Qantas cancels Adelaide-Singapore flights

[Sunfish]

This is an example of the behaviour that has made Qantas a national disgrace.

As anyone who has ever worked in the field of economic development would know, a lack of direct international flights is a major disincentive to international business investment and South Australia may suffer as a result. The Federal Government made a major blunder when it sold Qantas by not imposing a universal service obligation requiring it to provide a daily direct fight schedule to major international destinations from and to each State capital.

What is equally puzzling is the Union assertion that all Qantas direct international flights are full to and from Adelaide, but that the business is not making money from them.

Its time States and the Federal Government acted to impose a universal service obligation on a flag carrier or take further steps to open the skies to other carriers.

A good start for the South Australian Government would be to switch all their domestic air travel business to Virgin.

Qantas cancels Adelaide-Singapore flights - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-02-04/qantas-cuts-adelaide-singapore-flights/4500138)


Qantas cancels Adelaide-Singapore flights

Updated 9 hours 26 minutes ago
Qantas kangaroo on plane tail. Photo: Qantas will axe its Adelaide-Singapore services in April. (ABC News: Giulio Saggin)
Map: SA

Qantas will axe its direct flights between Adelaide and Singapore in April as part of a national restructure of its Asian services.

Adelaide Airport says the airline provides three weekly flights direct from Singapore to Adelaide and another three from Adelaide to Singapore via Sydney.

The airport says the decision is disappointing and comes as the number of international passengers using the terminal continues to grow.

Adelaide Airport says the loss of the Qantas flights will be partially offset by Singapore Airlines' decision to increase its Adelaide services in July.

But Senator Nick Xenophon has labelled Qantas's decision an insult to the state.

He says Adelaide is being marginalised by the airline.

"We now have a crazy situation where other countries' airlines are bringing more and more flights into Adelaide from overseas yet Qantas has now severed its last remaining flights in and out of Adelaide on an international route," he said.

"That, to me, is a disgrace.

"Qantas says that they've been losing money on the Adelaide-Singapore route when Qantas employees tell me that they're flights out of Adelaide to Singapore have invariably been incredibly full."

The Transport Workers Union says it expects the airline's decision will lead to job losses.

Branch organiser Matthew Spring says Qantas workers were given no warning about the changes.

"They only found out in the same that way we did, through the media and through us ringing them. They're shocked," he said.

"One of my delegates said 'I don't understand that, those flights are coming in loaded, they're not empty, they're coming in fully loaded. Why would you want to get on a domestic flight and fly to Melbourne to fly out to Singapore, when you go straight from here to Singapore on another flight?'"

Qantas says it is working on a deal with Dubai-based airline Emirates.

[Jack Ranga]

We all know the alternative :ok:

[dragon man]

And halving Perth/Singapore, dropping 3 Sydney/Hongkongs a week plus Frankfurt which is about another 80 surplus 747 pilots. Shrink the business to become profitable.

[qfguy]

QF decreases adl-sin while SQ increases.

Go figure.... :ugh:

[napiersabre]

What are the odds that we'll see JQ 330s out of Adelaide in the next 6 months?

[C441]

As anyone who has ever worked in the field of economic development would know, a lack of direct international flights is a major disincentive to international business investment and South Australia may suffer as a result.
Unfortunately Cathay, Singapore, Malaysian, probably a Chinese airline or two and a few Asian Low-cost carriers including Jetstar (non-Aust based) will step in to fill the void......sad really.

[ejectx3]

Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch, Norfolk Island, Nouméa, Nadi, Papeete, Honolulu, San Francisco, Vancouver, New York, Mexico City, Acapulco, Nassau, Bermuda, Port Moresby, Denpasar, Jakarta, Singapore, Kuala Lumpur, Bangkok, Manila, Hong Kong, Tokyo, Mauritius, Johanesburg, Colombo, New Delhi, Tehran, Bahrain, Damascus, Athens, Rome, Vienna, Frankfurt, Amsterdam and London.

Ref Qantas route map 1973.

All direct from Adelaide I heard ::cool:

[TIMA9X]

What are the odds that we'll see JQ 330s out of Adelaide in the next 6 months? pretty good odds... and appears to be in the script for the show.... behind those lounge doors..:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5wfjQXkZWo&feature=share&list=PL96B91A4A168225AE

[Fly_by_wire]

luckily syd has plenty of extra capacity for all these extra transit passengers

[Anulus Filler]

....And lets not forget the trashing of our former business partner BA. I guess we better lube up for when Emirates returns the favour.

'Furious' British Airways cuts Qantas code share | News | Business Spectator (http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Furious-British-Airways-cuts-Qantas-code-share-pd20130204-4LKJT?OpenDocument&src=mp)

[halfmanhalfbiscuit]

luckily syd has plenty of extra capacity for all these extra transit passengers

QANTAS may expect passengers to do that but I think below more likely. Etihad and even Emirates.


Unfortunately Cathay, Singapore, Malaysian, probably a Chinese airline or two and a few Asian Low-cost carriers including Jetstar (non-Aust based) will step in to fill the void......sad really.

[Sunfish]

Are premium, High Yield pax going to fly with an airline where there is even a remote chance of ending up on a Jetstar sector?

Why would anyone from South Australia make the rotten transit to Sydney?

Qantas has just lost whatever market share of South Australia it had - except for the bogan Coles frequent flyer point market.

[22k]

So is it confirmed now that Frankfurt is gone in April? I heard last week from an FA that it was going till oct? Quick check of the schedule a few hours ago still showed QF 5/6 running in sept/oct??

[qfguy]

Yeap 22k. FRA is gone in April. I think around the 13th.

Another one bites the dust. :mad:

[22k]

Grrrrr..... Why bother with London still then? Just bite the bullet and can it so we can all stop watching this car crash!!!

[Bagus]

As qantas has poor management ,the decision to cancel all this destination must have come from the Emirates management.

[topend3]

It's Adelaide...who cares?:}

[framer]

Won't the ADL pax that used to use the service just jump on the EK / QF flight number that EK will be running out of ADL shortly?

[neville_nobody]

That will probably be the idea.

And that is exactly what is going to kill QF. EK will erode them in so many markets they will probably just end up giving it all away to EK. Which is probably the EK long game. They takeover an entire market via the backdoor. QF are left with a Domestic airline and maybe a couple of 380's that do SYD-LHR and LAX, EK will cover the rest.

[UnderneathTheRadar]

Won't the ADL pax that used to use the service just jump on the EK / QF flight number that EK will be running out of ADL shortly?

Only if they take a parachute and don't mind trying to glide it in from mid-Indian ocean...

[DirectAnywhere]

In other words, EK don't do ADL-SIN at present. SQ is considering twice daily which will mean that the ADL-SIN-the rest of Asia market will be entirely lost to QF - unless they want to go via MEL or SYD. Bwwwahhhhhhhaaaaa!!!!:):):):) Brilliant.

[Aussie]

Yeah problem is not many will be interested in flying to Dubai to connect to Singapore... its a no goer!:sad:

[Eastwest Loco]

Aussie

ADL SIN was and is a semi viable route - IF there is the possibility of carrying oncarriage passengers into Europe.

These passengers provide the "base load" at lower overall yield compared for instance to selling the same seat to one dude ADL SIN and another SIN LHR.

Without the base load, the route is going to struggle unless you throw a LCC at it with smaller equipment. The LCCs who work on the pure model of mind over matter (they don't mind, you don't matter) sell all their seats one sector at a time, no oncarriage, no liability as this does generate more revenue per seat on a tight budget.

In the last month I have had representatives of our franchisor on the phone asking "why is your Qantas International revenue down when other airlines are up".

Simple answer is not disinclination to sell the product, not for one second. I want the big rat on the back of my aeroplane when I am going overseas, but I am running out of options.

Now, if you want an Asia stopover on the way to Europe and Oneworld benefits, Malaysia has the ball. Particularly with very cheap connecting flights to LGK, PEN, BKI etc. Then there is CX over HKG within the group. If Oneworld isn't a requisite there is always SQ.

In 5 years I despair to think that mainline QF International will not even be there but it seems to be heading in that direction. Senior management hauling back on logic to keep the bonuses rolling in until they are in a position to slink away and retire with a large slice of Australia's aviation industry stripped for their benefit, much as the fat prick and the news boy did to Ansett andin the end East West with the help of the Bodgie.

I am not nearly clever enough to know the answer and how to stop the rot. If anybody is, please say so - now!

The via Asia to Europe market QF had a good hold on has gone. MH SQ CX and TG as well as others are rubbing their hands toghether, and our booking profiles are showing this. Dubai as a stopover destination (despite the fact it is a great one and good value) is as popular as herpes with about 50% of passengers.

Take MEL DXB. One QF metal flight and the rest (including a few via Asia) are EK metal on codeshare. Four EK flights to one, 2 with stopover options. As a rule, QF will never undercut the aeroplane owners fare on a codeshare despite being repeatedly raped by AA on the Pacific.

If anyone can see a way out of the maze that senior QF people have buried the Airline's future in, please say so.

The flying kangaroo is down to wallaby and on way to quokka.

Not good.

Best all

EWL

[Sunfish]

East West, I'm one for the Asian stop over on the way to Europe.

I had Twenty Five years of the Qantas LHR route every second Christmas since I was married to a Pom. I copped the Twenty five hours plus each way complete with irritated kids and the obligatory transit through Sydney. In those days this routine regularly cost at least $7000 because it was always high season.

I can't see the frazzled parents with the unruly kids enjoying Dubai at all. In particular, it is only a matter of time before a disobedient teenager is caught with marijuana on them or someone takes exception to dress or behaviour.

Today I am semi retired, divorced, and so is my girlfriend. Hopefuly when her chemotherapy is finished we will fly direct to Singapore and check into a hotel in the marina area for a day or Two. She likes the pool, I like tropical sunrises and an early morning walk watching that city wake up.

After a day or Two it will be on to Rome or somewhere else in Europe.

[illusion]

It was not that long ago that a QF737 was diverted from ADL on final approach because it would have touched down 30 secs after the curfew started. 180 pax bedded in Canberra for the night and a lot of inconvenience.

SA is an economic and social backwater and if it wants a reasonable level of airline service then the state government needs to behave in a more realistic manner..

[Freehills]

CX has just announced 5th daily LHR flight...

[hotnhigh]

Eastwest,
Thanks for the perspective you offer. Many times opinions are clouded by the vested interest we have in a particular company. Your analysis backs up what people with the"vested interest" are seeing and saying.
It's a tragedy that the sewage flow from the top continues unabated.
Their answer, of course, is to have a happy clappers meeting and some how all in the world is good.
Your evidence suggests otherwise.

[jarden]

JQ has never shown an interest in international flying from ADL. If they did there would be on the Bali route now, they only funnel their ADL PAX onto their DRW flights that connect to MNL, SIN and DPS etc with some long layovers as well. So now all the ADL market is entirely served by foreign carriers.

[boocs]

Qantas gift keeps giving, Cathay Pacific adds London flights | Plane Talking (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/2013/02/07/qantas-gift-keeps-giving-cathay-pacific-adds-london-flights/)

b.

[ramius315]

I can't see the frazzled parents with the unruly kids enjoying Dubai at all. In particular, it is only a matter of time before a disobedient teenager is caught with marijuana on them or someone takes exception to dress* or behaviour.

What?

What you are really saying in those words Sunfish is "The rest of the world travels through Dubai without issues but Australians won't be able to."

Because Australians are a. stupid, b. ignorant or c. arogant? I guess take your pick. Over 50 million passengers travel through without an issue, but Australians won't be able to.

The funny thing is I agree with you.

Australians have developed an incredibly arrogant attitude that they are above other countries' laws and so I pick the answer to be c. arrogant. You're right, it will only be a matter of time before somebody is picked up for something against UAE laws simply because of the self-righteous attitude that has been developed amongst many Australians.

Rule 101: when travelling overseas know a country's laws and respect them.

It is the same whether travelling through Bangkok or Singapore.

The issue here is the rubbish that is spread through ignorance about what happens in the Middle East. Most of it spread by people who have never been to or resided there, and by sensationalist articles. It is also spread by the fact that Australians have ignorantly rascist views. (For the record, I am Australian, so I can pass that opinion.)

There should be no difference travelling through Dubai than travelling through Singapore or Bangkok.

But an ignorant and incorrect fear of a country that is consistently misrepresented by sensationalist opinions and articles will mean otherwise.

(* I'm curious as to whether you have actually been to Dubai? A passenger transitting through Dubai will not encounter any issue with dress. And neither will a visitor to the majority of areas in Dubai. It is only in certain areas of Dubai that repsectful dress code is an issue - and it is blatantly obvious to anyone that this is the case in those areas.)

[Sunfish]

Ramius, I agree with most of what you say, except it's ignorance not arrogance. The "fair go mate!" attitude doesn't play well outside Australia.

No specific experience of Dubai apart from a refueling stop years ago, but Karachi and many other places Islamic.

My own belief is "when in Rome"............. Teenagers find it hard to believe that laws may change and that they apply to them - hence drop kicks like Schapelle Corby.

[donpizmeov]

The pax on EK's 12 daily flights from Oz to DXB must just have all been very lucky then to have not run into trouble over the past years. I am sure that QF's huge contribution of two flights a day will change all of this. :ugh:

the Don

[Normasars]

I find it hard to believe that nobody on this forum has mentioned the withdrawal of QF from the PH-HK route effective the 31/03 either. All the pissing and moaning has been about the SIN route, and justifiably so, but nudda about the bit tacked on at the bottom of the statement re PH-HK.

What a disgrace this "national carrier" has become under the stewardship of the current and previous administrations!

[Angle of Attack]

Fair crack of the whip mate, I dont live in Adelaide, but I visit there often, its not 20 years ago and its a fairly decent joint these days, enough to have a heap of cathay, emirates, sia flights daily out of there.. Adelaide is what Perth was like 15 years ao, sort of, Id rather live there than syd, mel or per thats for sure..

[unseen]

it is only a matter of time before a disobedient teenager is caught with marijuana on them

Lucky that the Singaporeans are so accommodating to all of those disobedient teenagers and their marajuana that currently transit Singapore with Qantas.

[boocs]

Normasars,

My understanding is CX will be going double daily from HKG-PER due to QF's withdrawl, although their (CX) timetable does not reflect this at the moment.

So the only comment I guess is "$$$ for CX" as they will be the only carrier on that route!

b.

[TIMA9X]

I remember a certain aviation blogger a while back singing the praises of Emirates and Dubai, but now Emirates has linked with Qantas it appears to be a different tune. Whilst I respect an individuals point of view, I believe some individuals and bloggers abhorrent dissatisfaction with the current going ons with Qantas management are distorting their views on some basic factsand

by Dragon man, And halving Perth/Singapore, dropping 3 Sydney/Hongkongs a week plus Frankfurt which is about another 80 surplus 747 pilots. Shrink the business to become profitable. hmm, I think I may know which blogger you are referring to, I think DM answers well (above) why that blogger has changed his tune regarding the QF/EK tie up.. it's about Aussie pilots jobs, and if we all just step back for a minute and think about it, and because this is one of the many cut and slash "Qantas" downsizing thread announcements, says to me, "Houston we have a problem."

Dragon Man's quote troubles me, (above) I know how hard all of those 80 744 guys n girls have worked to be, though no fault of their own, finding themselves in this position. (2nd PA to "Houston" this is a problem...)



at the end of the day, this is a pilot forum, I support all of you, in all camps, sort of old fashioned I guess, but all LH pilots "earn their gig" as do the domestic guys n girls, but they're both different beasts, enter the latest batch of business mercenary management "accountant types" who are good convincing calculators the - is really a plus + ...

by OB What i'm finding amusing about all this is that prior to this Qantas agreement there was already millions of Australians transiting the middle east each year and no one said a word. Now that this code share with Emirates is taking place it's all about these poor Australians having to travel through the big bad middle east and not having a stop over in Asia, So what gives? I agree, the runs are on the board, .... What bothers me in this clip is when Sheldon says Dubai was unstable (sic) well over the top in my opinion, and it was on national TV..

Really poor diplomacy and not helpful, to anyone.... on the other hand,

I feel for the people back in Adelaide.... the uncertainty of it all.


zZHNSUlyrc8
.

[DrPepz]

Qantas says that less than 5% of pax flying from Australia to Europe get out in Singapore. Singapore is apparently a non-existent market that everyone flies through and doesn't stop at.

Maybe my maths is bad, but In 2012, there were 344,000 Singaporeans who visited Australia (Number 6 source country) and a million Australians visited Singapore (Number 5 source country). That's 1.34 million visitors one way per year, or 3,682 per day or 16 A330s at 75% capacity.

For O&D traffic that is not insignificant, that's massive. That's 4 A330s A DAY to Perth and Sydney EACH and 3 A330s a day to Brisbane and Melbourne EACH, plus 1 to Adelaide and 1 to Darwin+Cairns. I am guessing SQ almost owns the O&D market between Australia and Singapore.

The new QF SIN schedules are a huge turnoff for SIN-based pax. If you're on a family holiday why would you want to wake the kids up at 5.30am to get to the airport by 7.30am for that 0930 departure? What's wrong with the late afternoon departures QF used to have?

[Bazzamundi]

Having now done both, I would take Dubai with kids full stop.

Recent trip with the grandkids and EK. Dubai was so good for the little ones under 10 that we stayed there for 5 days on the way back. So much to see and do.

When QF started going through Singapore it was illegal to spit and chew gum there. Plenty of bogan Aussies survived.

Dubai was an eye opener. Plenty of scantily clad tourists roaming the beaches, and being an old timer with the family in tow, I didn't get to stay out past 10pm, however what I saw made me realise the night life over there is, to say the least, a bit more exciting than most places.

Got to say I was rather surprised.

[topend3]

however what I saw made me realise the night life over there is, to say the least, a bit more exciting than most places.

Yeah great if you don't like bars....

[BuzzBox]

Yeah great if you don't like bars....

I'm guessing you have never been to DXB?? There were plenty of bars last time I was there...

[Turkeyslapper]

Having now done both, I would take Dubai with kids full stop.


Yes dubai is well worth a visit....and there is also plenty of entertainment for adults as well http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

However........for 4 or 5 months of the year it is a rather unpleasant place to be (high 40s every day, high humidity etc etc)...throw Ramadan into the mix during summer and during the day options for things to do dry up petty quickly.

[topend3]

fair enough, about 5 years ago I couldnt find a bar not attached to a hotel, maybe things have changed, anyway off topic i guess :)

[aviator's_anonymous]

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i believe Emirates is the only airline that offers "First Class" out of Adelaide. The tie up between QF/EK on this route will see a increase in service and route choices for people travelling to Europe and in the High end market. So its actually a benefit for travelers in offering, since there is no way QF would ever bring its first class product into Adelaide.