The Boneyard, Arizona

[Dengue_Dude]

If, like me, you have an endless fascination for old and not so old aircraft, the co-ordinates below will take you to the Boneyard.

I've been unable to find it up to now and was probably the last person on the planet not knowing EXACTLY where it was. But just in case there is another numbskull out there, try here:

N32 09.1 and W110 50.5 or if you want it simpler, Google Pima Air Museum and track Northeast by about a mile.

Google Earth piccies are brilliant and well worth a look. There is an absolute mess of military hardware (and one or two P3s that could replace our Nimrods, when Scotland goes independent).

[shawshank]

We don't have any Nimrods to replace:ugh:

[thunderbird7]

And if you go round the right bit of the fence, all the Harriers are there, wrapped up in clingfilm. Got some pics somewhere, will try and post them. Brings a tear to the eye.

[smujsmith]

Blimey, I'm thinking that there's more capability parked up there than we have had in the past 20 years or so. Impressive place.

Smudge :ok:

[Easy Street]

AMARG History (http://www.dm.af.mil/shared/media/document/AFD-081208-047.doc) and Website (http://www.dm.af.mil/units/amarc.asp)

Fascinating place. If you ever visit Tucson it is well worth going to Pima Air and Space Museum just to get on the regular bus tours of the Boneyard. If you can't go, these bus tour pics (http://deanoinamerica.wordpress.com/2012/02/09/the-boneyard-at-davis-monthan-air-force-base/) are pretty comprehensive!

Here's one you can't pick out on the satpics...

http://deanoinamerica.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/stealth-fighter-joke.jpg?w=614&h=460

[500N]

Easy

That is very funny.

Someone obviously has a good sense of humour.

[Bob Viking]

I remember the day I took the tour around AMARC (I was on detachment at DM - the locals thought we'd brought our jets for storage!) there were 4382 aircraft on the books. Not sure why I remember the number but our brains are a strange thing.
It did get me thinking though. If the UK had a field big and dry enough for all of our old aircraft from let's say 1960 onwards (similar vintage to the US facility) how many would there be? I can honesty say I have absolutely no idea but I'd love it if someone in the know could make an educated guess.
BV

[hoodie]

Easy

That is very funny.

Someone obviously has a good sense of humour.

500N, in a similar vein:

http://militaryhumor.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/military-humor-funny-joke-airforce-next-generation-stealth-fighter.jpg

:)

[500N]

Hoodie

Thanks. Always good to have a laugh at the start of the day :O :ok:

[Ali Barber]

What exactly is the point of the boneyard, other than to look good on Google Earth?

[SASless]

It provides a Reserve of aircraft that can mobilized and as a huge source of spare parts.

A recent example.....the USMC brought back into service some CH-53D's to make up for some shortfall and were able to do so in a fairly short time.

DM is also the source for F-4's for use as Target Drones.

Plus......a lot of Soda Pop cans are made from the scrapped airframes!

[bakseetblatherer]

32.161474, -110.858915

One of the dead planes is alive!

[JimNtexas]

They've converted the last F-4 to a target. They are starting to convert F-16's to targets now.

[500N]

The good thing is the US don't just crush them straight away
and reading the various info a fair few end up in Museums
which is more can be said for the UK.

Or as mentioned above, occasionally put back into service,
either as normal use or as drones.

[5 Forward 6 Back]

which is more can be said for the UK.

I remember being told that the Boneyard was sited where it was because the desert climate's perfect for maintaining aircraft in a decent state.

We've got a handful of air conditioned hangars around with a few aircraft in them, but where would we put, say, an entire fleet of Jags or F3s?

[500N]

Build a Hangar
Fly them to the Boneyard
Think outside the square - everything, like in Aus seems to be too hard
although in sayng that, the Aus Gov't did at least get the F111's right.

or how about farming at least one or two of them out to Museums
or even a gate guard instead of crunching them.

But then again, does the UK use old aircraft again line the US does,
either as drones, re used as original or as spare parts.

It seems in the US, even if the mainstream stop using an aircraft
NASA and others still seem to keep a few going.

[BEagle]

.....(and one or two P3s that could replace our Nimrods, when Scotland goes independent).

Both such notions are equally unlikely.

[Dysonsphere]

And remember thats where the Caf'S B29 came from, flew down in a B24 with tool kits and worked over 5 B29's missed off inventory and finally flew FIFI back for full restoration. So it is a usefull place in 20 yeard someone will be reclaiming the last B52 or Harrier.

[500N]

Dyson

Is that written up anywhere ?

Sounds like a good story.

[Easy Street]

It's not just drones, occasional specialist aircraft or museum pieces that make a comeback from the Boneyard. ISTR that large numbers of A-10s were brought back into service from there post-GW1 when the USAF realised that it was actually a very useful aircraft. The Boneyard gives the US the ability to 'hibernate' capability in a meaningful way - without the finality of turning aircraft into razor blades before the ink dries on a decision to retire them!

[Not_a_boffin]

You don't need google earth. These sites have a perfectly good inventory..

AMARC Experience - AMARC Experience (http://amarcexperience.com/ui/)

http://www.amarc.info/

[500N]

Interesting article on the place with good facts and figures.

Living Boneyard (http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2013/February%202013/0213boneyard.aspx)


Somewhere I read 25% of what has arrived at the Boneyard has been
returned to flying status.

[Dengue_Dude]

Apparently 'NASA' (a euphemism?) have recovered a couple of R/WB57 (Canberra derivative) - well the ones with the grossly extended wings.

You can see a couple or three of those parked too . . .

BEags - I was being ironic about the Scottish MPA, they could even be painted blue . . .

[kintyred]

Not exactly a boneyard but last I knew many of the HASs at Strawberry were chock full of interesting hardware being stored "just in case".

[Tashengurt]

There was a boneyard of sorts at Dhahran that I would nose around.
Contained Sabres, Shooting stars, a Convair as well as the less intact remains of an Eagle or two and an IDS Tonka.


Posted from Pprune.org App for Android

[ex-fast-jets]

For what it is worth - a story........

I was on exchange with the USN at China Lake, 1978-81.

I was in the Officers Club bar one evening, and detected an english accent. As I was the only Brit that I knew of in the area at the time, I chatted to the stranger, who declared that he was from the Imperial War Museum and had come to China Lake to look for a B-29A - to represent an aircraft that the RAF had flown during WW2. There were several skeletons sitting in the desert on the undershoot of one of the runways.

He chose one to take back to the UK - the significance of the 29A was, as I understand, that the wings were bolted onto the fuselage, so could be removed for transportation by road to the west coast and then to the UK by sea.

After a few Californian beers, I declared him to be a wimp, as the previous two aircraft had been flown out from China Lake - one for the the Confederate Air Force, and the other for, I think, Yesterday's Air Force.

Several months later, he returned, and told me that he had chosen the airframe that he wanted, and after a bit of consideration, had decided that it would be cheaper to fly it back to the UK on a one flight basis, rather than ship it back by road and sea.

I claimed the right to a seat on the aircraft for the return flight, which he seemed to accept without any difficulty.

He asked me if I would like to see the airframe he had chosen.

Naturally, I said yes, so we drove into the desert to look at it.

From a distance or several hundred yards, I reversed my request for a seat on the return flight.

The metal structure looked fine, but the rest of it was pretty sad!! It was full of tumbleweed, the glazed units were all knackered, and it looked like a home for the local sidewinder snakes!!

They connected batteries to the engines, provided fuel and oil - and the engines worked OK.

So they dragged the aircraft from the desert, spent several months working on it, replaced the plexiglas bits and all the rubber bits which had deteriorated in the desert sun, and then flew it to Phoenix to get instrumentation and FAA/CAA approval for one-flight to get it back to the UK.

When it departed from China Lake - after some 40 years in the desert - it did a climbing 270 turn over the field before heading for Phoenix - and looked and sounded terrific.

For those so inclined, it brought tears to the eyes!!

[500N]

BomberH

Good story.

I would liked to have seen his face when you said
"After a few Californian beers, I declared him to be a wimp,"

:O

Englishmen don't always take kindly to people being up front
with forthright opinions, right or otherwise :O


Edit
I wonder where the B29 ended up in the UK. Anyone know ?

[The Toilet Tester]

I think you will find, that it is currently on display at the Imperial War Museum, Duxford.

[500N]

Thanks

Just down the road from me they have a B something being restored.

I'll look it up.


It's a B-24

Home | B-24 Liberator Restoration Australia (http://b24australia.org.au/home.html)

[Alber Ratman]

Pima was well worth going to, I was on the same det as BV. We were on the guided tour around the lines, when the tour guide said "And now we come to what I think is the ugliest aircraft in our collection, and it is British! "(as the Gannet comes into view) . One of the American punters pipes up "Hey man, you can't say that, there are Brits on the tour!" Instant reply from myself "Doesn't bother us mate, it's Navy!":E

[Bob Viking]

Al.
Did you get treated to the sight of swarms of bees crawling all over some old T37s?
Not sure if they were the African killer variety but I stayed we'll clear.
BV

[500N]

Interesting looking at the stats of aircraft and arrival dates.

They only have a couple of F-111's (the Australian one's were crushed
and buried so they didn't go have to back to the US).

No 117's, U2's or such like spy or stealth planes.

And one or a couple of the Mig 15, 17 and 21's.

[ozbiggles]

I don't believe Aussies or Brits need a boneyard for their Aircraft.
More often than not the museum pieces are still our frontline aircraft.

[Not_a_boffin]

They've had a real go at some of the fleets - in many cases to prevent spares trafficking.

600-odd F14s built, 402 made it to AMARC, ten remain.

[scarecrow450]

Not exactly a boneyard but last I knew many of the HASs at Strawberry were chock full of interesting hardware being stored "just in case".
Mmm replacement Hawks for the reds, Tucano's, Gazelle's and 3 ex RN Merlins !

[Biggus]

HASs at Shawberry - Isn't that where we keep the UKs crashed UFOs, on the basis we can't afford anything as swish as Area 51?

Must go, the doorbells ringing.......

[Dunky]

Pima was well worth going to, I was on the same det as BV. We were on the guided tour around the lines, when the tour guide said "And now we come to what I think is the ugliest aircraft in our collection, and it is British! "(as the Gannet comes into view) . One of the American punters pipes up "Hey man, you can't say that, there are Brits on the tour!" Instant reply from myself "Doesn't bother us mate, it's Navy!"http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

They used to have a Gannet parked up at HMS Dryad when I was there. As Dryad is now closed, I wonder what happened to it.

[topgas]

XP226 - at Newark

Fairey Gannet (http://plane-crazy.k-hosting.co.uk/Aircraft/Props/Gannet/fairey_gannet.htm)

[Dunky]

Cheers, found it :ok:
(http://www.******************************/gannet/survivor.php?id=127)

[Alber Ratman]

Sorry Bob, can't remember the bees on the T37s. Remember them around DMs golf course, and us still playing golf when the star spangled banner was playing.. Locals were not impressed.:E

AR.

BTW I was playing with a "Shiney" six painted XX741 on Saturday.. It looked nice. Project leader passed me some photos he took at Colt. March on for the Standard presentation, JEngo, yourself and Nick Lock..

[Navy_Adversary]

I am not sure since post 9/11 but before then, you could hire a Cessna from Genesis Aviation at Tucson international and fly over the Boneyard for some time and take piccies.
I did it 2 or 3 times with Sunday being the best day as the Davis Monthan circuit was quiet, one time there was even a couple of VC-10s and 8 or 9 Tornado F3s on the DM ramp, probably making their way home (slowly) from a Red Flag.:)

[SASless]

AR.....on a US Military Base.....when the National Anthem is played....or the Retreat Gun sounds and Retreat (Evening Colors) is played.....we stand to Attention, face the Flag.....or the Music....and if in Uniform.....Salute. All activity ceases....all vehicles pull to a stop....used to be all occupants exited the vehicle and rendered honors.

Playing golf is not the done thing as you found out it would appear.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhkMwAhIOcU

[TurningFinals]

I wish they would take the google street view car round that place.

[500N]

SaSless.

The same rules apply here in Aus.

And god help if you don't because you'd be march up in front of the RSM (WO 1 Regimental Sgt Major) regardless of rank (up to a point !).

[BEagle]

SASless / 500N - I can't see that catching on in the UK. For one thing the station PA system probably couldn't cope - and for another, many of the people on RAF stations now are civilian contractors who've never served in the Armed Forces.

Besides, what would their unions say.....

It was bad enough avoiding being run over by contractors' vehicles which failed to stop during the daily ensign lowering ceremony.

:uhoh:

[Budar]

As has been said Pima museum next to the DM boneyard is well worth a visit, as is the Missile silo which has been turned into a museum just a few miles down the road in Green Valley I think if memory serves me well.Pima had an SR71 when I visited in the late 90s, not too sure if that is still there.

[Tray Surfer]

Hello all, from the commercial world...

I went to Pima a couple of weeks ago when I was on a PHX trip and it was really good. Well worth a visit. I also drove past somewhere else on the way, which I can't remember, which had some commercial frames having an elongated break in the sun.

[Easy Street]

That'll be Pinal Airpark, a few miles NW of Tucson on the I-10.

The missile silo mentioned earlier is the Titan Missile Museum (http://www.titanmissilemuseum.org/). Another excellent visit and highly recommended.

[Geezers of Nazareth]

I am not sure since post 9/11 but before then, you could hire a Cessna from Genesis Aviation at Tucson international and fly over the Boneyard for some time and take piccies.
I did it 2 or 3 times with Sunday being the best day as the Davis Monthan circuit was quiet, one time there was even a couple of VC-10s and 8 or 9 Tornado F3s on the DM ramp, probably making their way home (slowly) from a Red Flag.

There are numerous companies at Tucson who will do that for you, and also at Ryan Field (a few miles west of Tucson). The rules have changed slightly in that you're 'not allowed' to overfly D-M (both the 'active' airfield and the storage areas), however this is easy to overcome.
Most departures from Tucson are to the south, so if you arrange to go to the north of Tucson you have to make a wide left turn after take-off ... which means that the storage areas are all laid out off to your left as you climb slowly. Pick a high-wing Cessna, don't be afraid of telling the pilot what you want to do, and they will 'accidentally' keep it low, and allow you to have the window open so you get some good photos without glass reflections.
On the way back from the north, ask to overfly the Tucson central area, which means that you keep well to the east, fly past D-M again, and make a wide detour to the west of Tucson Intl before turning finals.

On a visit there in the early 90s we stopped to peer through the fence. I remember looking at numerous lines of F-4 Phantoms lined-up ... there were 19 in each line, and I counted 23 lines!

19 in a line! ... what was the standard complement for a RAF F-4 squadron?

[Not_a_boffin]

As of mid-July, still north of 350 there, including some of the Boxhead F4F.

[obgraham]

Pima had an SR71 when I visited in the late 90s, not too sure if that is still there. Pima's SR71 is now indoors, in Pride of Place. Beautiful machine.

I bought the T-shirt.

Now I hope they can get their lovely B-36 to inside exhibition.

[Wessex Boy]

I could lose hours on that AMARC website.

I love the personal stories attached to this C5A and the incidents she was involved in:

AMARC Experience - AMARC Experience (http://amarcexperience.com/ui/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&catid=16&dbserial=70-0450)

[Pontius Navigator]

It provides a Reserve of aircraft that can mobilized and as a huge source of spare parts.

And a sqn of F4J post Falklands.

[Pontius Navigator]

I wonder what they would charge a foreign air force for open storage?

Ideal place for a spare E3D or maybe some redundant Sentinels.

[500N]

Thought this might be of interest to some.

Found when looking for something else.

Military Aircraft Boneyards, Storage, Disposal and Scrapping after World War II (http://www.planesofthepast.com/aircraft-boneyards-storage-after-wwii.htm)

[Dengue_Dude]

500N

You sir, are a star. I have no knowledge if anyone else is interested - but I sure as hell am, thank you!

That'll keep me going for a while . . . :ok:

[500N]

Dengue

It hooked me for about 15 minutes as well. I'll go back and look again later.

I knew a lot of aircraft were scrapped at the end of WWII and the start of
the jet age but I didn't realise that the US had so many different airfields
so close together in the Western US.

Looking at how many aircraft and how few now,
it's a shame more weren't kept - The B17's as an example.

[mexicanbob]

"And remember thats where the Caf'S B29 came from, flew down in a B24 with tool kits and worked over 5 B29's missed off inventory and finally flew FIFI back for full restoration. So it is a usefull place in 20 yeard someone will be reclaiming the last B52 or Harrier.
Last edited by Dysonsphere; 18th Aug 2013 at 00:48"

Actually, "FIFI" didn't come from the boneyard. She was found at China Lake Navy Base.

[Dysonsphere]

"And remember thats where the Caf'S B29 came from, flew down in a B24 with tool kits and worked over 5 B29's missed off inventory and finally flew FIFI back for full restoration. So it is a usefull place in 20 yeard someone will be reclaiming the last B52 or Harrier.
Last edited by Dysonsphere; 18th Aug 2013 at 00:48"

Actually, "FIFI" didn't come from the boneyard. She was found at China Lake Navy Base.

Sorry my bad

[bakerpictures]

I spent a few days photographing Davis Monthan, Pima and followed by Mojave some years ago. It proved to be one of the saddest places I'd ever seen old aircraft.

I'd be pleased if you looked at a gallery (http://richardbaker.photoshelter.com/gallery/Aviation-Boneyards/G0000MrmGtFd4ehE) on my archive site:

Rgds,
Richard.

[SASless]

BP....if those old Birds could talk....think of the stories they could tell! Imagine if you started recording the accounts back at the end of WWII and carried on till today what amazing experiences the old Girls had.

[bakerpictures]

Indeed. And sitting in those dusty cockpits you wonder at the thousands of hours that someone sat there dedicated to keeping the humans in the back safe - in all weathers.

[Dunky]

Following that train of thought, and going off topic, sorry. Living in an old house built c.1900, I've often wondered the same about this house, especially with the centenary of the start of WWI next year.

[PlanesOfThePast]

I've had the privilege of visiting several aircraft active boneyards recently, including Davis-Monthan AMARG in Tucson.

And looking through photos of the post-WWII boneyards, like the one at Kingman Army Air Field in Arizona, one thought keeps coming back to mind: the total differences in the assembly line and the smelter.

I can picture the attention to detail and thoroughness of those working on the assembly line, making sure every wire, dial, gauge, gun, gear, flap, and hundreds of more items worked to perfection. And then there is the end of the line, in the boneyard, where planes are unceremoniously stripped of equipment, cut in pieces by the guillotine, and pushed into a smelting furnace to be turned into aluminum ingots.

Here's what I have put together about Kingman after World War II, and the scrapping process used there, and at other boneyards.

Kingman Airport (IGM) in Arizona, storage site for jetliners in the desert, Kingman Army Air Field WWII aircraft boneyard at Storage Depot 41 (http://www.planesofthepast.com/kingman-airport.htm)