FOM to Civvy St

[FOMere2eternity]

Hi Chaps

I'm 15yrs in Flt Ops with the RAF and fancy paving the way to Civvy St. Realistically, does my experience count for much and, if I were to start getting qualifications, what are the ones to get ?

If you can suggest any qualifications, please can you provide a signpost for more details...

More exotically, anyone got any top tips on getting into Canada to do Flt Ops type stuff ?

Any help most appreciated.:p

[TicketyBoo]

Mr Fom,

There have been a few previous posts on this forum discussing the pros and cons of a) The UK Operations Managers' Association course for ops officers, run at Bournemouth, and b) the FAA Dispatcher's Licence course (much more expensive) run at Dallas-Fort Worth. Try the search engine, or at worse display all topics and scroll through the titles. This should also bring up links to the agencies running the courses.

Good Luck!

[MilOps]

hello mate, nice to see another FOM on these pages. Like you I am paving the way to civvy strasse and have eliceted help from this forum. The FAA Dispatchers license is my preferred route as I can get the RAF to pay towards a signifacant chunk through resettlement, I advise you investigate this avenue thoroughly. Also if you peruse the thread "FAA Dispatch Licence & Ops Training" you will discover some pearls, particularly from a very helpful chap called No Sig. I shall be contacting Glasgow school of Nautical Studies when I RTB from my present sunny Op Detachment and enrol on the ICAO Doc 7192 D3 Syllabus, the plan will be then to have both an ICAO FOO licence and an FAA dispatchers licence. I have Two and a half years to my 22, I like you am PVRing as I don't feel that the RAF can offer me what I want, so I am now actively seeking to ensure that I am a fully prepared and credible marketable quantity for the real world. For your info scan this forum regularly, there is an an awful lot of good gen on here. Best of luck and if you want a chat on the company jungle drums we'll have to organise a way of contact.

[FOMere2eternity]

Hi Mil
I have just under 7 years left to 22, so I'm starting to think ahead now (at long last !!). If the right offer came up I'd take it, but it's easy to jump out and work for a duff company.

I'm of the same mind as you - WO isn't impossible at all, but it's a visible limit that I can already see and OASC were more interested in asking what I spent my childhood pocket money on than seeing a potentially good, experienced Ops Off. That's immaterial, but frustrating, especially having seen some of the FOTS products !

I'm willing to work 36+ hrs straight for the right employer (and have done with this company, probably like you), but the foot in the door is the biggest hurdle. Thanks for the info - we'll have to chat if we can find a cryptic was of getting in contact.

I'm also off to sunnier places soon. They stopped me the day before my 4-monther and have me hanging around for the next one to come up. We'd better not get on the subject of personnel management here or we'll end up mysteriously disappearing !:rolleyes:

[MilOps]

Fomere2, hah you experiencies seem to exactly mirror mine. I did the OASC thing a few years ago when Flt Ops first started, back then I didn't relish the WO ceiling either. However having seen how the FOTS people have evolved I have radically altered my career plan; I have yet to meet a competent OpsO, and given the zero credibility they enjoy I am reluctant to embark on a career path that is again limited and offers a very narrow bandwidth of opportunity. Altogether the current system where FOMs work with non trade specialist FOOs who do not understand the trade or career structure of TG9 is an abhorration that will soon go horribly wrong. More and more FOMs are beginning to voice their disatisfaction with current policy. As for me I made the decision to go at about the same point as you so the last few years have been investigating all avenues in Ops, commercial pilot for me is out- crap eyesight-so all my energies are being channelled into ensuring that my time is well spent in preparing. Unfortunately apart from knuckelling down to a correspondance course, there is pretty much ****** all you can do until you are due to leave the RAF, the FAA course for example is 6 weeks long and 3 grand, without airfares and accommodation. I need to investigate the UKOMA week course but again I feel it fairly pointless to become genned up on civvy ops procedures when you still have some time to go in the mob, things change so wait until you are nearly demob and then do it. Like you I am waiting to see where my 4 month OOA will be, even though I'm on a FJ sqn and already spend obscene periods away, PMA are unwilling to recognise this and were planning to send me to the FI until things changed, now I await with baited breath. speak to you later dude..MO.

[FOMere2eternity]

Hi Mil

Hear you on the FJ thing - never done one, but know the score.
Your info on the FAA course was promising - 3k for that plus extras is a bargain in real terms.

I still have the option of another 15 secure years but I hope my ambition and balls kick in to stop the future unfolding like that. I would be disappointed if I woke up then and thought "was that it ?"

As for FOTS, it will continue merrily for now, using FOM experience as a crutch. Interesting how we're good enough to do it, but not do it with a different badge huh ? Anyway, I'll be accused of being bitter if I'm not careful - actually, I'm not, I just wish the people they were employing to command me had the ability to do so ! Good luck to them if the company wants em...

For now FOTS is a jolly jape where no-one gets chopped. It will evolve with time because it will have to. In the mean time 100% pass rates are good for stats but not for ops rooms. A part of me is relieved I've kept some credibility on my shoulder !!

I'll try and create an anonymous looking e-mail account somewhere so we can chat outside the public spotlight. Will let you know what it is next time.

I did start the C&G 7282 Aviation Studies a long time ago, but lost complete interest. It was kinda funny - the examiner (?) had a list of cheesy expressions for 'correct' - stuff like "that's a good answer Bloggs" and "Yes, Bloggs, you're right again" - I really wish she'd just stuck with tick and cross !!

:rolleyes:

[FOMere2eternity]

Hi Mil

The irony of protecting free speech and not having any always strikes me as ironic. Anyway, I'm now at [email protected]
Further instructions will be given there....(James Bond music)

[TicketyBoo]

You two chat away - don't mind me!

[FOMere2eternity]

Sorry Tickety, we get in trouble if we bleat in public and our 'airline' has the added attraction of being able to jail you - helps promote company harmony.

Besides, everyone smiles in the brochures, so what could possibly be wrong ?

[MilOps]

FOMere2,
Hi mate, tried your link but it won't work on this over policed military network so I'll contact you using my private email address.
You're spot on about FOTs, FOOs and retaining cred. I am of the same opinion though regarding the mob, in any capacity really. 22 Years should be enough for most, otherwise you are in danger of becoming institutionalised and insular. It's a big old world out there and I too don't wish to wake up one sunny morning and realise that I prostituted my integrity because my gonads were not big enough!
Tickety Boo, sorry mate if this all seems a tad insular, but be assured that even though we're military ops controllers we still are ops controllers and are just as keen/passionate about our craft as you civvy pro's.

[FOMere2eternity]

Steady on Mil - passionate is a bit strong !!

I'd perhaps say 'interested and professional' in the face of disinterest and apathy.

:D

[MilOps]

Ok Ok I might have over egged the pud a bit, but the sentiment was honourable. You're right though, onward, forever onward in the face of stupidity, apathy and mismanagement. Bet a few airlines suffer the same!

[Chooch]

FOMs

Don't just limit your choices to airlines........

:cool:

[FOMere2eternity]

enigmatic....care you expand on that ?

:cool:

[Chooch]

When I left Odiham in 94, I joined an Ops outfit providing
Dispatch solutions to airlines - keep your options open as
Dispatching for a single airline is not the end and be all of this
job...

You can pick up your FAA license through such an employer for
nothing !! Pay is about the same if not better and hours are also
more favourable.....

:p :D :p

[no sig]

Milops, thank you for the kind words. In reading this post it occurred to me that you and your colleauges might be interested in looking over the IFALDA or EUFALDA web sites for an insight into FAA Aircraft Dispatchers and the European equivalent. IFALDA is the Internatioanl Federation of Airline Dispatchers Assoc and EU FALDA is the European Assoc.

www.IFALDA.org
http://www.glasgow-nautical.ac.uk/

follow the links to the other sites.

On the pros and cons of FAA vs ICAO, both have their place. The FAA ticket is a requirement if you are working with a US registered operation and a positive benefit for those working with flight ops/dispatch service providers. The ICAO course is, in my opinion, a much more comprehensive grounding in airline flight ops studies. The FAA naturally is focused on US Fed Regs and not as academic, the ICAO course is close to the ATPL level study.

I note that you mention the UKOMA course, this is a weeks entry level introduction to airline operations and where very valuable there is only so much that can be covered in a week.

I have hired many ex RAF Operations officers and indeed have several working with me at the moment, your skills are easily transferable and if you complete the above prior to hitting civilian life I have no doubt you will increase your chances of a job.