Atlantic 50-50 Sponsorship....

[sqwawk7600]

About 18 months ago I applied for the Atlantic 50-50 sponsorship, but unfortunately did not get it. However, after this length of time I figured that the guys who did get selected must have finished by now and theoretically should be FOs.

So I was wondering if anyone out there can shed some light on the so called guaranteed job offer that Atlantic were so confident about. What are you guys up to?? Where you working??

[cynicaljet]

Hi,

I also got to the aptitudes for this one but didn`t get through and to be honest I am glad about it. From what I have heard the chosen few have not been treated especially well by Atlantic (Any surprise there I ask!??!).

The last that I heard, about a month ago, was that at least half of them got dumped by Atlantic. Reasons given were ranging from bad attitudes thru to failings of only a few exams (Even when passes were obtained on resists). It seems like any old excuse to terminate contracts basically. Possibly further evidence on this forum lately that AFT are not financially sound and could not actually afford to fufill their half of the bargain.

Those that did somehow make it past this stage have had their flying postponed for months on end and dragged out by the company. As far as I am aware NOBODY who started this course has a flying job.

I think that we got a lucky escape from this one. I just feel sorry for the guys who thought they had found something good.

[niknak]

I know of at least two guys who got through, and are now flying for Atlantic.
They both virtually lived in squalor for 9 months, and worked thers guts out to make it, but make it they did.
Both are now captains with the company.
Consider the nature of most of the work carried out by Atlantic, it requires precision flying and ultimate concentration, whether it's fisheries patrol, government work or pollution dispersal.
I know that they work their pilots hard, but in the case of the surveilance work, it's glass cockpit experience in a turbine aircraft (counts for jet time!), so why should they settle for less than the best when they are providing half the expense of starting an airline pilots career?:confused:

[5150]

I think you might be confusing these people with the 100% Atlantic cadets...........................

[Clearjet]

I thought the 50% scheme sounded really good when it came out, but from what I have heard the students taken on have had a tough time of it. Half of the first batch taken on have been chopped, and thats after they payed AFT 20K. I applied to the scheme a few years back but am glad I didnt get on it. Would rather pay for it myself and be treated fairly. The phrase 'aviation is a small world' comes into mind.

[skeet surfer]

Only one person from this 50-50 scheme has a job and he's working in operations at atlantic........

Atlantic have chopped people for falling below the standards, but neglected to tell anybody what those standards were....

I know of one chap who failed a few exams on the first sitting and only then was told that he was chopped if he didn't get them all in the resit - no pressure there then!!! As it happened he aced them all (EAT MY SHORTS)....

Those who have got past the exams are benefiting from the free CPL/IR, so it's not all bad news.....

[Tubbs]

Just out of interest, what sort of success criteria did BA/ BMI cadets have to meet?

[Dynamic Apathy]

I know this is a RUMOUR network, but how about some facts:

I know a couple of the lads who were accepted, one who unfortunately was removed, and that was very tough on him. On the other side of the coin, the scheme was and is ambitious with maximum benefit going to the students. I suppose therefore it is only fair to expect very high standards. You have to remember that these students will ultimately be presented to an airline and so they have every right to expect the best from such a scheme.

The expected performance in the theory exams was put at four resits maximum, and as far as I am aware all the students were aware of this. It is tough to support a company when it appears to have junked a mate, but give the scheme some credit for what it is.

As for the few here that didn't make it, and now think they are better off, could this be taken as sour grapes or what. The other lad that I know who is still there feels quite content and happy, even though he is under pressure to perform.........but hey, that's about par for the course in this game isn't it ?????

[Token Bird]

I am currently studying at FTC in South Africa. They have a partnership with Atlantic and we use Atlantic's notes on the ATPL course here. The 2 courses before mine were made up mostly of 50-50 guys. As a result I know some of the guys on the course. Out of the 7, 2 have passed all fourteen exams and presumably are now happily getting on with their IRs. When you think about it, considering these people are part-sponsored and were chosen from many candidates, 10 out of 14 first time passes is not too much to ask and I believe all 7 of the guys I know are on course to meet this standard. If other people want to doss around, then perhaps they deserve to get axed.

The original deal was that Atlantic guaranteed the candidates jobs within 1 year of completing their training. Unfortunately, when September 11th hit most of the airlines that were signed up to take the candidates dropped out leaving AFT in the lurch. As a result, AFT now have to absorb these guys into their parent airline (Air Atlantique). Air Atlantique then had to cancel their own fully-sponsored scheme, much the annoyance of people like me who were just about to apply for it. Whether AFT 'upped' the standard a bit in order to rid themselves of some excess candidates I wouldn't even like to speculate. I do know, however, that the guys I met were unaware of the standards they had to meet. According to Atlantic, this was a motivational move, and you can see how it would work! It would certainly make me work my butt off!

Basically the scheme seemed like a good idea at the time, but due to circumstances did not exactly work out as planned. I don't believe that AFT deliberately meant to mess these people around,

TB

[skeet surfer]

'dynamic apathy' - Is anybody actually in a flying job after graduating from this scheme? - that is the original question and one you appear to be avoiding??

Standards should certainly be high, perhaps higher than they presently are - the problem is that you cannot motivate someone to hit a target if they're not aware of the target.......

Atlantic definitely created a higher required standard in response
to the global business outlook post-Sept 11 - they are a business and that is their right... but please don't try to deny it....

There was no mention of the required standard in the contract pre-Sept 11....

[Dynamic Apathy]

Skeet,

I'm not denying anything, just trying to look at both sides. The students are obviously disappointed if they get chopped, and those who get through will have to wait. If it is true that Atlantic will absorb pilots into their own airline then I see that as making a commitment to the contract.

Aside from anything else however, surely it is early days yet for the successful students to be having jobs found for them yet. And didn't someone say that the contract gives 12 months from gaining the ATPL (frozen) to finding a job.

Personally I would love to have been successful in my application, even under current circumstances. For those others that failed I would say stop bleating about your own failure and dig deeper into your own pockets if you want to get ahead.

Alas that is what I must do to.......Welcome to the failure club boys.

[skeet surfer]

Fair enough DA -

I'd just like to point out that those of us who are paying are own way (and always have been) don't see ourselves as failures - We are just more committed (financially)

By the time we get jobs, we'll be well used to hardship........

Best of luck...

[Dynamic Apathy]

Skeet: You make a fair point as well.

Wish you, and all the others success, however it is achieved.

[theharrier]

Hey guys,

I too underwent the AFT aptitude tests at the beginning of April and unfortunately, although there were only 7 of us doing them I fluffed up!

However, from all the research that I have done on them and from what I have heard AFT have no plans neither have they ever had any plans to guarantee jobs for their sponsored cadets other than with themselves. They will give any cadet a job for 5 years providing they get themselves through the ATPL course which is extremely reasonable. All this is made clear to the applicant upon submission of their entry form.

After 5 years are up (and the cadets are free to go wherever they please) Atlantic have a 95% retention rate so I guess their pilots must be pretty contented guys....and from what they say, they pay extremely well too so I don't blame them. It will only take about 3 years to reach Captain on a DC6 / Electra earning you a salary of £55,000. Not bad eh?

With regards to an earlier statement that they may be in financial difficulties I am nearly 100% certain that this is garbage. They own all their aircraft as well as Coventry airport and have a turnover of £25million. With so little in the way of overheads I find it hard to see how they could be in difficulties!?!? Please correct me if I'm wrong.....maybe some of you guys are a little bitter about not getting in, maybe not but at the end of the day, I know I wouldnt hesitate about forking out £20,000 if it meant I had a guaranteed job, flying for 5 years......

All the best in whatever you choose to do, happy flying,

theharrier

;)

[Token Bird]

theharrier,

I think you may be confused. The 50-50 scheme we were discussing above is different from the cadet scheme you are talking about. The cadet scheme guarantees a job with Air Atlantique and ties you into a 5 year bond (like most other airline sponsorships). The 50-50 scheme was intended to give a helping hand to candidates to get into other airlines. Atlantic were never planning on taking these candidates themselves as they have the proper cadet scheme for that. However as it has turned out they are being forced to absorb a lot of the 50-50 guys, at the expense of their own cadet scheme,

TB

[Carew]

I did a lot of research into the 50/50 scheme as my son was offered a place with the very first batch of students. Very nice people at AFT who were very enthusiastic about the prospects for the students. However and there is always one of them, when push came to shove they could never name the participating airlines, I actually doubt if they ever had anybody signed up in the first place. I dont really think the events of the last year had that much of an impact on the scheme as the dye was cast well before that. Good luck to all those who have been offered a place with AFT and commiserations to those that have been cast aside. :rolleyes: :confused: :eek: