New uniforms/Letter in RAF News

[Talking Radalt]

In the current RAF News a letter has been published in which a Chief Tech at Lyneham questions the financial sense and raises the logistical issues of replacing the non-commissioned ranks' No1 Uniform. He quite rightly (in my opinion) points out that only a small minority of the RAF perform duties that require a personal-issue dress uniform and goes on to add that his own views are identical to those of every serviceman or woman with whom he has raised the subject.

The "official" reply is, quite frankly, laughable. Although it's only shirts n slacks we're talking about here, what worries me is the implied abscence of any grip on life in the real world or more importantly, at the front line.
The Group Captain in charge of clothing and uniform policy states that Chief Tech X is in a minority when he says he hasn't worn No1s for over six years, and goes on to ask why Chief Tech X doesn't wear said uniform when acting as "Duty SNCO" at his unit.
Just how many units can still afford to release personnel to dither around as "Duty SNCO" and, even if they had such a thing, would it neccessitate wearing No1 uniform?
(More to the point, how many Group Captain's in Command posts actually THINK units have enough "spare" people to fill that kind of duty?)
He also goes on to say how we ALL had to have a new No1 uniform because the old female skirted uniform wasn't compatible with the new female trousers. I suppose giving JUST the girls a new set of togs was just TOO simple, eh, sir?
At DBHQ people are trying to pack for a well publicised theatre of operations ending in -stan. Forget new suits and Jubilee medals.
Give us Proboots, proper sleeping bags, US-style camp cots, issued head-torches, Snugpak jackets and so on and so on.
Please, Group Captain who-ever-you-are (sorry, I always was crap with names), bin this new uniform thing and seek your promotion elsewhere leaving those of us in the real world with improved funds and better-employed assets in order to do the real work.

PS. I've never EVER worn my "current" No1s except during original tailoring and I've skipped from old-style "ploughed field" V-neck pull-over to the new round-neck type having by-passed the "smooth" V-neck all together. Still waiting on those Proboots though.
:mad:

[brit bus driver]

You mean there's a new sweater - thought I was very "a la mode" with the smooth v-neck! (That's what a 3 year hiatus does for you.) Not being on the RAF News mailing list out here, what's the gist. New togs for all, or just the NCOs? Hate to think I'll have to buy another No1; the last one was only required as I shall have to look at my wedding pics for some years to come, and couldn't bear the reminder of how badly it fitted!!

I do echo your sentiments though. Whatever happened to "Front Line First" etc etc. Still, better a new best bib & tucker, than some kit that actually does what it's supposed to I suppose......

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Mad_Mark]

Worry ye not drives,

The new number 1's are for all those below the rank of WO/MAEOp/MEng/MALM only.

The Group Captain responsible must have a position lined up on the Board at the company that is tailoring them after he retires ;)

As to duty SNCO, rumours are that Ord Sgt may be brought back at Ice Station Kilo. It is, after all, very important to take a SNCO off an undermanned crew or out of a busy section for 24 hours to raise and lower the station ensign. At least it will give them all a chance to wear the new number 1's - oh no, how out of touch I am, quick promote me to Group Captain.

Mad Mark!!! :mad:

[Udeski]

I really wonder whether SOME of our overpaid/overvalued aircrew brethren have an ounce of military ethos between them! This thread and the blind, uninformed nods of approval from the replying sheep just continues to prove my theory.

Stands back and ducks behind the parapet...........

[Flt Lt Spry]

When it was decided that No 1s were impractical for daily use, the No 2 jumper was introduced complete with ploughed finish and round neck. I thought that the reason we moved on to V neck several years later was to make the tie visible thus making the whole lot look less stupid. Makes you wonder how long will it be before the new jumper will be phased out and replaced with the V neck version once again...

[BEagle]

The last time I wore a V-necked pullover and a tie as uniform was when I was at prep school.

Had an original roundneck thing for some years until the cat ate a chunk out of it.

Aircrew Leather Jacket is the only thing to wear over the blue shirt!

[Talking Radalt]

Udeski,
I always thought military ethos would involve a modicum of common sense when it came to deciding where best to spend the Treasury's beerchits in order to meet military aims. Looking smart and having shiny shoes doesn't win wars or even minor police actions. I know a sense of belonging and pride in service is essential to any uniformed organisation, but at the expense of desperately needed kit elsewhere must surely be money badly spent?
I was still at school in 82 but can still remember the flag-waving pride in "our boys" being tarnished by rumours that Paras were robbing dead Argies (or is it Algerians, Beagle?) of their boots. Couldn't tie a decent set of puttees though could they and having a flag with a ghastly pastel shade of blue in it they were destined to lose! :rolleyes:

...and as for aircrew being sheep, at least sheep are correctly dressed for the environment in which they work!

[high spirits]

Udeski,
If you are a wind up merchant - congratulations. If not please take your p!ss poor opinions to the www.bluntymilitaryethos.com forum. What frontline aircrew need is good kit available 24/7. Getting a demand for sleeping bag/bivi-bag on pain of death 2 days after you get back from det is no good if you are trying to maintain an immediate standby commitment to go to the next place ending in stan. Some people join to fly - not to be seen at parades standing next to the boss!

[brit bus driver]

Oh my god, I have been gone too long! Psion 5 is it? Of course, when the whole world is moving to the Palm OS, or a personal PC, we get the Psion! Now, having been a stalwart Psion 3 owner for many moons, it is arguably a better operating system than the Palm...but it will be obsolete in the near future due to its lack of international exposure. Whatever next....RAF in surprise Betamax revival campaign?!

That's right,my original reason for posting...Udeski, I don't understand the banter. Seems to me like we are all happy to be military, but cannot understand the reason behind having to issue another uniform. As for being overpaid/overvalued...I don't see that either are born out in reality; if they were,my pay (basic, therefore pensionable) would be far in excess of yours. As it is, the tax from my bonus will probably help pay for your kids' education, so really, I'm doing you a favour just by being here....:D :D

[SAGA LOUT]

Steady on Udeski you may be mistaken for Admin Guru. Agree totally about uniform . Sometimes I think there is a TOTAL disjoint between clothing procurement and reality:mad:

[force_ale]

In a not so sleepy British outpost in the Med., a decision has been made to stop our white hatted friends from carrying out mundane gate duties as they are deemed to be "over qualified". These important tasks are now to be carried out by soon to be redundent chopper techies and no doubt the odd loadie. I hope that the Gp Capt from the first thread will insist that bush jackets are to be worn.

[TAC2]

having been given a few days warning of requiring my No 1 uniform, I
a. had to find them, have not needed them for more years than I care to remember.
b. had to have them altered, only slightly, honest
c. read this thread and agree totally with what has been said, why do we bother wasting the short finances we have to provide uniform/kit that will never be used. Why not have a ready stock of kit on station, somewhere like a storage or supply facility where you can pop in on a friday afternoon or the like and ask nicely for what you want and have half a chance of getting what you are after. Or am I being cinical!!

[Vortex_Generator]

So, I’m to get a new best blue, yet I still can’t get a set of Combat ’95. Perhaps the nice Group Captain will arrange for me to wear it next time I do station guard force, as it will probably be better than my 10 year old, second hand DPMs.

[FOMere2eternity]

I'd love to add an 'uninformed nod' to this thread, but that wouldn't be fair. I think we're playing Budget Wars. Inevitably the new No1 idea was conceived a long time before 11 Sep, so it's just coming to fruition now. Unfortunately we got invited to ANOTHER war in the mean time.

Whilst I don't think we needed it, the end product is much more comfortable for the 'once a decade' occasions I wear it. I'm so pleased to see the Czar's hessian has finally run out !

As for other kit, I managed to get all my Gulf kit about a month after visiting the stackers. I got a new pair of dessie boots, new sleeping bag and lots of other goodies. I appreciate you chaps given 24hrs (or less) notice are probably wearing wedgewood blue shirts and SD hats, but that's a supply efficiency problem rather than a procurement one I think.

Now, the brochures are another thing...maybe we could grass to Trading Standards or the ASA ?

[Talking Radalt]

FOMere,
It's not just post-Sept 11th that we're talking about here. For years SH crews in particular have been supplying themselves with kit which is not just prefereable, it's essential. And we're not just talking clothing. On Ex SSII, the SH element attached to the RM romped off to the desert with absoutely nothing to sit on apart from their elbows.......anyway this year sees the 20th anniversary of Op Corporate. Take a look in all the anniversary publications and see just how many SH, Albert and Harrier crews were wearing wellie boots in 82!
And as for it being a supply problem not a procurement one, if decent stuff was procured in the right numbers in the first place, a supply problem wouldn't arise.
:rolleyes:

[Yeller Gait]

lets not beat about the bush .....

the RAF is being overtaken by Blunties that are more concerned about their own careers than about the RAF achieving its tasks, and it has been that way for a long time.

There is no point us grumbling about it, nothing is going to change, make the most of the time you have left in the Service, get as good a pension as you can, then leave.


IT IS THE ONLY OPTION. (Unless you are a sad f*****r with no ambition in life)

[Yeller Gait]

and by the way TAC2 you spell cinical with a Y


You may need it in the days and months to come

Cynical ......

[Hugh De Payen]

BRING BACK THE HAIRY MARY'S! That'll sort you lot out.

[bluntie]

Bring back the 'thunderbird' jacket!. At least it was the correct colour!.

:D

[Talking Radalt]

Whaddaya mean bring it back?!!! I've still got mine!!!:p

[Mmmmnice]

Please go and get some kind of life you lot - if you want to take part in a fashion parade, then become a Commodities Broker and in your spare time between decorating the trains in Millwall Blue you can compare suits, and mobiles, and that sort of thing - what do you mean this isn't the Jonathon Ross Show - whoops sorry - I don't feel so good Mum, think I'll go and lie down for 5..........

[Mr C Hinecap]

FOM et al

Just ponder on this one - it is soooo much easier for your stackers to give you everything you want - don't you think it is far more difficult to say no, upset people and not give 'em the right kit?? You don't have to punch holes in the sky to want to do the best job you can and support the rest of the mob. OK - there are some out there - sorry to say - that treat kit as their own, but not as a rule. Stackers don't say what you need (want & need - two different things), but your Trade/Branch Sponsors dictate that. Tell them what you need.
Procurement IS a problem - just look at current Flying Clothing problems. Write to the DCTA & tell them about it.

I once nearly had to tell a stn cdr that he was not able to land his own jets at his own airfield, due to the Crash Cat being lost, due to the Firemen not being properly kitted with PPE, due to the f%$£*& string vest contract being allowed to lapse!! The ch0ds in procurement soon worked that one out for me!

Trust me - I believe we don't need the most Gucci kit in the world, just the RIGHT kit for the job. :( :(

[Talking Radalt]

MMMMNice,
Go shove your head up your own arse. I agree this is not a fashion parade, but I, like the majority of the Sqn, am down to my last couple of flying suits if not THE last. What's gonna run out next? NVG batteries?
:mad:
And Chine, I know it's not the stackers. I agree they are just the front line of and thus innocent link in a chain so defunct it defies belief. At Death Banana HQ the first of the groundcrew are being "called forward" for fitting of the new No1 which started this whole thread. I'm just waiting for news of the first bloke serving in you-know-where to receive a re-directed chit saying get your arse to stores for tailor's parade.:rolleyes: