BAF and the Bae46-100

[peachair732]

Did British Air Ferries order the 146-100 as a launch customer? I have seen the BAF livery on the first productions of the 146 but what happened? and why did BAF order and did they cancel? I know that BAF did not operate the 146-100 and I thought Dan Air were the launch fot the 100 series. What happened with the BAF order?

[munster]

The production list is here.
British Aerospace BAe 146/Avro RJ Production List - Planespotters.net Just Aviation (http://www.planespotters.net/Production_List/British-Aerospace/BAe-146/index.php)

[Barling Magna]

BAF did order the 146-100. It would have been the ideal aircraft to fly from SEN's short runway at that time. Sadly BAF entered administration before it could take up the order (it emerged from this later, as the first company to actually achieve that I think), although one 146 did appear in BAF's attractive colourscheme for a while.

[Expressflight]

BAF had 'plans' to order the 146 but I don't think any order was formalised, although I bow to Barling Magna's knowledge if I am mistaken, and an aircraft was painted in full BAF colours. Some final test flights were carried out from SEN in this livery to represent an operational environment to demonstrate the aircraft's in-service reliability.

I seem to recall the aircraft was based at SEN for about 10 days and my then company was contracted to be on standby to fly engineers and spares down the line in the event of unserviceability. Myself and some of our staff were offered seats on one of the later flights but unfortunately (for us) things went so smoothly that the last few flights were cancelled. The result is that the 146 and its variants is one of the aircraft on which I've never flown and probably never will now.

[Phileas Fogg]

I seem to recall that BAe needed a launch operator of the 146, it was to be BAF but it became Dan Air who, on one particular airframe, changed an engine most, if not every, day(s) ... I also recall that at least one of the airframes was in RAF spec whereas the avionics bay was directly below a galley and trolley dollies being what they are with the coffee pots and all that ... :)

Hence, in the early days, the 146 earned an appalling technical reputation some of which has stuck with it to this day.

[Buster the Bear]

Operated out of Luton for a while in BAF colours on 'route proving' flights.

[Barling Magna]

This should really be in Spotters' Corner, but on delving further into this rather than trusting to my ageing memory I find that Expressflight is quite right. BAF did not formally order the 146 despite a 146-100 appearing in BAF colours and even with the registration G-OBAF. They had intended to do so but Mike Keegan sold the company to Jadepoint in early 1983 and they had other ideas. A 146-100 did eventually appear in BAF's fleet, G-RJET, in 1992.

[peachair732]

I wonder then if BAF had thought of the 146 as an aircraft suited to IT charter work, maybe from SEN? It seemed to be ideally suited to opening up routes from Southend to Palma etc. I know Dan Air used the 146-100 on similar routes from Teeside, SEN was similar to MME in those days and Im sure of Dan Air could work the 146-100 from MME on ITs then British Air Ferries may have been able to do the same with SEN. If only. Maybe that was what BAF had planned for the 146 before it entered financial problems.

[Blink182]

Buster the Bear is right........ BAF did have a 146 for the Route Proving ( 200 Hrs ? ) part of certification. I should know as I was one of the Engineers flying with it.
IIRC we had Flt crew from BAe and BAF with cabin crew from BAF. Based at Southend the aircraft was used to simulate airline operations ......a typical flight was Southend to a BAe base ( Hatfield, Filton, Warton , Brough ) fill up with employees and fly to Jersey or Bauvais or Munich and then return. Interesting times .......especially the full evac due smoke in the cabin, and plenty of starter motor changes.

[peachair732]

Thanks Blink182, you may well be one of the best to ask then. Were BAF considering the 146-100 for some charter/IT work out of SEN? maybe working with tour ops to offer Palma, Alicante and the like, as well as of course Jersey.

How did the 146-100 perform, were BAF impressed and would they have ordered if they were in a better place financially at that time.

[willy wombat]

I remember a 146-100 doing demo flights from/to LCY (prior to the runway extension) as I was a passenger on one of them. I am pretty sure that it was the BAF liveried aircraft. I know that somewhere I've got a certificate commemorating the event.

[Jerbourg]

I remember BAF operating charters into GCI with 146-200/300 aircraft.

I flew on G-BTZN 146/300 positioning flight GCI-MAN in 1994 although this was in BAFs later guise as British World Airlines.

Photos: British Aerospace BAe-146-300 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/photo/British-Air-Ferries/British-Aerospace-BAe-146-300/2219362/&sid=e329cddd8a25549acf176e43374f2f0b)

Photos: British Aerospace BAe-146-200QC Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/photo/British-Air-Ferries/British-Aerospace-BAe-146-200QC/1579570/&sid=e329cddd8a25549acf176e43374f2f0b)

[Blink182]

Peachair732 Yes.... IIRC BAF had an intention to buy up to six BAe 146-100, basically to replace the fleet of Viscounts, but as stated before in this thread, everything changed when Keegan went .
I remember plenty of glossy brochures being printed with the bright shiney future!

[Buster the Bear]

Princess Air operated the 146 with some success from Southend.

Blink 182, some of my chums were fortunate enough to fly on one of such trials. Seats not wide enough for a bear sadly!

[sam dilly]

I was invited on a few of the proving flights, from Southend via Hatfield to Jersey and back.
Subsequently, I was on quite a few Lourdes flights from Stansted on G BRAB which was in BAF colours.

[WHBM]

The original BAF one from 1982

Photos: British Aerospace BAe-146-100 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/photo/British-Air-Ferries/British-Aerospace-BAe-146-100/1765463/&sid=7d3eccff9744b9a51d39cc3f10491be2)

BAF didn't take any of the original production but had a few in the early 1990s, by this time in a different livery, some pictured above, which they used for a variety of work.

I've used them (and the Avro RJ successor) for many years out of London City, and indeed in earlier years on Air UK from Stansted, and have never once had a mechanical issue cause a delay. Which is more than I can say for some other types.

willy wombat : The first 146 into LCY was in BAe house colours

http://www.lcacc.org/history/146.WMV

Can you see yourself ? :)

[Midland 331]

BAF escaped lightly. As someone further up the thread has written, the first of Dan Air's -100s, 'HT and 'MN, had horrific tech. problems.

At Teesside circa 1983, the NCL-based aircraft, usually 'HT, did a couple of weekend IT rotations. It was accompanied by a large horse trailer packed full of spares, which probably included some lucky heather, garlic, crucifix, and a rabbit's foot.

Not for nothing did we call it "the one-four-sick".

Sadly, 'HT suffered CFIT a few years back, flying from Spain to North Africa.

[willy wombat]

Thank you for that - I stand corrected. I think there were more than one flight on that day and I was on one of them because as well as noise demos, BAe used the day as a sales pitch to various airlines. I must be getting confused with my certificate from BAF re one of the Viscount retirement flights (of which there were many!) The one I was on went from Southend at low level up the Thames as far as Westminster and then back again. As it was at low level it bumped around a bit which caused one of the Council officials on board to throw up which in turn caused extreme mirth among the airline bods present, which in hindsight was a bit nasty of us.

[sam dilly]

Yes Willy
I was on the flight up the Thames, when the Mayor of Southend brought up his canapes.
yes we were very unkind, it wasn't really that funny, but there you are.
I am sitting here in my office looking now at the certificate given to all on that day for being on the last passenger Viscount flight.
Sam ;)