The Announcement May 9th

[Batman777]

Last year:

"The group's profit target for this financial year ending 31st March 2013 is Dhs3.5 billion. What can we do to achieve it?"

Six months ago, after making 2.1bn profit:

"I'm extremely pleased with the financial results and with your achievements these past six months. If we keep up the momentum, I have no doubt that we can reap rich dividends at the end of the financial year."

Shouldn't we all be expecting a rich dividend then? :D

[Capt. Flamingo]

Some will win, some will loose
Some of us will sing the blues


... Don't stop believing

[Mr Good Cat]

Journey Fan, huh?

Please leave the room quietly.

[fatbus]

Where is the info regarding an Announcement May 9th ?

[helen-damnation]

Mr Good Cat "Stevens"

It's "Just Another Night", now "Morning Has Broken", we're "On The Road To Find Out". Just find "Where Do The Children Play?". It's a "Wild World", but "If You Want To Sing Out, Sing Out".

Me, "I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun" and travel on "The Wind" in the "Peace Train".

I thank you, Taxi :O

[drop kick]

Before someone gets up and starts singing "Danny Boy" !:= Has there actually been an announcement of the "announcement:ugh::ugh:

[helen-damnation]

Emirates Airline to announce operating results on Thursday, says Sheikh Ahmed bin Saeed

May 8, 2013 - 01:30 -
WAM DUBAI: Emirates Airline will announce its operating results for the financial year 2012/2013 (April 2012 to March 2013 ) this Thursday noting that the carrier's profits have registered good year-on-year growth.

Sheikh Ahmed said the results are much better than last year, in terms of revenues and profits and noted that improved performance of carriers is attributed to seat capacity growth.

He said that Emirates was able to achieve the good results despite the increasing fuel prices.

He also noted that the carrier invested some AED500 million on its cargo center at the new Al Maktoum International Airport which will be operational after 18 months as Emirates plans to move all of its freight operations to the bigger airport in the future.

WAM/MMYS

If I can get the link to work:
WAM (http://www.wam.org.ae/servlet/Satellite?c=WamLocEnews&cid=1290004595889&p=1135099400124&pagename=WAM%2FWamLocEnews%2FW-T-LEN-FullNews)

[BigGeordie]

I see we have gone from "reaping rich dividends" to "posting good results". Ah well, all be revealed tomorrow.

Cat who?

[Sheikhthedripsoff]

Here's my prediction; 3.1B profit. No profit share, no pay rise, no step.

At least I'm setting myself up for a pleasant surprise if it's better than that.

Better than all the cabin crew who still think it's going to be the best profit share ever. There's gonna be a lot of disappointed campers out there.

The question we have to ask is...why has EK all of a sudden become a loss making juggernaut? (in the last few months)

[Yarra]

STDO....

Lots of sold seats...low yield...

[jack schidt]

The old chestnut about how tough it is with such high oil prices cutting into profits, don't they realise we can look at the average price of any oil stock over the last year and see the price trend for ourselves?

Quoted form above
"He said that Emirates was able to achieve the good results despite the increasing fuel prices."

For example lets take a look here>>>

Oil 5-6-2013 | Market Weekly Update (http://marketweeklyupdate.com/2013/05/07/05072013-market-update/oil-5-6-2013/)

[Saltaire]

Sheikhthedripsoff,

You might be right on most counts, although a hope your not. 3% step at a minimum is my hope... I do think the profit will be over 4 billion drm. Should be interesting.

[SOPS]

ICAO is reporting fuel prices down 17 percent

[FL XXX]

It's all about managing expectations!!! Personally I don't have a clue. That's the way EK wants it. We just have wait and hear.

[Schnowzer]

3 plus 3 gets my vote

[Rim-job]

Lads,

Does anyone know around what time the announcement is to be made? Late morning... Afternoon ... 5pm ?

I'm not sure what time they've announced in years gone by. My memory is ****e after 18 years of night flights.

[Schnowzer]

Normally about 11am

[Mach_Krit]

wouldnt it have been nice to announce the results to the employees first...ahhh how naive...:ugh::ugh::ugh:

[falconeasydriver]

In the Lambo dealership...ready to drop the deposit, any news?

[Temujin]

Falcon do it, 20 weeks!

[Schnowzer]

It was a joke! What colour is the Lamborghini not that gopping orange.

[aeropix]

3 posts, he's just playing up. Am sure the money was reshuffled so "DNATA" made enormous profits while poor "EMIRATES AIRLINE" just barely missed the profit target, while still making the biggest profit in history.

[Schnowzer]

The profit is the group not the airline and includes DNATA. Mind you never let the truth get in the way of a good rumour.

[falconeasydriver]

Well it's 12.15, and the Egyptian salesman is offering his first born to sweeten the deal.....any news? :E

[Rim-job]

Rumour has it that the bonus was announced at EGHQ and it's is 'zilch/ zip/ notta'.

Can anyone confirm or deny this? Hoping it's BS.

[oz in dxb]

We'll know when the profit share has been announced as all the investment companies will be ringing like never before!

[thatwasclose]

Understand it is nada, zero, zilch. Nothing, empty space, a lack of anything, an absent of matter.0 .

[yada.yada.yada]

They wouldn't call a meeting to announce if it's zero. We would simply get an email like last year. Someone's just winding you up.

[haveago]

Its not like anyone knew about the announcement! They hardly advertised it did they!

[Rim-job]

Tick, tock, tick , tock...

Still nothing confirmed one way or the other? WTF? :mad:

[Mr Good Cat]

They wouldn't call a meeting to announce if it's zero. We would simply get an email like last year. Someone's just winding you up.

However, I think that's exactly how it happened in 2009.

I am expecting something along the lines of: " Very good year, everybody worked hard - BUT due to the $500 million cargo centre at DWC and some bond repayments this has resulted in not meeting the profit target "...

Such is life.

[DuneMentat]

And here I thought it was only the financial result they would announce not the profit share... :ugh:

[Mr Good Cat]

I think historically they've been announced together, no?

But I agree the announcement is regarding financial results NOT the share of the profits.

Ergo, we may hear nothing more than if we exceeded the target or not (as we know this was set at 3.5 bn AED).

EDIT: Should also add: We won't about any step increase or pay rise until the pay review is announced by email...

[thefoxandfirkin]

Ha ha, one things for sure the closest we'll get to sitting in a Lambo is if we get pulled by Dubai police in their new one :}

[Mr Good Cat]

400 million AED short of the target, so no bonus!

500 million on the cargo centre down the road.

What did I tell ya?

;)

[Rim-job]

No bonus. Check your emails. :ugh:

What a joke.

[Rather Be Skiing]

Of course the threshold is increased to ensure they don't pay again next year. Profit share is a thing of the past.

Well at least we get a shiny new uniform.

[thefoxandfirkin]

45,000 or so very demotivated employees two years in the running......:{

[falconeasydriver]

Can't say I'm surprised, is anyone in all seriousness?

[sluggums]

Not to worry, I'm sure the VP's, SVP's and above will be quite happy with their hefty bonuses....

[SOPS]

I'm not surprised.

[Mach_Krit]

what a joke....

[Instant Hooligan]

With 45'000 demotivated employees I'm absolutely sure there won't be a profit share next year!!



FZ 44million profit and 3 weeks
EK 840 million and sweet FA

[Mach_Krit]

I take it there will be FA in terms of payreview? :yuk::yuk::yuk:

[Big06]

I thought about reading of future pilots' shortage? Money isn't all - but a profit share is indeed an incentive and contributes to loyalty if your contribution to a company's success is reflected in a monetary benefit. But I guess I just have been taught mysteries in business school . . .

[johnnyramjet]

Although our profit increased by 34%, we regrettably did not meet our profit share target. Our group profit of Dhs3.1 billion fell Dhs400 million or 11% short of our Dhs3.5 billion target. :=

[Saltaire]

Profit target..... Joke.

Low cost arm FLY D barely makes a profit and we make hundreds of millions. Nothing to share for all the hard work? Thanks

[HighLow]

No Bonus 2011-12,
No Bonus 2012-13,
AND
More than likely No Bonus 2013-14
(not at least due to upcoming RWY Closures in DXB, reduction in EK routes as a consequence)

I believe the target for 2013-14 is even higher than 2012-13,
well, this is a body blow to the workforce, without question !

The profits for this airline are simply off the chart, compared to carriers around the world, and even closer to home in the Middle East.

Not even a gesture of a few weeks bonus, Shocking stuff really, especially since the majority of the work force are ex-pats. (need to attract people, not demotivate)

Good News Travels Fast, Bad News Travels even faster !

[thatwasclose]

Falcon, the Kia dealership has some great deals.

[Rather Be Skiing]

No Bonus 2011-12,
No Bonus 2012-13,
AND
More than likely No Bonus 2013-14
(not at least due to upcoming RWY Closures in DXB, reduction in EK routes as a consequence)

I believe the target for 2013-14 is even higher than 2012-13,...
!

From the report:

The profit share target for the new financial year has been set at Dhs4.255 billion.



Yield management has taken a nose dive but the target increases over Dhs 3/4 billion. Not likely it will be achieved. At least no false hope this fiscal year.

[helen-damnation]

I've got a second hand bike... pedals of course!

Don't go near HR, the CC charge to resign will look like the herds of wildebeest on the Serengeti :ooh:

[777-200LR]

Everyone will still put their uniforms on tomorrow

I on the other hand, will be on one of the infamous World Islands sipping a cocktail and drinking to the total disaster that they have become. If you guys can't see that EK has become the primary main source bailout to DP World and Dubai's $110b debt, then please enlighten me to another company here that makes as much profit as we do...:yuk:

Profit share is soooo 2004

777-200LR

[fliion]

Four words.

PROFIT SHARE, RICH REWARDS

For the 68,000 people who made this machine work that resulted in a profit of:

3,100,000,000dhs.

Not even a week, not even 500dhs to buy a meal nope...nothing

Except

...a Qantas notebook.

Hello tomorrow...and your discretion to go above and beyond.

What should have been a great day for EK is truly a sad one.

Insult to injury: We want you to go out again next year and make a "Herculean" effort, make a billion dhs more ....and we still won't give you a dime.

f.

[falooty]

WHY NO BONUS? a silly reasons from silly management???:ugh:

[Shaky Hands]

Expect to share rich dividends..........erm ok when?

[Saltaire]

Helen-damnation,

Priceless. I think you're spot on! And for good reason... Why am I here again she says?

[Rather Be Skiing]

Four words.

PROFIT SHARE, RICH REWARDS

For the 68,000 people who made this machine work that resulted in a profit of:

3,100,000,000dhs.

Not even a week, not even 500dhs to buy a meal nope...nothing

Except

...a Qantas notebook.

Hello tomorrow...and your discretion to go above and beyond.

What should have been a great day for EK is truly a sad one.

f.

You forgot about your new uniform to be worn with pride!

All part of today's corporate world: employees are liabilities not assets.

[Daisy Chain]

So....Let me get this right, we have to live in a "sh#t hole" put up with the "local laws" live away from our home countries, away from family, friends and our own culture, to be constantly "threatened" with warning letters, have the goal posts changed every time it suits in regards to the "contract" e.g., overtime, loss of flight pay for dead heading for the freighter, threatened with letters in regard to Dewa bills and having a flight taken away from me in top bid as I was 3 hours into overtime, to be told there is no bonus either??
Mmmmmm Korean anyone??
What is the point of living in this sand hole, cant even get out of this dam place on staff travel as the flights are always oversold! NOT HAPPY!! :mad:

[Dropp the Pilot]

Y'all only have yourselves to blame. The target was missed by 11%. If you had only flown 103 hours a month instead of 92 we would have made it.

[donpizmeov]

Relax, the caning our salary is going to take in the pay review will take our minds off the lack of Profit Cher.

We just need to make a Billion $US and change next year to get the full 2 weeks pay. Nothing greedy in that at all. I feel ashamed that we got three weeks for making 250 million a few years ago.

But still we have em lining up at the door to join. The same old same old.

The Don

[thefoxandfirkin]

Well after crying into my firkin beer those two comments about the deposit on the Kia and Helen D's CC stampede to HR post have now cheered me up.

Good job some people still have a sense of humour even in this dark hour :D

[Mach_Krit]

portal seems to be having some trouble coping with all the users trying to log in ey...:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk:

[donpizmeov]

The pay review is not released yet. But no matter how bad it appears I am sure it will be cost neutral just like the other pay cuts, oops, adjustments have been.

the Don

[givemewings]

Yes, portal has imploded from everyone logging in. BookFace, on the other hand...

my my, you should see the comments.... :E

[cerbus]

EK will just continue to lower the bar to fill the seats. Now Qatar and EY pay more than EK. Why come to EK and get shafted? Only those that can't, will come. God help us all!

[falooty]

after 20 years working with EK loud i am saying EKP to the hill :ok:

[Instant Hooligan]

3 weeks on 44 mill USD

[Shaky Hands]

When can we expect to hear about the pay review :(

[Wilya]

Thanks for nothing you numbskulls:mad:

[SOPS]

Pay review....that's funny....my bet is there will be none.

[baps]

I just invested my profit share. That notebook (aka profit share) that was in my pigeon hole got the BBQ burning really well!

[Instant Hooligan]

Ex, please do not mention the big elephant in the room!!!

[worldaccording2]

Ha ha oh my god what complete and utter Wa:mad:rs.... I guess sponsoring F1, Real Madrid, Arsenal, tennis probably even the friggin world tiddlywinks championships is more important than morale of the real workers on the pit face.

But hey on a brighter my new uniform came yesterday! Along with name tag. But they misspelt my name, I requested "Gullible Tw:mad:t", but apparently we seem to have almost 3000 colleagues of said same name! So I took my second choice of "ALReem Meharder"

The truth ladies and gents is we can bitch and moan till we are blue in the face, the dividend will always be paid to the "shareholder" first. And with the runway closure next year it will be another disappointment next year. The only option is to find alternative employment! Easier said than done.

I'm off now to write a very strong letter to my Un:mad:n..sorry seven days

[mooseknuckles]

As long as there are desperate souls willing to come to an airline that is now a shadow of its former self, then nothing will change. Each time they have taken something away, people keep sending in CVs. Why? Because they are coming even bigger POS outfits.

Pay for your uniform? Sure, just give me a job.
Pay for your meals? Sure, just give me a job.
Pay for your PPC? Sure, just give me a job.
Pay for your training? Sure, just give me a job.

This generation of pilots hasn't had to earn anything so they have no idea what they are worth.

250 hours? Come fly a 737, but you'll pay for everything.
Could I please, boss?
Sure, that will be a hundred bucks for the privilege of interviewing with our new concept airline where the customers AND the pilots pay the management salaries.
Oh thank you kind sirs, I love airplanes.

I really don't understand how any self respecting professional pilot could apply here now. Wait, there aren't any of those left. That explains how we got here.

[drop kick]

I am getting sick and tired of hearing about their rising fuel costs, is anyone surprised oil is expensive, budget accordingly !!! It will be a major cost next year too, no doubt the excuse will be wheeled out for its annual airing again, same time ,same place.

The real truth is the days of the profit share are over, this company never came out of "milk jigger" saving mode. Excess profit will be paid to the government and reinvested by the company.:D:D:D

[pilotrob23]

Well, good news is that MMI is still open!

[fliion]

Lol

There's a silver lining to everything I guess. Just got off the phone from a mate who just arrived in from a flight.

Gloom all around except one our finest from Newcastle, big smile on her face so he tells me this is how the convo went sitting beside her on the bus.

Capt: What are you so happy about?
GR1: I had a final warning two years ago! Yippee! So now it's cleared. Yippee
Capt: So
GR1: so I got two weeks off work bonus more than you lot! Yippee
Capt: huh
GR1: yea I dialed2 for a total of 13 days off and got an final warning letter - no pay raise, no bonus for two years. You guys got the same punishment for pitching up for work ..ha!

You can't make this Shiite up.

f.

[sevenfoursharer]

Never in the field of commercial aviation was so much owed by so few to so many.

Yet these few choose greed over appreciation, opportunism over loyalty.

Everyone who works for this organization needs to remember: No matter what you do for this company, no matter how much of your personal life you sacrifice for these few, your last interaction will be one of rejection.

[Wilya]

Our fuel bill increased by 15%

More aircraft flying more routes, surely an increase in the fuel bill is to be expected:confused:

Every employee worked smart and doubly hard

Thanks, don't expect that in the future...

We must invest to ensure our business is future proof

How about investing in the morale of your workforce:ugh:

I'm aware of your herculean efforts last year

We are truly screwed for next year and thereafter, even Hercules wasn't good enough..

I hope you feel proud

More like cheated:mad:

The profit share target for the new financial year has been set at Dhs 4.255 BILLION. Is this realistic?

Good luck with that:eek:

Together, we will continue to shape and share our world of success

Please note, "our" does not include staff working at the coal face or in the salt mines...

[Nil defects]

Emirates Airline sees profit soar by 52% - ArabianBusiness.com (http://www.arabianbusiness.com/emirates-airline-sees-profit-soar-by-52--501036.html)

[kaycee]

So we work our ass off, don't get overtime as the threshold is too high and now no profit share......note to self.....don't work so hard, make roster adjustments!

[fliion]

Or how about even a couple of SRCs for each employee as token of our appreciation...

Space available would have cost them nothing.

I mean NOTHING really defies belief.

f.

[Mr Good Cat]

6 month mark - 2.1 billion
12 month mark - 3.1 billion

Wtf ??? 80% load factor.
Something is not truthful here.

By the time you add in the contributions to Dubai Inc.'s debt payoff and also all the new infrastructure it was always going to make a huge knock on the declared profit.

As someone else pointed out - Emirates is the only machine around here making money, it's simple maths that they will be the source for at least part of the huge debt solution, even if it's not declared that way.

And I also agree that this IS the way it will be for the foreseeable future until one day demand exceeds supply again and EK struggles to attract enough experienced staff.... and with the state of aviation it will be a long time before more attractive options elsewhere are on the table for employees to consider.

Jus' Sayin'...:ouch:

[FL XXX]

SUPPLY AND DEMAND!!!! That's what rules and nothing else!!!

[thefoxandfirkin]

The company has missed a massive PR trick here. Sure they missed the target but they could have really saved the day by paying a token amount out of the cash kitty which is $7bn. It doesn't take the brains of a sim engineer to work out what two weeks x an average salary x 45,000 staff would cost and its a a very low hundred million or so. In the scheme of the cash pile that wouldn't have much impact yet the effect on morale would have been massive and the PR very good for the company.

I think most people knew it would be a tough year and we all dug in hard working ourselves into the ground thinking that based on the past years we wouldn't have two years of no profit share. I think the two year shock is what's hit home more than the fact its a zero this year.

All rapidly growing companies hit peak, mature then decline its basic economics, same as companies like Microsoft and Apple. They get huge then fall of the cliff and have to reinvent the wheel again and again to regain share. To do this they need focussed, motivated staff. Emirates probably gives more job security than others but that doesn't always motivate no matter where your from.

Us flight deck crew, the CC and even the office boys and girls have been pushed to the limits for commitment but it sure can't keep going forever when its not rewarded.

I think they could have done something really positive here in a negative situation but missed the opportunity big time :mad:

[Wilya]

Well at least we now know how much we are worth to this money making beast:D

[jack schidt]

You should know by now guys, in the ME>

Its all about the profit!

[jack schidt]

Oh and by the way, fly safe, make sure you take enough fuel!

[puff m'call]

It's a very poor show. We know we're just being used to help line the pockets of others, I said from the start there would be no bonus. Bums on seats is all they care about, get used to it!!!!!

[FcU]

Greed, arrogance and utter contempt. The traits of a modern management team. I used to believe in the EK vision but you have finally lost me. Well done. I'm so glad I live away from my country, family and friends to fund football teams, cricket teams, race teams, failed projects, people who can't pay off they're personal loans and all the other numerous souless ventures that pollute our planet with their BS immoral behaviour. Aligning yourself with them says so much about what you consider important. Truly shameful but unsurprising.
I'm taking tomorrow off.:mad:

[puff m'call]

I said from the start and I was right, nothing but a thanks.
Just be here for yourself, not them.

[flyaway777]

'It Takes a World' - whatever that means, was this years theme.

Maybe it's about the world of BS contained in the email.

[777_Scotty]

An utter disgrace after spending hundreds of millions on sponsorships...unfortunately you find many of my ex-colleagues on the A380 discussion still parsing and loving the place. Feed them and they will come.

:mad:

[Swan Man]

What took so long Seaman? Like you said you have been here awhile and you are just now disenchanted. What took you so long to realize you work for a scum airline?

[777_Scotty]

I've heard some disturbing rumours about what their planning in the wolfs layer for staff during the 3 month runway closure....if half of it is true...profit share is probably the least of your worries.

I say u because i'm out of here..very happy for it.

Really hope things improve for you all...a good bunch of guys working their tits of for a bunch of chimps. Good luck:ok:

[Fellowship of the drink]

Well at least the fear factor is gone, warning letter threatening no profit share - Like that is going to work after today.

EK, you have lost the goodwill of a lot of staff today and that may be your downfall.

[fatbus]

They lost the goodwill last year, this is a repeat of 2011/12 and the same will happen 2013/14 and my thinking is 2014/15 as well. To me profit share will not happen again.

Anyone who has been here for a few years should not be surprised by this.

[Pixy]

“Profit share or Bonus, whatever you prefer to call these two animals will be whatever is decided by those who govern most aspects of your life. Nonetheless don’t search for rhyme, reason or any measure of fair play. That is a fool’s errand.”

I made this comment last month. I wasn’t necessarily predicting no profit sharing (I actually did expect at least a token), but rather cautioning against searching for rationale behind whatever may evolve.

Yet judging by some comments, we search for justification, reasonableness, explanation, or simply a human touch and find little. And this is because the system of the profit sharing and indeed the whole corporate reward system today has no redeeming features or rational other than pure unadulterated, breathtaking greed and arrogance.

Profit Sharing is extraordinarily simple in concept. Make a profit and some of it will be shared with those who made it possible, even if the lion’s share goes to the shareholder. That means any profit, not that beyond a non-specific, baseless line drawn by pure conjecture. After all if some cataclysmic event occurs in the next financial year the company may be extremely grateful to make a profit at all. And that could be with the full co-operation of every employee to power and work through the hardship that occurred. Would that not warrant some reward?

There is a sense of entitlement in the 1% that controls the majority of the world’s wealth. Indeed I imagine if they bothered to read the sentiment aired on this forum after today’s disappointment some would be extremely indignant. I can only imagine the comments in board rooms:

“We pay them a good salary how can they be so ungrateful?”
“We missed the profit target. What aren’t they getting?
“They are lucky they have a job. Look at the unemployment”
“They are much better off here than they would be in another airline”
“We put up the risk, why do they think they are entitled to any reward?”
“It’s a supply and demand world. What are they going to do about it? Leave?”
And as I have commented on before: “If they don’t like it they are always free to go elsewhere”

There are so many fundamental flaws in all of this that it would take pages to systematically tear down these arguments and conclusively prove them wrong. I would have to go into more esoteric rational and philosophies that it would be beyond the scope of a forum but nonetheless uphold basic facts, truths and age tested outcomes.

So let’s distill this down to what it ultimately represents. Greed, exploitation, manipulation and a worldwide system that is finally devoid of any humanitarian ethos.

It’s easy to make a profit in good times, harder in bad times. The size of the profit bears no resemblance to the effort; it depends largely on the climate. Therefore the fairest solution would be to reward all and any profits. Stakeholders are every bit as important as shareholders. Business 101 says it’s not wise to belittle them. Only the arrogant would ignore this.

The extremes of corporate greed with regard to exploitation have only recently been so vividly demonstrated in Bangladesh. We are not there yet by any stretch (though some in the company may not be far off) but the trajectory is not good. Besides where is the demarcation line? The ethos of profits at all costs suggests we must indeed explore its boundaries for managers to fulfill their directive.

Should we be surprised? No. After the Great Financial Crisis of 2008, corporations gave out massive bonuses while putting millions out of jobs and houses. Lives were expended to give individuals obscene and unnecessary amounts. And the individuals actually believed it was their entitlement.

Yet we accept it, feeling we have little choice. We are revolted but feel we cannot force change. Our minds are twisted to accept the justifications given for the system we find ourselves part of. So much so that many of us parrot its mantra’s and “truths” without sparing it a second thought. Some of us even fall captive to the illusion that maybe there is a minute chance we may join the 1%, so supporting and climbing the system is the way to go.

How sad are we, hoping for a few crumbs from the table that is groaning with plenty. Like dogs waiting for scraps that may fall.

We should have expected more. For example: 50% of all profits will be shared with the employees that made this happen. That would be logical, fair and can you imagine living in a world where all companies took a similar stance?

Should we dare to demand a world of plenty, without wars, poverty, despair, unemployment, starving children and shattered lives?

Forget 2, 4, 8 or 12 weeks – With all those billions made, I expect more.

[Instant Hooligan]

Amen Pixy, we should all expect more

[tifosi]

"Only the arrogant would ignore this."

Think you hit the nail on the head there.

[K9]

Pixy:

Calamus Gladio Fortior

:D:D:D:D:ok:

[disconnected]

Ouch!

Thats gotta hurt...............

:ok:

[The Turtle]

if I only taxied single engine 11% more none of this would have happened....

jeeze i'm sorry

(oh and idle reverse too)

[Kempus]

Seaman styanes has it in one!

I know Scotty 777 will say I told you so but f**k me! That was not expected and being down route right now the whole crew is gutted and thinking wtf!!!!! I won't be surprised if only 12 turn up for pick up!!!

[jarops]

HAH... no bonus, as I expected, I have seen this too long. More savings, restrictions, more demands for benefits... to whom? I was not expecting any bonus anyhow, but for the "air" for VERY hard working staff, this is a quite a fiasco. This is not improving to achieve the goal requested by the "managers".

[Lubeoil]

As per previous posters I must say that I am very disappointed (but not surprised) by the news from our great leaders. When I put on my sensible head I may conclude that it's not personal and only business. If this is indeed the case then I use my business basics to add up the numbers to decide if this job is now financially competitive with other airlines. Personally I feel that the profit share was required to bring the wages here up to a level to compete elsewhere. I would be interested to see how the numbers comare with the other airline up the road. You really have to look at the pros and cons, put a number on each of these, and decide if its worth the financial package. I must say that without a decent annual profit share then my answer is no. I often hear the old chestnut about "we are lucky to have a job" and "there are no jobs back in my own country". I am afraid that as long as management are aware of this sentiment we will continue to be shafted, not only financially but in a continuing erosion of respect for the workforce. I believe that many of us won't be going above and beyond to help out the company in future. Pre briefing oneself with gabi, jumping in the company car to work before actual pick up time, arriving at briefing room earlier than our already fictional briefing time along with all the previous stated operational cost saving measures are certainly something I will be giving great consideration.

[ChocksOn]

The company could make $1 or $845 million... looks like you get the same....zilch!!!!
My target would be the former for this year if I was still there at the end of it.
:ugh::mad::yuk:

[Emma Royds]

The lack of motivation and disillusionment was very much evident back on arrival into Dubai, this morning for us at least. Stand guidance wasn't switched on, no communication from ground crew whatsoever after stopping on stand, despite trying to make contact with them. Furthermore, the GCU was connected but wasn't switched on. One got the feeling that the Dnata boys that were allocated to look after us, just simply didn't care this morning.

The people who I feel sorry for the most are not our colleagues but our passengers. They are the ones that will suffer in the days, weeks and months ahead. On time performance will get worse, cabin crew won't go the extra mile and ground staff will be nonchalant when it comes to tight connections and the like. The timing of the planned closure of 12L/30R this summer could not have been planned at a worse time! :}

As is often joked 'If you don't like it, then go somewhere else'. Never a truer word as indeed many will..... it will sadly be our passengers.

I wonder how many years of installments Sheikh Mo has left to pay as I hope Sheikh Khalifa's interest rate is not too punishing!!! :E

[Desert Camel]

Really, really gutted! :(
Profit share is definitely a thing from the past!
I was not very hopeful, but I still thought we might get a little something though. What a big disappointment!

I actually feel cheated, to tell the truth. My decision to come here was based, amongst other things, on getting a "bonus" (maybe not every year, but at least, on a regular basis) as it was making the overall package more attractive. We can forget about that now....:mad:

All about fake appearances and empty promises...

[fatbus]

It surprises me how naive some EK pilots are. The writing was on the wall. Do a bit of research on Dubai's financial situation and all will be revealed. People think it's bounced back, maybe in some very small area's, but have a look at the overall BAD situation it's in. For one 110B US in debt . Trying to push tourism in Dubai is a joke, there is a very dark side to this place. Expats have to remember the 2 bucket plan.

[helen-damnation]

Page 3 - 777-200ULR
If you guys can't see that EK has become the primary main source bailout to DP World and Dubai's $110b debt, then please enlighten me to another company here that makes as much profit as we do...

I understand Dubai Ports got 3 months share/bonus. Do they contribute?

[Cloud Bunny]

Scotty what have you heard on the grapevine then regarding the runway closures?
I like everyone is majorly pi#*+d off (not though surprised) about the total lack of recognition and the demotivation felt on the flight back yesterday was visibly noticeable. No doubt by the pax as well. Dangerous and stupid by our "leaders". And to totally demotivate everyone for the coming year by not even dangling the carrot of an achievable target for the coming year shows not just their undeniable greed but also their total lack of man management ability.
This is starting to show all the hallmarks of my previous Irish lcc employer - he's not sneaked onto the board has he?!!

[777-200LR]

helen-damnation

I suppose if that's true, then part of the bailout instalment includes a bonus to their hard working port boys/girls!

On a different note, lets contact those top 3% OTP Captains again and see if they're still willing to share what their secret is to getting their flight dispatched on time. I'll delegate my PA to the augment captain next time, that should do the trick...oh wait, where's our tug? Damn, I must write this up in my EK/QF note book.

[777-200LR]

Did anyone else see the American Eagle ad and the bottom of this page?

Hiring $5,000 Bonus!

How ironic

[lospilotos]

That didn't take long...No Bonus - YouTube

[ex-XL]

Fwiw, FZ did indeed get 3 weeks worth of 'Basic Salary' as a bonus (payable to anybody whom had been in the company for more than 6 months). However, that bonus payment needs to be put into context with the fact that since 2008 (when FZ started) there has only been the following:

In 2010: A 2% increase in 'Basic Salary'.
In 2012: A 10 Dhs per hour increase in 'Flight Pay' (block hour pay).

Furthermore, in that same 5 year period there has been:

No increase in 'Accommodation Allowance' (remembering that FZ do not provide company housing); and likewise
No increase in 'Transport Allowance' (remembering that FZ do not provided a limo pick-up service to / from work)

It is the case that probably 50% of FZ's total package (for pilots) is made up of 'Allowances', it being a financial system which is purposefully used in order to help FZ limit their fiscal damage when people decide to leave, i.e. when FZ have to pay-out the End-of-Service-Gratuity, the latter being based entirely upon an employees 'Basic Salary', it also helps them to limit any bonus payment through much the same mechanism in that the 'Basic Salary' is held down at a low level.

Fwiw, the current rumour inside FZ is that there is going to be some sort of increase in Basic Salary for 2013 (to be back-dated to 1st April), BUT that it will only be for Captain's on the 'C' scale (and don't even ask about the ineptitude that resulted in all the pay scales!); i.e. in an endeavour to lift them up to at least the same level as Captain's on the present 'B' scale, and that in 2014 the then 'B' scale Captain's will then be lifted up to the same rate as Captains on present the 'A' scale; And, any bonuses aside, in that interim period: the present 'A' scale Captains will get no increase for at least the next 2 years; the 'B' scale Captains will get no increase for at least the next 1 year; and that all 'Allowances' will, respectively, stay pegged!

At the CP's meeting (last week), where the COO was in attendance, when questioned about the evident dramatic increase in the cost of accommodation, the COO drawled a response that this was being caused by those dastardly opportunistic realtors / estate-agents and that FZ was not going to play into their hands with any increase in the 'Accommodation Allowance' for its staff (remembering that FZ's Accommodation Allowance has not changed, by even one Fil, since 2008).

Any reality in respect to the ever increasing prices of all commodities in Dubai, results in Management doing a head-in-the-sand denial that even an Ostrich would be proud of!
And as for loyalty, hard work, commitment? These are evidently measured in terms of months of service, i.e. 6 months to be precise, 'coz that's seemingly all the time it takes to be in FZ to be worthy of a 'bonus'.

Regardless of which side of R12/R30 you reside, it's the same **** that's in one of those two buckets!

[maimax]

top of dissent....

[drop kick]

It is clear that the days of profit share are over. The company has a clear intention now to the re invest excess profits and feels a duty or fulfills an obligation to repay / compensate the Dubai government for the mistakes of the past.

Motivated by greed and the above, the days of the sharing of profits are clearly over. A share in the profits in any organization is a powerful motivational tool used by progressive companies to maximize future potential profits.

This company has saved today by not honoring this previously employed tactic and will pay tomorrow with the efforts of an understandably demoralized and unmotivated workforce. I believe they will pay by employees not implementing their pedantic cost cutting measures, a loss of good will and a maximization of sick leave to say the very least. I am not advocating this merely outlining the costs.

[scandistralian]

"Every leader wishes to reward his team and so do I"

Lets hope this is reflected in the form of a decent pay review, when is this due?!

[lospilotos]

According to the financial report employee costs were 9 billion dirhams. I guess this includes all allowances and flight pay so the basic salary for all employees would be a bit less that this. But just 9Bn / 52 / 2 weeks equates into some 346 million dirhams. So now when they don´t have to pay this it pretty much comes to the same profit for the owner in the end of the day. Hopefully the profit target for 2012/13 included the intention of the 3% raise so still hoping for the best, but fearing the worst...

[sanddune 1]

To add insult to injury: Headline in the National Newspaper Business Section,
today, May 10, 2013.

[B]EMIRATES AIRLINE HITS NEW HEIGHTS WITH PROFIT![B]

"Emirates lifted profits by 52% as the worlds #1 carrier by International traffic, carried more than 39 million pax across its fast expanding route network.
Emirates Group recorded a Dh3.1 billion net profit, up 34% from last year, on revenue of Dh77.5 billion, an increase of 17% over last years results!

All this and NO BONUS!

You know what this means?

I'm using the little bottles of OLIVE OIL AND THE BALSAMIC VINEGAR dressing!!
May even take a couple off! I'm having the shellfish, maybe even some caviar!!

Enjoy!

[QCM]

Biscuits
Or
Nuts
Unfair
Sharing
:ugh::*

[Gulfstreamaviator]

Is this true, if so then the Puss is really being taken.

glf

[Panther 88]

As Willie Nelson sang,

"Turn out the lights the party's over
they say that all good things must end
Let's call it a night the party's over and tomorrow starts the same old thing again"

Yes boys, the party (good will) is over. Stating the obvious, IMHO, this zero P.S. will affect the ground staff more than us. So let's try to give them some slack.

Wear those ID lanyards that say FLY EMIRATES with pride. But feel very good that once again YOU have managed, through your hard work and sacrifice, to allow your manager to receive his well deserved bonus, whether a new Range Rover or actual cash. That in itself should make you feel much better about your P.S. :D

[Spikedog]

Instead of moaning on here why don't you reply to the email from HH Sheikh and tell him what you think.

I agree with everything that is being said and think it's disgraceful that profit over the last 2 years of AED 5.4b leads to Zero bonus, but posting on pprune is a waste of breath and we all know it.

[Swan Man]

EK paid back 1 billion dhs out of our profit share. Our profit was only 3.1 billion dhs so our illustrious leaders gave our landlords over 33% of our profits. What other company in the world pays this kind of dividend rate?

[Spikedog]

ex-XL

If you work for a low cost you get paid low cost. Everyone knows that, so don't moan.

[sheikhmahandy]

Moving Pictures - What About Me (1982) - YouTube (http://youtu.be/OzQKECQgjW8)

[Old King Coal]

Spikedog - If you work for a low cost you get paid low cost. Everyone knows that, so don't moan.
I don't believe that ex-XL works for FZ any more?!... but I, however, do still work there (on the 'A' scale) and last year I looked at applying as a DEC at EK and found that I couldn't afford the pay cut that I'd take in the LHS at EK (and I did v.carefully do the math!)... so go figure that one about 'low-cost' ?!

[Narrow Runway]

All the talk of goodwill being gone is a load of bollocks. People will still go the extra mile. Why? Because of this:

The small number of you talking on this forum demonstrate the complete lack of interest that most of your colleagues unfortunately show.

If anyone realistically thinks anything will change, you are bonkers. Your directors will be happy to replace you with other lunatics.

Equally, to expect a profit share, bonus or even a congratulatory back slap is utter folly.

You work for a corporation in the Middle East. I wouldn't trust them to necessarily even honour my basic pay if it didn't suit them to.

Go figure.

[jack schidt]

I can tell you that I for one will not be busting my gut anymore to get the on time performance statistic when it doesn't benefit me in any way shape or form. If I told you I might of had the letter for being a good boy before then that would be telling and you wouldn't believe me anyway (if I did?).

2 engine taxi, if it doesn't make life easier and is a hazard to my "safe" operation then why should I bother? STATCON, well as it says, thats just a CON anyway and I think that should be name changed to STATAVERAGEPILOT CONTROLS FOB.

ALT flight = drink the bar dry and well I feel like a kid but there are ways to get 10 + weeks of salary spent in no time "IF" you aren't being proactive at being a company man and helping pay the DXB 110 Billion debt off.

You are dealt your hand here, you play the cards your way to your own advantage!

You have your choices as they say, put up with the current greed, leave or make your own life much more relaxed and comfortable (I mean safe) at work.

Edit> with all the runway closures etc factored over the next couple of years budgets, expect NADA. NADA is the new norm! The lies of fuel pains and yet such continued growth in record profits does NOTHING to give me anything but disgust at the way the company thinks it can pull the wool over the employees eyes. You cannot do anything but unite in doing your part to create a "very" safe airline here at EK!

[cerbus]

I wonder what the soft c0cks like Craggenmore and Wiz think of the screw job we just received from the company. Their silence thinks even they don't mind what just happened.
I wish I could meet them because if I take or steal $12,000 to $15,000 from them they won't mind a bit and won't call the police.

[camel_hump]

No Bonus - YouTube (http://youtu.be/g-eZZp5e78U)

[Narrow Runway]

The simple reality is that the management don't give a sh1t.

They think they can get away with not rewarding you and are prepared to take their chances in that gamble.

They think you are replaceable and aren't really bothered currently, as there are few decent places to go to, even if you did resign in mass numbers.

The management are totally confident that the places you COULD leave EK for are in fact worse than EK itself. Therefore, people may piss and moan, but they won't leave in large numbers.

As for single engine taxi, low drag approaches and extra fuel. In time, acceptance of fate will set in and the norm (management demands) will be adhered to. Not many pilots have the appetite, or backbone, to become a ME management target. And we are, generally, a pretty mild mannered bunch.

Therefore, nothing will change drastically I feel.

I wish you would all get a MASSIVE bonus. That would perhaps wake up other management to do the same, as it would indicate a staff shortage in reality.

However, I've just been to the home of "Flexicrew" for an LPC this week. CTC it is called.

I can tell you that they have a veritable sausage factory of capable, willing and able cadets coming through the machine. These kids are literally queuing up to get in the RHS of an Airbus with no permanent contract for easyJet. And that's after getting into £100,000 of debt to do so.

Imagine what they'd do to get in an A330/340 or 380. And do not even tell them you've got B777's.........

[fliion]

Narrow

You may be right, time will tell.

But I believe this one is palpably different. Can't put my finger on it yet...need time to digest.

There is just a different sense of injustice that has been perpetuated this week.

The talk now is almost a calm sense of indifference ... Inner voice that is saying for every action there is a reaction. It has has reached higher level this time, no question.

Worked out with a true company man today - TRE - he had finally 'switched' for lack of a better term.

We shall see but a rot has started to settle in...never a good thing for any company.

Permeated multiple levels now....

No more of the 'esprit de corps' to get it done...of that I am sure.

Not our doing BTW...reap what you sow.

f.

[Yarra]

NR.....not rewarded? We get paid...bonus is bonus and separate from the salaries we signed on

[glofish]

Appalling!

What bugs me most, is the fact that they don’t mind telling blatant bulls#it (second h/y only 1 billion) and they don’t even bother losing face when FZ and EY give p/s and the superiour company does not. That shows that they hold us in such low respect, that they couldn’t care less about anything like a face, because they stopped looking into ours, it got too low on their perception radar, we’re enclosed in their maids room, out of sight of their life.

There are very few weapons to counter. Write to HH? Come on, the letter doesn’t get passed his sub-sub-sub secretary. Gear-down at 20 miles, no more s/e taxi? With the ridiculous amount of “protect the hub fuel” we’re carrying this does not even show on statistics.

The only thing that makes it to the higher levels is our OTP and ops disruptions, especially with the upcoming rwy closures. I guess with strict adherence to sop, this is achievable and not punishable …… Let’s better be safe than sorry (absolutely no discretion!), let’s be the ultimate and extremely good EKSOP operators (any little doubt? -> g/a) and by this send a message.
All we need to invest is a bit of our time, but at least that is still paid!!

Goodwill and the extra mile are still ours to grant!

[Panther 88]

Next question will be the pay review. I am dead certain that they will realize the error of their ways and make this right during that process.....wait I'm sorry, just woke up. But in reality, isn't that the next shoe to fall? Won' be able to explain that away with a flick of the hand. And yes, even the "koolaid" drinkers are miffed.:cool:

[Rather Be Skiing]

Yarra- I think we all know that. But this year is different.

We made 2.1 BN in the first 6 months.
The second 6 months is traditionally better performing.

We allegedly made 1bn in the the ensuring 6 months.

No accidents, no wars, no volcanic ash, stable fuel prices, and by their own admission 80% load factors.

so how come over 50% less in the second 6 months. Something stinks, something doesn't add up. That is the issue. Just who is responsible for that?
...

This is what bothers me:

Key ratios 2012-13 2011-12 2010-11 2009-10 2008-09 2007-08 2006-07 2005-06 2004-05 2003-04

Operating margin 3.9 2.9 10.0 8.2 5.3 11.5 11.4 11.7 14.6 13.3
Profit margin 3.1 2.4 9.9 8.1 1.6 12.9 10.6 10.9 13.4 12.0

The last 2 years have seen operating and profit margin much lower than historically.

What has our highly touted new yield guru done to address this. Since his background, I believe, is legacy (LH) is he applying legacy airline strategies here? In which case will we see our first loss before long?

If so, will he be accountable?

[Yarra]

There will be no more big bonuses, if at all... The company are in a far different position to what it has been in the past...competition....seats sold versus yield...aircraft to pay for...

Plus...lack of efficient work practices/bloated staff numbers and a continuation of them instead of seeking alternative methods are just SOME of the legacies that exist from the days of consolidating the establishment of the airline expansion and it's subsidiaries

For mine the bonus system is flawed as well. The same ratio of any profit share is paid to all and does not discern from those who put in extra or conversely those who are the samsonites when on duty.

Y

[fatbus]

This highlights the fact that all you are is a contract employee and the company will use you and abuse you until you have had enough which suits there plan. EK's management style is and always has been "If you dont like it leave" EK is a LCC with wide bodies.

[Desert Camel]

The reason why I am really upset and feel cheated:mad: is that profit share is part of the contract I signed and remuneration package I expect. I know PS depends on the company making a profit, but the company does make a profit. I don't really care about the practicalities.... It is way too easy to set up unrealistic targets or artificially reduce the profit!

If they start taking away what I signed for and what they promised, this is the beginning of the end. What's next? :ugh::ugh:

[MosEisley]

DC, they ave been taking away things in our signed contract for years. "Operational needs" and "company's discretion" invalidate most of what you think you are entitled to. Back to your oars, the drum is beating. Nothing will change. The desperate from the LCC will continue to flock here. Once that plague has burned out maybe we will see some improvements. Until then, the beatings will continue until morale improves.

[adolf hucker]

And Lo!

There was a great wailing and gnashing of teeth. The Prince's subjects beseeched unto him and said "Lord, thou promised us but 6 months gone that we would share in the bounteous harvest. Yet, now thou giv'st the fruit of our labours to to the King who is in a spot of financial bother. What giveth, oh Lord?"

The Prince spake unto them, in a sweet and honeyed tongue. "Oh humble scrotes, dost thou not know that It Takes a World?" And, moving swiftly on, "Verily, the harvest was not half bad but we have battl'd with demons and had to give many coins to feed our beasts. Some of the harvest was promis'd as a dowry to join unto the Kingdom of Quonnus and some unto the begetters of 'Greetings the Morrow'. But fear not, my beloved workers, next year's harvest will be a right corker, no doubt, inshallah. Thou shalt have thy rewards if only thy can deliver 120%."

But the people were fearful and there was discord. "Lord, thou didst tell us we were thy chosen people and our riches would multiply beyond belief. Not only that, Lord, but our needs are many. Our women are weak and cannot work so we must pay servants one fortieth of our bounty to tidy up a bit and look after the kids. Plus there's a new Land Cruiser which will not buyest itself."

The Prince spake softly, as unto a child, "Thou art not my chosen people. Thou are unto me as the slaves are unto you that tend thy households and gardens. Speak not of your own greed but think of thy deeds to those less fortunate. Besides, if thou don't like it, thou can head back to the wastelands from whence thou came."

The people were crying and there was much wringing of the hands. A great cry went up, "Blimey, we've been rumbled. We should have listened to the prophet, Adolphe (pbuh), when he spake unto us and told us the Prince's land was not all it's cracked up to be."

But Adolphe had left the land of Silk and Money and was journeying to the place of his birth. For he had been wise with the Prince's bounty and had not given it to the innkeeper come Friday brunch, nor had he kept many slaves to wipe his ass or his oxen.

Here endeth the first lesson.

[Mr Good Cat]

For he had been wise with the Prince's bounty and had not given it to the innkeeper come Friday brunch, nor had he kept many slaves to wipe his ass or his oxen.

Here endeth the first lesson.

IMO just about the most genuinely useful statement ever to make it on to the Pprune Middle East Forum.

[nador2707]

You first Spikedog. Let me know how that works out for ya. :ok:

[fringhtok]

Lots of complaining and strong words. How much will turn into action? How many will leave because of this? Last I heard attrition is at record low levels. Literally hundreds waiting to join. DEC applications were wildly oversubscribed, reportedly over 1,000 qualified applicants. Supply and demand.

Let's have an unofficial pole: hands up everyone intending to leave in the next 6-12 months due to lack of bonus. Remember, with more than 3,400 pilots, any number less than about 150 is inconsequential. Until something happens, nothing will change.

FOK

Ps. I'm not leaving.

[Dune]

adolf hucker:

One of the most unique, well versed and inventive posts on Pprune in years. I applaud your efforts. Well done Sir.

Having been in this company for many, many years and not one who indulges in the daily banter that is Pprune; I am stunned and appalled by the myopic, self serving corporate ethos displayed by our current "management" team (a term I use very loosely given the utter lack of management/leadership skills this current group has shown they possess over the past few years).

It is obvious to me this management team has forgotten this is a SERVICE industry and not a fuc#ing factory. As such, this company has forgotten its employees are a balance sheet ASSET; equally as valuable on the airlines balance sheet as any aircraft, building, computer system or executive lounge. An investment in each is required in order to maximize ROI, efficiency and productivity in a service industry such as aviation (perhaps I need to donate my subscription to Harvard Business Review to one of our "management" as they seem to have lost their way since grad school?).

Instead,these "EK geniuses" have determined those who actually deliver the bottom line in this service industry (ie. every single employee on the front line who actually makes this operation work day-to-day from the check-in staff, baggage handlers, cargo loaders, cleaning staff, caterers, station staff, engineers, cabin crew, pilots, etc, etc, etc) to be more a liability than an asset and that the fixed capital assets they invest in will ultimately deliver them to their "airline nirvana".

I strongly disagree and believe disregarding one of your most important service industry "balance sheet" bottom line assets (YOUR EMPLOYEES) is a stunning mistake.

I have been a proud contributer to the success of Emirates for a very long time. I cannot say what others might do. I can only say my personal contribution going forward will be SIGNIFICANTLY less than it was before this event. Not because I personally needed a "bonus" (believe me, I do not) but because fellow Emirates employees who are much less fortunate than I have worked their tails off for this company and have not been duly rewarded. I despise flagrant corporate greed displayed in such an abhorrent manner.

You each need to look into your soul to see where you stand.

Dune

[BenCartwright]

All attempts to watch the "NO BONUS" video on You Tube fails.
-Removed, banned, blocked... most likely - all of the above!

Anyone know if it can be found somewhere else?

Kind of makes you wonder how long we'll be able to discuss these subjects here and all...

http://i1277.photobucket.com/albums/y490/madslauritzen/nobonus_zps735c883b.jpg

[fatbusdriver]

Fringhtok:

My hand´s up. I´m leaving. Tought about it before. Just wantrd to wait for this announcment. Well, it helped me now with my decision. Enough of this sh*t! I wish they´d get a flood of resignations!

Hello tomorrow

[a747jb]

In a company the size of Emirates (airline or not) its not the ones that leave that cost the company the most money, its the ones that stay and are pissed off. What do I mean by this? 400 pilots leaving cause they are pissed off cost a lot less money than 3500 pilots uploading an extra tonne of gas every flight because they are pissed off. 3000 cabin crew leaving are far cheaper to replace than 16000 cabin crew letting all the passengers know about all the free things (think ear plugs and playing cards) that are on the airplane specifically for the customers and never get used because our pax didn't know it was there. They will now simply because the crew are pissed off and want the company to make less money since they aren't going to share anyways. Is the crew doing anything wrong, no, the passengers in theory paid for these things. When they are removed, passengers will switch carriers (its the little things that keep frequent flyers). 5000 ramp workers leaving cost a lot less money that 20000 ramp workers dragging their feet and causing every flight to be delayed by 10 minutes every day. Again, passengers will leave for other airlines if they are always delayed. You get the idea. This company's now problem isn't the ones that are going to leave, its the ones that are going to stay and be pissed off. And I am really sad to say that right now that is vast majority of everyone below a SVP level no matter what department you work in, even the boys and girls in the office. I can't say I am surprised, but I am very very disappointed. 1 announcement may have just brought this company to its knees for the near future. A small token, even a very small one (1 week bonus) would have gone a tremendous distance to say "you, our employees, are still important to us" Those days are over at EK and in fact most of the corporate world in general. :bored::ouch:

[Alconguin Crusader]

It is the arrogance of the management that is most telling. Talking or I should say lecturing us like we are stupid.
"We didn't get close to the target.". Well actually we reached target in Dec and we passed it by a long shot you just decided or were ordered to give 1 billion dhs to your bosses. That was about a 33% payment on the profits thank you very much.
"Our next year target is vey attainable.". Well even if we do have a good year (how can we not with our labor costs) you will give OUR profits to Dubai again and screw us for the 4th year in a row on the bonus or profit share.

I agree that a pissed off pilot IN the cockpit is much more dangerous than one that leaves the company. However a far too high percentage of the pilots here come from absolutely crap airlines and do not think EK is that bad. Makes you wonder what they put up with before. Do you think the Canadians are going to do anything drastic? Don't even mention the South Africans. They can cut our pay 50% and they ain't leaving and will still be happy. We are not even going to talk about the 3rd world pilots.
As long as Emirates keeps hiring from the dregs of the industry the company will keep on shafting like they did this week until something or someone hurts them where in counts. In the pocketbook. Don't count on it though, just look around at your colleagues.

[Rather Be Skiing]

...

I agree that a pissed off pilot IN the cockpit is much more dangerous than one that leaves the company. However a far too high percentage of the pilots here come from absolutely crap airlines and do not think EK is that bad. Makes you wonder what they put up with before. Do you think the Canadians are going to do anything drastic? Don't even mention the South Africans. They can cut our pay 50% and they ain't leaving and will still be happy. We are not even going to talk about the 3rd world pilots.
As long as Emirates keeps hiring from the dregs of the industry the company will keep on shafting like they did this week until something or someone hurts them where in counts. In the pocketbook. Don't count on it though, just look around at your colleagues.

Well... as a 'colleague' what is your plan? Have you resigned? Or are you also here from some 'dregs of the industry' outfit?

If you haven't resigned yet I don't see how you are in any position to slag off your 'colleagues'.

[Rim-job]

Crusader....

You might want to watch your words and how you choose to use them. You sound very condescending towards other countries and aviation backgrounds. Besides coming from the great US of A, what exactly is your background that makes you so superior? Let me guess, you are one of these astronauts that has to tell everyone about how good you were at your previous airline, how you were a Captain on this, a Captain on that, etc. I'm guessing you are prob still in the right seat and chances are there is a reason for that if you catch my drift (Does your previous PPC performance come to mind?)

Btw, I have many American friends and you sir are the type that gives the rest of them a bad name :oh:

[Shaky Hands]

Crusader
Aiming your frustrations at your colleagues in such misguided and poor manner is ridiculous. They are not the problem here, pilots with that attitude are.
Here's hoping there's a pay rise!

[fliion]

Guys - stay on thread. Leave Al Cru for another day. This one hasn't drifted yet...don't let it.
It has been focused and one of the most insightful I have read.

From a different angle - one of the more significant by-lines of the results is from a business journo's perspective....in that EK had a massive collapse in profitability from 1st half to 2nd half of the year.

If the Co. was public, the stock would have been slaughtered due to a 50% plunge in money making over the course of a very short period of time.

Very, very few CEO's would make it through 'the Boards' performance review on that kind of wild swing without a "force majeure" event.

Lets face it - if you can get a final warning for being sick..or liquidate the the Training Dept leadership for doing a good job...

...what in the good Lords name is going to happen at the top level with this kind of profit reverse?

Any guesses? Surely they are trembling at their ominous future.

f.

[flywildcamel]

I am pissed off like everyone else here...

Having said that, am I gona to resign from my position? certainly not, I have a salary by the end of the month...

But let's try to be practical:
They take from our human ressources as much as they can...
so let's do what we are paid for: flying according to our contract, following the rules and only the rules: OM-A, and do not forget the GCAA text, as the OM-A is not that compliant with the GCAA text (eg the last recall made by the GCAA authoritiy to EK! Credit flying times, Burn out policy which is totally illegal).
Try to be aware of the foreign laws, indeed we have to comply with the most restrictives ones (EASA is more restrictive than GCAA). Find out in what, and do respect that.
Refuse ANY discretion, as EK plan lots of our FDP just close by the max FDP cause EK knows you will take your discretion...
Any reason is a good reason to take more fuel (cb's enroute, delay expected, etc...) you are all good enough to find out a good reason.

Let's show them how hard we have been used and not have been thanks or recognized with a bonus regarding to this huge profit.

We should all do that (ground, cabin, cockpit).

I began already since this announcement.
I am from now doing only what I am paid for... no more anymore!!!

[Mr Good Cat]

recall made by the GCAA authoritiy to EK! ..... Burn out policy which is totally illegal).

I've not done the Harare triangle trip, but when did the burnout policy disappear and what has it been replaced with?

Do the operating crew not still need their 3 hours minimum rest?

[HighLow]

Step back a few years,
"the building blocks of this airline was based upon superior customer service"

This airline would NOT compromise one bit to ensure the best customer service was being maintained, with the goal of even exceeding these high standards. This meant looking after the staff also. Without these people (office, ramp, engineering, flight deck, cabin crew, the list goes on), the airline would just be like the rest of them.

Reflecting on both their updated message on their website and a quotation directly from HH Shaikh Ahmad Bin Saeed Al Maktoum regarding their recent financial results;

Our Vision & Values (WEBSITE)
The principles which propel us forward

A strong and stable leadership team, ambitious yet calculated decision-making and ground-breaking ideas all contribute to the creation of great companies. Of course, these have played a major part in our development, but we believe our business ethics are the foundation on which our success has been built. Caring for our employees and stakeholders, as well as the environment and the communities we serve, have played a huge part in our past and will continue to shape our future.



2012-13 Financial Results
“Achieving our 25th consecutive year of profit in a financial year with our largest ever increase in capacity across the network is an achievement that speaks to the strength of our BRANDS and our LEADERSHIP,” said Shaikh Ahmad Bin Saeed Al Maktoum, President of Dubai Civil Aviation and Chairman and Chief Executive of Emirates airline and Group.




the obvious is now clear !
Whether it is due to external financial pressures from Dubai Government or whatever the reason might be; it seems to a neutral bystander, there has been a monumental shift away from these important founding principles, and they now believe (rightly or wrongly) that their route to continued success is through their Brand and Leadership.

The final statement "Caring for our employees and stakeholders, as well as the environment and the communities we serve, have played a huge part in our past and will continue to shape our future." is profound and correct in many aspects. REMEMBER: It has shaped Emirates to where it is today, but recent decisions made, of course will shape the future of Emirates in the years ahead.

1.Does the leadership believe that the product Emirates provide continues to be superior, and is out of reach by many of your competitors. If so, surely you must do what it necessary to maintain this high standard.
OR
2.Do you want to alter this product, in order to maximise profits.


For the sake of maximising profits, you risk demotivating your employees to the extent that the well known Emirates Standard is lost.

As a frequent passenger of this airline, I would hate to see this Gold Standard lower, due to a decision made simply not to reward their staff.

It seems the fortunes of both Dubai and the Emirates are interlinked.
The current financial health of Dubai, has had a knock on effect to the health of the Emirates Group.

If it is the case, the Emirates Group have now been given the responsibility by the powers that be, to get all the crazy people before 2008 off the hook, by paying back insane dividends (all from the result of wreck less behaviour before the 2008 crash), Emirates can no longer say they are a single entity, responsible for their own success.

Interesting times ahead, no doubt!

[happygilmore]

I have to laugh at all these comments being made about a bonus.

We, as a pilot group at EK, are a bunch of pansies. All we do is complain and hide behind anonymous postings on pprunes. Does it suck that we did not get a bonus that we were all entitled too? HECK YEAH. But in the end we as a pilot group will do nothing about it. People will say they won't go into discretion, single engine taxi, they will call sick more, and not do anything to help this company moving forward. It is all BS. Not one of you will do as you say on pprune. I bet there was no increase of sick calls the last few days. Why? because EK management has put the fear into every pilot here and they are afraid to get called into the office. BOO HOO.... I just flew with a guy that has not called sick in 4 years. How is that possible? it is not. He is flying sick cause he is afraid to get his name on that "list"......

Has there ever been a pilot that refused to go into discretion? I doubt it. With the runway closures about to occur, most India night turns will all be into discretion every night, but will anyone step up and refuse? NO. We were once giving an OFP that put us indiscretion and the captain just stood by and accepted it, and he said that when I became cpt i would understand. Thats crap that the company has made people scared to the point of accepting an illegal ofp. Cause in the end, if something happens on that trip, EK will hang you out to dry.

There is strength in numbers, but unfortunately there are only a select group of pilots that continually stand up for the rights of others. How many pilots call sick when they are actually sick fatigued? By not calling fatigued does nothing but help management in their data collecting. Management says we are not fatigued. Why? Because EK pilots are too scared to call in fatigued cause they do not want to get into trouble. So therefore, we are not fatigued.

People complain about about missing bdays and holidays with families, yet do not call in sick once in 3 years. Great, you are a excellent employee and the company with award you with NOTHING.... Now I am not saying to call sick whenever you feel like it, but stop complaining about things you can control. Its called roster management. But once again, pilots are too scared to do this..

The yearly bonus is a thing of the past. Get used to it. But stop hiding behind a forum and be a man (or woman) and follow thru with your threats or do not make them at all. Until we as a group come together, nothing will ever change..

[a747jb]

I want to make it very clear that I am not advocating uploading extra fuel or doing anything of the sort. I am not telling the cabin crew to go and hand out everything on board. I am not telling the ground staff to drag their feet.

My post was simply meant to express my opinion, as a pilot and a person that knows about business, that a pissed off employee group that stays in the work force is far far more costly to any large corporation (especially an airline) than the training costs of the ones that quit.

[flywildcamel]

Quote:
I've not done the Harare triangle trip, but when did the burnout policy disappear and what has it been replaced with?

Do the operating crew not still need their 3 hours minimum rest?

Sorry, I have written this:
Quote: eg the last recall made by the GCAA authoritiy to EK! Credit flying times

and then I meant (I was not clear) that the "Burn out policy is totally illegal", this one has not been (yet) recall by the GCAA.

The burn out policy does exist in the OM-A, but doesn't not in the GCAA text, this is something totally contradictory with the OFFICIAL FDP definition by itself.

One more time, EK does whatever it likes! until the GCAA starts showing it is an authority...

[jetjockey696]

Even monkeys know when they get cheated....

Equal Pay for Monkeys - YouTube

[Saltaire]

Even the media have caught on to the obvious injustice and lack of goodwill...


Emirates defends no staff bonus, despite huge profit - ArabianBusiness.com (http://www.arabianbusiness.com/emirates-defends-no-staff-bonus-despite-huge-profit-501206.html)

[Desert Camel]

What I don't understand is people thinking it is OK not to get the profit share again this year by saying this is the best package around, we should be pleased to have a job..... Read the previous online article: that's exactly what the management say and want us to think!

Why do they settle for second best? :ugh::ugh::mad:

My previous company was meant to be worse....I am starting to wonder if, in fact, it was not better....:rolleyes:


PS: Adolf, the best post ever!

[Panther 88]

Gents, Let's get this definition straight. We do not get a bonus, for once and for all, we get a PROFIT SHARE. Those on the palace get bonuses, whether a profit is made or not. What we call it does make a difference in the mindset. WE made a profit, but do not get to share. Those who "manage" us get bonuses for increasing our workload and continually eroding our total "package". Lower costs in your department and you will get a BONUS. the only incentive for us to go above and beyond is the possibility of a SHARE of the rewards. We will never get a BONUS.

Think about the PR as above. A bonus is one thing, not sharing in a 52% profit increase is a whole 'nother animal. Call it as such. There is nothing in our contracts that refer to a bonus.

[White Knight]

Watching the Spanish Grand Prix. I can see where the PS went:ugh::{:{:ugh::{

[millerscourt]

WK
Talking of the Spanish GP, just over 18 years ago I was in a bar in Bahrain and Rothmans were there promoting the upcoming GP in Spain and had a competion for a 3 day trip to the GP all expenses paid from LHR to be wined and dined by them and a pass to the GP where Damon Hill and Coulthard would meet us and I won it and was on the grid just before the start to boot. ( Perhaps you saw me on the telly if nanny was not changing your nappy at the time??)

Corrected for spelling of Damon Ooops

[White Knight]

just over 18 years ago I was in a bar in Bahrain

That's some nanny to wipe my vitals whilst I was in a bar in Alderney ;-)

[fliion]

And where are Rothmans now?

Telling.

f.

[White Knight]

Besides MC; how much did you pay to win that little GF competition:}:ok::}

[millerscourt]

WK

Do keep up! :} It was a Rothmans competition not a GF one as they were sponsors of the Williams team.

Not being a smoker I assume Rothmans are still made but because tobacco companies are persona non grata these days most GP's went overseas.

[White Knight]

I for one will be putting my foot down as regards the giving away of crew food to pax who obviously could not be bothered to order their own veg meals.... no more. If they don't order, that's their problem. Crew should not go without (happens on majority of flights these days) watch that change. And crew are within their rights to say, wait, that's my food, sorry no you cannot give it to mr want-3-meals....

Once upon a time a CSD (purser) gave my crew food away to a pax. She positioned back to LGW at my behest and was subsequently demoted by the company!
If she'd asked I would have said 'go ahead':D

[millerscourt]

WK

Positioned back to LGW all the way from BHX no doubt. Were they really still called a CSD in those wee franchised pretend BA Airlines:confused:

[Hansol]

The number was a big one, but for an operation the size of Emirates it looks like a poor performance.

[what_goes_up]

The number was a big one, but for an operation the size of Emirates it looks like a poor performance. This is poor performance indeed. With a trading profit margin of only 4%, whereas it should be 7 to 8% to (self) sustain such a growth, there is not much meat on the bone... There will be a lot of (expensive) external fund raising needed to keep the ship floating.

In the real world the management would have a hard time to explain such a performance to the stake holders and would, most probably, be replaced for under performing badly.

Once again shiny figures but if you dig a bit deeper, it doesn't look too good.

[fliion]

Really, name & profit of a comparable carrier that had an acceptable performance.

EY, QR, FZ. Did better than us?. They got a bonus.

f.

[what_goes_up]

fliion
Did I say we shouldn't get a PS? I was merely stating the fact that our esteemed management did a $hite job...

[jeff748]

"Therefore, staff, whom we know continue to work very hard, will not receive a bonus on this occasion. They will, however, continue to enjoy the generous benefits package offered to all staff of the Emirates Group."

That's office talk for "they will never do the bonus again". Get used to it.

[fliion]

WGU

If one were to believe the integrity of the numbers - then I agree.

...and there in lies the rub

f.

[disconnected]

3 accountants were interviewing for a well paid corporate position. They were each presented with a complex Balance Sheet problem. The CFO wanted them to decide if the example presented was an asset or a liability.

The first pondered and replied: "An Asset"

The second replied: "A Liability - definitely"

The third answered: "What do you want it to be?" - He got the job.

[ekwhistleblower]

This is poor performance indeed. With a trading profit margin of only 4%, whereas it should be 7 to 8% to (self) sustain such a growth, there is not much meat on the bone... There will be a lot of (expensive) external fund raising needed to keep the ship floating.

In the real world the management would have a hard time to explain such a performance.

If you take out the Cargo Terminal, Formula One , PSG, 1 Billion to government etc, the Trading Profit Margin is actually pretty close to 7% which is not bad even with abysmal yield management. (I bet those responsible for that don't get the bullet!)

Let's face it had we closed the book, paid the profit share and then given the owner the dividend it would have been win/win for all. Unless of course it is in someone else's interests not to do so!

[CAYNINE]

You forgot the added cash to the reserve fund......

[journeyman]

Hey, MC - what's Damian Hill's claim to fame? Should we know him?

[millerscourt]

Was world F1 Champion once and would have had it a second time if Schumacher had not shunted him off the track on purpose. Son of Graham Hill F1 Champion a few times.

A bit of thread creep but reference to Super WK's mention as to all the EK signage at the Spanish GP which clearly costs them loads perhaps affecting your bonus? How much does EK spend on sponsorships I wonder as one only has to turn on the TV at any sporting event and Emirates loom large everywhere.

[fatbusdriver]

His name is Damon. ;)

[PPRuNeUser0215]

That would Damon Hill then...

[millerscourt]

AMEX Ooops you are right, corrected post.:ok:

[EK Pilot]

Unmitigated drivel indeed, the phrase 'Spoiled Children' springs to mind!

No one owes you anything, and the sooner we all learn that the better. EK will do what they want and if that means no profit share, then they will do just that. It seems that the idea of 'If you don't like it, leave' is still on the tips of the manager's forked tongues.

[cerbus]

Actually EK pilot the company does owes us. Big Time!
As you should be aware once the company reaches target which they achieved in Dec the employees get two weeks pay. We did not get that.
In addition to that the employees get 25% of the profits above the target. We did not get that either.
The company made about 4.2 Billion dhs in profit. They choose to give away OVER a billion dhs. That money was a quarter of what was ours not theirs. We were robbed and we have to make the company pay or they will continue to steal from us year after year.
Now I know no one is going to resign in mass but by calling in sick more, doing Go-arounds (above 1000 ft agl) and not being a team player will send a message for sure. Maybe just maybe if the message is sent they won't steal from us again. Then we have to work on them not treating us like crap. Big task I know.

[fliion]

EK pilot...are you serious?

The Co. have decided to apply their profit share SOP to the letter of the law - no target, no bonus.

The letter said not even a "token" deviation from their SOP of bonus giving is acceptable as it is against company policy.

Do you have any clue what would happen if we, the safety people, applied the same strict adherence to SOPs as our leaders and mentors advocate?

-Full TOGA take off when possibility of w/shear exists ...well that just about covers all of Asia

-Gear & flaps at G/S alive

-APU on during after landing flow

-Single Eng taxi around the worlds busiest airports with a GE 90 - eh no.

-Extra fuel for enroute wx

-Discretion to extend FTL

...the list goes on.

I for one will not adjust the way I have always operated ... But that's just me. (& before you say anything you don't know whether I did the above before 5/9)

Cannot speak for the other 3500

After all it has come from the top...not even a token deviation from policy.

There are 50 shades of grey...the co are back & white.

f.

[EK Pilot]

No, you are wrong. The Co does not owe you. It makes the rules, we are hired personnel. They change the rules, we are still hired personnel. They can make up new rules and guess what? We are still and always will be just hired personnel. Don't like it? You know where the door is. There are thousands waiting to come in. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but that is how it is.

I guess you know the story of two buckets? If not then ask the senior guys. But no one leaves with a bucket full of money. I still like the job, but the country and corporate culture has changed dramatically since I joined. You can protest all you like and operate the aircraft how you like, but you will be noticed and flagged as a 'problem ' and despite your militant views, it will change nothing. You will always only be one of the hired personnel that helps makes billions for the government.

[Pucka]

Boys..welcome to the CX experience!! Sounds like you're going through the same phases as per 1992/2001. Sadly , the reality is..we are all on 3 month contracts and yes...the door is always ajar if we can't take the BS any longer. management will only get more distant and inevitably less transparent, meaning greater shafting with less vas!!...if you begin to apply rigid SOP or maximum safety standards..slow taxi, early GA, full config approaches at GS alive etc..it will eventually be flagged, tagged , bagged and asked..just like the CX 49 ers... Risky stuff and more so in the sand pit me thinks.....

[jack schidt]

Emirates confirms PSG shirt sponsorship deal

posted: 22.05.2013
In a deal estimated to be worth €25 million per season, newly crowned French champions Paris St Germain (PSG) have officially extended their shirt sponsorship deal with Dubai airline Emirates for another five years until the end of the 2018/19 season.

Aviation Jobs - AviationMatch: Aviation News | Airline Information Emirates confirms PSG shirt sponsorship deal (http://www.aviationmatch.com/news/245/Emirates-confirms-PSG-shirt-sponsorship-deal.html)

[loc22550]

i like this one.
PSG belongs to Qatar and the main sponsor is Emirates.:E

[AvroRider]

Maybe the profit shares went there too...:E

http://www.aerobuzz.fr/local/cache-vignettes/L490xH368/Emirates_aerial_camera-5ac0b.jpg
http://i2.wp.com/worldairlinenews.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/emirates-a380-sky-camera-emirateslr.jpg?fit=1000%2C1000

Emirates A380 takes to the Sky at Roland Garros | Emirates Côte d'Ivoire (http://www.emirates.com/ci/french/about/news/news_detail.aspx?article=1236738)

[YYZ]

The advertising/promotion teams seem to be working overtime?

Dubai?s Emirates set for $160m Real Madrid shirt deal - Sport - ArabianBusiness.com (http://www.arabianbusiness.com//dubai-s-emirates-set-for-160m-real-madrid-shirt-deal-503443.html)