Greed/profit first

[Wally Mk2]

I read this morning that the ACCC (whom I subscribe to for their latest decisions/releases & to show the real corruption in this country) has released their annual report regarding investment V profit for the main Aussie dromes.

The report basically states that the dromes continue to record profits but the overall services provided was lower at all the monitored dromes compared to last years report.............surprised?...............well if you are then ya must have dropped out of the sky of late !:ugh::ugh:
They (ACCC) have called for increased investment to avoid congestion in the future, this part I found particularly amusing!! :ugh::ugh:(more head banging there!)
The dromes have been investing in their infrastructure alright by way of retails outlets, more car parking & bigger newer buildings for the drain on the Auusie purse (chk out the new AFP building at Tulla, very flash bro!!!)

Rwy's, terminals?....nah can't have that who's gunna pay for them?:ugh:

Oh boy have we here in OZ got the whole way of doing business wrong!

And after hearing 'Juliar' about the up & coming budget (which near took me offline due severe diarrhea!)I think for such a wealthy country we are heading down the toilet fast!

Wmk2

P.s....Go Clive Palmer, at least he can call his new Titanic his roving Kirribilli house:-)
P.s.s............no need to slam this thread shut early Mods as I haven't mentioned the Q or J word anywhere in here:-)

[IsDon]

P.s.s............no need to slam this thread shut early Mods as I haven't mentioned the Q or J word anywhere in here:-)

And yet you did. :O

[Nautilus Blue]

Oh boy have we here in OZ got the whole way of doing business wrong!

The sole purpose of a business is to make a profit, surely. The mistake is making important infrastructure a business in the first place, doubly so if its a monopoly.

[Frank Arouet]

Just heard on the teev something funny re horse racing, when a well known bookmaker's mother said her son was not motivated by money.

I guess by that assumption privatised/ cororatised airports are there to make friends, not money.

God bless them all.

Philantrophy at its best.:rolleyes:

[Wally Mk2]

...me 'tinks ye all taking it out of the spirit of things:-)

Profits are fine but without customers ever expanding as well ('cause their not looking after the golden gooses health just catching the eggs for now) then the profits will eventually evaporate from which they first came from, the need to catch a plane in a timely manor!

Wmk2

[Icarus2001]

Profits are fine but without customers ever expanding as well ('cause their not looking after the golden gooses health just catching the eggs for now) then the profits will eventually evaporate from which they first came from, the need to catch a plane in a timely manor!

All fair points but it is about cost shifting. If the privately LEASED not OWNED airports built actual airport infrastructure, you know, runways, taxiways, gates etc then it costs them money and they may be able to charge a little more. If they don't build them, well the aircraft keep arriving but get tied up in delays, these delays cost the airlines money but very little cost to the airport operator. So there is little incentive to put precious capital into airside works, when car parks nd shopping make a better return.

You cannot blame a fox for eating the chickens if you let him in, a fox is a fox after all.

Some highlights from the last few days in Perth...

Mr Geatches said the two existing runways provided more than enough capacity throughout a 24 hour period, it was just certain times of the day on certain days where there was congestion due to demand from the resources sector and their fly-in fly-out operations.

"There was not one person in this state in 2008 or 2009 saying build a third runway," Mr Geatches said.

"We welcome scrutiny of our operations and we welcome the state government's scrutiny and we understand the role of the state government and the Minister for Transport to make sure that we're doing our job," he said

Perth Airport has also given assurances that shortcomings at its new regional Terminal 2 will be rectified.

Passengers are critical of the terminal's lack of parking, single-lane access, seating capacity and the long walk to planes. "This airport looks to have been designed by someone who doesn't have to use it," one fly-in, fly-out worker said.

Perth Airport had said that discussions with airlines over construction of the runway would start in December and be concluded by this month, with lessees of the land advised to vacate by 2017.

"It is disappointing to hear one of the first milestones for the development of a third runway has been missed, as we had every indication these discussions would be completed by April," Mr Buswell said.

'Please explain' runway delay - The West Australian (http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/16916193/please-explain-runway-delay/)

Perth Airport | Third Runway | Troy Buswell (http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/concerns-raised-over-runway-delay-20130429-2inv6.html)

If you want to see how it can be done, fly to Kuala Lumpur, KLIA. They are currently building KLIA 2 to replace the existing LCCT (Low cost terminal) which was rush built only a few years ago but the stellar growth of Air Asia means it is at capacity. The new KLIA2 will also be in on the high speed, driverless train line to KL Sentral, 29 minutes away. admittedly the opening has been delayed a few months.

Ultimately Wally one is locked into flying to a particular airport, it is not discretionary and so market forces are heavily distorted. Can I go by high speed train from Melbourne to Brisbane, not in my lifetime. Can I fly to a secondary smaller airport? Perhaps but not yet available.

[Wally Mk2]

"I2001" all a good in depth way of looking at it:ok:

How did you know that a fox has recently taken out my chooks?:{
I didn't let him in but mother nature provided the opportunity, a broken tree limb that landed against the chook run fence & the fox simple seized the chance to dine out, or in this case dine in !!!!

IN the first "Airport" movie with Dean Martin, George Kennedy & Burt Lancaster (1970) in it there was a comment that went something like .............we have a 100 miles of paved rwy's & taxi ways to keep clear of snow, they can't afford enuf equip to keep it clear 24/7 with a once year snow fall like they had so they work around the clock & do their best with what they have when it comes:-)
Having said that one could look at this problem by saying that the 'once a year' snow storm is now a regular event & their still using the now inadequate equipment!:-)
We all know ones things for sure, it's now unsustainable in a world where we are time poor & too politically correct.

Wmk2

[Angle of Attack]

The government sold them off, so what do you expect? It's not going to get any better, that I can guarantee..

[601]

As a public company with shareholders, under present legislation, the first duty of the board is to maximum the return to the shareholders.

If you have a large block of land and people want car-parking, DFO shopping or warehousing you go for it.

The return per sqm would be a lot more than long bits of concrete.

[standard unit]

The government sold them off, so what do you expect?

That would be the Howard Liberal Government who sold Sydney airport off to the Macquarie group.

Amazing coincidence that Ex Howard staffer Max Moore Wilton ends up [not long after] running Sydney airport for Macquarie......

[Normasars]

Jack, spot on!!!

This country is fast becoming the joke of the economic developed world. More natural resources than just about any other, but a fcuking ripoff to live in; yesterdays technology tomorrow, and more taxes than any other country on the planet and about to get worse.

These pricks "running" this place should be locked up and have the friggin key thrown away. If an ASX Co had management as inept as this crowd, they would be linched and locked away.

Sad, sad state of affairs.

[Metro man]

I can't believe the speed at which things happen in Asia, buildings go up, new airports get opened, major projects get announced and work starts immediately.

The time it takes in Australia just to decide to do something is unbelievable.

[fl610]

Yep, trying to extend a dam on my property. Can't get anyone in the local council to decide if I need a permit or not. Need to fill in multiple forms, plans and drawings, pay a fee, submit and then someone will decide (6 - 12 months)! if I need a permit or not. If they decide I don't need a permit then they will refund the fee. Fark me, no wonder that we are going to hell in a hand basket. :(

Edited to include aviation content. Aircraft fly over my property!

[TIMA9X]

ACCC damns major airports, urges more investment | Plane Talking (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/2013/04/30/accc-damns-major-airports-urges-more-investment/)

All that would be left to complete this morning’s spectacle would be for the ABC to have arranged for the Federal Infrastructure and Transport Minister, Anthony Albanese, to have coincidentally come within range of the news crew at the same time as the Premier of NSW, Barry O’Farrell, for a spontaneous debate about how Sydney Airport can cope superbly with the Asia Century from now until 2049 and never need another airport in the Sydney basin. Says it all.

and

As a public company with shareholders, under present legislation, the first duty of the board is to maximum the return to the shareholders.

If there was competition then I agree with you 601, the trouble is, we have no competition so everyone in Aviation should be concerned with shareholder favouritism as opposed to job security. Both major Airlines also have to answer to their shareholders, but it is not a level playing field when control of the infrastructure (airports) is abused by bankie types who will go out of their way to stifle competition at all costs.

All fair points but it is about cost shifting. If the privately LEASED not OWNED airports built actual airport infrastructure, you know, runways, taxiways, gates etc then it costs them money and they may be able to charge a little more. If they don't build them, well the aircraft keep arriving but get tied up in delays, these delays cost the airlines money but very little cost to the airport operator. So there is little incentive to put precious capital into airside works, when car parks and shopping make a better return.

You cannot blame a fox for eating the chickens if you let him in, a fox is a fox after all.Well said and a huge problem for all involved in aviation in this country, it strangles growth, meaning less flights = less pilots etc.


uiwoxdqHLDU

I can't believe the speed at which things happen in Asia, buildings go up, new airports get opened, major projects get announced and work starts immediately.

The time it takes in Australia just to decide to do something is unbelievable. 1st May 2013 23:33Spot on, but we are embracing Asia.... aren't we? :ugh:

[Wally Mk2]

'fl610' don't get me started on useless councils, corruption at it's finest outside of the biggest corrupt section, the Fed Govt!:ugh:

Anything to do with public transport ought to be Govt run like a utility, after all the Govt represents the public right?...(well they are meant to but we all know that's never gunna happen!)

The lucky country (unless yr a polly).............NOT here, not anymore !:ugh:


Wmk2

[601]

If there was competition then I agree with you 601, the trouble is, we have no competition

Agree. Public infrastructure should not have been or be sold. That included road, rail, airports, power, ports etc.. But once it is in private hands, rules change.

Classic examples are AF, BK, PF etc.

Trouble is, can public servants run things better?

[ohallen]

601 that is exactly what drives this debate. Any suggestion of PPP has such a high inefficient factor due to public service management that in theory it MUST succeed if privately run. That gives the buyer about 5 years to rape and pillage and then have it handed back when everyone realises that public service and corporatisation have different objectives. Meanwhile pollies have moved on with their agendas and everyone forgets to ask...why did we do that????

[QSK?]

Just for a bit of balance, here is the alternative argument from the Airports Association Aviation Business: Airports Association provides perspective missing from ACCC report (http://www.aviationbusiness.com.au/news/airports-association-provides-perspective-missing-from-accc-report)

I must admit to being somewhat disappointed with the performances of some journalists; many articles today seem to reflect a strong bias towards one party or the other, in this case airport operators. Personal commentary should never be required. And here's me thinking that a journalist's role was to INVESTIGATE issues and provide a BALANCED assessment by providing the perspectives of all players in an issue. But I've now come to realise that investigative journalism probably went out the door with the WMD issue in Iraq.

[601]

journalist's role was to INVESTIGATE issues and provide a BALANCED assessment by providing the perspectives of all players in an issue

We don't have jurnos any more. The people who call themselves jurnos are only interested in personalities and how they can provoke an argument between them.

[haughtney1]

Interesting repost regarding the ACCC comments..but missing the key point, no runway capacity improvements, lots of nice new car parks, shops, check in areas...and yet the bottleneck is the operational tarmac:ugh:
PER was a cluster f@ck yesterday afternoon..seemingly no coordination between ground and twr, and it sounded like the whole show was about to fall off the rails....

[Wally Mk2]

It should be mandatory viewing by all Airport corporations to watch the "Bell System" doco called "Plane Talk (1965)" Found on YouTube it's somewhat corny in places but nearly 50 yrs ago they had foresight, something that can't even be spelt by today's Airport owners.


Wmk2

P.s....some great early footage as well, makes one laugh when you hear the way ATC/Pilots communicated way back then.Now you would be hit with multiple reports & having tea & bickies in the CP's office!

[haughtney1]

A way another private operator of airports is improving their setup..

Our video - YouTube

[ratpoison]

Just utterly amazing haughtney1. All done at Gatwick without any ex "blue shirts" attempting to "manage" it all. I'm absolutely flabbergasted!

[Wally Mk2]

Don't 4get guys we are just a bread thieving colony of the mother country that's still in it's infancy with bugger all population. The latter is actually most of our problem (apart from the current Govt) with a land mass roughly the size of the USA & something like less than 8% of their population so we simply don't have the No's to warrant much more than a backwoods effort on any of our major infrastructure. Even the UK has roughly 3 times our population with a tiny country compared to our vast wasteland.
With an inept Govt that is patting itself on the back by way of increasing taxes to cover it's own stuff ups & giving itself more money at our expense by way of pay rises & extra Super (Vic Govt) we haven't got a chance of this country coming anywhere close to the rest of the world infrastructure wise.

We also have copious amounts of resources here in Oz but it might as well be Aeroplane jelly the under the ground for all the good it's doing us with forward thinking!
The Gatwick Drome is amazing, I am almost embarrassed to say I live in Australia, the lucky country!!!!!


Wmk2