Transfer times in T1 LHR - EI to NZ

[Gerry Lawlor]

Hi All,

I am travelling along with SWMBO from DUB to HKG on Sundy 24th February with Air New Zealand (NZ38). The journey is ticketed by Air NZ. The Aer Lingus leg (EI178) arrival is scheduled for 1950 and NZ38 departs at 2105. Arrival and departure are both T1. However, as we are not travelling within the UK I know we will have to thread our way through LHR security. Hopefully, we will get boarding passes for both legs in Dublin.

I queried the short changover with Air NZ when booking but understand that it's within their tolerance. At this stage I feel a little uncomfortable about it but believe it will cost me to change to an earlier arriving flight which I am not inclined to do.

Has anyone any experience on how long it takes to transfer at LHR via security but remaining within T1. Any chance of time for duty free? I would like to pick up a bottle or two there for the far end. We will be travelling PE if that helps matters anything at boarding time.

As an aside I believe NZ38 is a 772. Is the travel experience much inferior to the 773s which we will be travelling on at a later date? Or is this compensated for by the smiling and cheerful staff?

Any comments or advice most welcome.

[Skipness One Echo]

That's pretty risky, depending on how busy security is at T1 and you will be departing from the far end of T1, as far as you can go on the new T2B satellite. I would be surprised if your bags go with you.

Take your running shoes as the gate will close about 2050.

[Haven't a clue]

You have no tuck whatsoever for a late arrival - the issue really is if you miss the connection you are going to be waiting for a further 24 hours for the next AirNZ flight. Do you want to take that risk?

[DaveReidUK]

You have no tuck whatsoever for a late arrivalQuite so - and on the 6 Sundays this year to date, EI178 has been on time once, early once, and late 4 times (once by over an hour).

[Gerry Lawlor]

Thanks for the very discouraging but realistic inputs, folks.

It does not seem sensible to take a chance on it when there is a suitable AL flight 1 hr earlier. I shall have to put my thinking cap on pronto and discuss with Air NZ. I fear, however, that the attitude will be "pay up if you want a change" and that is 30 quid a head AFAIK.

I'll report back if there is a happy outcome.

Regards

[finncapt]

I may have read this incorrectly.

As I understand the rules, if the whole booking is on one ticket and the published minimum connection time has been met, whilst it may be inconvenient to miss the connection, EI as the delivering airline are responsible for any enforced stay in LHR.

You may be able to persuade EI/NZ that it is in their interests to change the tickets, for free, to avoid possible costs for a 24 stay in LHR.

My two penneth (eurocenteth doesn't sound so good!!).

[Dannyboy39]

This is probably the worst connection in the whole terminal, if not the whole airport. Takes around 10-15 minutes walking at a brisk pace from the gate to security. The transfer centre is rarely busy in T1 so that shouldn't take too long. The transfer centre takes you into the departure lounge at the wrong end of the building; continue through to the opposite end towards the 70s gates and gates 2, 5 and 7 and follow the signs to the Irish pier. I think its another 10 minute walk from here!

[wowzz]

Even with boarding passes, I cannot see how this connection is possible.
I strongly feel that you need to book an earlier flight.

[blaggerman]

This is probably the worst connection in the whole terminal, if not the whole airport. Takes around 10-15 minutes walking at a brisk pace from the gate to security. The transfer centre is rarely busy in T1 so that shouldn't take too long. The transfer centre takes you into the departure lounge at the wrong end of the building; continue through to the opposite end towards the 70s gates and gates 2, 5 and 7 and follow the signs to the Irish pier. I think its another 10 minute walk from here!OP is connecting EI to NZ. Bus to connections centre and security. Walk to NZ gate. Easily doable if EI is on time.

[scroogee]

And pick up the duty free in NZ on arrival- no secuity hassle nor requirement to transfer at HKG, no time restraint and possibly cheaper- google the NZ auckland airport duty free shops for comparisons etc.

[DaveReidUK]

on the 6 Sundays this year to date, EI178 has been on time once, early once, and late 4 times (once by over an hour).Yesterday's was on time, by the way.

[Heathrow Harry]

i'd say doable (especially on a Sunday) but risky - and if you have family or aren't fit and organised.........

and I'd pack some clothes in my hand luggage as well

[Gerry Lawlor]

Again thanks for all of the inputs.

I would be clearly barking not to take account of the almost unanimous opinions of experienced punters on this site. Being of a certain age I am reluctant to make a successful transfer in T1 dependent on athleticism on my part. Also, I will be breaking the trip in HK for a few days so needs must pick up the prezzie booze in LHR.

Consequently, I have thrown the towel in and paid up for a transfer to a 2 hr earlier flight from DUB. At 60 quid it rankles but is better than having to throw myself on the mercies of AL who would be responsible for my late arrival/non-connection or so I believe. An additional 24 hr delay is not available as fallback as there is no NZ38 flying on the Monday! Besides which, after more than 40 years travelling through LHR, I am fully prepared to pay to avoid such an outcome.

I will vent my spleen on ANZ and complain formally about their ridiculous booking system that can permit such a short change-over in (of all places) LHR. Thanks DaveReidUK for the information on the flight statistics and I will follow that one up and cite to them. Unsurprisingly, some of the delays on the AL flight seem to relate more to stacking at the LHR end rather than just a late departure from DUB. Interestingly, in the RTW (of which this is the first leg) taking in AKL, BNE, LAX and SFO, there are no other tight changeovers.

I am, however, looking forward to a good flight experience with ANZ and I remain interested in comments on the comparative experience of using their 772 vs 773 on long haul.

Regards

[ExXB]

Before you vent your spleen, could I suggest a nice letter asking politely for a refund of the fees? Tell them how much you like their services, how often you fly with them - and that you would like to fly with them in the future. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. (Many airlines respond to 'I'll never fly with you again' comments by ignoring them - what do they have to gain, if they have already lost you as a customer)

Also you might want to check flightaware.c om to see what actually happened to the specific EI flight. If it was late you could also argue that you saved them the connecting expenses they would have to have paid.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

[Gerry Lawlor]

I concur with the good advice on how to approach ANZ. I will do my homework before corresponding. I will report back in due course but, given that this is a 3 month trip, you should not hold your breath in anticipation.

Thanks to all for the inputs and now hopefully "ad astra" on Sunday

[Trinity 09L]

On several occassions I have turned up early at DUB for EI to LHR and they have offered an earlier flight, maybe a solution especially if you show the connection thru to ANZ. Good luck

[Sober Lark]

Sun 24 Feb:

EI178 dep Dub 18:30 (actual 18:27)
arr LHR 19:50 (actual 19:40)

NZ38 dep LHR21:05 (actual 20:54)
On time arrival in Hong Kong.

Taking bets as to whether Gerry and his baggage arrived HKG as planned?

[Heathrow Harry]

well he did get an earlier flight - or at least he said he shelled our for one...

I've just turned down a 40 minute connection from Domestic - International at Atlanta although the agent (who has never been there) assures me "it will be OK" .......... where do they get these numbers??

[Sporran]

As an airline captain working out of T5 at LHR it never ceases to amaze me how passengers know better than us how to book their flights. I often have to 'bite my lip' when I hear a passenger who has missed a connection - but only allowed an hour between connections!!!

Airports give a minimum connection time for VERY good reasons, yet too many passengers feel that they know best. There are a myriad of reasons that aircraft run late - and many, many of them are NOT the fault of the various airlines.

Transfer time recommendations are there for YOUR benefit. Please do not be surprised etc etc etc if you do not manage a connection when you choose to ignore info relating to connection times.

[Hartington]

Sporran, I concur absolutely with what you say. In particular a regular issue here is people who have purchased separate tickets assume that those tickets have the same connection time and protection (should the inbound be delayed) that a through ticket has.

(There are some exceptions to the "separate tickets do not allow connections" rule as I found out recently. I flew BA LHR/CGH and then LA CGH/SCL on separate tickets and, because of a oneWorld benefit, I was able to through check baggage and get boarding passes at LHR but that's an exception. I digress)

Our OP here however, had purchased a through ticket and had even questioned the connection time with the selling agent. Now, it's possible the agency was at fault but having worked with systems like Galileo and Amadeus (which is what BA uses) I know only too well that some minimum connecting times published by the airlines can be (how can I put this) "ambitious". They work if the planes are on time and nothing goes wrong but with any kind of problem there is simply no margin.

As a for instance, many connections from the UK through US points of entry to US domestic points can have ludicrously short MCT. I've quite deliberately searched beyond page 1 of an availability (be it directly into the GDS or using a web interface) to find a connection that provides a safer MCT that the minimum the airline offers; in many cases I consider them unatainable. But I'm lucky, I've worked in the industry and seen (as you have) the results of broken connections and I take a conservative view. But Joe Public doesn't (usually) have our knowledge and takes what he is offered and then suffers when it goes wrong.

At least our OP had the sense to ask *and* to pay up to make himself feel more comfortable.

[Sober Lark]

It is not always the consumers fault. Many have a tight connection time because that is what the airlines booking engine put them on.

With the new 'duty of care' there is an incentive for the airline to build in a buffer to their assumed MCT but until recently if things went wrong it only seemed to cost them a €45 contract rate in a local hotel.

[ExXB]

With all due respect I think the airlines are more concerned with baggage connecting than passengers. The assumption being that if the bags can make it then the passengers can as well.

This works for the majority of passengers but not those with special needs. i.e. those who are not able to sprint down long corridors, leap security queues in a single bound (not recommended) and withstand the slings and arrows of other passengers trying to do exactly the same thing.

My recommendation to anyone in such a situation is to request assistance (mandatory at EU/EEA airports). That way you will get through queues faster and somebody else will get the exercise. Also that chair-pusher will likely have a walkie-talkie / cellphone and know who to call, which might increase the chance they will hold the aircraft door open for a few extra minutes as they know you are coming.

Assistance is mandatory and they cannot question your need. You ask for it, you get it.

[Sober Lark]

Assistance is mandatory and they cannot question your need. You ask for it, you get it.

Just imagine a whole family of Larks getting special assistance, gesticulating gracefully as they sail pass the crowds of great unwashed on their way to an ontime departure. Another glass of Champagne please Jeeves.

[ExXB]

Silly lark, you can't take Champers through security ...