Just in - India approve massive Bi-lateral

[fliion]

Breaking news...cabinet approves quadrupling of seats.

India cabinet OKs increasing airline seats to UAE | Reuters (http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/09/03/india-uae-airlines-idINL4N0GZ2VC20130903)

Get ready for more India...and you heard it here first...(hinted on Dubai Eye this week)

The IPO of Emirates & DNATA to fund expedited move to DWC - no other source of 100bn needed with GFC bond creditors due payments in 2015/16

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[Kiwikid]

So do any of these extra seats get allocated to Emirates or just the airline that cannot be discussed?

[fliion]

Reuters:

"Under the bilateral agreement, designated carriers of both countries will be allowed to add 36,670 seats per week over three years to 2015, to the current entitlement of 13,600."

From the UAE side presumably - EY,EK,FZ & G9

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[pilotday]

Hello Tomorrow; Hello 2 class 380's to India.

[glofish]

Good news!
The whale will finally make some money. It's the perfect people-mover-route.

With guys riding the roof, it will make a nice picture ...... :}

[Kapitanleutnant]

Two class???

Wouldn't surprise me if a few 380's come in as one class "India Specials" at
800-900 seats total. :ooh:

[cyrilroy21]

The article above is slightly misleading

India actually signed a pact with Abu Dhabi (not the UAE ) to increase the seats between India and Abu Dhabi from the present 13,700 to to 50,000 seats in a staggered manner

The UAE is the only country in the world where India has Bilateral agreements with each individual Emirate rather than the whole country

India - Dubai sector already enjoys 54,000 seats and EK has been clamouring for an additional 50,000 seats since 2010 but the Govt has been sitting on their application for quite some time
Only if the more Indian carriers want to fly to Dubai will the Govt give in to more seats ( which seems likely by the way as the Indian Carriers too seems to have almost exhausted their quota )

The article below should give a more accurate picture

Govt approves India-Abu Dhabi air services accord; enhances number of seats to 50,000 per week - The Economic Times (http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/govt-approves-india-abu-dhabi-air-services-accord-enhances-number-of-seats-to-50000-per-week/articleshow/22262203.cms)

[fatbus]

This latest plays into the on going deal between Jet and EY, just a thought. Not a Hugh change, who knows.

[vfenext]

Who cares?

[ironbutt57]

more airplanes full of hygenically challenged passengers crowding the already overloaded Indian ATC system

[Wannabe Flyer]

Way I look at it Jet will now feed EY for onwards routes westwards as well as Africa and ME. Jet will sell its slots at Heathrow and in the US to EY and shut down Brussels. Will get rid of its long haul clunkers that are not being filled and become a feeder airline for EY outbound and Jet will become a EY inwards distributor.

So net loss will be EK and Brussels as a hub as Jet will leverage its partnership with EY to lower cost of its hub and increase inside India load and feed EY. EY in turn will get guaranteed traffic westwards which it is struggling to get from an otherwise boring Abu Dabhi layover....Co lateral damage might be Turkish, Gulf and Qatar......

[vfenext]

Wannabe, methinks you think too much!

[fatbus]

Vfe , time to chill mate!

[masalama]

This article and the related news on India-UAE bilaterals do have future implications on ME carriers , there's no denying that.India is and will be a very crucial market for the ME giants .

But what I find a bit un-settling is the attitude of many of our professional colleagues , tongue-in-cheek I'm hoping , which border on racism,insensitivity and gross generalization. Some of the examples so far are:

the A380 which was purpose-built for hauling slave-ship loads

With guys riding the roof, it will make a nice picture ......

more airplanes full of hygenically challenged passengers crowding the already overloaded Indian ATC system

Now, there's no denying the fact that a lot of poor , under-paid, over-worked ,uneducated labourers use the airline you work for to travel between the sub-continent and the middle east and it can be a very difficult task at times for you and your crew dealing with them. But can you generalize every sub-continental person as that? You really don't understand the demographic that you're dealing with I'm afraid if that's the case..

Today, Mr.XYZ might have difficulty in understanding how the toilet in an aircraft works or what is the general etiquette and manners when flying , but if you take the time to explain to your crew to treat these passengers with respect as you would anyone and sensitize yourself and your crew to these "special " passengers and try and "communicate" with them, I'm quite certain XYZ would move out of the "special" handling list in a few trips.

The airline that cannot be named has made a smart , calculated and in my opinion a good long term investment that guarantees them a large chunk of the Indian market and the remaining ME carriers will have to scramble to get the rest.

One needs to understand that it's going to be a cut-throat market in the not too distant future and Mr. XYZ who lives in Al Qouz industrial Area # 4 and visits his family once a year after saving (slaving) his hard earned dirhams will also be an important customer for your airline.

My intention is not to create a slug fest but for people to introspect . Do you and your crew see the poorly dressed , fumbling, large suitcase carrying person walk down the aero-bridge and think , " here's my next paycheck , how can I make his trip memorable and comfortable , and maybe assist him in understanding this unfamiliar environment so that he will continue to use my airline ???

The years to come will decide on how much a difference attitudes make in changing the fortunes of these maga carriers.....
masalama:ok:

[falconeasydriver]

Now I would be the first to admit, that at times I could be accused of a bit of cultural insensitivity, but by the same token, I take people as I find them. Lie or cheat me, then you are fair game, pay my wages on the other hand then you deserve a little bit of added respect and leeway.

Well said masalama, the airline who we doth never to mention again has indeed invested/negotiated wisely.

[ironbutt57]

One might suspect it is the onward connections that generate revenue for most carriers...India is indeed a very competitive market

[fliion]

Cyrilroy,

I stand to be corrected but by my reading I believe it's a 'Nation to Nation' agreement ie UAE - India.

There is no way AUH would increase their rights fourfold and let DXB simmer. Even if that's what they internally wanted - it is not how the region works. It would be a gross violation of the 'norms of respect' between brotherly entities - but again this just my opinion.

Masalama - great post and very well said.

Although our frustrations manifest themselves into vituperative outbursts on anonymous (wishful thinking on our parts ; > ) web boards....

...we should never bite the hand that feeds us...our customers.

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[Gutter Airways]

LongLander, cultural sensitivity is a part of our job, as is a good attitude. Please don't spout generalised hatred or think too much of yourself, just because you hold a higher status in society to those you are looking down upon.

A wise person once said, to know the true character of a person, give them power.

They didn't choose their life, neither did you choose yours. We are all different but the same. Show some compassion and open your mind.

[Wannabe Flyer]

@Vfenext

Your comment should have read methinks you read a lot and this is why.

If you browse thru articles from the past few months leading to this deal you will see

1) Jet has sold its slots to EY at heathrow
2) Jet has leased out its 777 to THY on a wet lease
3) Jet is ordering / replacing primarily its 737 fleet

I have no inside information but this is prudent business sense as I do not see EY gaining financially much from the revenue and profitability streams within India which is loss making for most airlines. It is a pure and simple feeder game plan.

Time will tell on this but this is how the sequence as envisioned by me goes

1) Cut throat rates on routes between India and England, Manchester, Paris and some other European destinations especially in Business class

2) Cut throat rates between India and MENA.

3) Some innovative routes from B and C cities via Abu Dhabi to the above destinations giving better connectivity by bypassing BOM and DEL

56K seats a week if flown by a 737 is almost 43 additional flights a week......

For all those with comments on smells, hygiene etc. Just remember the color of money is the same.

[cyrilroy21]

Cyrilroy,

I stand to be corrected but by my reading I believe it's a 'Nation to Nation' agreement ie UAE - India.

There is no way AUH would increase their rights fourfold and let DXB simmer. Even if that's what they internally wanted - it is not how the region works. It would be a gross violation of the 'norms of respect' between brotherly entities - but again this just my opinion.


Like I said earlier , India signs the Bilaterals with each Individual Emirate , nobody knows why things run like this with respect to the UAE alone
( Some under the table dealings are of suspect at the corridors of power in New Delhi but you didnt hear that from me :E )

Dubai already enjoys 54000 seats a week . You can count the number of seats flying into India by EK to verify it . Fly Dubai occupies a small portion of those seats

Abu Dhabi at present is only entitled to 13000 ( approx ) seats per week . With the new bilateral they will now come on par with Dubai in 3 years time