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fireflybob
10th May 2013, 22:16
No need to fear - he wore a High Viz and was not carrying any yoghurt...

Fake airline pilot 'landed planes at Gatwick' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-22487205)

Torque Tonight
10th May 2013, 22:27
At least thse kids have achieved a professional licence, type rating, base check, proficiency checks etc which is more than can be said for some posters. :=

Edit - looks like the post I was responding to has been deleted, so disregard.

parabellum
10th May 2013, 23:04
At least thse kids have achieved a professional licence, type rating, base

check, proficiency checks etc


When was the last time a training establishment that processes self funded trainee pilots terminated a students training due to a lack of progress etc. and told them not to waste anymore money?

b.a. Baracus
10th May 2013, 23:15
Was the said 'Internet Forum' PPRuNe?

bluecode
10th May 2013, 23:24
I've come across some of those kids. They really can't fly properly. It's almost unbelievable.

Cldrvr, you haven't a clue, if you really know what you're talking give us some examples of incompetent Ryanair pilots. But you can't because in fact Ryanair quickly weed out the useless idiots. They are ruthless enough to do that.

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

ExSp33db1rd
11th May 2013, 06:01
No need to fear - he wore a High Viz and was not carrying any yoghurt...

and I bet he had to remove his shoes to get on board the aircraft.

Waste of time, World's Gone Mad

Mike-Bracknell
11th May 2013, 10:23
Fake pilot flew for Afriqiyah before being spotted on 'an internet forum'...

BBC News - Fake airline pilot 'landed planes at Gatwick' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-22487205)

BOAC
11th May 2013, 10:25
Who was it????
NURSE!!:sad:

Mike-Bracknell
11th May 2013, 10:27
I'd like at this point to mention i'm not Michael Fay.... :)

(although i'll gladly accept any pretty nurses)

Hotel Tango
11th May 2013, 10:49
Not entirely a "fake" pilot if he once flew for the air force, just not legal for the job.

wizzkid
11th May 2013, 11:06
Same guy a few years back in India

Mint Series | Foreign, but not entirely safe - Livemint (http://www.livemint.com/Home-Page/Dc6eZiggKgoIpNIW0qtWSN/Mint-Series--Foreign-but-not-entirely-safe.html)

He was flying for an European company in the early 2000. Someone got suspicious, he got the sack. A few years later he shows up with the same company but with a different name. A driver recognizes him and he gets the sack again.

This guy will keep doing this until he is jailed and the key thrown away.

NacelleStrake
11th May 2013, 13:17
BBC News - Fake airline pilot 'landed planes at Gatwick' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-22487205)

vctenderness
11th May 2013, 14:09
Mmm not quite as dramatic as it sounds at first! He was, after all, a pilot just not a qualified commercial pilot.

That's not to say I would be happy finding myself on a his aircraft.


Maybe he should contact Indian captain who can train you up on a airbus in five minutes.

DX Wombat
11th May 2013, 14:25
It went walkabout and we ended up with it in JB. :rolleyes:

Cacophonix
11th May 2013, 15:04
The fact that this guy had been an air force pilot and had passed (presumably) the relevant line checks, sim sessions etc. begs the question as to why he didn't just get himself properly certified to do what he could quite clearly do?

Surely the stress, effort in subterfuge to keep us this charade must have been far more challenging than just getting himself properly licensed in the first place?

Caco

BOAC
11th May 2013, 15:11
The fact that this guy had been an air force pilot - at the moment that is an assumption....:hmm:

Cacophonix
11th May 2013, 15:21
The former US Air Force Pilot, who had settled in Alton, was arrested in February 2011 after raising the suspicions of another pilot on an internet
forum.

BBC News - Fake airline pilot 'landed planes at Gatwick' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-22487205)


The BBC are reporting that he was a former US Air Force pilot but who knows what the full story is?

What with his boat race plastered all over the press he is going to have a difficult time in avoiding recognition unless he disappears to some isolated part of this globe of ours.

Caco

Wino
11th May 2013, 16:02
Is the Guvnor out of jail yet?

Cheers
Wino

BOAC
11th May 2013, 16:21
I would guess so, and if still alive probably quite sore in places:E

jumpseater
11th May 2013, 16:58
Is the Guvnor out of jail yet?

Cheers
Wino

I'd be surprised if he is, para 29 / 34 / 35 and 36 here make welcoming reading.




NEIL DUNCAN ROBERTSON v. HER MAJESTY'S ADVOCATE, 17 February 2004, Lord Justice General+Lord Hamilton+Lady Cosgrove (http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/opinions/XC1020.html)

flash8
11th May 2013, 19:03
ahhh the Guv, that brings back memories... invariably bad, must be 10 years or so.... kudos to Danny for his persistence in getting that sicko off the street.

I'm afraid you require a modicum of intellect to attain any degree of credibility... whether imposter or genuine! the guv had none!

Blues&twos
11th May 2013, 21:14
It was his 60 degree take off profiles which caused suspicion.

Low Flier
12th May 2013, 00:18
This con-man has been well known to USG for years.

Here's a WikiLeaks cable which of some relevance:

VZCZCXRO3800
RR RUEHCHI RUEHDT RUEHHM RUEHNH
DE RUEHGP #0680/01 0940536
ZNR UUUUU ZZH
R 040536Z APR 07
FM AMEMBASSY SINGAPORE
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC 2812
INFO RUCNASE/ASEAN MEMBER COLLECTIVE
RUEHBD/AMEMBASSY BANDAR SERI BEGAWAN 1337
RUEHCG/AMCONSUL CHENNAI 0215
RUEHCI/AMCONSUL KOLKATA 0013
RUEHBI/AMCONSUL MUMBAI 0280
RUEHNE/AMEMBASSY NEW DELHI 1744
RUEHGO/AMEMBASSY RANGOON 1967
RUEHHK/AMCONSUL HONG KONG 6179
RUEHBJ/AMEMBASSY BEIJING 2482
RUEHGH/AMCONSUL SHANGHAI 0055
RUEHGZ/AMCONSUL GUANGZHOU 1118
RUEHCN/AMCONSUL CHENGDU 0066
RUEHSH/AMCONSUL SHENYANG 0092
RUEHDN/AMCONSUL SYDNEY 0724
RUEAORC/USCBP WASHINGTON DC
RHMCSUU/HOMELAND SECURITY CENTER WASHINGTON DC
RUEHPNH/NVC PORTSMOUTH 1730
UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 02 SINGAPORE 000680

SIPDIS

DEPARTMENT FOR CA/FPP AND INL/HSTC
DEPARTMENT PLEASE PASS TO KCC FRAUD MANAGER
POSTS FOR FRAUD PREVENTION MANAGER

SIPDIS

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: KFRD CVIS CPAS CMGT ASEC SN
SUBJECT: SINGAPORE QUARTERLY FRAUD SUMMARY - Q2 FY2007

REFS: (A) Singapore 225 (B) 06 Singapore 3469

SINGAPORE 00000680 001.2 OF 002


1. SUMMARY: H-1b fraud continued to be our most serious form of
fraud, but the number of H-1b applications from unqualified and/or
short-term residents of Singapore originating from India continued
to drop this quarter. Post devoted significant resources to
addressing potential adoption fraud. END SUMMARY.

2. SINGAPORE FRAUD SUMMARY

.
.
.

E. ACS AND PASSPORT FRAUD: Embassy Singapore had another encounter
with identity fraud perpetrator Michael Fay/Doherty (Ref B). An
officer from the Embassy's Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)
office approached the ACS unit requesting help with verifying
whether an American citizen had renounced his citizenship.
According to the FAA officer, a pilot of Irish nationality who
claimed to have renounced his U.S. citizenship had approached FAA
Singapore requesting their assistance in helping him to transfer his
pilot certification into his new name and nationality. The FAA
officer was unaware of post's prior encounters with Fay/Doherty.
Consular chief briefed the FAA officer on some of elements of the
case and provided some limited written information concerning Fay's
visa application, including that the visa had been refused. Cons
chief referred FAA to CA/PPT for requests related to Fay's passports
records. We understand from FAA that Fay submitted a written
application to transfer his pilot's license to his Irish nationality
and made a written statement that he had renounced his U.S.
citizenship. Consular chief was subsequently contacted by a
Diplomatic Security agent seconded to CA/PPT. Cons chief briefed
the agent on the full details of our encounters with Fay/Doherty to
date.

mustpost
12th May 2013, 13:33
Regrettably the Guv is using his time to become a barrack-room lawyer and try to find a way to influence the parole board. I remember the case well (before I joned here).
It won't take to much to googling to come up to speed on his offending, but what is chilling are his attempts to find a way out - try reading these in sequence and come to your own conclusion...

http://www.itspublicknowledge.info/U...on133-2009.pdf (http://www.itspublicknowledge.info/UploadedFiles/Decision133-2009.pdf)
SOTP a placebo for the public - Inside Time Newspaper (http://www.insidetime.org/articleview.asp?a=1297)

The final pars of his 'article' reveal his true motivation.

Cacophonix
12th May 2013, 23:08
**** the governor...

This thread is about somebody else... you whelks...

Caco

Yarra
13th May 2013, 06:47
Fake pilot flew Airbus A320 into London
Date
May 13, 2013 - 10:40AM
221 reading nowRead later
Claire Duffin
Zoom in on this story. Explore all there is to know.
Gatwick Airport London Afriqiyah Airways Airbus A320
Pin Itsubmit to redditEmail articlePrint

Fake pilot on the run: Michael Fay.
A conman forged a pilot's licence and medical certificates to get a job flying airliners into Gatwick Airport.

Michael Fay, 59, an American who settled in Alton, Hampshire, spent eight months piloting an Airbus A320, landing at Gatwick.

He is now being hunted by police after he failed to appear in court to be sentenced for fraud. Fay is believed to have fled Britain and may be seeking work as a pilot or flying instructor, police said.


An Afriqiyah Airways Airbus A330-200 aircraft takes off from London's Gatwick airport in this file photo. Fake pilot Michael Fay flew a smaller A320 for the airline over eight months. Photo: AP
Fay, a former US Air Force pilot, worked for Afriqiyah Airways, the Libyan national carrier, and made eight landings at Gatwick between June 1, 2010, and his arrest, on February 3, 2011. Police were alerted to his fraud when another pilot became suspicious while talking to him on an internet forum.

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The conman was due to appear at Winchester Crown Court on Friday, May 3, but failed to appear. He was sentenced in absentia to three years in prison.

Detective Constable Chris Thorne, from Hampshire Police, said: "Fay is a clever and resourceful man who clearly shows no concern for public safety if he's willing to work without the correct licences and medical certification."

An international hunt for him is under way and the Civil Aviation Authority has been alerted.

The fraud came shortly before the collapse of Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's regime, which owned Afriqiyah Airways. It resumed its European service in July 2012 after losing safety accreditation during the conflict in Libya.

Medium-range A320 jets seat 144 passengers in two classes.

Detective Con Thorne added: "He targeted Libyan aviation at a time when the country's political and economic standing was vulnerable and volatile. Had it not been for the quick thinking of a genuine pilot on the internet forum, Fay may have continued to put the public at risk in this manner unnoticed."

The company said Fay's employment "may have been arranged through a third-party broker" who should have checked his documents. A spokesman added: "We place great emphasis on the safety and integrity of our crews and aircraft, and will treat the investigation of this matter with the utmost seriousness it deserves."

DaveReidUK
13th May 2013, 06:57
http://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/514503-fake-airline-pilot-landed-planes-gatwick.html

lexxie747
13th May 2013, 07:45
What a shame, I flew with him, and i can state he was probably one of the nicest guys to fly with , and also one of the best informed about the plane(742)
Having said that, it would be great if all certified pilots would behave like mike.
If only he had used his savvy to gain genuine licenses,he would be an asset to the flying community.
Mind you, i flew with many licensed pilots that were complete incompetend w.nkers.

ExSp33db1rd
13th May 2013, 08:32
How did this/ how does this happen???

Because Aviation Security is an oxymoron - like Military Intelligence. Total waste of time and money.

The Bad Guys will do what they want, when they want to do it.

He didn't have murderous intent - just imaging what he could have done, tho'

And 'nobody' found out for a l o o o o n g time !

KBill
13th May 2013, 08:40
Looking at the news articles which we can all appreciate may be withholding info or stretching the truth... It mentions that 'Afriqiyah Airways said it believed Fay had been employed through a third-party broker that had recommended him as a contractor.'

I heard Parc supply to them... again what truth there is behind this I do not know. I just hope that proper checks are being run against ALL pilots whether they are agency workers or not.

It is not fair to those of us who are going through the lawful and debt building process and it is not fair to the airlines passengers who think ":mad: I could have been on that flight..."

Tourist
13th May 2013, 08:42
Not in any way condoning what he has done, but frankly am far less worried about an ex military competent pilot without the correct piece of paper than half the chimps with the paper but no ability.

18-Wheeler
13th May 2013, 09:00
What a shame, I flew with him, and i can state he was probably one of the nicest guys to fly with , and also one of the best informed about the plane(742)
Having said that, it would be great if all certified pilots would behave like mike.
If only he had used his savvy to gain genuine licenses,he would be an asset to the flying community.
Mind you, i flew with many licensed pilots that were complete incompetend w.nkers.

PMSL! Me too!
He really was a nice fellow to work with.

VP959
13th May 2013, 09:29
Is it me, or is something odd going on with this thread?

There are apparently 27 replies, yet only 20 seem visible. The thread keeps popping up as having new posts, yet when opened they don't seem to be there. The thread stats show posters who have posted here, yet their posts don't seem to exist.

Seems pretty odd to me, is it a glitch this end?

KBill
13th May 2013, 09:33
I can see 29 including your comment... Probably a glitch :ugh:

ATC Watcher
13th May 2013, 09:42
Police were alerted to his fraud when another pilot became suspicious while talking to him on an internet forum.
:(
I hope it was not here .

Hotel Tango
13th May 2013, 10:02
As I said in another thread on this subject somewhere on PPRuNe, he wasn't a "fake" pilot as such, but was just a not legally licensed pilot.

Dushan
13th May 2013, 11:06
Do you have people on the ignore list? I don't know how "ignore" works but I think their posts would not be visible to you.

I see 29 or 30...

Trim Stab
13th May 2013, 11:27
Not in any way condoning what he has done, but frankly am far less worried about an ex military competent pilot without the correct piece of paper than half the chimps with the paper but no ability.

What do you consider "ability"? If he was uncovered by another pilot on an internet forum he must have had some fairly large gaps in his ability to fly an airliner.

captjns
13th May 2013, 11:58
I'll wager a guess that if the Afriqiya Airways, and the Libyan DGCA did their due diligence, by contacting the FAA for a certificate confirmation and PRIA report, this would not have occured.

I don't care how great a pilot or chap he is, or branch of any service he served. He is nothing more than a miscreant who cheated the system and should be dealt with accordingly.

Centaurus
13th May 2013, 12:06
If he was uncovered by another pilot on an internet forum he must have had some fairly large gaps in his ability to fly an airliner

That would apply to 50 percent of the world's airline pilots, wouldn't it?:E

paddy in the east
13th May 2013, 12:44
I know the guy and there has to be more to the story. I worked with him at SQC and he was a very good pilot. I know he was typed on the 320 both his FAA and CAAS licenses.

I will echo lexxie747 and 18-wheeler's comments, he was a true gentleman to fly with and knew what he was talking about.

So, all I can say is there must be more to the story than being outed on an internet forum....

I do have some ocean front property in Arizona if anyone is interested.....:ok:

KBill
13th May 2013, 13:24
Whether he was a competent pilot or not, nice guy or not he still broke the law.
There may be pilots out there who do not hold the skills he must have had in order to go undetected for so long but that is irrelevant. They are legally allowed to operate an aircraft.

G-CPTN
13th May 2013, 13:42
Graham Hill and Colin McRae both crashed their private aircraft when unlicensed.

KBill
13th May 2013, 14:31
Question - Would you want an unqualified doctor to operate on you?

He is, apparently - a really nice guy and knows what he is talking about so all is ok then...

vulcanised
13th May 2013, 14:38
Plenty of unqualified doctors outed on a regular basis.

Some of the qualifications are a bit dodgy too............

paddy in the east
13th May 2013, 14:53
Whether he was a competent pilot or not, nice guy or not he still broke the law.
There may be pilots out there who do not hold the skills he must have had in order to go undetected for so long but that is irrelevant. They are legally allowed to operate an aircraft.

Question - Would you want an unqualified doctor to operate on you?

He is, apparently - a really nice guy and knows what he is talking about so all is ok then...

My point is he was licensed and did have the skills. There must be more to the story than what is in the press.

KBill
13th May 2013, 14:53
vulcanised - Haha, that is very true. Did not really think of that

flash8
13th May 2013, 15:00
So he has or has held a Professional licence, no doubt an IR as well... probably to a higher standard than most as well being ex-Mil.
Has 742 experience..
So he passed the A320 sim check?
He has an A320 type rating?

FFS... he's about as competent as half the muppets I know!

The Surgeon analogy is totally meaingless....

BOAC
13th May 2013, 16:19
My point is he was licensed and did have the skills - I thought the BEEB said he had forged several documents? How about a 320 type rating?

Trim Stab
13th May 2013, 17:47
So he has or has held a Professional licence, no doubt an IR as well... probably to a higher standard than most as well being ex-Mil.
Has 742 experience..
So he passed the A320 sim check?
He has an A320 type rating?

FFS... he's about as competent as half the muppets I know!

The Surgeon analogy is totally meaingless..

One huge assumption after another - sure you're not in airline HR?

Who knows if he was really ex USAF? If he was, was he even a pilot? And if a pilot, what did he fly?

And if he really was an hot-shot USAF pilot, why didn't he just take the exams and get the licences for real?

flash8
14th May 2013, 20:43
One huge assumption after another - sure you're not in airline HR?

Assumptions made on (alleged admittedly) facts already stated.

I very much doubt he walked straight off the street into the pointy end of a medium sized transport category jet after a heavy dose of Flight Sim on a PC.

Yes, the facts will be outed (suitably spun by both the airline and the agency, both dodgy) but I would wager he pretty much just cut a few corners and plainly was a bit of a silly bugger.

Cacophonix
14th May 2013, 21:39
God damn it. We fly like men...

The rest is supposition...


Caco

Dushan
14th May 2013, 22:45
Or, maybe, the rest is a suppository.

Boone
17th May 2013, 21:39
From what I could find, he was a Buff pilot from 76-82. Left the AF as an O-3.

ROLLA
29th Nov 2013, 23:30
Shame flew with this guy when I was doing my left seat line training on A320 really nice guy, and he knew his stuff. But I always felt there was something off. He said he flew a 747 for some VViP in the sandpit somewhere I just saw someone saying he flew with him on 742.. I would appreciate if you could give some more input .if he did fly 74s for while then he wasn't lying about stuff
:eek:he is not a bullshiter... Because I'm shocked about allegations he is a so called fake pilot. He was a TRI for Christ sake???

bcgallacher
30th Nov 2013, 00:47
Rolla - I worked in maintenance for the same company he flew 742s for so can confirm that he did fly them. Seemed to be professional enough in my dealings with him.

fleigle
30th Nov 2013, 01:28
I heard that he is now a line check pilot in Korea !!!!
:E:E:E
f

AKAAB
17th Mar 2015, 20:05
His name just came up on another discussion and I remembered we had discussed him on PPRUNE. He was a certified pilot at one point. A320 Type when I flew with him.

Pilot pleads guilty to stealing union funds.(NEWS) - Star Tribune (Minneapolis, MN) | HighBeam Research (http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-62623066.html)

This is why he faked his credentials to fly in China, then in the US at JetBlue. He was reportedly terminated after post 9/11 background checks were expanded and his failure to disclose the felony conviction caught up with him.

He's had every opportunity to regain his credentials legitimately, but has chosen to try to con his way back into the cockpit. No sympathy. None from the magistrate, either...

http://www.eturbonews.com/35269/fake-airline-pilot-sentenced-three-years-and-one-month-uk

I used to fly with a kid that was busted with a boat full of hash oil in Florida. He had served his time (4 years), cleaned up his act, and worked to get all of his credentials back legitimately over the next four years. Had to take all of his writtens and checkrides again. It can be done...