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ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 20:04
Sometimes, it really is obvious which drivers are only let loose at weekends, isn't it?

Today: I approached a roundabout, in the left lane, indicating left. A V*lv* 4 x 4 with blacked out rear and side windows was already on the roundabout, driving very slowly (less than 20 mph, estimated).

As it had right of way, although it was indicating right (as if to continue right round and back the way it had come), I slowed then stopped to let it go past then eased slowly out behind it. It was still indicating right and was almost past my turning. Suddenly, without warning, it swerved sharp left and exited just ahead of me. Thankfully I'd decided to go slowly and hadn't over-lapped on its left. :suspect:

After it entered the main road, the right hand indicators were now switched off and the left indicators then came on, albeit now driving straight down a main road where no indicator was required. Because of this, and the very low speed, I thought the driver had an engine problem such as no fuel and needed to stop at the side of the road. But no. The car now crawled along at 25-30 mph. The indicators, left and right, flashed randomly a few times, then finally went off again. The car's speed increased to just over 35 mph (60 limit, no overtaking on that stretch).

I couldn't get past due to white line restrictions so just held back. After a mile, another roundabout. This time, no signal, the car moved to the right hand lane without slowing (right turn lane). It entered the roundabout, slowed after entering, indicated right but almost immediately turned left (exited straight ahead), still indicating right. Left indicator not used at all. Right hand indicators cancelled after exit.

Third roundabout... same again. This time it was a busy roundabout, five ways joining. The incorrect signals confused another driver waiting to enter the roundabout. He filtered onto the roundabout but thankfully, as I had done, drove slowly enough (only just) not to get rammed from the right by the V*lv* turning left to exit whilst indicating right, this time cutting right across two lanes. At this stage, it became a dual carriageway so I overtook, glad to be out of it. A quick glance at the driver proved it to be a very large, middle aged lady, having a conversation with her passenger and waving her left arm about. The car was chock-a-block with luggage inside, right up to the roof, so she obviously couldn't use her rear view mirror, probably didn't use her side view mirrors, and hadn't got a clue about use of indicators or lane discipline on roundabouts.

Who teaches these people?

I suppose she needs a big, protective 4 x 4 for good reason..... :rolleyes:

reynoldsno1
3rd Mar 2013, 21:36
I suspect that this driver's observed behaviour is not restricted to just weekends ...:ooh:

ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 21:55
I suspect that this driver's observed behaviour is not restricted to just weekends ...

Probably correct! I also suspect that a "big protective" should be issued to all other drivers having to deal with her V*lv*, during the rest of the week, too! :E

seacue
3rd Mar 2013, 22:00
Inept drivers are certainly more numerous on weekends. I have to remind myself that weekend drivers (especially Saturday):

Don't know where they are going,
Don't know how to get there,
Are unaware that their car has turn signals,
Don't know which way to move the lever to signal a turn.

Story from Washington Post newspaper:

Memorial Bridge reopened after crash that left vehicle in Potomac River

February 25, 2013

Memorial Bridge, an icon of monumental Washington, reopened Monday with a temporary barrier shielding the place where a sport-utility vehicle crashed through the railing and plunged into the Potomac River.

The vehicle was headed east when it left the road about 10 p.m. Sunday and apparently jumped a curb and crossed a sidewalk before crashing through the chest-high stone railing, according to an account from the U.S. Park Police. The bridge was closed until about 2:30 a.m. Monday.

The SUV crashed through the railing about 100 yards from the western end of the bridge. A section of railing about 20 feet long was missing Monday from the southern, or downstream, side of the bridge.

Several of the urn-shaped supports for the top of the railing lay cracked and broken on the riverbed beneath the gap. At about 2 p.m., near low tide,the water there was about 20 feet below the bridge and about two feet deep.

thing
3rd Mar 2013, 22:00
To me it says we should get rid of roundabouts.......always been a bit of a lateral thinker though...:(

ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 22:08
The driver in question thinks we already have......

Worrals in the wilds
3rd Mar 2013, 22:18
...or overtake at speed thereby keeping time in the danger zone to a minimum.That's usually my option. It also provides a certain amount of self satisfaction.
To me it says we should get rid of roundaboutsI'm not a big fan either, but IME the sort of drivers who own big expensive 4WDs and dither on roundabouts also dither at traffic lights, on multilane roads, at T intersections and any other time the right of way isn't clear cut. Some people are just terrible drivers, and many make it worse by failing to concentrate. If you treat a roundabout like a crossroads you get it mostly right, at least enough to be safe.

Frequently (while overtaking at speed) I notice them gobbing on their cellphones, tucking into snacks and/or chatting to their passengers, oblivious to road conditions and other users. They'd last five minutes on a construction site...:rolleyes:

They're also over-represented in the population of drivers who sit in the right hand (fast lane) at 20 kmph below the speed limit, then write cross letters to the paper about how everyone speeds past them in the inside lane, honking and making rude gestures. :ugh::ugh:

Loose rivets
3rd Mar 2013, 22:24
I used to hate incompetent drivers. Now IR 1.

thing
3rd Mar 2013, 22:24
I've noticed something as well since I bought the Beemer. Bear in mind I'm 57 and not a boy racer but if I'm coming up behind slower moving traffic and there's a 'sporty' car in front of me (usually an Audi for some reason) they will drop down a gear or three and overtake, when they had been quite happily poodling along at 60 or so until I appeared in their rear view mirror.

I suppose I have to assume that they are either:

1. Looking for me to race them, or

2. Proving they have a larger penis.

Either way I'm quite happy to ignore them, along with the Citroen Saxos, Vauxhall Corsas et al driven by what look to me like eight year olds who roar past me at traffic lights etc.

Is it a Pavlovian reaction to the shape of Beemer? I had a VW Passat and it never used to get the same reaction even though I used to drive it in exactly the same manner.

Edit: I've just remembered, if you want clottish behaviour at roundabouts try Australia. They just kind of ignore the fact they are there. I've had three minor accidents in 40 years of driving, one of them in Oz when a guy just pulled out in front of me when I was going around one. It was a fair bump and he said to me 'Didn't you see me you ******** clown?'

I figured that telling him that it was my right of way would mean little to him....

Worrals in the wilds
3rd Mar 2013, 22:28
I think it's because it's a Beemer. Down here there's a bit of rivalry between Audi and Beemer drivers at the moment; maybe it's the same in your neck of the woods?

ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 22:29
Ah, yes, "The Ditherers"! I'm careful of overtaking some for fear of being side-swiped because they tend to change lanes at no notice - panic decisions made without checking the way alongside is clear.

They tend to be under-confident and often seem terrified of the prospect of taking a wrong turning, especially if it might involve incorrectly joining "a big road". They inadvertently put the risk of causing an accident as less important than taking the wrong road. Seen that on roundabouts a number of times.

This driver was in a different league, though. Using her indicators only as decoys.

thing
3rd Mar 2013, 22:32
I think it's because it's a Beemer. Down here there's a bit of rivalry between Audi and Beemer drivers at the moment; maybe it's the same in your neck of the woods?

Haven't a clue. It's a box with a wheel on each corner to me. Don't get the rivalry thing.

Loose rivets
3rd Mar 2013, 22:48
in Oz . . . when I was going around one . . .
I figured that telling him that it was my right of way . . .


Are the rules the same as the UK? In Jersey they zip, or did, and got really mad at mainlanders that sat there and waited.

thing
3rd Mar 2013, 22:55
The rules are the same anywhere I think in any English speaking nation (I say that because I know that in other places traffic on the roundabout has to give way to traffic entering.)

When the police turned up to my Oz accident the cop said 'Yeah, we haven't got used to roundabouts yet.'

Incredibly the very next night at the same roundabout (after I had replaced the rather bent hire car) I had a very near miss with a taxi. I take roundabouts in Oz with a pinch of salt now.

ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 22:59
UK drivers in general seem to have little idea of how to drive "zip fastener" fashion. If someone dares attempt it and slot into a gap, it's usually countered by someone "in the queue" accelerating to close the gap because in UK everyone has to use the "first come, first served, keep back!" technique, irrespective of how it blocks up junctions and roundabouts. To many drivers, leaving a small gap and allowing someone else to get through a hold-up is tantamount to admitting you have no masculinity. The men are even worse! :p

Worrals in the wilds
3rd Mar 2013, 23:09
Are the rules the same as the UK? In Jersey they zip, or did, and got really mad at mainlanders that sat there and waited. People don't really zip here (I take it that you mean one car at at time, turn and turn about?), so the busier roundabouts don't really work as effectively as they should. The dominant stream of traffic tends to get a run going, and the secondary stream gets stuck until someone charges out in front of them.

Most busy intersections get traffic lights; roundabouts are more for medium traffic. I agree that many Aussie drivers are really bad at using them.

thing
3rd Mar 2013, 23:12
The old traffic light conundrum. Lincoln is full of lights that split into two lanes about 100 yards before the lights and merge about 100 yards after. This of course is to stop traffic backing up in the approach to the lights. However it would seem that if you choose the outside lane you are up for the 'get in this 4 yard gap if you can' game. The mind boggles.

Greek God
3rd Mar 2013, 23:12
The Zip now there's a concept!!
Use both lanes to the merge and then left & right zip in an orderly fashion - so much more efficient and painless except in the UK. :D
Here the rule is all move to the live lane at the first sniff of any lane closure and then block/cut off anyone who has the audacity to use the now empty lane!
In the old days there used to be the odd educational film or advert on telly to emphasise various driving techniques. :ugh:

ShyTorque
3rd Mar 2013, 23:22
Use both lanes to the merge and then left & right zip in an orderly fashion - so much more efficient and painless except in the UK.
Here the rule is all move to the live lane at the first sniff of any lane closure and then block/cut off anyone who has the audacity to use the now empty lane!

The most important thing seems to be to ensure those damned motorcyclists get held up, too. Cars should straddle both of the blocked lanes of stationary traffic, to ensure there isn't any way through, for anyone!

Worrals in the wilds
4th Mar 2013, 00:02
Here the rule is all move to the live lane at the first sniff of any lane closure and then block/cut off anyone who has the audacity to use the now empty lane!There's a bit of that here, too. In fairness the person who's using the empty lane has usually ignored fifteen 'lane closed' signs, more flashing yellow lights than a dance party and a large number of trucks and asphalting plant parked along the side of the road, only to come upon the lane closure with a bewildered, bunny in the headlight look. Wow, who'd have thought all those signs were real? :confused::ugh::} This is a common dithery driver manouvre.

Then there's the alpha male types who just ignore the whole lot, hoon up to the closure and shove their way into the traffic at the last minute. :hmm: I guess you have to admire the audacity.

seacue
4th Mar 2013, 00:22
I've noticed a dramatic difference between various USA cities regarding aggressive driving. Drivers in the Cleveland area are far less aggressive than here on the east coast. In the east, people entering a highway rush past as many cars in the main lanes as possible and merge at the last moment. In Cleveland, they seem to synchronize speed with the main lanes and are allowed to merge ... knowing that no one is going to then rush past to get ahead. It's a little hard to get used to traffic politeness.

Perhaps wrongly, but I've felt that driving became more aggressive here in the DC area at the start of the Kennedy Administration, which brought many New Yorkers to the area.

david1300
4th Mar 2013, 01:39
Hey, we almost managed to get into a B v A debate back there (BMW v Audi) just like in R&N. What a pathetic slip in standards ;). Somehow "if it's not BMW I'm not going" just doesn't have a ring to it:}

Roundabouts - God was kidding when she inspired someone to come up with this idea. I think what happened in the planning dept is someone said "We need an intersection round about here, another intersection round about here" etc and the design engineers thought that meant 'build a roundabout intersection here'. Uddy Blidiots.:eek:

sisemen
4th Mar 2013, 04:46
I think that the OP had spotted a visitor from Western Australia.

Apart from the ex-pat Brits no-one has a clue how to use roundabouts. (They are also still trying to discover the whereabouts of the indicators and have a phobia about driving with the kerb too close to their left hand side. And don't get me started on their pathetic attempts to turn right off a highway.)

Loose rivets
4th Mar 2013, 04:53
Wot's a highway?

sisemen
4th Mar 2013, 04:58
two feet further up than a low-way.

Hydromet
4th Mar 2013, 05:00
When I used to drive to work, there was a slip from one busy road - 60 kb/h to a busy freeway - 90km/h. In all the time I drove to work, I can't remember ever being held up - everyone on both roads knew how to merge seamlessly. However, whenever I had to use the slip at weekends, you could bet that someone would stop at the merge and wait until there was no traffic - something that rarely happened.

Solid Rust Twotter
4th Mar 2013, 05:22
You aint seen nuthin' yet re roundabouts. Try the old French colonies in Africa where they're still stuck in the time warp of using le systeme ancienne de Frog. Those entering the roundabout have right of way, so you stop halfway round to allow someone to enter an already crowded space. It's a recipe for a monstrous traffic jam once all available space has been filled and traffic grinds to a halt. It doesn't help that people drive like utter bellthronks and often the wrong way and on the wrong side of the road, thus further jamming up all intersections.

ExSp33db1rd
4th Mar 2013, 06:51
......someone would stop at the merge and wait until there was no traffic........

NZ has three options for motorway joining procedures.

a) a traffic light that oscillates red and green at about 5 second intervals, these are placed at the start of a slipway entrance to a freeway/motorway ( language to suit yourself) and so cars entering are initially stopped, then 'fed' on to the motorway at 5 sec (approx) intervals, and having been stopped, a single car will then race down the slip road out of sheer frustration, so that there is a good chance that it will be doing something like the comparative speed when it actually reaches the rest of the traffic.

b) at some entrances, or the conjunction of two motorways merging, a big sign which is a painting of a zip fastener bearing the words "Merge Like a Zip"

c) nothing, free for all.

option 'b' is the most effective, people actually do. Surprisingly.

I wish we had a zip sign in the middle of our village one-way system. Traffic turning right at what is a swept,and merging, T junction is required to "give way" to traffic continuing straight through from left to right, so that two roads merge into a one lane one way street, merge like a zip is what is required, but there is no sign to that effect, so people stop if there is even a car on the distant horizon.

"Give Way" does NOT - necessarily - mean Stop. Get it ? :ugh:

Hydromet
4th Mar 2013, 07:22
option 'b' is the most effective, people actually do. Surprisingly.
We don't have the 'zip' sign, but that's the way it happens during the week. Not at weekends, though.

ShyTorque
4th Mar 2013, 07:43
Having lived in Germany for some years, where the "zip technique" is encouraged, I think it's a great idea. Putting up signs to tell drivers to apply it is even better, it removes the perceived stigma of letting someone out in front.

Back to my original topic, which was:

Inept weekend drivers!

How about those incompetent muppets driving those enormous 20 mph rolling road blocks, sorry, horse boxes at weekends? They really get my goat (so to speak).

KAG
4th Mar 2013, 07:54
ShyTorque: I have been driving with my own car for 7 years in China mainland (I am not speaking about Hongkong or the like, I really mean China) and I have millions of stories you wouldn't believe.
The most astonishing is that one: I am still alive and I have managed to avoid all the bicycles and drunk walkers all those years.

When I drive I see 2/3 car (truck-small motorcycle-bicycle) crashes on a daily basis. I am not bullshiting you.

beaufort1
4th Mar 2013, 07:59
It's fun in my neck of the woods, the roads are all very small and narrow and usually lined with hard granite walls. Max. speed limit is 35 mph. We do have one system which seems to catch 'visitors' out and that is the filter in turn at junctions, it does keep traffic moving.

Filter in turn system
Some junctions have filter in turn on a sign and painted on the road. Approach these with care! At these junctions all directions have equal priority.
You must only enter the junction in turn with other vehicles. These are also usually box junctions, so you must not enter the box unless your exit is clear.

Lord Spandex Masher
4th Mar 2013, 08:04
Then there's the alpha male types who just ignore the whole lot, hoon up to the closure and shove their way into the traffic at the last minute. :hmm: I guess you have to admire the audacity.
Hooning and shoving aside that's the correct way to do it in the UK. Use both lanes for as long as possible.

There's always some knob blocking the way or not letting you in though.

Capetonian
4th Mar 2013, 08:07
I compare driving in Switzerland and Germany where drivers are intelligent enough to 'zip', with France, where they resolutely do everything they possibly can to jostle for position and to obstruct everyone else.

This results in anger, frustration, bumps, and above all, slowing down of the traffic flow.

Alloa Akbar
4th Mar 2013, 08:24
Shy't

I reckon men between the ages of 35 and 55 should all have cars armed with missiles and machine guns a la James bond, and granted a licence to fire upon the following as required:

1. Caravans

2. Bin Lorries blocking the whole road when you are trying to get to work.

3. Horse Boxes.

4. Teenagers in Vauxhall Corsa's with 4" Exhausts

5. Women drivers in BMW X5's who can't park or make it through a gap in traffic 30 feet wide.

6. Foreign lorry drivers.

7. 20 - something blokes in 1993 - 1999 Subaru Imprezza's with the big rear wing.

8. Tractors who fail to pull over and allow the train of 65 cars behind them pass.

Sorted. :ok:

Capetonian
4th Mar 2013, 08:28
9. Cyclists in brightly coloured plastic clothes and silly hats who ride in more than single file.

10. Renault Clios.

Lord Spandex Masher
4th Mar 2013, 08:28
7a. 40 or 50 - something blokes in 1993 - 1999 Subaru Imprezza's with the big rear wing.

WTF.?

radeng
4th Mar 2013, 08:44
At one time, the Highway Code had you enter a roundabout in the right hand lane when going straight on. I can't remember if you were supposed to indicate right, though. This is probably why a number of older drivers still do.

Trucks on a motorway with one in the middle lane overtaking at 1 mph get me......Plus the boy racers in Minis or Corsas who HAVE to overtake and break speed limits. Besides fining them 500 for each mile above the speed limit, I'd ban them for a year for every mile over the speed limit.

KAG
4th Mar 2013, 08:54
Solid rust twotter: Try the old French colonies in Africa where they're still stuck in the time warp of using le systeme ancienne de Frog.yes because the remaining Africa (no former French colonies) is well known for its excellent traffic.

Alloa Akbar
4th Mar 2013, 08:57
7a. 40 or 50 - something blokes in 1993 - 1999 Subaru Imprezza's with the big rear wing.

WTF.?

WTF Indeed M'Lud.. WTF!!

Solid Rust Twotter
4th Mar 2013, 08:57
Mongtards dribbling along in the fast lane at 20mph in a 70 zone with two lanes clear to the left of them. Total lack of awareness of the simple keep left, pass right rule.

Enforce the rule by transporting vehicle to nearest roadside crushing depot where the vehicle will be returned to them in an easily transported cube.

Worrals in the wilds
4th Mar 2013, 08:59
Hooning and shoving aside that's the correct way to do it in the UK. Use both lanes for as long as possible. Fair enough. It makes sense from a road use perspective.

How about those incompetent muppets driving those enormous 20 mph rolling road blocks, sorry, horse boxes at weekends? They really get my goat (so to speak). True, but try getting around these suckers! :\ A common sight between midnight and 4am on Queensland roads. It's double fun when they drop the house on a major road ...'yeah Donny in the traffic chopper for ya, there's a house on the inside lane of the M1, so be careful! :eek::}'

http://www.whitepages.com.au/wpol-images/PRODUCTS/70/482511170/1/CONTENTS/73/22948873/1/47212196/hero1_474871346_29jun12.jpg

SMT Member
4th Mar 2013, 09:10
11. Lorry drivers who, on a 2-lane motorway, attempt overtaking of other lorries and/or caravans, horse boxes or coffin dodgers on a Sunday jolly, with a speed difference of less than 20 km/h. If in doubt, shoot first and ask questions later.

12. See 11.

cuefaye
4th Mar 2013, 09:27
Try not to get too old sonny!

MagnusP
4th Mar 2013, 09:38
Enforce the rule by transporting vehicle to nearest roadside crushing depot where the vehicle will be returned to them in an easily transported cube.

Nah. Leave 'em in the car.

vulcanised
4th Mar 2013, 11:55
The dumbest thing has to be a roundabout with traffic light control :ugh:

reynoldsno1
4th Mar 2013, 23:08
b) at some entrances, or the conjunction of two motorways merging, a big sign which is a painting of a zip fastener bearing the words "Merge Like a Zip"
yes, Kiwis have become quite good at that - now all we need to do is try and understand the "do not enter a junction unless your exit is clear" concept ....

parabellum
6th Mar 2013, 03:52
The problem in Australia isn't the rounabout but the bloody drivers! The idea of roundabouts is to maintain a flow of traffic, the only person with a right of way is the person on it, provided other cars are more than ninety degrees away from you then there is no need to stop, try explaining that to 60% of drivers here, they will stop if opposite direction traffic approaching the roundabout in signalling a right turn! Far too many still adhere to 'give way to the right' rule as well, which went out years ago.

If you think roundabouts are bad try driving in Holland where it is all traffic light junctions and huge tails backs!

hellsbrink
6th Mar 2013, 04:08
When I drive I see 2/3 car (truck-small motorcycle-bicycle) crashes on a daily basis. I am not bullshiting you.

Sounds like the Antwerp Ring on a good day......

And when you have muppets like the one I had the misfortune to be behind yesterday evening, him (yes, it was a male driving) in a 4x4, doing 35 in a 50 zone then speeding up to 50 in a 70 zone before slowing down because there was actually people driving in the opposite direction on the other side of the road, as well as the small matter of drink driving being a national sport over here...........

Let's just say you don't want to get me started. There are hopeless drivers everywhere, standards can be as low wherever you go irrespective of how "strict" the driving test is.

ExSp33db1rd
6th Mar 2013, 04:26
yes, Kiwis have become quite good at that - now all we need to do is try and understand the "do not enter a junction unless your exit is clear" concept ....

and NEVER use a right indicator on a roundabout if going straight across.

personally - I'd ban the use of right indicators on a roundabout at all times ( left hand driving countries of course ) we all have to go right-handedly around the thing, stay on all day going clockwise if you want to, no law against it -remember the Mad Major and Piccadilly Circus in his Bubble Car ? can't think what excuse they used to eventually stop him after a couple of hours - I only need to know when you're going to swing left across my bows.

( there might be some excuse on multi lane roundabouts, but only to signal a lane change, not a roundabout manouevre. )

KISS

Krystal n chips
6th Mar 2013, 04:47
" Sounds like the Antwerp Ring on a good day"

No change there then over the years and I assume the tunnels are still two lanes?...

In ones current location, the inept weekend drivers have expanded into the rest of the week, usualy between the hours of 10.00 and 17.00 thus I only encounters them when on holiday during the week. To counteract this however, we have the Tamzin and Justin brigade, so terribly important that double white lines / "S" bends and oncoming traffic simply get ignored!....West Mercias finest ( sightings thereof ) are about on a par with that of a Yeti and the locals know it.

The weekends are very different...so many, it seems, have an exemption from the RTA....I would like to know how this can be achieved actually although as many of the population are devout senile Mail readers (note to self...insert :p:E at this point before being accused of left wing bias ) this is not really surprising.

Then there are the tractors ( here we both agree on something A.A.;) ) ..yes, it's a rural area, yes, they have to use the main arterial route, no, they do not have to fail to pull over, drive oblivious to other road users and bimble along gobbing on their mobiles.

rgbrock1
6th Mar 2013, 12:12
Skytorque:

If you like I can take a hop over to your neck of the woods and install an AIMS system on your car, similar to what I have on mine. An AIMS system you might ask? This is an Anti-Idiot Missile System. And is very useful in ridding the world of jerks who haven't a clue how to drive. The end result looks similar to:

http://www.seihin-world.com/i/04/09/missiletruck.jpg

I use the system regularly, here in the US, on Mini-Vans.

DType
6th Mar 2013, 15:27
Occasionally I had to leave the TVR behind and make a delivery from Edinburgh to Bristol by diesel Transit. Pretty straightforward - just full throttle all the way.
However, we noticed that an awful lot of BMWs passed us, and we passed a remarkable number of BMWs. Eventually we worked out that each BMW we passed got so upset at being overtaken by a white van that it promptly accelerated to re-pass us. Then it slowed down and fell asleep again until we re-re-passed it, and so on ad infinitum.
DT

PS On the return trips we found that you can power slide an unladen Transit beautifully on a damp road.

G&T ice n slice
6th Mar 2013, 18:07
Me bruvver drove a white diesel transit for a time...

when empty he could pull away from traffic lights in fourth (top) gear with wheelspin and lots of associated smoke!

It didn't seem to have a top speed, given a long enough road it just seemed to go on accelerating ad infinitum.

Those white long-wheelbase Mercedes Sprinter vans are the ones to have. I was sat about 150 feet behind one on the M5 one quiet summer's evening and just sort of put the brain into automatic. After a while I was a bit annoyed because there was a very slight judder on the steering, annoyed because I'd just spent money on tracking/alignment/wheelbalancing etc etc and it was obvious that they'd not done a good job. So I looked at the speedo to make a note of the speed at which the judder started. Gosh, I suspect would have been permanent loss-of-licence...........it was just a teensy-weensy bit more than the speed limit (ahem)

Whirlygig
6th Mar 2013, 23:05
ShyTe my dahling ... I can guarantee that your V*lv* driver was from Norfolk. That's how they all drive; they are taught that way from Norfolk instructors who were also taught to drive that way. It's NFN. They were on a daytrip.

Next time you come across such a driver, take note of the number plate and if it's of the new type and begins A ... fear the worst. Of the old type registrations, beware the last two letters of AH, CL, EX, NG, PW, VF, ... not that I know them by heart by experience or anything you understand. :ouch:

Cheers

Whirls

hellsbrink
7th Mar 2013, 03:34
No change there then over the years and I assume the tunnels are still two lanes?...

Some are, and it never fails to stun me when we hear of yet another accident in the Kennedy Tunnel......

sitigeltfel
7th Mar 2013, 05:23
Occasionally I had to leave the TVR behind and make a delivery from Edinburgh to Bristol by diesel Transit.

A good choice. The TVR would never have made the distance ;)

Capetonian
7th Mar 2013, 06:04
BBC News - Volvo unveils cyclist alert-and-brake car system (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-21688765)

It sounds fine in theory, as they often ride in the blind spot, but then :

Volvo has announced it is releasing a cyclist detection facility which should prevent fatal accidents.

The auto firm says vehicles fitted with the system will be able to detect threats including a cyclist suddenly swerving out into a car's path.

It said that if a collision risk was detected an alarm would sound and the car's brakes would be fully deployed.

So you're driving along and all of a sudden the 'detection facility' slams on your brakes. That sounds like a recipe for disaster for anyone behind you.

thing
7th Mar 2013, 06:58
Surely you should be a far enough distance behind to brake safely should someone slam brakes on in front? Mind you I was driving behind an idiot last year who slammed on her brakes and stopped in the middle of the road for no apparent reason, no indication, no attempt to pull in, just stopped dead in the middle of the road. I managed to stop but the goon behind ran into the back of me.
Driver of the car in front got out and calmly posted a letter in a roadside postbox, got back in and drove off totally oblivious to the mess behind. I'm not a violent man but I now understand how road rage occurs with those less in control of themselves.

Capetonian
7th Mar 2013, 07:05
Surely you should be a far enough distance behind to brake safely should someone slam brakes on in front?

Of course you should, but that's theory and in practice it doesn't always work, particularly when you know that if you leave a safe gap between yourself and the car in front, some kid in a Renault Clio or a white van man will blast past you and fill it.

thing
7th Mar 2013, 07:13
This is true of course. I just back off a bit further to maitain the gap. Talking about Oz as I was earlier reminds me that they have one excellent IMO idea; undertaking on motorways. Keeps the traffic moving and you get no fast lane hoggers because there are effectively no fast lanes. At least they got something right.

Lightning Mate
7th Mar 2013, 07:37
I just back off a bit further to maintain the gap.

As taught by the Institute of Advanced Motorists.

I did my course with a volunteer police Class 1 driver, and was mildly taken aback when the brief was - "today we're going to learn how to drive two cars at once".

"Yours and the vehicle behind you"

Have employed the technique ever since. When you think that you are allowing adequate space between you and the vehicle in front, double it at least.

If a vehicle in front stops abruptly you will not need to brake hard at all and the driver of the following vehicle will not be caught unawares.

RAC/OPS
7th Mar 2013, 22:30
Talking about Oz as I was earlier reminds me that they have one excellent IMO idea; undertaking on motorways. Keeps the traffic moving and you get no fast lane hoggers because there are effectively no fast lanes. At least they got something right

Really? This only encourages drivers to constantly change lanes to get to their destination a minute or so early! And of course over here we have little appreciation of how much of a gap to leave for the vehicle we are overtaking. In fact merely signalling our intention to change lane gives us right of way. That is if we can be bothered signalling.

G&T ice n slice
8th Mar 2013, 06:34
Have they changed the way driving is taught? (here in UK)

I notice that most drivers under about 40 seem to drive along then brake for no apparent reason, then indicate left (or right) at about 3 car's lengths from the junction at which they plan to turn off.

It's quite consistent and leads me to believe that it has been how they learned.

I was taught mirror, signal, (brake), (position), manoevre. I was also taught that you drove "defensively" - i.e. :
mirror [check the moron behind you],
indicate [at a reaonable distance dependant upon speed, visibility, type of junction, volume of traffic and a whole bunch of other stuff]
brake gently to adjust speed appropriate to the nature of the manouvre
position vehicle appropriate to the next manouvre.
Then when it's safe, perform the manouvre

I left stuff out

I also notice that (UK again) turning right (i.e. across the oncoming traffic) not many people position themselves to the centre of the road, rather position themselves to just-off-centre of the lane.

The other thing that annoys me - especially with these new-fangled LED rear lights is that design has trumped utility. The amber turn indicator surrounded by red LEDs mean that when idiots brake-and-indicate simultaneously the turn indicator is virtually invisible, even at night. THe worst offenders are busses waiting to pull out into the road at bus-stops. They sit with the foot on the brake whilst having their right indicator on... only because the indicator LEDS are surrounded by the extra-bright red braking LEDS the indicator is invisible. So even though I am the type that will let a bus pull out from a bus-stop when there's lots of traffic, I can't - coz I can't tell he's wanting to pull out...

whine, moan, whinge, complain

Lightning Mate
8th Mar 2013, 06:59
Ah G&T....

You and I were taught to DRIVE.

These days kids are taught to pass the test.

probes
8th Mar 2013, 07:13
:D - super, LM. Applies to more things, also.

ShyTorque
18th Mar 2013, 08:42
Another form of "ineptness"...

Non mirror using, non indicating, cruise control jockeys.

I had to use the A1 yesterday (a two lane section). The road wasn't busy. I was steadily gaining on two cars in front, all of us in lane 1. They seemed to be going the same speed as each other, probably about 60mph. I indicated to change lanes to overtake. As I got to twenty metres or so behind them, the rearmost of the two, without indicating, drifted across to lane two in front of me. I braked to keep my distance. The car just sat there, a rolling road block, no speed increase, just cruising along. He wasn't overtaking, just maintaining station behind the first car. After about a mile (!) I think the driver must have woken up and looked in his mirror, because he suddenly sped up, then swerved across in front of the first car, without indicating. I got an angry glare and some mouthed words. I resisted the temptation to reply with a middle finger and just shook my head to myself .... :rolleyes:

Why do people drive like this? Are they blind, stupid, or just totally careless?

Noah Zark.
18th Mar 2013, 09:29
SHY,
Are they blind, stupid, or just totally careless?
Certainly the latter two!

charliegolf
18th Mar 2013, 10:01
I'm seeing more and more of this, on rural roads especially. Stuck behind a moron who touches the brake as he or she is just about to pass an oncoming vehicle. Every one that passes, not the odd biggie that might seem to 'fill' a lane and a half! Why?

CG

Andy_S
18th Mar 2013, 10:40
......how some drivers only seem to use their indicators as an afterthought? I've seen this a lot recently, particularly at roundabouts, where the perp doesn't actually indicate until they've actually turned off into their exit lane. I don't know why this should be - maybe their tiny brains can deal with either manoevering or indicating but not both simultaneously. Or maybe they genuinely think that as long as you use the indicators eventually, that's OK.

Listen idiots - it's Mirror, SIGNAL, Manoeuvre. In that order.

ShyTorque
18th Mar 2013, 10:51
Roundabouts! The standard of modern driving instruction must be extremely poor in this respect.

Lane discipline and use of indicators.......you can have three different drivers all carrying out the same manoeuvre and doing three different things whilst doing so!

Or, three drivers, all actually intent on doing totally different manoeuvres, yet on the face of it, doing exactly the same thing.

Some drivers obviously think other drivers are psychic, or only use indicators as a decoy.

lomapaseo
18th Mar 2013, 13:14
how some drivers only seem to use their indicators as an afterthought? I've seen this a lot recently, particularly at roundabouts, where the perp doesn't actually indicate until they've actually turned off into their exit lane. I don't know why this should be

Where I live the rondabouts are so small in diameter that it's impossible to engage your turnsignal while driving in the inside lane to turn outward, unless you neutralize the steering thererby starting the turn outwards.

To lessen the resulting accidents the coppers have started ticketing the overtaking outside lane drivers for failure to give way

Course this is the US and unlike the UK our roundaouts are less than a mile in circumference

Windy Militant
18th Mar 2013, 13:24
Andy_S
What age car were the aforementioned winkers* driving?
I drive hire cars quite regularly and what I'm finding now is that they seem to come with two really annoying things which may cause some of the major gripes here.
First so called Intelligent Indicators, the logic behind some of these is so obscure that I've given up trying to figure out how they worked and gone back to hand signals!
Electric handbrakes again figuring out when they engage/disengage means most of the time people use the foot brake and don't bother with the handbrake. Hence the blinding you with their brakelights when queuing.
If it's an older car then it's just bad driving.

*Misprint!

Lon More
18th Mar 2013, 14:05
Electric handbrakes again figuring out when they engage/disengage means most of the time people use the foot brake and don't bother with the handbrake.
Similarly with an automatic. If there's someone behind me I put mine in park.then just use the brake when selecting drive.
I learned to keep to the outside on a roundabout until approaching your exit. Many people drive all the way round to the kast exit on the inside and even then don't bother to indicate.

AlpineSkier
18th Mar 2013, 15:19
I learned to keep to the outside on a roundabout until approaching your exit.

If I am reading this correctly ,Lon, then according to what I was taught, you may be guilty of a dangerous manoeuvre.

If you want to go round 270 o and stay in the outside lane, then you are blocking someone who wants to exit at 180 o and is the inside lane which, per my memory of the Highway code is the recommended (or equally acceptable with the outside lane ) for straight ahead.

Andy_S
18th Mar 2013, 15:35
I think when Lon talks about the "outside lane" he means the one closest to the island.

lomapaseo
18th Mar 2013, 16:25
I think when Lon talks about the "outside lane" he means the one closest to the island.

Now here is an accident waiting to happen !!

we can't even agree on geography :p

AlpineSkier
18th Mar 2013, 16:55
Ha, loma


]Course this is the US and unlike the UK our roundaouts are less than a mile in circumference

That's cos' this is The Big Country :p

OFSO
18th Mar 2013, 20:53
unlike the UK our roundaouts are less than a mile in circumference

The Catalans read the EU rule books and discovered that the construction of any and every roundabout larger than 18m circumference plus the approach roads can be financed by Brussels. Hence the preponderence of huge roundabouts here.

Locals here go round a roundabout in the inner lane if they want to (a) go straight ahead OR (b) turn left (270). Germans go round the outer lane if they want to (a) go straight ahead OR (b) turn left (270).

Which accounts for a lot of Germans doing (b) getting T-boned on the left hand door by locals doing (a). "A lot" as in you see it every few days. And they never learn......

chevvron
19th Mar 2013, 02:09
Position: just north of Wickham on the Meon Valley Road.
Heading north, I come up behind a female driver in a Corsa; speed limit is 60, she's doing about 40, until a vehicle comes the other way when she brakes sharply and pulls to the left (this is an A road single carriageway)
A few weeks later heading south on the same stretch of road, I come up behind a male driver in a large Ford; same thing happens!
Only ever happened to me on this stretch of road.
Oh and the other day just south of Windsor Great Park, an elderly driver (with hat) appeared to have invented a new hand signal. He'd been doing about 35 with the speed limit variously 50 or 60. We came to a clear straight stretch of road and as I pulled out to overtake, his arm came out of the window with the index finger pointing down. Anybody know what that's supposed to mean?
In England, I'm always wary about the ones wearing hats as they always do the unexpected. It's not just the 'weekend' or 'sunday' drivers either; any day after about 10am they come out, dawdling and dithering, failing to indicate, opening their door without glancing in the mirror etc.

Loose rivets
19th Mar 2013, 07:21
Strange thing here in the Valley. (south Texas.) They don't move forward on a green light when turning left. (unless there's a green turn-arrow.) They just sit there like lemons unless there's a huge gap, and then they might chance it.

One, or even two extra cars could go every light cycle. I think in London, folk would get so angry they'd push them out.

I phoned a driving school to get the gist. There was no real gist, just that it's safer. So is leaving the car in the garage.

However, in a lot if not all states, they turn right on a red, but now giving way to opposite traffic turning into their direction. You are supposed to come to a full stop before taking advantage of this concession.

It works very well and I don't know why we don't do it in the UK.




Look down there.:suspect: What?:confused: It's an edit thingie.:( Oh, amazing. Send a telegram to the Queen! Tell Brussels. Inform the PM. Why did you edit anyway? The answer's hidden in the edit message, I'm told. But it's also down there, look. OH :uhoh: OW:ouch:
Sleepers, hurry up and kick in.:ooh: