Someone, please put me out of my misery...

[Skytrucker87]

What does ex-FLM mean to anyone? Does it mean that the person so described was a Loadmaster??

[Courtney Mil]

Flight Line Mechanic?

[12 twists per inch]

FLM - Flight Line Mechanic.

An obsolete trade employed to carry out flight servicings only. A great bunch who had a reputation for partying hard.

(Awaiting FLM stories of freckles etc)

[gr4techie]

Now called AMM. Aircraft Maintenance Mechanic. Or nick-named Liney.

I believe FLM was a trade in its own, line work is all they did.

While people today join as a Avionic or Mechanical Technician. They spend the first 18 months as an AMM working on the line, then they go back to Cosford for a fitters course and then become a technician.

[Tinribs]

FLMS
Were the outdoor boys with basic mechanic training, they did fuel, chocks marshalling seat pins and such stuff

They were the ones who said quietly, check the tyres boss, or came to the crewroom with your torch, or brought your jacket cold wet to the aircraft when it was throwing it down or fetched a cuppa as you waited for a tyre change

Unsung heroes that made life easier and safer

[Wetstart Dryrun]

I think the origin of FLMs lay in cheapness - the RAF avoided the real trade training and it was a bit of a con to get people working on the flight line just putting the gas in, washing the screen and emptying the ashtray. Pretty hard to get out onto a rigger/fitter/armourer course.

A good crew chief and a bunch of FLMs was a pretty formidable task force.

regards

wets

[NutLoose]

I think the origin of FLMs lay in cheapness - the RAF avoided the real trade training and it was a bit of a con to get people working on the flight line just putting the gas in, washing the screen and emptying the ashtray. Pretty hard to get out onto a rigger/fitter/armourer course.


Correct, indeed it was a completly separate established trade group that could progress up to rank of Sergeant.

They did A/F B/F T/Rounds on Fighters mainly, shoved in the fuel, Oxy and Chutes and cleaned the windows and that was it..

When the trade was abolished the RAF put them through Mechs courses and some through Fitters courses in the trades of their choice, though how much choice they had was in the lap of the Gods....

Of course before they could become Fitters they were required to become Mechs, so they would at the time be posted to Halton, do a full Mechs course, then start again straight after and do a full Fitters course, I actually joined one that had just completed it's Mechs course when i went through my Fitters course..

They were commonly refered to as Flem's or ameoba's (as in single cell ameoba's, as they were the simplest form of pond life.)

:E

[thing]

Also seem to remember they were on short service terms? Was it six years? I was a nav insty working with a shift load of flems both at Coningsby and Gutersloh. There were some very clever lads amongst them who knew they had been short changed.

Mind you, I was instructing at Cosford some years later (on the very first Avionic courses as it happened) and I had lads straight from school with 'A' levels in maths and physics. Don't quite know what the RAF were playing at there, but heyhoe, head down, gob shut.

[TLDNMCL]

Ahem! Ex-FLM here. :E

It wasn't possible to go any further than SAC in my days as a FLM - it was possible after a spell of time on the job to go on to what was essentially a Direct Entry fitter's course in your chosen (or available!) trade.

FLM was a basic but very hectic job depending upon what aircraft type or the function the squadron or unit performed. Happy days...:ok:

The extra pennies following the fitter's course were very welcome though!

[Haraka]

Then there were the "TAGs" Trades Assistant ( General) often considered at the bottom of the pile, and they knew it.
I had a tribe of them at one stage many years ago. I ended up running most of their bank accounts, wrestling with Finance companies, Loan sharks etc. on their behalf and being a father confessor.
They reduced our AOC to hysterics during the annual inspection, with an impromptu comedy act of badinage which merited a turn on the West End stage.
Lovely kids, some of whom moved on to higher things in the Service , a move that I was proud to assist in.
Others went out.............

[thing]

There was a radar techy at Sealand who remustered to whatever trade group guardroom staff were. His reason was that promotion was dead men's shoes at that time in TG2, as I well knew, and he thought he would have better promotion prospects as a shouter and marcher. He was right, he made Sergeant in short order and last I heard (this was back in the early 80's) he was a FS discip somewhere, no doubt he made SWO.

[smujsmith]

FLM - Flight Line Mechanic,

Commonly known to all and sundry as Flems. The guys I had experience of, through 80/90s I think, had all joined it seemed on a promise (chance would be a fine thing:rolleyes:) that after around 18 months they would be considered for further training in a trade. The theory was that many, general, flight line jobs, did not require a course of any great magnitude. In general the lads did their square bashing, a quick familiarisation of the aircraft. And then out to a unit for employment/On the job Training. As I remember some very good lads entered the RAF this way, who may well have gone elsewhere had nothing been open to them. I'm sure an old friend of mine, now an ex GE from C130 days started life as a Flem. I would never knock these guys, after all, they all wanted to be part of the RAF that we were lucky enough to be part of. And bless them for that.

Smudge

[thing]

Funnily enough I knew a Flem called Smuj Smith, Coningsby 74 ish...wouldn't be you would it?

[teeteringhead]

whatever trade group guardroom staff were TG 10 - of blessed memory. :ok:

[NutLoose]

Yup, they got a lot of dodgy deals at the CIO's,

One of our Armourer CPL's had wanted to join as a Musician, but the CIO had told him to join as a Armourer then remuster, needless to say he couldn't remuster down.... He had a degree in music and was a qualified music Teacher before the RAF screwed him over.


Trade Assistant General

There were a couple at Odiham who were the nicest guys you could meet, one was a pot washer in the airman's mess and the other worked in the guardroom. You could become a TAG if you failed your course whilst awaiting further training (if any).
Anyway back to the guy at Odiham, had a long chat one day and finding out he actually joined up as a TAG I enquired why as he was a bright lad and obviously well educated.
He told me his father was a Colonel in Chief of some regiment or the other and his father had pressurised him into joining the Military with the emphasis on becoming an Army Officer... He promptly ( to squash that idea ) went to the nearest RAF CIO and on enquiring what the least qualified and lowest possible job there was in this mans airforce joined up as a TAG.... And loved it :)



..

[goudie]

Well at least this trade did what it was supposed to do. Brize in the early '70's was awash with Ch/techs and Sgts, especially on the Brit line. SNCO's were marshalling, lugging ground equipment around, refuelling, B/F's A/F's and doing all the other mundane jobs that keep a line going, because there were very few SAC's etc to do the job. Hence some of us being offered lucrative financial incentives to leave quietly!:ok:

[Wensleydale]

Must admit - I prefer to look at FHM.....

[smujsmith]

Thing #13

Definitely not me I'm afraid. Ex 214 entry Craft Apprentice RAF Halton 1969-71. I have to admit though, I have many similarly named " friends " in the RAF, Army and Royal Navy. I bet he was a good bloke, your Coningsby Smudge :ok:

all the best

Smudge

PS. On my first tour out of Halton I was posted to a Base 3 C130 servicing team at Colerne. It was a great posting because it took my mother nearly 2 years to find out I was not serving in Germany:eek: However, our tea bar came fully equipped with an LAC Lloyd, a TAG of unique abilities. We got every second egg banjo free, tea made to order and not given tea bar as a duty. An expensive tea bar mechanic is a Jnr Tech rigger. I always remember him being hauled to court in Bristol for driving the wrong way up a one way street. His only witness in his defence was his then girlfriend, who admitted guiding him that way up the street because it got her home more quickly, she told the court that she had learned this from her father, who at the time was the local Chief Constable!! Respect was gained from all when the case was dropped. :ok:

[NutLoose]

Two Smudges maketh a smear. :p



The other we had in the late 80's was the Youth Training Scheme, we had an LAC engine mech that was in the RAF as a YTS and was paid £40 a week or whatever it was and still had to pay Food and Accom, it was a pittance so the rest of the guys used to stand his drinks etc.... After I think a year the RAF could either chop them or take them on, if taken on they would get back pay which he did.. Needless to say we all sampled his new found wealth in the bar :)

[GreenKnight121]

His only witness in his defence was his then girlfriend, who admitted guiding him that way up the street because it got her home more quickly, she told the court that she had learned this from her father, who at the time was the local Chief Constable!! Respect was gained from all when the case was dropped.

Given a break, due to "having been led astray by a skirt". :ok:

[Akrotiri bad boy]

I worked the line on Jags and Tooms as a single trade mechanic, (A Mech A), along with a bunch of FLMs.

The Line Chief on both squadrons was an airframe Chiefy, this made my life a little worse than that of my FLM chums. Day shifts were not so bad,
0: stupid - 16:00ish. However night shifts 16:00 - 22:00ish had a very nasty sting in the tail. All the green line snags for the day such as tyres, brakes, loose rivets etc were carried until cease flying. That was when my FLM chums passed me on the way to the Fulmar Club/Mally as I pushed the wheel change kit around the hangar. :{

Chiefy's point being; "You're a rigger, you're paid to fix it, so fix it."

My FLM chums were gradually assimilated (assassinated) into aircraft trades of their choices, generally on a level move at SAC.

[SOSL]

The flems were a great bunch; they worked incredibly hard and often in the sh*tt*est of weather with, in those days, pretty inadequate Cold Wet Weather Clothing.

I first encountered the trade when I was posted to a BFTS on a station in the North of England, from which, when the wind was in the right direction, you could detect the aroma of 2 breweries. Very different beers but very similar names!

I think the QFIs and Studes really liked the FLMs - not only did they do AFs, BFs, TRs, refuelling and replenishment but they helped with strapping in and they understood how to marshal with care and meaningfully.

They were direct and to the point. One LAC submitted a gen app for early replacement of his trousers quoting "Fare, ware and tare".

Another one was discovered by the RAFP to be growing cannabis plants in a propagator under his bed in the block. However, it turned out that they were such tiny shoots that the technology of the day wasn't up to proving they were actually cannabis.

The RAFP decided that if they kept the propagator and allowed the shoots to grow, they could be done for possession. So no charges were brought. Later it turned out that he was the secretary of the North Yorkshire branch of the Legalise Cannabis Society! But that wasn't a crime!

The RAFP were obsessed by the idea that the FLMs were obsessed by the idea of getting into the WRAF block, so they kept more or less continuous obs on the WRAF block (what fun it must have been for them!).

Eventually they detected an illicit liaison in the WRAF block and nicked the guilty FLM (who, as it happens was engaged to his little WRAF).

He was charged and marched in front of me - charges read out - RAFP witness didn't appear; apparently he was "too busy elsewhere" (on a BFTS?!).

I dismissed the charge and spent the next 2 days justifying my decision to more senior officers, who frankly didn't seem to understand - if you don't have any evidence in front of you can't convict. They all said "yes but we all know what happened" - not in my orderly room we didn't!

Rgds SOS

[dctyke]

I know at least two FLMs that made it to WO. Quite a lot of them 'aligned' themselves with trades on the sqns helping out beyond their remit. Of those quite a lot got good write ups and returned to their chosen trade training fairly quickly.

[Saintsman]

Another ex-FLM here.

One of the better things about it was it allowed me to chose a trade for my fitters course that I was interested in and new something about.

Lots of people join up with no real idea of what the job entails and find that they are square pegs in round holes.

No regrets from me.

[NutLoose]

They were direct and to the point. One LAC submitted a gen app for early replacement of his trousers quoting "Fare, ware and tare".


Define that,

I wore through the crotch of my working trousers and trying to get new trousers out of clothing stores was a joke, fair enough i thought, two can play that game, eventually I got pulled over due to my testicles and really bright lurid underwear i had taken to wearing hanging out the front... After the one sided conversation one pointed out that one had been to clothing stores twice, but they seemed to think looking like a tramp was better than spending the MOD's budget on a replacement pair of trousers was the preferred outcome... Job done Sgt in clothing stores got a gob full and new trousers issued..

Took my smooth soled DMS boots to change (remember them) told still a bit of tread left (just), told them they were dangerous to wear working on Helicopters, in the rain, answer was that's what safety boots are for, pointed out we actually operate Helicopters in the field, though he expected one to wear ones combat boots, change into my safety boots as I entered the aircraft, then change back as I left it :ugh::ugh: :ugh: thought right well soon sort that... Took for ever to get jobs done and work eventually intervened when I started doing as said...

[Truck2005]

We had some of the very first FLMs at Lyneham in the mid '70s. They were all up for it and we returned that attitude with trade training on the desks when we could.

They were all level headed and keen as you could want, considering they had just been shafted by the CIOs.

Most of the ones that I knew have all gone on to make excellent single tradesmen. The only problem that I saw was later down the line you had FLMs training FLMs training FLMs and single trade desks did not have an input which, in the end, produced guys that had not a clue because they had been trained by guys that also did not have a clue!

[Rigga]

There were no FLMs on helicopters - So I didn't meet any until well after I joined up and after my (rigger) Fitters Course, when I was posted to Honington.

Contrary to other posts; FLMs often helped out doing many rectification jobs - especially if they were interested in that trade or were trying to see which trade they wanted to join (early applicants for FT did have a choice).

I remember working alongside many of the flems, but not all of them.

Some went on to engo or flying careers...at least one flies for EZY.

[Flight_Idle]

Smudge

PS. On my first tour out of Halton I was posted to a Base 3 C130 servicing team at Colerne. It was a great posting because it took my mother nearly 2 years to find out I was not serving in Germanyhttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/eek.gif However, our tea bar came fully equipped with an LAC Lloyd, a TAG of unique abilities. We got every second egg banjo free, tea made to order and not given tea bar as a duty. An expensive tea bar mechanic is a Jnr Tech rigger. I always remember him being hauled to court in Bristol for driving the wrong way up a one way street. His only witness in his defence was his then girlfriend, who admitted guiding him that way up the street because it got her home more quickly, she told the court that she had learned this from her father, who at the time was the local Chief Constable!! Respect was gained from all when the case was dropped

Bloody hell, even I remember Lloyd at my great age, top man!

Remembering 'Pasty' a biker from the Bannerdown gliding club would be an admission of guilt though.

The FLMs were treated like **** at Lyneham, probably much better off on the fighters though.

As I remember it, every junior man & his dog looked down upon them & it was just not right.

[smujsmith]

Flight Idle,

I hear what you say, but, I suspect that any animosity was ill founded and disappeared when the "tradesmen" realised that these were not just cheap replacements. By the time you got to Lyneham, I was away in Cyprus, not sure that we had FLMs in 73 at Akrotiri. By the time I got back to reality I believe that FLMs had been superseded by another great political decision. Whatever happened to FLMs, how did the trade wind up, and have no doubt, it was a trade. For me they just seemed to disappear.

Smudge :hmm:

[Lima Juliet]

Skytrucker

There was always a Mess Webley for putting oneself out of one's misery...

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2008/08/29/webley-460x276.jpg

LJ :ok:

[NutLoose]

The FLMs were treated like **** at Lyneham, probably much better off on the fighters though.

As I remember it, every junior man & his dog looked down upon them & it was just not right.

Yup how I saw it too, not on fighters though, just Jags..

[Jayand]

I didn't think you could remuster down trade groups?

[Kitbag]

I didn't think you could remuster down trade groups?

Generally true, used to be that you were not allowed to move down a TG (weren't there some 47?) eg TG 1 couldn't remuster to TG17, but I believe thar failing to reach the standard during trade training was one way of doing so.