to a distant loved one, for example, and we note this retrospectively and see some sort of causation at work. In truth it would be strange if some interesting contemporaneous events didn't occur as significant things are happening simultaneously all the time in an infinite number of places throughout the universe.

Pareidolia is another form of apophenia that allows some to see Jesus' face in clouds and others their mother in law's face in a bit of toast.

Fascinating stuff but all down to the unique aspects of human psychology and biology.

Caco

er340790
6th Sep 2013, 14:42
Very interesting. For the first time in 49 years I actually had what I would term a 'premonition' last weekend...

Our eldest son started driving in August. Though I say it myself, he is already a technically good and conscientious driver. Late Sunday afternoon, my wife asked him to drive into town to pick up our youngest.

I can't explain it, but I had a feeling of TOTAL dread. In fact, it was far more than a feeling - it was almost a physical thing. Never known anything like it before, so decided to act on it and drove into town myself.

About halfway into town is a traffic light intersection where vehicles regularly go through at 120kph, though the limit is 90kph. As I approached it, still several hundred meters away, a very high-pitched ringing started in my left ear. The lights changed to amber and the delay-to-red is some 7 seconds. Normally I would have driven through. That day I hit the brakes. At the same moment, a vehicle jumped the lights directly across my path.

Did I avoid something that might have involved my son due to a subconscious alert??? I guess I'll never really know. I've always believed that to a certain extent that disaster comes out of a clear blue sky. Whatever, I am just so glad that I did feel something and act on it, however misplaced.

If I felt the same thing ever again, would I act on it?
YOU BET I WOULD! :eek:

Captivep
6th Sep 2013, 15:00
Onetrack - sorry, not convinced.

Deja vu has been explained as an anomaly of memory, caused by a brief glimpse of something before the brain has constructed the whole picture. Every time you've had deja vu (and I include myself in this) you can't remember the context in whch it happened "before".

The Australian sailor? It's hardly a surprise that a wartime sailor's wife has a nightmare about her husband on a raft. It the times were the same (and my suspicion would be that they really weren't - perhaps the same night, even the same week) then, a coincidence.

A woman passenger who was terrified of flying and then her plane crashed? What about the millions of people who confidently expect that their planes won't crash, and then they don't! Why is her "vision" more spooky than theirs? Not to mention those who are convinced they will die in a blazing fireball and then don't...


Abraham Lincoln's death dream? Many people dream of death. And, even in this story, he doesn't dream of his own death; he dreams of a President's death - not the same thing.

ER - Let me get this right. You saw the lights turn to amber (which is when you're meant to stop anyway) and then someone else jumped the cross lights (which road you should have been looking at anyway to check it was clear), bearing in mind you were still a distance away from the lights? And somehow that stopped you being involved in an incident that "might" have involved your son? Well, was it or wasn't it? Was he driving the other car?

500N
6th Sep 2013, 15:02
That sixth sense is interesting.

Have had it a number of times when hunting, that something
is watching (hunting) you etc. I have also been told this by
people who hunt things that hunt back.

Cacophonix
6th Sep 2013, 15:05
An interesting take on that sense of being watched... it is a very useful survival skill...

How you know eyes are watching you | Psychology Today (http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-narcissus-in-all-us/201102/how-you-know-eyes-are-watching-you)

Caco

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 15:48
An interesting take on that sense of being watched... it is a very useful survival skill...


survival :confused:

I only sense that when I'm standing at the urinal.

500N
6th Sep 2013, 15:56
Caco
Very interesting reading.
The bit about predators in true.

probes
6th Sep 2013, 16:15
as for the ones that 'hunt back', 500N, I've heard that when hunting for tigers, one hunter should always keep his eyes backwards, because the tiger will sniff you, come behind you and start hunting for you?

Dunno. But if the gadgets are able to send signals wireless, why wouldn't the brain be? There are even TV-sets with double pictures now, so why wouldn't some people see more than most? :E ...the Multi-View capability. The capability means that two people in the same room can watch two different programs at the same time on the same screen using Multi-View glasses and earbuds to provide stereo sound.

500N
6th Sep 2013, 16:20
Probes

A lot of animals that hunt back wait for you to pass and come from behind or
as you say, just hunt you from behind full stop.

Thankfully, Tiger hunting is not allowed any more.

Now the tigers hunt people - a few "man eaters" have been shot
in the last few years which is a shame.

ShyTorque
6th Sep 2013, 17:44
Some years back while operating as Flight Mech on a 747 freighter I was sound asleep in a crew bunk,suddenly woke up and thought we had a hydraulic failure.I went to the flight deck,checked the pressure and quantity gauges which were normal. Felt stupid and started to tell the F/E why I was there when # 3 hyd. low pressure light came on and both quantity and pressure fell to zero.There is no explanation except coincidence.

Oh yes there is. You're a jinx! ;)

bcgallacher
6th Sep 2013, 18:30
That sounds like the only rational explanation - never thought of that one!

TBirdFrank
6th Sep 2013, 19:19
OK - I'm no superstitious type or religious nut - BUT - explain this.......

Many years ago I am returning from London and strolling through the ticket hall at Piccadilly station to get to the stairs down to Store Street where we routinely parked our car.

I put my hand in my pocket to get the car keys and clear as day a voice in my head said "I wouldn't bother - it isn't there"

I walked out of the station and down the stairs - and it wasn't!

We had great fun with Greater Manchester's finest over the next two weeks before I got my £125 pound fee back - but there is still no explanation for that voice!

Captivep
7th Sep 2013, 12:17
TBird

It's simple; you have just forgotten all those times when you've had similar "premonitions" and they haven't come true.

Nervous SLF
7th Sep 2013, 12:42
I seem to remember that only a small percentage of a human brain is actually used ( 15% ? ) so who knows what happens with
the remaining part ( 85% ? ) Most people seem to agree that gifted people are more skilful at things than others, think musicians,
artists writers etc so why shouldn't ESP be in some but not others ?

cattletruck
7th Sep 2013, 13:27
It's simple; you have just forgotten all those times when you've had similar "premonitions" and they haven't come true.

Captivep that is so true. I think that thought all the time as I own a car that is desirably easy to steal and much preferred by the chop shops. Fortunately that premonition has not yet come true.

FerrypilotDK
7th Sep 2013, 17:27
To Captivep and rest of the "Solid-feet-on-the-ground-I-don´t-"believe it" crowd. (http://www.pprune.org/members/197416-captivep)

Have any of your read the fabulous series written by C.S.Lewis called the Chronicles of Narnia? This brilliant man wrote great truths in what were disguised as children´s books. In the dedication to his niece Lucy (and so he used the name as one of the little girls in the books as well) he points out that it has taken him a long time to write the first book. Perhaps she is now too old to enjoy it. But that one day, she would be old enough again! In the last book, after having been betrayed, the dwarves are adament to not be fooled again. As it is, they are in Paradise, but living in the dark. So the kind people try to give them food, which they complain about and describe as rubbish. They prefer to keep their eyes closed and remain in darkness.

Anyway......part of the problem you seem to have, is not being aware of the ultimate reality. That is that there is in fact no time and space. Your physics are probably at O-level and so you never got into the higher theoretical physics, which reads more and more like esoteric literature.

It is difficult to imagine, but try--Imagine that what I said is correct. You would be inundated with perceptions and noise to such a degree, that you could not cope. So what we call time and space has been created to assist us. When something really terrible can happen, like death, accidents, etc some people tap the unity (Reality) and access parts of the wholeness and that explains how they see their husband on the raft, how she tells him to hang on, how the accident is avoided, allows a woman to pick up a car and pull a child out and any number of inexplicable things.

Try not to be dwarf-like and close yourself off from these realities, because there is no reason to be afraid of being tricked.....the darkness is not a natural state. Be TRULY scientific and keep an open mind, not needing to explain everything rationally, because ration is only ONE tool.

Many scientists have related how they "saw" the solution to a problem. Then they spent months in labs doing science to arrive at the solution they saw in intuition. That is another powerful tool. So open up to it and it grows, like an exercised muscle.

I had a friend who woke to what anyone would call a ghost, opening the door and walking into the room, over to her and looked down at her. She screamed bloody murder and her husband came running into the room. (she was sleeping apart from him, as they had a small baby and she had been up to feed it, then not wanting to disturb him, she lay down in the living room)

Anyway, he is a doctor and had rational explanations. She is a dentist and just as rational, but it bothered her a lot, as she KNEW what she saw. Turns out that the house was a farmhouse that had been owned by a man that lived alone and tended his cows. He would go out to the stalls in the very early morning and feed them. Then he would come back in, feed the fire and sleep for a couple hours before milking. ......right where she was lying down!

One of the neighbours had a photo of the man....and of course.

To EVERYONE else, she said later "I was dreaming....." partly because she simply doesn´t have a framework to believe in "ghosts." But then she said to me, quietly "but I wasn´t."

No amount of stories will ever change the dwarf´s mind though.

God....this is so off aviation topics! n

Captivep
8th Sep 2013, 21:32
Ferrypilot DK

Actually, my physics education is at PhD level....

Just kidding! It was really a C grade O level and I haven't read any CS Lewis either.

However, I don't consider myself (or any other rational person) to be a "dwarf" in any context. Thanks for being so condescending though...:O

FerrypilotDK
8th Sep 2013, 23:33
That the dwarves in the book happened to be the ones representing rationality, was not meant to be condescending. I suppose it could have been unicorns, but somehow that wouldn´t quite have made sense, so to speak!

OK......try this then. A film called "The Sunset Limited" with Tommy Lee Jones and Samuel L Jackson. Not exactly what we are discussing now, but might be easier than getting you to read 7 "children´s books."

Remember the story of the blind men and the elephant? How can one argue with a man holding on to the elephant´s ear and based on his first hand, personal experience, claiming that an elephant is very much like a palm tree. He is absolutely right, in a limited sense. Just trying to open up the possibility that an elephant is also very much like a tree for the man holding the leg, a snake for the man holding the tail and a house, for the man feeling the side of the elephant. They are all giving their first-hand, personal experience and more than anything, they are angry when the see-er seer, says "you are all right." Because as long as they hold to their limited experience, how can we all be right?

cattletruck
9th Sep 2013, 05:31
how can we all be right?

Cue cattletruck's favourite quote that he invented himself:

"We are all right, therefore we are all wrong, therefore we are all right".

I don't drink much, promise.

deefer dog
9th Sep 2013, 07:10
I was about twenty years young at the time and driving my dad's pride and joy (1600GT Capri) way too fast along a dual carriage way. I crested a hill and could see the road ahead for about two miles, completely clear of traffic, and I floored it!

In the distance below I noted the smoke from stubble burning drifting across the road, and from my vantage point above could see that it was obscuring only about 100 feet of the dead straight carriageway. There were no cars in front of the smoke, and none beyond it.....I decided to blat through it as fast as I could!

At the very last moment a voice called out and told me to stop! I hit the brakes, screeched almost to a halt, and drove at a snails pace through the think blanket of blue smoke....before bumping, very gently, into a Ford Anglia!

probes
10th Sep 2013, 07:21
I know that I am walking towards a frightening goal which is assigned to me by Destiny… I shall leave like smoke that drifts away, my soul will flee through a tiny little opening in my heart.
Said Empress Elisabeth of Austria, a day before she was stabbed in heart - Sept. 10, 1898.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fd/Erzsebet_kiralyne_photo_1867.jpg/131px-Erzsebet_kiralyne_photo_1867.jpg

Captivep
10th Sep 2013, 12:38
Deefer do - that voice was your brain telling you to use common sense.

probes
10th Sep 2013, 13:45
yeah, but think of the many who never had that? :E

SpringHeeledJack
10th Sep 2013, 16:33
Deefer do - that voice was your brain telling you to use common sense

But why would the brain talk to you in a voice ? Most of our thinking (controlled by our brains hopefully) doesn't involve a 'voice' it just happens. You analyse a situation and react, or not, as the case may be. I've had the 'voice' many times in my life and it seems to be distinct from my own thoughts and thinking process. As to whether this is a part of my consciousness/unconsciousness or an energy from without, who knows. My feeling is that it is to do with the latter, though not provable through scientific means. Each time it's happened the situation has been potentially dangerous to me, but not perhaps one of those life threatening situations where the senses are buzzing at crazy speeds.

As this is an aviation forum, here's a simple one. I was a passenger on a flight some years back and was asleep. The steward was coming along serving drinks and the rattling of the cart woke me up, though I wasn't properly awake. A voice (in my head ;) ) said very calmly (the voice is always calm) "He's about to spill coffee onto your lap". I then became awake and a few seconds later a momentary bump from turbulence caused the steward to tip the cup of coffee he was serving to someone in the next row all over my stomach and lap......Stupidly I didn't press for compensation :hmm::rolleyes:



SHJ

Effluent Man
10th Sep 2013, 17:30
I'm an Atheist,don't believe in ghosts etc but I have had one experience that was pretty weird.I had a chap who worked for me on a casual basis,driving etc.We got to spend quite a lot of time together and got on really well.He was thirty years older than me and a Normandy Veteran with the Guards Armoured Division.I suppose we had more a father/son relationship and we went on holiday with him and his wife a few times.

In his early 60's he developed angina.Not especially bad and used to take the odd tablet.One day I was sitting at work when I got an really bad pain in my chest.If I had not only been 35 I would have been convinced that I was having a heart attack.About an hour later his wife called and told me that he had collapsed and died,about an hour before.