So you think the RAF has problems

[Lightning Mate]

South Africa Loses Use Of Its new Gripens (http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htmurph/20130731.aspx)

[Heathrow Harry]

TBH who are they going to fight?

To a large extent the size and shape of the S African defence forces is a hangover from the dreadful days pre 1990 when everyman's hand was against them.

They need a different set of kit and vision - more helicopters, more MPA's, more transports (C-17 anyone) more patrol vessels and lots of PBI for power projection/"police actions" in Africa South of the Sahara

but M 2.0 fighters.............. not really

[Pontius Navigator]

HH, so why do WE need Mach 2 fighters?

















don't answer that question just say why the RSAF don't

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Some South African politicians are now calling for the Gripens to be sold


Can a Gripen go on a QE Class carrier?:E

[The Old Fat One]

I'd suggest this country has bigger problems.

[Laarbruch72]

I'd suggest this country has bigger problems.


Do you mean we in the UK have bigger problems than SA? South Africa is just about the worst developed nation on earth to live in in terms of violent crime including murder, rape and car jacking. The public health service is far more chronically underfunded than the UK and 5 million people live with HIV. Xenophobia still exists as a way of life for the country, whatever colour you are.

What are the bigger problems that you're thinking of, or were you referring just to the military? Sorry if I've misunderstood.

[The Old Fat One]

Sorry, poor choice of words...my bad.

I meant SA has bigger problems than grounding part of its air force...as in indeed, you describe.

[Heathrow Harry]

"South Africa is just about the worst developed nation on earth to live in in"

gross exaggeration there - I have a number of family, friends and colleagues who live there and are perfectly happy and wouldn't come back here if you paid them

It has problems but then there are parts of the USA where you wouldn't want to live either

[t43562]

As to whether it's a great place or not - it depends on your skills and education. It's certainly somewhat dangerous but also that depends a lot on where you go.

It has a very powerful and balanced economy (as African economies go) and if some people at the top weren't mis-managing it they could probably fund their Gripens. In any case, as I understood it, the airforce didn't want them for the very reason of their being hard to afford and not easy to adapt/modify/upgrade locally as they had done with their Mirages in the past and their Hawks now.

It's handy to have jets when few others do (you have maximum advantage) or when Cuba decides to take an interest in Angola (perhaps China will be next?) and if you decide not to have any then you're basically opening a door and shouting to the world that they should come in please and this is the way to do it.

[vascodegama]

Come to think of it there are parts of the UK I wouldn't want to live in.
Also am not sure I would describe the NHS as underfunded-badly run yes.

[CoffmanStarter]

Let's make them a Fire Sale offer for all 26 aircraft :ok:

ETPS certainly know how to operate them ...

[Laarbruch72]

gross exaggeration there


It's not remotely a gross exaggeration, it's a truly awful place to live by first world standards and sits at the top of just about any list you can find of places you don't want to settle. If you're reasonably comfortably off then you need to live with a 24 hour security presence at your property.
I know it has it's interests and attractions (and I do love the country), and like most places it has it's bad areas, but the trouble is that the bad areas don't make up a minority of areas, they make up a majority.

If you're using the example of family members' experiences (which is worthless), I counter with my grandfather who lived in Durban for 25 years and moved back to Kent about 8 years ago, he said he was sick of being burgled and being at constant risk of armed car jacking.

[Samuel]

After the UK, SA has, for some years now and in ever-increasing numbers,become a source of new immigrants to New Zealand.

[gr4techie]

Having read the link in the original post. I found their ""selection process"" and method of streaming aircrew jaw droppingly shocking! :eek:

[500N]

gr4

Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

[Heathrow Harry]

"using the example of family members' experiences (which is worthless)"

why?? they live there, they work there, they are citizens.............

surely they are in a better position to know than someone living in the UK....... or wherever "Near You" is..........

[Union Jack]

Whatever way one looks at this sorry state of affairs, Dick Lord must be spinning in his grave .....:sad:

Jack