Britain's Taranis Demonstrator Delivered to Australian Test Site

[SpazSinbad]

Britain's Taranis Demonstrator Delivered to Australian Test Site 17 Jul 2013 By ANDREW CHUTER
"LONDON — A concept demonstrator aimed at putting Britain on the road to developing an unmanned air combat vehicle capability has been delivered to a flight test site in Australia and is scheduled to make its maiden flight within weeks, according to sources familiar with the program.

The concept demonstrator, known as Taranis, is sitting at the remote Woomera test center in South Australia in preparation for a first flight scheduled for September...

...About the size of a Hawk jet trainer, the 8-ton Taranis will demonstrate autonomous controls, stealth and other technologies for possible inclusion in an operational aircraft...."
Britain's Taranis Demonstrator Delivered to Australian Test Site | Defense News | defensenews.com (http://www.defensenews.com/article/20130717/DEFREG01/307170027)

[BEagle]

't Bungling Baron's attempt at building a drone?

Well, at least in Oz it's safely out of the way...

[500N]

And can't crash on anything important !

Woomera is not a nice place.

[SpazSinbad]

'500N' said: "...Woomera is not a nice place." What does that mean?

[VinRouge]

I take it you haven't watched Wolf Creek?

[SpazSinbad]

That's a standard? God help us all.

[JSFfan]

It's not that bad, but I only went there because it had a yank bowling alley.

[500N]

Spaz

Wolf Creek is a very good start. A bit of personal explanation is in order
and this is from a person who normally likes and finds attractive harsh,
dry, arid environments.

The Australian GAFA - Great Australian Fcuk All.

Now we have quite a few areas (deserts) in Aus that could be called a GAFA
but having seen most of them, I can honestly say Woomera is No 1.

I might fill this in with some more detail if interested.

[500N]

JSF

Did you only go to the town only or the rest of it ?

I now know why they sight Woomera and Pine Gap in these places :O

[SpazSinbad]

'500N' I have a good idea about Australia from my time overflying the landscape at high and low levels during my time in the RAN FAA. One memorable long flight was flying hi-level to East Sale from NAS Nowra where an A4G airborne buddy tanker refuelled our pair for a transit / descent to low level near the SA/Vic border to fly at zot feet over the undulating desert dunes/mulga to Broken Hill - climb to hi level for transit back to NAS Nowra.

Another long medium level flight was in a Macchi MB326H from NAS to RAAF Edinburgh (via RAAF Laverton) thence to Woomera for an overnight and return to NAS to Edinburgh then direct to NAS Nowra hi-level with the jetstream. Also I have toured the centre of Oz by car/bus. I think I know the landscape well enough and appreciate it even today living in the Blue Mountains west of Sydney.

As a contrast to the more usual wide brown land another memorable nav was in a Vampire with underwing tanks low level all the way to summit Mt. Kosciuszko with snow from snowline then east to coast and back up the coast seaward of the beaches to NAS. Cool as.

[500N]

Spaz

My apologise, I posted and then noticed you lived in Aus :(
I should look first.

RAAF Laverton - I live almost next door :O
(It's now being turned into a housing estate :()

Inland Aus would be an awesome place for low level flying.

[JSFfan]

The alley isn't in towm. it was an invite

[SpazSinbad]

From 1969 till 1974 every now and then when on VC-724 (if not on VF-805 or in USofA briefly) the squadron had Fleet Support Duties based out of RAAF Laverton and sometimes from Avalon (which in those days was deserted except for QANTAS 747 training circuits) being controlled from Laverton ATC to work with RAN Fleet units in Port Phillip Bay or at the gun range [West Head] near HMAS Cerberus etc. Mostly flew Vampires with the occasional Sea Venom sortie, then Macchis [on these early away from NAS FSUP duties]. A4Gs were difficult to support away from NAS in those early years due to RAAF non-co-operation. Once the Kiwis in their A-4Ks started to visit Oz then the RAAF relented somewhat. It was easy to rock up to a RAAF base and be refused fuel in those early years. What a bunch of bastards eh. :}

Plus in those years (mine first half of 1968) RAN FAA basic flying training was conducted with the RAAF course at RAAF Point Cook with Navs all over the joint of Vic with circuits and bumps at RAAF Laverton in the Winjeel. Then over to RAAF Pearce for advanced training in Vampires (just at the end of 'em - last half 1968) with the Macchis coming afterwards, with lo-hi navs all over Southern Half WA even out to Kalgoorlie.

[500N]

Interesting, thanks for posting.

Glad the attitude had change when we interacted with the RAAF.

Avalon was a desert in those early years, the wind was something else though !

[Wetstart Dryrun]

...size of a Hawk, 8 tons, Adour powered....

is it designed to knock the enemy off their bikes on the take-off roll?

wets

[TBM-Legend]

Plus in those years (mine first half of 1968)

what Course???

[BBadanov]

what Course???

TBM-R, by the sound of it, No.69.
I think 68 (Bad Boys) was the first on the Macchi, and 69 was the last on the Vamp.

[SpazSinbad]

No.67 RAAF Pilot Course. Started ground school at RAAF Point Cook late in 1967, then flying training started with RAAF Academy Grads beginning of 1968. After completing basic we went to RAAF Pearce mid year until graduation late December same year to go our different ways. There were four RAN Midshipmen on that course. Photos to follow....

Yes No.69 was the last Winjeel/Vampire Pilot course which followed us by a few months. No.68 was the first Winjeel/Macchi course which was only about 6 weeks behind (but I could be wrong on those week numbers). Certainly it was crowded not only at Point Cook with ARMY being with us only for basic flight training but in the circuit at Pearce with instructors refaming in Macchis or instructors being instructed for their first times in the Macchi with Vamps in the mix was one hell of a riot. Then GinGin was opened only for the Macchi circuits and bumps later.

There was no graduation mass flyby for us because we were all going home ASAP (along with instructors - too close to Xmas).

After one earlier year in RAN beginning 1966 I joined BATC 2/67 beginning 1967 at HMAS Cerberus. Due to lack of places in RAAF Flying Training in that era (Vietnam War) Basic Aircrew Training Course was split in two with me in the second half going to sea aboard HMAS Anzac until joining No.67 Pilot Course etc. Earlier BATCs had gone training in the USN - we were to go also but that was scrubbed early on. Here are the early flying training badges.

CLICK 'EM: http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/NewerAlbum/th_No67raafTrain1968badgesBATC2-67.jpg (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/SpazSinbad/media/NewerAlbum/No67raafTrain1968badgesBATC2-67.jpg.html) http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/NewerAlbum/th_RAAFbasicAdvancedFlyingTrainingBadges1968winjeelVampire.j pg (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/SpazSinbad/media/NewerAlbum/RAAFbasicAdvancedFlyingTrainingBadges1968winjeelVampire.jpg. html)

Number 67 Pilot Course Graduation Photo December 1968 RAAF Pearce

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/67courseGradPhotoForum.jpg~original (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/SpazSinbad/media/67courseGradPhotoForum.jpg.html)

CDTAC Lloyd Smith (first left back row) died in a Mirage IIIO crash at night in Malaysia; CDTAC "Ted" Collett died with F.O. McLean in an Iroquois crash near Canberra; F.O. Herbert died in Vietnam in a Canberra bomber. The nine younger F.O.s were from the No.17 RAAF Academy class.

Midn. Andy Perry was awarded a U.S. Silver Star in Vietnam with the RAN Iroquois detachment. All 3 Midn. went to Vietnam to the RANHFV3 EMU (Experimental Military Unit) in 1970 & were all MID (Mentioned In Despatches). Youse know where the fourth went.

[Lima Juliet]

The first flight follows a three-year delay and more than 55 million pounds (US $83.1 million) in additional costs caused by technical issues, an increase in the list of requirements and extended risk mitigation work on Taranis.

A Ministry of Defence spokesman said the additional risk mitigation work was behind an increase in program costs to “around 180 million (pounds).”

The original budget when the program was launched in 2005 was 124 million pounds. By 2011, the delays and requirement changes had driven Taranis costs up to 142 million pounds.

As I understand it, it was also supposed to have flown recently and has slipped again (don't know why).

Even the French look fed up with their own version of Waste O'Space and are buying Reaper - DSCA Informs Congress of Intention To Sell Reapers to France | Defense News | defensenews.com (http://www.defensenews.com/article/20130628/DEFREG01/306280014/DSCA-Informs-Congress-Intention-Sell-Reapers-France) It looks like Telemos announced 2 years ago is dead then http://www.baesystems.com/article/BAES_019799/joint-unmanned-air-system-programme-named-as-telemos?_afrLoop=598782264312000&_afrWindowMode=0&_afrWindowId=null&baeSessionId=vH1qSD1bzQZnnTvsrWCJ2kkj0XhTz2z0Ldl5ZlvfMdV19T2 GQptx!-1075078496#%40%3F_afrWindowId%3Dnull%26baeSessionId%3DvH1qSD 1bzQZnnTvsrWCJ2kkj0XhTz2z0Ldl5ZlvfMdV19T2GQptx%2521-1075078496%26_afrLoop%3D598782264312000%26_afrWindowMode%3D0 %26_adf.ctrl-state%3Dzxv4gb0iw_4

It all boils down to these big companies not listening to their customer and trying to tell them what they want. That's the difference with General Atomics, they listen, they understand what the customer wants and then they deliver through development using their own money...much that it pains me to stick up for a US company. Our companies would do well to replicate their example :{

LJ

[judge.oversteer]

Hi Phil,
Thanks for the photo! Many fond memories.
I was on 68 Course, we were the Best Boys, not the Bad Boys! Ha, Ha.
Happy days, eh?
Rgds.
JO.

[SpazSinbad]

'judge' have sent you a PM - meanwhile here are the last Vamps No.69.

CLICK!: http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/NewerAlbum/th_No69winjeelBasicCoursePointCook.jpg (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/SpazSinbad/media/NewerAlbum/No69winjeelBasicCoursePointCook.jpg.html) :}

[BBadanov]

Judge: "I was on 68 Course, we were the Best Boys, not the Bad Boys! Ha, Ha"
Judge, if u r living in London (as suggested bye your avatar), then the "worst" of the "bad boys" is there too, masquerading as a banker!

Luig, the course photo shows 1AFTS as "Advanced" FTS. In fact, AFTS stood for "Applied Flying Training School" - I bet you had forgotten that over the past 45 years.

[SpazSinbad]

'BBadanov' the best bet I can make is that I HAVE forgotten a lot over those 45 years - thank goodness for that. Which course were you on? I'll check up on the 'Advanced/Applied' thingamejig. Early on when starting out making the PDFs seen on SkyDrive and GoogleDrive (about 8-10 years ago now) I corresponded with the chap [Leslie R. Jubbs] who made this PDF:

http://www.futurepd.org/les/Documents/Pearce%20Book%2008.pdf (0.9Mb)

"No 1 Advanced Flying Training School was created at Pearce during May 1958 using Vampire jet aircraft. Some of the Cadet pilots initially found some difficulty in adapting to the speed of the new jet, especially in the "circuits and bumps" stage. The first summer at Pearce proved to be the usual scorching temperatures that West Australians accepted as normal. To both Flying instructors and cadets it was unbearably hot to enter the cramped cockpit, of the side by side seating arrangement, when aircraft were left in the broiling sun. This discomfort was further exacerbated when flying exercises to very high altitudes the aircraft heaters had to be activated soon after take off so that by the time the high altitude was achieved the windscreen was protected from icing or fogging....."
&
"...
1 January 1969 AFTS was re-named : No 2. Flying Training School and the Macchi

In 1969, No 70 Pilot Course completed all their flying at Pearce by only flying the new Macchi jet.

No.70 Course arrived at RAAF Base Pearce from RAAF Point Cook to go directly to a fast jet trainer without any Elementary flying. This would be the first occasion in over 50 years that the RAAF try such an experiment. No doubt there would be some apprehension but there would be certainly a great deal of assessment and evaluation by such a break from tradition...."

&
"...No. 1 FTS. It re-formed again in 1952 as No. 1 Applied Flying Training School (No. 1 AFTS), and was transferred to RAAF Base Pearce, Western Australia, in 1958. [When name changed as above to 'Advanced'.]"
No. 1 Flying Training School RAAF - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No._1_Flying_Training_School_RAAF)

As I was there until Dec 1968 I guess I have the right to call AFTS as it was then. No?

[SpazSinbad]

History of RAAF Pearce Australia's Pilot Training Base by Leslie R Jubbs

RAAF Pearce (http://www.futurepd.org/les/pearce.htm)

[judge.oversteer]

Spaz.
Thanks, check PM's.

BBad.
Yes, thanks, a few of us here (of that era) get together for a few beers every now and then.

Cheers.
JO.