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lomapaseo
5th Sep 2013, 22:07
This may appear to be the wrong forum but to be honest I trust the quick answers I can get here than other forums.

I suspect there are employee agreements that cover this within each airline but not generally known to outsiders like myself.

For business purposes I need to rely on my clients but I am unsure of my bounds for negotiating specific airlines to carry me to Asia

How can I find this out before even starting the negotiations?

Dushan
5th Sep 2013, 22:23
What exactly is the question? It is unclear, from your statements, what you are asking.

But just to speed things up in the JB fashion here are a few possible answers.

It is GWB's fault.
The aircraft will/will not take off from the conveyor belt.
Amsricans are late to the conflict.
Americans come too early to the conflict and screw things up.
I voted for Obama, then, but now I see what a foole I was.
If GWB knew that all it takes to get France's approval is to have a SECSTAT that speaks French he would have fired Condi. She only spoke Russian.

The SSK
5th Sep 2013, 22:51
I have staff travel privileges
Would you like me to register you as my nominated travel partner?
You would have to negotiate with Mrs SSK to be her 'replacement'.
It's all worthless anyway because all the flights are full and Standby = Stranded

Wxgeek
5th Sep 2013, 23:11
Employee travel is usually a fingernail biting suspense thriller 30 minutes prior to t/o followed by angry disappointment when they announce the flight is full. Load factors on the mother airline at 89.5% this summer means when you want to go somewhere so does everyone else.

I agree standby=stranded. Is it really cheaper than a confirmed seat after you are paying for a hotel room and a couple restaurant meals?

Hanging out at airports is something I need to get paid. No pay = run away.

Dushan :Amsricans are late to the conflict.

An American originally from Costa Rica? Puerto Rica?

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 01:10
What exactly is the question? It is unclear, from your statements, what you are asking.


I guess I screwed that up :)

I wanted to ask only about staff travel on airline business. In such cases would an airline have agreements with most other airlines for free or discounted travel? Or would they likely have none? If the answer is only agreements with a select few how would I find out what airlines they have reciprocal agreements like this?

http://fromtheflightdeck.com/MEL/1/Alteringmycourse.jpg

Cacophonix
6th Sep 2013, 01:19
lomapasseo

The whole thing is quid pro quo... (as you know)....

There is no such thing as a free lunch nor helping your mortal enemy on a highly compettive route unless there is some logical upside.

Think game theory.

Caco

probes
6th Sep 2013, 06:25
You would have to negotiate with Mrs SSK to be her 'replacement'.
Wow, that's negotiable, then? :8 Any pre-requirements to start the process?

ExSp33db1rd
6th Sep 2013, 08:45
Would you like me to register you as my nominated travel partner?

Don't start me.

Yes, every airline has a different policy and Staff Travel is like Miners' Coal, or Supermarket discounts for staff, or a Company Car, or other "perks" a fact of life and not obscene - as many who don't qualify try to attest. ( If you want my perks do my job )

B.A have recently moved the goalposts and as of 1st April (an auspicious day ?) will kick out many of their old, loyal, hard working retired pensioners from the 'concession' of Staff Travel, but, serving staff can now take a 'Travel Partner' who can be someone who has not given a lifetime of service to the airline, never worked a day for them but just happens to 'know' someone who does, and ............that employee can change that 'friend' every 6 months, so an employee who starts to work for B.A .at age 20, and retires at age 65 can theoretically take 90 total strangers around the World on freebies during his working life and into retirement, whereas those of us who ......... oh what's the point, nobody cares.

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 14:07
Well I didn't get the answers that I was expecting but that is part of the learning process. :)

For me it's not a question of free holiday travel, it's purely airline business.

So far the best I could hope for would be the ability to use one of the airline's partners. I figure that at least they have interline agreements on sharing the routes. If I could use a partner airline I could shave 6-7 hours or more off the journey time

mutt
6th Sep 2013, 16:13
From a business point of view, the answer is no. When we negotiate with contractors we expect them to provide a budget estimate for travel, that way they get to choose the airline/class that satisfies their business rules. We have no way of saying to airline XYZ, " hey can you give us a free ticket for this vendor"....

Mutt

Capetonian
6th Sep 2013, 16:25
The irony of airline ID travel, especially when youwork in Revenue Management, Distribution, or Marketing is that a perk of the job is 'free' travel (which isn't) mostly on a standby basis if there are empty seats at flight closure time. If you do your job properly, every seat will be occupied by the right passenger paying the right fare at the right time, so the better you do your job the less likely you are to get your 'free' perk.

As someone once said, it's like being a prostitute, the better you are the more they screw you!

lomapaseo
6th Sep 2013, 22:37
From a business point of view, the answer is no. When we negotiate with contractors we expect them to provide a budget estimate for travel, that way they get to choose the airline/class that satisfies their business rules. We have no way of saying to airline XYZ, " hey can you give us a free ticket for this vendor"....

Mutt

I'd be happy to adopt a practice like this but I need to understand it better

Somewhat unclear to me is the personal pronoun of "we"

What if the business is a foreign airline and I am the contractor? Should I just expect them to accept or decline my travel estimate based on class of service without specific knowledge or limitations on what airline I choose to enter their country?

I'm just trying to be politically correct here while still remaining flexible.

In past years the government use to pay for my flights but had some general guidelines about using only government approved airlines which I continually flaunted when I visited another countries airline.

ExSp33db1rd
6th Sep 2013, 22:53
If it's "Airline Business" then I'd expect the "Airline" to negotiate a seat - one way or another ?

B.A. make it very clear that the use of Staff Travel is strictly for personal convenience and in no way to be connected with any business,trade or commercial enterprise, and many have been thrown out of the "club" because they infringed the perception of "personal" travel for "holiday" purposes (define "holiday" ) just as me and many of my colleagues are about to be thrown out because we have passed our "use by" date - in the eyes of the present bean counters. Barstewards.

Guess which airline I won't be giving my hard earned beans to after next April !

Farrell
6th Sep 2013, 23:00
I took staff travel once, which resulted in two days of standby downroute from home base.

It will never, ever happen again. It is not a perk. It's a pain in the proverbial.

Farrell

Pitts2112
6th Sep 2013, 23:07
And about time BA changed that policy, too, because it condemned single staff to either traveling alone or never getting to use this perq like couples. At one time, the travel partner had to be a spouse, which was even more archaic.

If every person who is entitled to the perq is allowed to take someone with them on a trip, why does the airline, or any of its staff, care who that accompanying person is? A person's a person, unless someone wants to judge the nature of the relationship or something.

SMT Member
6th Sep 2013, 23:56
Tried this non-rev malarky once, many many moons ago. Working for a handling agent, someone had bagged us staff the lowest possible priority non-rev tickets on BA, against a discount on the ground handling. Booked CPH-LHR-BKK and back, flew J out and J home, on the flights I had originally planned, with not a single delay. Have been told many times since that is statistically impossible, but I'm still here to tell the tale.

Fast forward some, many actually, years and we're two guys off to IST for some shopping, was in October or November so hardly peak season. Ended up stranded in MUC on the way down, spending an extra day in IST on the way back due over-booking, and got stranded in FRA as well. All that to 'save' around 200 EUR combined; we blew 3 times that on hotels and meals.

Never gone done it again.

Pitts2112
7th Sep 2013, 02:05
Similar happened when you were airline staff at a legacy airline, until you had about 40 years in and enough seniority that you had priority over all other staff. Anything less than that on popular routes/times just wasn't worth the effort.

UniFoxOs
7th Sep 2013, 09:10
two days of standby downroute from home base

Three days at SFO once, as one of our lot had the bright idea of selling a load of returns to LHR at half price.

Had to take a flight to Chicago once instead of Miami, as even paying standby pax were waiting 2/3 days to get away.

OTOH managed to get to Christchurch and back (3 sectors each way) on all the same flights as MIL who had an Apex ticket. Just as well - I remember seeing her sat in her own little world in LAX totally oblivious to the boarding calls for our flight.

Checkboard
7th Sep 2013, 10:15
Yes, every airline has a different policy and Staff Travel is like Miners' Coal, or Supermarket discounts for staff, or a Company Car, or other "perks" a fact of life and not obscene - as many who don't qualify try to attest. ( If you want my perks do my job )

It seems that the policy has suddenly become obscene to you Ex-SB :)

... and you don't do your job. ;)

ExSp33db1rd
7th Sep 2013, 22:15
No, the policy of any Company Perks isn't obscene to me at all, and although I don't do my job now - I wish I did, I'd get a day off once a week ! - the concept of rebate travel for life, even in retirement, was one constantly dangled before us as an incentive to be good boys and do our best for the Company, and in my case an expressed inducement to respond to their then request to accept early retirement to assist with the Stock Market flotation, re-iterated that concept.

The goal posts have now been retrospectively moved, and although not written as such, in fact target the older, least remunerated pensioners least able to resist or adapt to the changes due to the sheer dynamics of ageing.

No, I'm not happy - why should I be, the barstewards have screwed me.

I have a barrister working on the principle of "Legitimate Expectation" which apparently is a legal concept, but my fingers aren't crossed.

Tray Surfer
7th Sep 2013, 23:30
I seriously dislike using my concessions.

I rarely use them.

I am using my annual free ticket to go on holiday later this year, and plan to use it once next year on a standby to go somewhere in Europe... But, I usually just pay for flights either on Hotline or regular commercial fares.

Vercingetorix
8th Sep 2013, 02:19
Most folk seem to book ID 90% in economy class so they are normally the first ones to get bumped off should the load factor increase.
ID 90% business class is not a lot more expensive than ID 90% economy with much less chance of getting bumped off.
With ID 90% business you get moved to economy and the ID 90% economy gets the cold shower.
Staff travel is generally most effective when only one person travels, with two it becomes much more difficult.
Generally staff travel is a pain in the arse.
As mentioned in a previous post buying tickets is my preferred option.

Cheers:ok:

Checkboard
8th Sep 2013, 09:54
I work for a company with pretty rubbish staff travel (as we fill up with paying passengers) - and No reciprocal deals with any other airline (no ID90 anywhere).

The wife and I are travelling to Australia and back from the UK, and have decided on First Class - we must be the only two airline pilots in the world paying full fare for that!