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ORAC
16th Jan 2013, 20:14
Weather: 24 hours of snow on Friday (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/weather/9806933/Weather-24-hours-of-snow-on-Friday.html)

With snow flakes falling for 24 hours on Friday, bringing chaos on the roads and at airports, the Met Office has warned people to leave the house only if absolutely necessary....

Overnight and into tomorrow temperatures will continue to drop below freezing.
Friday will be see the biggest snow fall since the ‘big freeze’ of 2010. A band of snow will hit the west of the country just in time for the Friday rush hour in some of the UK’s busiest cities. Up to 5 inches is expected down the centre of the country and to the west, including Glasgow, Manchester, Birmingham and Bristol. Gale force winds of up to 40mph will bring blizzards to the top of mountains, closing roads, with strong winds also felt on lower ground.....

On the higher ground in the Pennines and Welsh hills up to ten inches could fall, while snow drifts will rise to several feet. By the afternoon the snow will have moved to the east with up to four inches expected just in time for the evening rush to the pub in London. On the high ground in the east, where snow has already settled from earlier in the week, drifts could again be growing to several feet. The snow will continue into next week and beyond, but not as heavily, with mostly winter flurries in the east and sleet and rain in the west....

The Met Office already had the country on a ‘severe weather’ amber alert and is considering a red alert for Friday as the snow threatens to make roads impassable and travel dangerous. In the South West, where the snow may fall as rain and the ground is still saturated, further floods are possible. Temperatures will barely get above freezing during the day and plunge down to -9C at night.

Helen Chivers, of the Met Office, said it is the most widespread and heaviest snow fall since 2010. “East Wales, north west England, down through the midlands to the Bristol area will see the heaviest snow and biggest impact with 10 to 15cm,” she said. “Up to 25cm could fall on higher ground in the Pennines, South wales and higher areas around Birmingham. “Clearly that brings some potential for severe disruption, not only in those areas but as the snow extends across country. People need to be aware this is on the way and change travel plans accordingly.”...

qwertyuiop
16th Jan 2013, 20:20
What's the bet it doesn't happen.

OFSO
16th Jan 2013, 20:20
Thanks ORAC. Much the same here inland in the Pyranees with "significant" levels of snow and many schools closed. However up to now none has fallen on the coast. Anyone up in France seen the white stuff this week ?

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 20:23
Thanks ORAC. Much the same here inland in the Pyranees with "significant" levels of snow and many schools closed

unfortunately, monday, snow chaos, whis saw the UK one level below national emergency was the result of oh about 1cm of snow.

how on earth did the UK conquer half the world ?

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 20:28
On the ball up here, I noticed that a lot of the "country lanes" had been gritted this afternoon. These are roads that aren't even on these maps

Winter Gritting in Cumbria : Cumbria County Council (http://www.cumbria.gov.uk/gritting/default.asp)

G&T ice n slice
16th Jan 2013, 20:28
Frankly, the Met Office is no longer "fit for purpose" and should be closed down and the staff all fired for gross dereliction of duty (read being a completely useless set to twerps).

Then there should be a reconstituted Met Office with new staff with the mission of forecasting the weather.

If they're predicting 10 inches of snow and 40 mph gales then we can expect a sunny day with light breezes and "shirtsleeve order" conditions.

They are utterly, utterly, utterly useless and if they spent a bit on weather forecasting rather than "Global Warming Scaremongering"....

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 20:33
i got stuck behind a grit truck on the A3 north from portsmouth on tuesday.. bright blue skies, dry roads.. 3pm in the afternoon. :ugh:

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 20:35
If they're predicting 10 inches of snow and 40 mph gales

are they ? i should break out the BBQ then ..

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 21:06
Frankly, the Met Office is no longer "fit for purpose"

I don't know I've looked at two other sources and they also forecast the same with one suggesting 6 inches of snow here on Friday!!

Sprogget
16th Jan 2013, 21:07
i got stuck behind a grit truck on the A3 north from portsmouth on tuesday.. bright blue skies, dry roads.. 3pm in the afternoon. :ugh:Explain please. I'm not getting the socialist wrecker angle on this.

Fox3WheresMyBanana
16th Jan 2013, 21:12
I have a secondhand lawn tractor with a snowblade, total cost £750. I quite like snow as plowing my driveway is fun!

AlpineSkier
16th Jan 2013, 21:13
OFSO

Had about 25 cm here in the N Alps @ 1,400 m and forecast -18 C tonight, but I'm hearing on the news that the Pyrenees have had 2 m in 3 days and they have declared a level 4 (highest) weather warning . If that has only affected the French side, that's a hell of a micro-climate

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 21:14
i got stuck behind a grit truck on the A3 north from portsmouth on tuesday.. bright blue skies, dry roads.. 3pm in the afternoon.

Er, it's called pre-treating the roads, even airports do this on the runways and taxi ways when freezing conditions or snow is forecast

ShyTorque
16th Jan 2013, 21:15
unfortunately, monday, snow chaos, whis saw the UK one level below national emergency was the result of oh about 1cm of snow.

how on earth did the UK conquer half the world ?

We spoofed them about bad weather, told them to stay indoors, then invaded. :p

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 21:17
Er, it's called pre-treating the roads, even airports do this on the runways and taxi ways when freezing conditions or snow is forecast


point taken,

but at 3 pm, before rush hour has even started isnt the grit going to be ground down and blown to the sides by nightfall particularly on a road with high traffic use?

Lord Spandex Masher
16th Jan 2013, 21:18
OFSO, that's the second or third time I've seen you write Pyranees. I've always spelt it Pyrenees and never seen it your way. Is it the local lingo?

Oh yeah, snow. Bring it on, as long as all the muppets in cars stay out the way.

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 21:18
We spoofed them about bad weather, told them to stay indoors, then invaded. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/tongue.gif

good answer !

bigmano
16th Jan 2013, 21:18
What's the bet it doesn't happen.

I am with you. I love the people who believe this crap and start panic buying. God forbid you have to go 1 extra day without bread.

Just though I would make light of the situation with: Top 10 Snow Day Fails | Ultimate Top 10s (http://www.ultimatetop10s.com/top-10-snow-day-fails/)

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 21:25
Some useful stuff here: -

Salting : Cumbria County Council (http://www.cumbria.gov.uk/roads-transport/highways-pavements/highway-maintenance/wintermaintenance/Saltingyourroadsinwinter.asp)

grit going to be ground down and blown to the sides

I think the plan is for it to be ground down into powdered salt that adheres to the road surface. It is only in the form of rough "grit" as it is unprocessed rock salt

22 Degree Halo
16th Jan 2013, 21:29
Here we go again - UK comes to a stand-still - rest of world watches and laughs :rolleyes:

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 21:31
UK comes to a stand-still

Only if it affects London and the SE as they are the UK according to the media. The rest of us don't matter!! :ooh:

G-CPTN
16th Jan 2013, 21:37
Rocksalt (which is what is commonly used in the UK) has to be crushed by traffic before it becomes fully effective, so it is best applied before it is necessary. Only if it rains heavily will it need repeating, though during continuing potentially freezing conditions it's usually done twice per 24 hours (depending on traffic volumes).

To maximize manpower, it is usually done from mid-afternoon through to late evening and again from early morning (depending on weather and traffic conditions).

Looking at our schedules:- http://www.northumberland.gov.uk/Default.aspx?page=12252 - it demonstrates how much area has to be covered. Undoubtedly some areas will be covered sequentially, though if there is snow that requires ploughing it might require a dedicated vehicle for each area in order to keep routes open.

Our village has not had any significant snow this time, but higher ground surrounding had enough to disrupt busroutes.

stuckgear
16th Jan 2013, 21:38
I think the plan is for it to be ground down into powdered salt that adheres to the road surface. It is only in the form of rough "grit" as it is unprocessed rock salt

i would suppose also that they have a few roads to deal with and they have to start somewhere..

ChrisVJ
16th Jan 2013, 21:39
6"? Load of babies the lot of you. Now 3 ft a night is what I call dumping. We still have school if there is only 2 feet of snow.

A A Gruntpuddock
16th Jan 2013, 21:41
If you wait until it starts snowing before sending out the gritters, they have to travel for some distance before reaching their 'zones', and it might not be possible for them to arrive at all because of the snow.

Also, even if they are pre-positioned, they might not be able to cover the whole area before snow makes the roads impassable if they start too late.

Gritter drivers are covered by the same regulations as other HGV drivers, so the total transit, waiting, gritting and return to the depot must be completed in a specific period. If the gritter is late, the driver has to park up, and that vehicle is not available for the next round unless a spare driver can be ferried out to pick it up.

Drivers are a scarce resource and you can quickly run out of qualified drivers during a prolonged snowstorm.

It is also a very expensive process, both in manpower and salt.

When I worked in local government many years ago, the budget for snow clearing alone was about nine times the budget of my department!

For all these reasons, the decision to deploy is not taken lightly.

Desert Dingo
16th Jan 2013, 21:42
Nope. Relax. It ain't gonna happen.
Remember what the climate "scientists" told us.
The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/snowfalls-are-now-just-a-thing-of-the-past-724017.html), 2000:

Snow is starting to disappear from our lives.
Sledges, snowmen, snowballs and the excitement of waking to find that the stuff has settled outside are all a rapidly diminishing part of Britain’s culture, as warmer winters – which scientists are attributing to global climate change – produce not only fewer white Christmases, but fewer white Januaries and Februaries …
Global warming, the heating of the atmosphere by increased amounts of industrial gases, is now accepted as a reality by the international community …
According to Dr David Viner (http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/index.php/dailytelegraph/this_is_not_happening/), a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become “a very rare and exciting event”.
“Children just aren’t going to know what snow is,” he said. The science is settled.

1DC
16th Jan 2013, 21:45
Weather in my location has been nothing like the severe conditions the local tv and radio have been trying to portray. Had to do a 40 mile trip this morning so was carefully listening to local radio which gave the impression that conditions were dire and then sadly we heard; "Breaking News" reports are coming in about a helicopter crash in London.. Didn't hear anything about weather conditions after that and it wasn't mentioned any more.. Went out and roads were fine.
I am sure half our problems now are the crap reporting and the need for reporters to try and put a negative slant on anything they say..

pigboat
16th Jan 2013, 22:04
Ho hum. :zzz:

Sept-Īles - Port-Cartier.
Snow squall watch in effect
Wind chill warning in effect.
Tonight..Cloudy. 40 percent chance of flurries this evening. Snow and
local blowing snow beginning late this evening. Amount 5 cm. Wind
southwest 30 km/h gusting to 50. Temperature steady near minus 5.
Thursday..Snow ending near noon then clearing. Risk of snow squalls
in the morning. Amount 2 cm. Wind southwest 30 km/h gusting to 50
becoming northwest 40 gusting to 60 then diminishing to 20 gusting
to 40 near noon. Temperature falling to minus 19 in the afternoon.
Wind chill minus 30 in the afternoon.
Thursday night..A few clouds. Wind northwest 20 km/h gusting to 40
becoming light near midnight. Low minus 28. Wind chill minus 38.

P6 Driver
16th Jan 2013, 22:11
I lived in Northern Germany for a number of years and don't recall the country coming to a grinding halt very much in winter conditions.

One problem we have in the UK is that many drivers don't know how to drive in snow/freezing weather - but they think they're brilliant at it!

seacue
16th Jan 2013, 23:06
I live in the Washington, DC, area. People in the frozen north make fun of us when we have snow. But they don't have our kind of snow. Here many storms occur when the temperature is about 32 F or 0 C. Put weight on the snow and it compresses and turns to ice. Hard to get around on.

I lived two winters in Boulder, Colorado. Their snow is usually comes when it is really cold and just blows around ... then evaporates without ever melting. But one winter they had a snow of the Washington, DC, type. Those Colorado drivers couldn't get around on the "refreeze into ice" snow of the DC type.

I'd imagine that many of the snows in Britain are the melt and refreeze type. I believe you when you say it is hard to travel if the road is untreated.

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 23:13
One of the forecasts is now showing a reduced snow risk. The problem is the expected temperature is 0 or -1 C with a force 6 wind.
This is where the risk of damage to powerlines is at it's greatest as a those temperatures it is wet and sticks readily to them.

14SIX785
16th Jan 2013, 23:30
OFS - Isn't it time you learnt the correct spelling of Pyrenees or do you know something I don't??:=

FullOppositeRudder
16th Jan 2013, 23:39
We could use a little snow weather here in South Australia at present. 44c is going to happen today in my area, and we have several significant bushfires in the region.

Of course it's all because of global warming :=

So snow sounds like a good thing at present. Can we swap for a few hours? :E

west lakes
16th Jan 2013, 23:44
Can we swap for a few hours

Split the difference so we both end up with temps in the low 20's :ok:

SilsoeSid
17th Jan 2013, 00:58
UK snow - Met Office (http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/learning/snow/snow-in-the-uk)

On 25 September 1895 snow was reported to have fallen at London and Wallington in Surrey making it the earliest fall of snow on the capital.

Surely this can't be so?

The History of British Winters - Netweather.tv (http://www.netweather.tv/index.cgi?action=winter-history;sess=)

1694-95 heralded deep snow, with falls of continual snow affecting London. This lasted for 5 weeks, along with the freezing of the Thames. This heavy snow and frost theme, continued for a good long while. In fact 1695 is believed to have been one of the coldest years ever recorded, the severe snowy winter ended around mid April, at which time arctic sea ice had extended around the entire coast of Iceland! 1695-96 saw -23c (?) in the UK.

pigboat
17th Jan 2013, 02:33
I posted that weather forecast with tongue firmly in cheek. It is, after all, winter in the north and snow and low temperatures are the norm and not the exception. It depends on what the city, county, state etc. is equipped to handle. We have excellent snow clearing and removal, but the crews sometimes get caught with their pants down. The first snowfall we had this season was forecasted to be 5 cm, and this overnight. For such amounts the city will not call out an evening/midnight shift. We got 25 cm, and the next morning there was much wailing and knashing of teeth when the snow ploughs came on at 0500.

As seacue says, in places like Washington they get most of their snow at temperatures barely below freezing which creates hazardous driving conditions. Couple this with drivers who haven't a clue how to drive in snow, in cars without proper tires, and it's easy to see why even a small amount causes chaos.

I was in Montreal over Christmas, a city that prides itself on the efficiency of its snow clearing. They got 45+ cm of snow in one dump on December 27, which set a one-day record dating back fifty years. A week later they still hadn't cleared all of it away. Where I live if that had been the case, city taxpayers would have hung the mayor and city manager from the nearest lamp post.

This is what 45 cm of snow looks like the morning after.

Looking east on Sherbrooke St W.
http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/424089_10151156506382115_169580598_n.jpg

We were staying in that yellow brick three-decker on the right. My car is in front of that [email protected] parked kitty corner.
http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/550889_10151156505622115_786634164_n.jpg

Not only do you have to shovel your car out to go someplace, you have to shovel out a place to park when you return.
http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/263263_10151156507377115_302677674_n.jpg

hellsbrink
17th Jan 2013, 04:10
OFSO

Anyone up in France seen the white stuff this week ?

A couple of centimetres around Paris at the beginning of the week

Krystal n chips
17th Jan 2013, 04:37
" If they're predicting 10 inches of snow and 40 mph gales then we can expect a sunny day with light breezes and "shirtsleeve order" conditions"

Alas, in this instance, a quick look at that chart with wiggly lines and arrows and stuff would suggest they are correct.

True, there is a slight contradiction on their websites, notably between the old version and the new one ( which is actually quite good, although this one has N/A for regional warnings....:confused:. which you would think may be relevant...no matter, it will, I sure be sorted in time ) for the area one resides in.

The snow however, as always, brings out those who should really never be allowed behind a driving wheel.

Monday, and it snowed a little bit. Proceeding in a sedate manner in a queue of traffic ( at a conservative guess, at least 1 mile long at one point) at the front of which is Big Dazza....doing a steady 25 mph although we did make to 30 at one point when Dazza found out that there were gears on his artic...a bit of reduced vis as well....thus we watched as Tarquin, in the BMW tank ( naturally) elects to overtake....with the door / rear windows still nicely covered in snow..but the windscreen was clear, which helps I suppose.

The undisputed winner however, emerging from a village near to where one works and where the residential idiots : normal people ratio is heavily skewed towards the former, was the "driver" whose idea of vision was...the area cleared by the wiper arc..and that was it...the rest of the car..completely covered in snow .....:ugh:

Lon More
17th Jan 2013, 05:37
although we did make to 30 at one point when Dazza found out that there were gears on his artic...
Have you ever driven a truck? It doesn't take too much to jackknife an artic. What in a car is a small, easily controlled skid can be a nightmare in a truck.

Not too bad here at the foot of the Dutch Alps, although there's only about 5 centimetres, not enough to fire up the snow blower.

There was some snow in France, along the coast from Calais on Sunday evening

alisoncc
17th Jan 2013, 05:45
No snow down here. I suppose all the bushfires have melted it. Pity. ;)

Krystal n chips
17th Jan 2013, 05:56
Lon

I appreciate the difference, however, sitting there at 25mph, on clear roads ( as in no snow) does make you wonder.

A bit off topic but there is a regular (ish) supermarket driver who does this speed, then pulls into a layby...and you can see him pointing and laughing at the cars as we drive past...:mad:

sitigeltfel
17th Jan 2013, 06:19
A few snow showers earlier in the week, but it did not settle for long. It is currently -5c, and with the Mistral howling the wind chill factor will be considerably less. Todays mission..........keep warm.

Yamagata ken
17th Jan 2013, 07:28
Interesting photos pigboat, thanks for that. One thing that stands out clearly is that with all the on-street parking, the snow clearers are absolutely stuffed. There's no on-street parking allowed here, so the machines get a clear run.

45cm is a heavy-ish fall here, but quite normal. This is what the numbers look like. The blue line is the actual snowfall, measured daily, and the orange line is the depth of the undisturbed snow pack.

http://imageshack.us/a/img211/424/oishidasnowfall.png

There is no way that you can muddle through with numbers like that, so the town (population 10,000) is well equipped, and this isn't the only depot. Also, everyone (no exceptions, this is Japan) uses winter tyres, and all Japanese car makers offer AWD as an option on their mainstream vehicles. Here, the take up would be 90%+.

http://imageshack.us/a/img15/8854/xdsc1650.jpg

Here's my car after an overnight dump.

http://imageshack.us/a/img842/4048/x1040481.jpg

Here's the works van after I've dug it out.

http://imageshack.us/a/img338/4056/x1040480.jpg

Here's the memsahib's factory (left) after I've cleared the overhanging glacier into the car park (right). We had a lot of snow that year.

http://imageshack.us/a/img443/4951/x1111197.jpg

Out in the country they use graders to clear the roads. There are actually three here, running pretty fast en echelon, and followed up by a snow blower, pumping it all into the rice fields (Yamagata has an ideal climate for premium rice, once all the snow has melted).

http://imageshack.us/a/img651/5909/x1111189.jpg

In town they use loaders fitted with blades for ploughing.

http://imageshack.us/a/img191/1820/x1111193.jpg

When the build-up gets too much, the blowers follow through, pump it into tippers, and it gets dumped on to the river flood plain.

http://imageshack.us/a/img542/5374/x1111183a.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img543/8531/x1050572.jpg

And yes, it does snow in Japan, especially if you live in the west side of the north. This is the road up to Gassan. Gassan opens for skiing in June, assuming they get enough snow hahaha.

http://imageshack.us/a/img442/6074/1060613s.jpg

G&T ice n slice
17th Jan 2013, 08:18
WOW! brrilliant piccies...

Only 1 slight question, what happens when it all melts in spring?

Lon More
17th Jan 2013, 08:22
Useless machine advanced edition - YouTube

stuckgear
17th Jan 2013, 08:25
that's hysterical lon.. its the physical manifestation of posting in JB !


:}

Takan Inchovit
17th Jan 2013, 09:08
Would be great for turning that mag switch back on when you meant to hit the landing light switch.






*

stuckgear
17th Jan 2013, 09:48
now this is completely bizarre:



ice gritting trucks are being targeted by impatient motorists - who have been pelting their vehicles with rocks.

Staff at Northamptonshire Council revealed they have come under a barrage of missiles while out on their rounds as they attempt to make the roads safe from icy conditions.

They said disgruntled drivers stuck behind their vehicles have been pulling over to throw stones and bricks at them because they are driving too slow.

A spokesman for Northamptonshire Highways said there had been numerous incidents of drivers coming under attack while spreading grit across the county.

He said: 'Unfortunately, some of our drivers have had stones and bricks thrown at them.




wtf?

Lord Spandex Masher
17th Jan 2013, 09:51
C'mon SG, people are too self important to wait for anything these days.

Yamagata ken
17th Jan 2013, 09:54
what happens when it all melts in spring

The rivers have evolved to deal with the snowmelt, so it's not normally a problem. Summers are hot and humid with lots of sunshine. Combine that with super-fertile volcanic soil and plenty of water, and you get superb rice, melons, stone fruit and river fish.

In the summer it looks like this. Ginzan (silver mountain) Onsen has a river running through the middle of town. Clean and clear rivers.

http://imageshack.us/a/img255/926/sdsc0230.jpg

Plenty of fish in town, no supermarket trolleys.

http://imageshack.us/a/img541/1148/xdsc1036.jpg

People go fishing.

http://imageshack.us/a/img593/7640/sdsc0065.jpg

ricardian
17th Jan 2013, 10:32
Weather up here (http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/7668200) is chilly but there's no snow.

Big Tudor
17th Jan 2013, 10:33
Yamagata ken
I wanna live there!!! :ok:

beaufort1
17th Jan 2013, 11:18
Yamagata Ken those are wonderful images. :ok:

Lon More
17th Jan 2013, 11:25
very nice Ken :ok:

Bill16STN
17th Jan 2013, 12:46
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8372/8388676503_b33d764d2b_o.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/bill16stn/8388676503/)
UKMO (http://www.flickr.com/photos/bill16stn/8388676503/) by Bill16STN (http://www.flickr.com/people/bill16stn/), on Flickr

west lakes
17th Jan 2013, 14:49
The forecast for here has gone down from about 10cm to .5cm!! So we'll no doubt have .5m!!

hval
17th Jan 2013, 14:54
Briefly:

There are difefrent types of treatmets: -

1/ Dry rock salt (Salt tends to be less effective at temperatures below minus five degrees centigrade (-5°C) and has virtually no effect below -10°C. Salt has a limited effect on snow and where accumulations occur, ploughing will be necessary before salting can take place )

2/ Grit/ sand

3/ Brine solutions (a brine solution is sprayed on to dry salt is it comes out the back of a gritter)

4/ Glycol or some such. Generally used on structures

5/ A mixture

They all have their advantages and disadvantages.

Misconceptions
1/ When a road is gritted all the snow and ice will go away. The truth is it wont. The salt needs to be worked in to the snow and ice for it to be able to work. If no one drives that fast lane it is not going to clear - even if it has been gritted

2/ Ploughing will clear the roads. Due to the fact that roads have cambers and cross falls as well as road studs the closest you are likey to get is about 20/25mm. This still leaves snow and probably ice (compacted snow from vehicle traffic) on the road. You wont get better than that. In Canada road studs are recessed for this very reason

3/ A gritter has travelled the road so the snow and ice will go away. If having to grit during rush hour, or when there are many vehicles on the road, you have no chance of clearing roads. The vehicles stop the salt from getting to the correct location.

4/ Gritting the roads will melt the snow. No chance. Salt has little effect on snow. Even if worked in. If snow falls on top of gritted roads, there is some effect, but minimal. Putting further salt down has little effect, other than to stop people whinging that nothing is being done

5/ The road has been gritted so the snow and ice will have no effect. Rubbish. For the above reasons, plus the fact that if the roads are dry the wind and the vehicles will move the salt to the verges. Is why brine solutions may be used. The brine solution wets the dry salt and helps it to stick to the road surface. If there is a wind the salt dries and then blows away.

I am surprised by how well the councils, Highways Agency, Trunks Roads Authorities et al. manage to do.

People really have very little understanding of the effects of precipitation and all its types.

Fox3WheresMyBanana
17th Jan 2013, 15:03
My cousin lives in Winnipeg, Manisnowba. There's so much snow they have to dump it outside of town, creating artificial mountains.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv320/imec46/IMG_3678.jpg

It stops snowing around April, but the mountains don't completely melt till September (They were still visible when I visited in August).

To cope with the snowmelt in the surrounding countryside, the Red River Floodway was built. It was the second largest construction project ever (only the Panama Canal shifted more earth). It can cope with the equivalent of two Niagara Falls.
Cost around $360 million in today's prices, but has saved an estimated $10 billion since.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry when I see the UK failing to cope with 10cm.


.

stuckgear
17th Jan 2013, 15:55
I don't know whether to laugh or cry when I see the UK failing to cope with 10cm.




10 cm ! that's armageddon in the UK.. 2cm is enough to block the news channels with tales of state of emergency.

mind you it never used to be this way, about the only time we were sent home from school due to snow was because all the toilets froze up. of course it didnt stop many of those from the lower year classes being buried in the 3ft snow drift up the school drive.

500N
17th Jan 2013, 16:01
"mind you it never used to be this way,"

Agree.

What is it with everyone in the UK seemingly getting in a tizz
over a little snow ?

hval
17th Jan 2013, 17:01
500N,

Expectations, politicians and a right to sue have led us in to this situation

wiggy
17th Jan 2013, 17:22
Anyone up in France seen the white stuff this week ?

Yes, a brief dusting of show at Chez nous three days back and about 5mm of snow on the car early this AM when I left home ( we're on the northern edge of the Pyrenees, not a million miles from Andorra, at about 300 metres amsl). To be honest we're lucky it has in the main just stayed far enough above zero for the precipitation to stay in liquid form because it has p***** it down for the last few days and many of the slightly higher villages are well and truely snowed in.

On the sunny side the local ski resorts have had more snow than they know what to do with - problem is getting the access to them open for le weekend rush :ooh:

stuckgear
17th Jan 2013, 17:33
weyhey panic buying has kicked off...



http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/17/article-2263837-16FF7310000005DC-347_964x789.jpg
Shoppers stripped the shelves in the Tesco store in Abedare in South Wales. Customers have been stocking up on both milk and bread as the weather forecast predicts heavy snow and wintery conditions overnight and tomorrow



http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/17/article-2263837-16FEA7A9000005DC-753_964x544.jpg
Lucky escape: A car slides off the A482 in icy conditions near Pumsaint, Carmarthenshire, narrowly avoiding crashing down a steep embankment

Krystal n chips
17th Jan 2013, 17:37
" Expectations, politicians and a right to sue have led us in to this situation"

Erm, no.

For many years, the UK enjoyed pretty much snow free winters ( apart from the areas where it snows every year anyway and they prepare and are used to it ) and thus a generation or two ( almost ) got a bit complacent.

Being a lady, nature decided to remind us of who runs the weather and thus, snow duly appeared back on the menu.

For Tamsin and Jezza et al, for whom the term 4x4 was merely a type of ego extension in the form of a car, the funny lever being something to hang whatever on. The rest of the population, faced with real life conditions in contrast to those depicted as real life on their diet of game shows, simply failed the grasp the difference.

Councils ( varied and numerous ) quietly downgraded the budget allocations and the Highways Agency performed in the same inept manner they do irrespective of the conditions. Trains we know about thanks to many sensible and explanatory posts on here.....the airlines, well we all know what happend there.....all perfectly normal for the UK then. :p:E

However, by pure luck, one does not have to venture out tomorrow as one booked a day off..before Christmas...but, whilst one will be amused at the antics of the "OMG ! what does this do !" 4x4 brigade as they grind to a halt/ into a ditch or whatever, one does have genuine sympathy for those who have no choice and have to be out in the weather.

stuckgear
17th Jan 2013, 17:52
"OMG ! what does this do !" 4x4 brigade as they grind to a halt/ into a ditch

ahh back with your perception of people that drive 4x4's Komrade..

i've pulled probably 15 people out of ditches in the local area over the past two winters and also done a bit with 4x4 emergency response, shuttling HCA's and nurses round to elderly and disabled people that have been inaccessible to ambulances.. many 4x4 owners do a lot of local support for their communities.. many more get their 4x4 'dirty' regularly, many have them due to actual need; towing, rough ground, hauling stuff..

you may want to head over to Landyzone forum for a reality check, yes i use that forum too one drives a r.ange r.over meerly to look down on the plebs Komrade.. :hmm:

hval
17th Jan 2013, 18:01
KnC,

I am correct in what I write. Just ask people who manage winter maintenance. Look at tonnage of salt used by council over the years, when the roads were gritted, how the number of roads gritted has increased with time and much more

500N
17th Jan 2013, 19:17
"one does have genuine sympathy for those who have no choice and have to be out in the weather."

That's funny KnC.

Albeit 20- 30 years ago, everyone I knew used to "be out" in that weather,
be it going to work, going to school. I think everyone who traveled to school put on gum boots and changed into shoes later.

Hell, we even had to play Sport (Rugby or whatever it was you played)
with Snow on the ground. Yes it was bloody cold :O

I suppose now the "wrap in cotton wool brigade" wouldn't allow it
and would keep all the kids at home for the day.


hval
Thanks

Trim Stab
17th Jan 2013, 19:29
However up to now none has fallen on the coast. Anyone up in France seen the white stuff this week ?

Snowed this morning here in Cannes!

broadreach
17th Jan 2013, 19:30
Throwing stones at the grit lorry drivers is disgraceful. One would hope they have cameras recording the idiots and their plates. If I were driving I might just succumb to a bit of road rage and flatten their cars.

500N
17th Jan 2013, 19:36
broadreach

Agree.

How about they drop a load on salt on the car, that should
have a bit of long term effect.

broadreach
17th Jan 2013, 19:37
Price Waterhouse Cooper take on global warming:

PwC Global press room- Current Rates of Decarbonisation Pointing to 6°C of Warming (http://press.pwc.com/GLOBAL/News-releases/current-rates-of-decarbonisation-pointing-to-6oc-of-warming/s/47302a6d-efb5-478f-b0e4-19d8801da855)

Krystal n chips
17th Jan 2013, 19:41
" Albeit 20- 30 years ago, everyone I knew used to "be out" in that weather,
be it going to work, going to school. I think everyone who traveled to school put on gum boots and changed into shoes later."


Strangely enough, I was one of them and still am.

Having said that, one has also long been of the opinion that, if you can avoid the "delights" of snow and associated s£$te ( one is not a fan you may have gathered, one has always preferred warmth ) then it makes sense to do so.

It was actually colder inside the place one was working on Wednesday than outside, much to the disgust of modern "yoof"...aged 40 plus. One simply layered up as they say...again, much confusion ensued despite ones ever helpful advice.

hval...delete RTFQ, insert RTFP....notably what I said about, er, councils.

pigboat
17th Jan 2013, 19:59
One thing that stands out clearly is that with all the on-street parking, the snow clearers are absolutely stuffed. There's no on-street parking allowed here, so the machines get a clear run.


The same thing where I live ken. From November 1st to April 30th, no overnight on-street parking, your car will be towed. In Montreal, where those pics were taken, the houses were built around the turn of the 20th century when automobiles were a rarity. There is no other parking available. What the plows do is make one run down the center, then everyone has to shovel out. A day or two later they forbid parking on one side of the street and the snow is cleared and removed. A day or two after that they repeat the process for the other side.

The three towns with the highest average snowfall on the east coast of Canada - read North America - are Gander and Corner Brook, Newfoundland, and Sept-Iles, Quebec. Average winter snowfall is 150 inches, give or take a couple of inches. I live in the third town. The pic is of the front of my house, taken during the winter of 1989. I seem to remember that year we got around half again as much.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m8/Siddley-Hawker/pigboathouseFebruary.jpg

rab-k
17th Jan 2013, 20:17
Looks like mid-Wales is in for it tomorrow - wish they'd send some of it up here, wouldn't mind a change from the usual [email protected]

Fox3WheresMyBanana
18th Jan 2013, 01:16
Not happy with Government ploughing in the UK?
Just do it yourself then

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag156/RickXI/snowplough.jpg
my driveway, today


Whaddaya mean "Not everyone has their own snowplough"?

Now you're just being silly ;)

pigboat
18th Jan 2013, 02:39
It appears you're having a whole lot of fun with that thing Fox. :D

Guy D'ageradar
18th Jan 2013, 05:25
Nothing against 4x4s myself, having owned quite a few.

I have, however, regularly p1ssed myself laughing at the numpties from UK/Paris/Geneva who used to go screaming past, fishtailing like crazy on their way up to ski resorts in their new, shiny Cayenne/Rangy/etc clad only with summer tyres, having a great time - only to round a bend / crest a hill shortly after and find them digging themselves out of a snowdrift wondering why the brakes didn't work as advertised! :D

Priceless :E

edited to remove unserviceable "quotes"!

Krystal n chips
18th Jan 2013, 05:33
Well SG, wrong as ever in your assumption please note, it's like this.

There are 4x4 drivers and owners for whom this is a working vehicle and thus they know how to operate it as such.

There are plenty of others however ( see the post above :ok: ) for whom the vehicle is merely a perceived status symbol.....now, try and work out which drivers I refer to....

throw a dyce
18th Jan 2013, 06:50
Got one of those plough attachments on my Stiga mower.Best thing I ever bought and call it Thunderbird 4.
Our private access road is about 400m long which the Council never touch.In a normal winter we can get 12" drifting snow off the fields,when the met office hasn't even mentioned it's going to snow(NE Scotland).So it is an essential piece of kit.
Also in this part of the world winter tyres and 4x4s are necessary not just a fashion statement.It was interesting after the colder winters of 2009 and 2010 people shut up about 4x4 and carbon footprints.It was virtually the only thing moving around here.

charliegolf
18th Jan 2013, 06:52
Exactly as advertised here, from timings to quantities. Gritted road outside us, no vehicles on the move. Recommended to Mrs Golf that she work at home. Lucky we didn't rely on Stuckgear and G&T for our advice.

CG, back to bed and bar.

pulse1
18th Jan 2013, 07:03
Well bugger me the forecast was correct

I am pleased to say that we haven't seen anything like the forecast wind here. Local TAF was giving gusts to 27 kts. Currently showing 8 kts.

treadigraph
18th Jan 2013, 07:08
There are plenty of others however ( see the post above http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif ) for whom the vehicle is merely a perceived status symbol

Couple of years ago, a centimetre or two of snow dusted London. Breathless BBC TV reporter collars young mum outside her terraced council house somewhere in East London:

"And how are you coping with the conditions?"

"It's terrible, innit? I can't even back me car up the drive to take me kids to skool", all the while indicating some vast 4WD parked on a barely discernable slope.

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 07:12
Well SG, wrong as ever in your assumption please note, it's like this.

There are 4x4 drivers and owners for whom this is a working vehicle and thus they know how to operate it as such.

There are plenty of others however ( see the post above http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif ) for whom the vehicle is merely a perceived status symbol.....now, try and work out which drivers I refer to....


Komrade, that's soo last decade. what it costs to run a 4x4 in the UK tax, tax, tax makes it no longer a status symbol, it's either a requirement, a hobby or a money pit. (and in some cases all blo0dy 3 :{)

Krystal n chips
18th Jan 2013, 07:15
CG " Exactly as advertised here, from timings to quantities"

Same here, but with one notable inclusion.....seen walking past the hovel, a local ( naturally ) clad in, erm, a T shirt and jeans...:ugh:

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 07:17
morning Komrade :ok:

Sprogget
18th Jan 2013, 07:22
Frankly, the Met Office is no longer "fit for purpose" and should be closed down and the staff all fired for gross dereliction of duty (read being a completely useless set to twerps).

Then there should be a reconstituted Met Office with new staff with the mission of forecasting the weather.

If they're predicting 10 inches of snow and 40 mph gales then we can expect a sunny day with light breezes and "shirtsleeve order" conditions.Quoted, well just because. http://www.pistonheads.com/inc/images/rofl.gif

wiggy
18th Jan 2013, 07:27
LHR

0825 local......

It's here..............................:ooh:

Fliegenmong
18th Jan 2013, 07:30
Pretty much like this here today...

Google Image Result for http://surfersparadise.i4u.com.au/images/gallery1.jpg (http://www.google.com.au/imgres?um=1&hl=en&sa=N&tbo=d&rlz=1C1CHMZ_en-gbAU487AU487&biw=1600&bih=775&tbm=isch&tbnid=0LISwc2flCiaxM:&imgrefurl=http://surfersparadise.i4u.com.au/&docid=IzTFwfct9uTmPM&imgurl=http://surfersparadise.i4u.com.au/images/gallery1.jpg&w=480&h=250&ei=rwb5ULSqCITFkQWOpIDQAQ&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=274&sig=108562458183583068865&page=1&tbnh=139&tbnw=270&start=0&ndsp=28&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:0,i:141&tx=115&ty=113)

Though more of a heat haze about, temp somewhere around high 30's today (90+F)

Not much of a surf today due the Northerly that hung around overnight, but still put in a 2 km swim up and back the coast :ok:

Lottsa white stuff here to, they're just playing beach volleyball on it, or lazing around topless on it....best be careful though! It burns ya feet!

Ancient Mariner
18th Jan 2013, 07:31
Why are people getting so worked up by 4x4s and their owners? I've had rear wheel drives, front wheel drives, no wheel drives and all wheel drives. At present I have one 4x4 and one front wheelie. At what point in time did I change my personality?
Trust me on this, a 4x4 on summer tyres will have better traction than any 2x4 on unstudded winter tyres, braking however. :rolleyes:
I once drove a Opel Ascona rear wheel drive on summer tyres from Norway trough Denmark, Germany and Switzerland and had heavy snow all the way. In Lausanne we made a wrong turn and ended up driving into France over a mountain pass at night. I'll never forget the sign by the roadside as we closed on the border crossing. "Mandatory snow chains may be removed". Didn't have any. Even my '67 Hillman Super Minx pottered happily around Winter Norway on summer tyres when I could not afford the winter variety.
What I'm trying to say is that 4x4, winter tyres, traction control, ESP/C or whatever are all driver aids, and at the end of the day it is up the clump of biological matter behind the wheel.
Enjoy your skiing!
Per

Lord Spandex Masher
18th Jan 2013, 07:36
Per, not everyone who owns a 4x4 is a numpty. Most numpties buy a 4x4.

Ancient Mariner
18th Jan 2013, 07:40
LSM, must be a Brit thing. ;)
Per

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 07:45
Why are people getting so worked up by 4x4s and their owners? I've had rear wheel drives, front wheel drives, no wheel drives and all wheel drives. At present I have one 4x4 and one front wheelie. At what point in time did I change my personality?


well the only reason i can think of is that some like to dictate what others may drive.

personally, i dont give a toss if someone chooses to drive a fiat 500, a mercedes sprinter, a 4x4 or a 911, if it suits their puprose and it's their choice then good luck to them.

G&T ice n slice
18th Jan 2013, 08:17
Weather report from West Cumberland

Slight breeze from the SW, blue skies, sunny, temp approx 5 deg, no precipitation of hail, snow, rain, frogs or fish, no ice, no fog, no mist

Looks like we've got our 1 day of summer a few months early.

ORAC
18th Jan 2013, 08:21
Arrived in Brighton. 8 Oktas, blowing snow but not settling.

vee-tail-1
18th Jan 2013, 08:45
10 cm of snow here with gales and drifting ... normal winter conditions ... will be going round our village delivering supplies to the older residents and those without a 4x4 ... No problem for my ancient Kia.
Even so I have to remind myself 'Use the GEARS don't use the brakes'

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 08:53
Britain braced for 40 hours of snow - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/weather/9808984/Britain-braced-for-40-hours-of-snow.html)

Britain is braced for 40 hours of snow with icy winds as gas companies warn that tens of thousands of people will see their heating fail.

MagnusP
18th Jan 2013, 09:00
Cold but sunny in the capital of the people's republic of jockistan. Snow shoes not yet required. The mog may know something I don't, though, as he was sprawled along the top of a radiator when I left at 7 this morning.

ORAC
18th Jan 2013, 09:45
Now settling - Shoreham Airport:

http://www.shorehamairport.co.uk/widgets/webcam/img.php?dummy=1

green granite
18th Jan 2013, 09:57
Snowing hard in Oxford at the moment by the look of it:

Camera 1 | Oxford Webcam | Oxford Internet Institute (http://webcam.oii.ox.ac.uk/camera1.cfm)

Fliegenmong
18th Jan 2013, 10:52
Warm balmy night here........:p

Coastalwatch :: surfcams :: Surfers Paradise (http://www.coastalwatch.com/camera/cameras_large.aspx?cam=1300&state=QLD&t=6:21:15%20PM&camName=Surfers%20Paradise)

Do wish that ever so annoying Northerly would bugger off though....

Lon More
18th Jan 2013, 11:09
in this part of the world winter tyres and 4x4s are necessary not just a fashion statement.
About time the gubbinment realised this and reduced the taxation on them.
Could be offset by raising it for the Chelsea Tractor set:O

Lightning Mate
18th Jan 2013, 11:11
Snowing quite hard here - almost unheard of in this metropolis.

Yamagata ken
18th Jan 2013, 11:15
Very nice Fox3, I have one like that too. I wish I could ride on mine, but the memsahib was paying and she likes me to walk behind.

http://imageshack.us/a/img9/6403/sdsc4282.jpg

I like mine very much because it can do around 6 times more work than I can. It's first name is Honda, because that's a nice name, and it's second name is Yukios because that means "snow push", and I'm not very imaginative. The snow in the picture fell between breakfast and lunch. A minor inconvenience here, but enough to bring the entire UK to a standstill.

The key to the picture is the "special magic hole" which is the essential part of the system. Three times a day the town pumps river water to the highest point and into the storm water drains. Dump the snow through the hatch, and it's gone, back to the river. Just like magic. We're on a corner, so I have a double frontage to clear: our parking, the footpath and the road where the plough has swept everything into the gutter. The morning session, up at 5 to load up with tea, ready to start at 5:30 takes about 2 hours. Lunchtime takes another hour, and I generally don't bother in the evening. Everyone in town does their bit, it's amazingly efficient, and the entire community benefits from the community effort. Japan :ok:

On cars. Just about all the mainstream stuff comes with AWD, so your Corolla/Micra/Civic drivers get the traction benefits, without the 4WD tank thing. I, of course, have a gentleman's express: a SubaruLegacyWagon. It's amazingly sure-footed in the worst conditions, but in the ski-jo car park, can be easily encouraged into satisfyingly lurid tail slides and doughnuts. Allegedly :O

airship
18th Jan 2013, 11:29
Don't forget to put out some extra food for all the birdies, hedgehogs and stray cats... :ok:

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 11:34
hey fox.. i got the same lawn tractor.. as a question is the snow blade any good for grading with earth or is it a no-no due to the weight on the transmission ?

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 11:37
About time the gubbinment realised this and reduced the taxation on them.



lon.. gummint.. reduce taxation on motorists ?

oh come on.. in this reality!

what are you smoking?

:ok:

Alloa Akbar
18th Jan 2013, 13:14
I have just driven from Romford to Staffordshire, via the M25, M1 and M6, I passed 1 Gritter on the way!!

The snow wasn't heavy by any stretch of the imagination, simply made worse due to lack of grit.

Usual, a slight sprinkling of snow and England comes to a halt.. Pathetic.

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 13:17
Romford to Staffordshire, via the M25, M1 and M6, I passed 1 Gritter on the way!!



is that rhyming slang for northampton ?

Fox3WheresMyBanana
18th Jan 2013, 13:19
throw a dyce - Thunderbird 4 - excellent! I shall copy if I may?

pigboat -My friends in the UK said "Your own plough; that's way cool!" when I got it. I thought it might be fun, but now I've been using it, it is in fact "way cool"

Stuckgear - would not recommend grading unless it's very light stuff like gravel or doing it very carefully. My neighbour bust his lawn tractor's transmission last year trying it. Hire a bobcat for the day - they're even more fun to drive!

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 13:21
cheers fox 3 i figured that would be the possible outcome.

G&T ice n slice
18th Jan 2013, 13:41
Re 4x4s - didn't some gummint somewhere raise all the taxes on these to punitive levels, except where there could be shown an "agricultural reason" for owning a 4x4, which included towing horse trailers.

overnight the local equivalent of Ivor Williams sold out production.....

TBirdFrank
18th Jan 2013, 13:53
No such concession unfortunately - but the Commander is just the thing for being sure that what we need to do - we will! - just a good job its not needed in Moss Side - eh Radar?

simon brown
18th Jan 2013, 14:39
Took the hound for a walk this morning and saw the usual mouth breather in his drug dealer ML Merc that had to be towed out of a slight ditch he chose to park in. They all seem to have these very wide wheels that offer no traction what so ever when a 4 x 4 should come into its own.Its time manufacturers sold winter wheels with these Chelsea poseur mobiles so they can actually be used. Most roads are clogged by 4 x 4 drivers, of lesser machinery who think they can go anywhere who usually end up biting off more than they can chew. An Automatic X5 or some such is a waste of time in such conditions.

When will they ever learn.....

stuckgear
18th Jan 2013, 14:48
SB,

a lot of these 4x4's are more SUV's and have wide road tyres for motorway cruising.

i dont think i've seen an ML being used as proper off roader, same rith RAV's and a whole host of others.

the G-Wagen is a fairly good offroad vehicle, but the gangstar, types that seem to gravitate towards them the huuge price tag they command theses days are frankly siht on road. as i understand it, motorway use on the Gwagen tends to wreck the engine as the constant high load through the transmission from driving at speed doesn't do it good at all blown head gaskets IIRCC.

UDJ7Sd5LUl0

Sunnyjohn
18th Jan 2013, 14:53
Wots all this about snow then?

AlpineSkier
18th Jan 2013, 14:59
Pride cometh.... No, wrong words


Smugness cometh.........:p

green granite
18th Jan 2013, 15:15
From the Torygraph: Parents think it's too dangerous to let kids outside in snow - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/weather/9810865/Parents-think-its-too-dangerous-to-let-kids-outside-in-snow.html)

Nearly a third of parents believe it is "too dangerous" to let their children play outside in the snow, in case they slip on ice or get hit by a snowball, a survey has shown.

Worried parents will ban their children from making snowmen and having snowball fights this winter - for fear they will catch a cold, a study found.

The protective one in five mums and dads, 20 per cent, will try to stop their youngsters falling ill by keeping them wrapped up warm indoors.

Furthermore, 29 per cent say it is "too dangerous" to let them outside because they may slip on ice or be bruised by a tightly-packed snowball.

Blacksheep
18th Jan 2013, 15:22
I drive a Honda CRV AllWD. Its a front wheel drive with traction control on all four. The system can lock the differentials to give full 4WD, but I've only used that twice in five years. I chose it because its comfortable and roomy - its actually what used to be called an estate car.

This morning at the office, Planning called to ask if they could defer a work order for an antenna replacement. I refused and asked why. The answer? They didn't want to send people on Line Maintenance outside in these conditions. Hell, that's what they get paid for.

candoo
18th Jan 2013, 15:28
Well bugger me the forecast was correct

Krystal n chips
18th Jan 2013, 16:42
" They didn't want to send people on Line Maintenance outside in these conditions. Hell, that's what they get paid for"

From the infinite and creative list of "reasons why not / can't" as offered by and ingrained into, avionics engineers then....any ambient temp below crew room / van level being classed as extreme weather conditions....:E

Of interest, during a visit to the local metropolis today and on foot, were the contrasting dress styles.....the " older" generation ( above 55, inc moi ) dressed to be practical / warm and sod the sartorial "image"...those of the "younger" generation dressed as a fashion statement.

And one did witness two 4x4 drivers, whose wheels were rotating at a rate of knots, in the not that deep snow and with a :uhoh: on their faces....one smiled...:D:E

OFSO
18th Jan 2013, 17:03
I have just driven from Romford

OFSO was born in Romford. Have they got a plaque up on the wall yet to commemorate me ?

AlpineSkier
18th Jan 2013, 17:03
About 20 years ago in winter I was visiting a client in Sweden and, as usual at 08:30 we were comfortably sitting in a conference-room, jackets off consuming the usual pastries and coffee . Internal temp about 20 C, external about -15 C.

The senior engineer was drawing something on a flip-chart, when turning back to us he caught sight of some workers on the adjoining building-site. Stopping his discours about the importance of one particular tolerance, he suddenly blurted out ".....this Socialist government is ruining the country. Do you realise that those builders can stop work WITH PAY when it gets down to -17 C :hmm:

gingernut
18th Jan 2013, 17:58
It's only a bit of snow :)
]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0113_zps5118e788.jpg

22 Degree Halo
18th Jan 2013, 18:42
Ejaculated? ^^

aviate1138
18th Jan 2013, 18:56
The BBC has decided to postpone a popular early evening programme "A Question of Sport" with a half hour News doc on todays snow!!!!

We pay for the BBC and we get a pathetic snow replay!

Blacksheep
18th Jan 2013, 21:15
I'm an avionics engineer, KnC. spent 15 years of my 45 year career on the windswept wastes of remote airfields, so I did. Never complained once. Dead 'ard, me. ;)

C130 Techie
18th Jan 2013, 21:41
Ginge


Ours went absolutely mental this morning. Great to watch.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c316/lloydr/2010_01060045.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c316/lloydr/2010_01060022.jpg

I just wish that someone would teach the muppets in this country to clear the snow off their cars before driving :mad::mad::mad:

gingernut
18th Jan 2013, 22:24
Of course, there's always one...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0059-2.jpg

G-CPTN
18th Jan 2013, 22:33
Heard a story on the radio last.

RAF station, Erks building snowmen, Snowdrops in Land_Rover kept running over the snowmen and demolishing them - until - the Erks spot a concrete bollard and build a snowman around it, then, yes, you guessed . . .

Sprogget
19th Jan 2013, 06:39
There's usually more than one Ginge.

http://thumbsnap.com/s/ehkIPOMN.jpg

gingernut
19th Jan 2013, 07:06
:D:D

lovely doggies.

Krystal n chips
19th Jan 2013, 08:30
The meedja reports last night were somewhat diverse.

Whilst the Beeb did include a piece about Wales and the use of 4WD vehicles to help in delivering food / people, but they also managed to offer us the usual "sit up at the back !...I am BBC reporter" unctious hectoring making it as far as LHR in one case and...Guildford ( noted for it's, ahem, rural isolation ) Station.

In contrast, this report was worth watching. As ever with all C4 News items, pertinent and factual plus not insulting the viewers intelligence.

Catch up - Channel 4 News (http://www.channel4.com/news/catch-up/)

A valid point however about HGV's ( don't take umbrage Sproggy, there is a valid point here) and breakdowns....plus, as always, the capacity of some to prove that stupidity is ingrained in many cases....listen to the comments from the Welsh snow plough driver !.....:ugh:

stuckgear
19th Jan 2013, 08:56
Whilst the Beeb did include a piece about Wales and the use of 4WD vehicles to help in delivering food / people, but they also managed to offer us the usual "sit up at the back !...I am BBC reporter" unctious hectoring making it as far as LHR in one case and...Guildford ( noted for it's, ahem, rural isolation ) Station.



so we dont need to ask your opinion on 4x4 owners that play golf do we.

by the way Komrade, Guildford and the surrounding area has a population that commutes, not only into london for work, but also, like many other towns and cities around the country long-ish distances. Not 4-5 miles south, east and west of guildford it does get fairly rural..

like albury..
http://www.surreywildlifetrust.org/images/habitats/1/large_Albury_View_L._Jennings_.JPG?1270828805

and people still need to travel to their work, for their work and as party of the community.

if you can be bothered, here is alink to surrey's diverse nature..

Surrey Wildlife Trust : Biodiversity : Chalk Grassland (http://www.surreywildlifetrust.org/conservation/habitat/1)

of course, it may not interest you as surrey is just full of 4x4 driving, golf playing, middle class southerners that would be first on your execution list should you ever become 1st Kommandant of the Socialist Republic of England.

:ok:

Lon More
19th Jan 2013, 11:32
Even the Mods are having problems

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/395414_513708552007529_847250287_n.jpg

edited to add; party of the community Was your journey really neccessary Stuckgear?

A A Gruntpuddock
19th Jan 2013, 12:03
http://assets.amuniversal.com/2b2676802b5e01300649001dd8b71c47

Windy Militant
19th Jan 2013, 15:59
Newyddion - Cau ysgolion a ffyrdd (http://www.bbc.co.uk/newyddion/21094228)

Welsh language news I don't know if this was transmitted with English voice over but the interesting bit starts around 5:30 Apart from the Four by on it's side they're mainly saying the problem is the snow drifting up to four foot deep across the road from gateways and gaps in the hedges!

RedhillPhil
19th Jan 2013, 16:36
The BBC has decided to postpone a popular early evening programme "A Question of Sport" with a half hour News doc on todays snow!!!!

We pay for the BBC and we get a pathetic snow replay!

Breaking news: It's snowing in January!

G-CPTN
19th Jan 2013, 16:46
BBC News - Wales snow: Warning of ice after day of disruption (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-21096956)

ExXB
19th Jan 2013, 16:53
A quote from itv:

One Australian man on his way to a conference in Geneva, who asked to be unnamed, remained lighthearted, saying: "We've spoken to more reporters than BA staff.

"Does it come as a great surprise that it snows in the northern hemisphere?"

Sour grapes, if you ask me (and you didn't), he could be withstanding the slings and arrows of outrageous OZ January weather.

AlpineSkier
19th Jan 2013, 16:54
I have to say that the current ( but repeated every recent year ) ridiculous nonsense about snow in Britain reminds me of the episode in "The Hitch-Hikers Guide to the Galaxy " when a space-ship is full of emigrants because the population of Earth was wiped out by a virus contracted from telephone receivers ( the receiver cleaners being on strike or similar )

cavortingcheetah
19th Jan 2013, 17:28
A Spanish snow plough in action at Europe's busiest airport?
http:
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02456/snowheathrow_2456213c.jpg

Some snow removal equipment at KORD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huNcNLPdo_4&feature=player_detailpage

Baden Powell was British, from Paddington, something he shared with the bear.

4mastacker
19th Jan 2013, 17:37
Shamelessly borrowed from Arrse

http://forums.bit-tech.net/picture.php?albumid=2163&pictureid=31766

http://forums.bit-tech.net/picture.php?albumid=2163&pictureid=31767

G-CPTN
19th Jan 2013, 17:45
YSv3eMFGOjI

OFSO
19th Jan 2013, 20:27
Ghastly scenes of dead and dying in blizzards the other side of the Pyranees from us, one hears.

On this side, it's 12ŗ plus and the wind is due to gust to 125 kph by 04:00, as winter drawers on.

Windy Militant
19th Jan 2013, 21:39
as winter drawers on.

"That's a pretty old Joke."
"Well They're pretty old drawers"*


* The Perishers circa 1969

Lon More
20th Jan 2013, 10:46
The Russians do it better.
Š¢Š°ŠŗŠøŃ… ŠæŃ€ŠøŠŗŠ¾Š»Š¾Š² Ѹ ŠµŃ‰Šµ Š½Šµ Š²ŠøŠ´ŠµŠ» - YouTube

stuckgear
20th Jan 2013, 10:50
they certain do lon.. that's quite a feat to get a car on end like that.. or is it a modern art installation?

Dop
20th Jan 2013, 13:31
Winterwatch 1963 - The Big Freeze (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01q9d86/Winterwatch_1963_The_Big_Freeze/)

Contains a documentary from 1963. I suspect if we had conditions like that now people would act like it was the end of the world or something.

G&T ice n slice
20th Jan 2013, 13:37
ahh winter 1963, I remember that - we build ourselves an igloo in a field next to the Horsham-Steyning-Worthing lines (long gone).

at boarding school we went outside to warm up by going on mandatory cross-country runs in the Sussex countryside, because that was safer than playing rugby-football.

didn't [twitch] do me [twitch] andy harm [twitch]

sisemen
20th Jan 2013, 15:14
ahh winter 1963, I remember that - we build ourselves an igloo in a field next to the Horsham-Steyning-Worthing lines (long gone).

Look, there's been 50 summers since then surely you didn't expect your igloo to last did you?

Lon More
20th Jan 2013, 15:30
1963, Too cold to cycle to school so had to go by bus. Open rear deck Leyland double decker with no heating. My then girl friend on my lap - mini skirted of course, and my hand under her skirt as no-one could see, singing, "What is this thing called, Love?" :=


apologies to the person who posted this earlier.

mustpost
20th Jan 2013, 15:38
Walked to school and back three days running IIRC, well not running as I was wearing wellington boots..3.9 miles each way.. aged 10 :ooh:

stuckgear
20th Jan 2013, 15:47
now here's a dumb ass...


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/20/article-2265333-170C49D3000005DC-240_470x423.jpg
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/20/article-2265333-170C49DF000005DC-692_470x423.jpg

Dangerous: An Audi drives along the M4 yesterday with a gap of only a few inches in the snow on its windscreen



Blizzards, black ice... and now for the FLOODS: Fresh falls hit Britain as thaw starts in the south (but there's more snow to come) | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2265333/Blizzards-black-ice--FLOODS-Fresh-falls-hit-Britain-thaw-starts-south-theres-snow-come.html#ixzz2IXEdXvzK)

SilsoeSid
20th Jan 2013, 15:51
As the schools are now yet again announcing that because of the bad weather, they will be closed tomorrow, I find it hard to believe that all these teachers live in the country or so far away from their school that they can't make it in to work. ("Too treacherous for my teachers to make it in", "Too dangerous around the school for the children "- Head Teacher on Jeremy Vine show last week)

Well here's one for you teachers out there struggling to make it in to work, how about contacting the nearest school to where you live, and asking if you can help out for the day. That way the pupils still get some form of education and social activity and the parents that can still make it into work can do so. Funny how parents can make it into work, yet teachers can't isn't it!
yes I know some teachers have their own children!

Oh! and when does the taxpayer get that day you've had off back?
I guess you're all now going to say you'll be staying in, marking books, preparing lessons etc.....only you left those books and prep materials at school because you didn't know you were getting the day off did you!!!



.....and ...relax :O

stuckgear
20th Jan 2013, 15:58
SS what they really mean is 'we're terrified of having our asses sued six ways till Sunday if someone slips on some ice'.


probably along with an inspection from a battalion of H&S inspectors, local councillors looking to gain some local 'profile', probably a media firestorm of 'WHY? Oh the humanity ...' and probably some poor so and so getting the chop for not anticipating the 'catastrophe' !

tony draper
20th Jan 2013, 16:03
I think it said at the end of that documentary or other the one that was on last night that about 200 deaths were directly attributable to the freeze,I suspect there would be a lot more should the same occur now,the human race having become a lot more stupid and incapable of coping for themselves since 63.
:uhoh:

radeng
20th Jan 2013, 16:06
We had a few days off in 1963 because the diesel multiple units froze to the rails in Sheffield and there were no trains to school. Not that we objected... Some days, they managed to find a steam engine, but DMUs being single manned, they couldn't always find enough firemen.

SilsoeSid
20th Jan 2013, 18:08
SS what they really mean is 'we're terrified of having our asses sued six ways till Sunday if someone slips on some ice'.

That's heard every time closing schools for the weather crops up, has that ever happened?

...over and above the other claims that is;
£2m bill as ten kids a week sue our schools | The Sun |News (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3153696/2m-bill-as-ten-kids-a-week-sue-our-schools.html)

Sept 2010
PUPILS hurt in school accidents were handed £2.25million in compensation last year.
At least ten kids a week picked up bumper payouts after suing for injuries in the classroom or playground.
Many were for minor mishaps such as slipping on a wet floor or falling off a climbing frame. The enormous sums revealed by the survey have raised fears that “compensation culture” is out of control.
One expert believes this is helping to ruin kids’ education.
Sociology professor Frank Furedi said: “There is little doubt that children’s school experience has suffered because of compensation culture. Some schools are using it as an excuse to avoid the hassle of organising trips and activities.”
The biggest payout was £33,500 given by Poole Council to a pupil who missed the landing mat while doing the high jump.
A student who burned their legs on a radiator was handed £29,000 by Surrey Council, while Essex Council paid £23,000 to a kid who slipped on ice. Even schools that try to protect kids get sued. Wakefield Council paid out £3,275 to a child hit with a FOAM javelin.
Lawyers’ fees and legal costs bump up the figures even more.
The survey of 140 councils found 400 successful compensation claims in 38 weeks of school last year.

Emma Boon of the TaxPayers’ Alliance said: “There are too many spurious or opportunistic claims.”


Why don't the courts wise-up to this nonsense?
"Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is knowing that a tomato doesn't belong in a fruit salad."

rgbrock1
20th Jan 2013, 18:13
stuckgear:

Lots of dumb asses around here like that depicted in your photos.

Remove 6" of snow from the roof of my car? Nah, why bother? I'll just let it blow right off. (And hit YOUR car in the windshield with it.)

It's better known as laziness.

Mr Chips
20th Jan 2013, 18:20
Snow too dangerous for kids to go to school - so they all go sledging. How is that any safer? :ugh:

Fox3WheresMyBanana
20th Jan 2013, 18:29
SS - I taught in Independent schools, mostly out of town boarding schools. We would generally take weather days off approximately 80% of the time the state sector did, so I don't think those state sector people are skiving overly much.
Points to bear in mind.
Buses collecting kids may have remote roads to negotiate.
Not many workplaces involve everyone moving around outside 10+ times per day. Those that do often close too. Most of the site needs to be made safe before the first kid arrives.
Kids are immature, so they do stupid things. The teachers get the day away from school because the kids aren't safe, not the other way around.

...and teachers can do a full days prep at home thanks to planning ahead - I think I only had one unexpected weather day in 11 years. Plus there's the internet now.

As ex-mil, I was always part of the decision loop for cancellations. I only recommended one day when the Head decided to cancel, but I would have cancelled one day she didn't. I scuba dive with sharks, so I don't think I'm overly cautious (or unfamiliar with the behaviour of lawyers ;)).
.

stuckgear
20th Jan 2013, 18:36
Quote:
SS what they really mean is 'we're terrified of having our asses sued six ways till Sunday if someone slips on some ice'.
That's heard every time closing schools for the weather crops up, has that ever happened?



didn't say it *has* happened but you have to admit compo payouts for the most banal things do happen, and who wants a legal bill of settlement out of their budget.


Snow too dangerous for kids to go to school - so they all go sledging. How is that any safer? :ugh:

the parents can sue someone else instead because 13yr old Chardonnay slipped on snow in her 13inch platform stripper shoes.

sitigeltfel
20th Jan 2013, 19:19
Snow too dangerous for kids to go to school - so they all go sledging. How is that any saferSo true......

A man and his daughter have both suffered broken legs during a sledging accident in the Scottish Borders. In a separate incident, a 40 year old woman sustained a leg injury when she fell from a fast moving sledge in Great Ayton, North Yorkshire. She was treated at the scene before being airlifted to James Cook Hospital by the Great North Air Ambulance. Elsewhere, a 16-year-old boy suffered what were described as life-threatening head injuries after falling off a toboggan while out sledging in Middlesbrough.

OFSO
20th Jan 2013, 20:10
Preemptive cancellation of flights tomorrow: that's the way to do it !

G-CPTN
20th Jan 2013, 20:28
Despite dire forecasts for abundant quantities each day since Friday, we currently have no significant snow, and it has been thawing faster than it has fallen every day.

Yet again we are promised copious quantities overnight, and the local schools have already cancelled tomorrow (despite all roads being open and totally clear of any white stuff). :ugh:

stuckgear
20th Jan 2013, 20:32
Despite dire forecasts for abundant quantities each day since Friday, we currently have no significant snow, and it has been thawing faster than it has fallen every day.

Yet again we are promised copious quantities overnight, and the local schools have already cancelled tomorrow (despite all roads being open and totally clear of any white stuff). :ugh:


same here too..

Helol
20th Jan 2013, 20:57
We must have received you fair share of the snow then, it's not stopped here all day. Same last Friday too.

G-CPTN
21st Jan 2013, 08:34
Do schools realise that, by closing, they cause hundreds of parents to have to stay away from their work with the knock-on effect of their workplaces - all because a few teachers are unable to manage to get in to their workplace.

Of course I remember groups of pupils from outlying locations failing to make it to school on wintry days (or having to leave early to avoid being snowed-out of their homes), but I don't remember school closures. Most of the teachers lived locally and many didn't own cars so they would walk to school (as did most of the pupils). Those that did fail to reach school were compensated for by those children who didn't arrive and classes could be combined for supervision.

AlpineSkier
21st Jan 2013, 08:39
Can some one tell me, if from an operating point of view, any amount of snow on runway/taxi-ways is a problem, or is it like roads where (skidding risk and gradients apart ) it needs at least a couple of inches to become a real problem ?

stuckgear
21st Jan 2013, 08:46
any amount ?

could take that either way.. as a minimal amout or a huge amount...

of course deep snow compacted by weight will result in ice which is not 'ideal' for aircraft ground manouvering.

A key problem is contamination on the ASDA.

wilkins ice runway.

http://www.airport-technology.com/projects/wilkins-ice-runway/images/1-wilkins-ice-runway.jpg

A319 ice runway at McMurdo Sound..

AEgBJ4hMK_4

Helol
21st Jan 2013, 09:06
Perhaps part of the problem these days is that people are living further away from their place of work, rather than in the same town/village as they tended to in the 70's.

izod tester
21st Jan 2013, 09:24
Certainly the case with the school Mrs IT is head of. We live 14 miles from it, most of the staff live similar distances. Although the school itself is in the outskirts of Gloucester, most of the teachers live in the villages in the Cotswolds or the Forest of Dean. School was closed on Friday since few of the rural roads had been cleared, but is open today despite 2 of the teachers in the Forest of Dean still unable to get out to the cleared roads (very steep, icy roads where they are). Most of the teachers who do live in the rural villages have 4x4s and usually do manage to get in to work.

stuckgear
21st Jan 2013, 09:40
the hospital my wife works at is 27 miles away, some of her collegues live up to 65 miles away.

throw a dyce
21st Jan 2013, 09:47
In the 70s the schools stayed open.If any pupils/teachers didn't make it in that was the just the way it happened.Some pupils in real rural areas sometimes had problems,as you needed a tractor to get out of the farm roads.But we made the effort.
This countrys reaction to the slightest snow flake these days is pathetic.Get some winter tyres and a shovel.:ugh:

500N
21st Jan 2013, 09:55
Whatever happened to people using chains ?

I remember my father had a set for the car.
They were used sparingly for obvious reasons
but they worked.

What the Fug
21st Jan 2013, 10:09
500N, would they ever justify the cost, planning ahead re canned food and a bag of cement/fertilzer for the boot was all we ever needed for living in the Countryside.

Also in 10 years only ever missed 1 day of school because the school bus could not make it out the valley, kids hated hated that driver

G-CPTN
21st Jan 2013, 11:05
Whatever happened to people using chains? would they ever justify the cost?
Simple snow chains are available for less than £40.

I bought a set as I live down a steep cul-de-sac which isn't cleared by the council.

I also bought a set of snowsox (again, less than £40 a pair).

Search on 'polar snow chains'.

throw a dyce
21st Jan 2013, 11:29
Cooper Weathermasters on 225/45 R17 can drive through over 12 inches of snow,into a steep uphill carpark,with zero wheelspin.
Done it and on their 4th winter still doing it.:ok:

G-CPTN
21st Jan 2013, 11:33
drive through over 12 inches of snow,into a steep uphill carpark,with zero wheelspin.2WD or 4WD?

izod tester
21st Jan 2013, 11:34
We have winter tyres on and chains in boot for both of our cars - trouble is, roads get blocked by other cars/lorries which don't.

500N
21st Jan 2013, 11:47
"and a bag of cement/fertilzer for the boot was all we ever needed for living in the Countryside."

What the fug

Was that to add a bit of weight to aid in the tyres gripping ?

If so, I used to drive a ute, like this
http://www.exfoleyation.co.uk/photography/NZsouthisland/images/29_%20The%20Holden%20Ute_JPG.jpg

Great cars but on dirt roads, slippery roads, needed two bags of
cement to weigh it down then it was great !

G-CPTN
21st Jan 2013, 11:59
Back in the early 1960s, when I first started to drive, I would swap the rear wheels for ones fitted with deep-tread 'town and country' tyres then fit chains to the two removed wheels and tyres which went into the boot (along with my heavy cantilever toolbox which contained sufficient tools to handle any remedial work).

We used to get regular snow (remember 1963?).

What the Fug
21st Jan 2013, 12:08
500N add weight is correct, other essential piece of kit was a length of scaffolding tube for me mother to loosen wheel nuts in case of puncture , and a towing rope (my fathers purchase of a FORD necessitated that).

500N
21st Jan 2013, 12:18
"my fathers purchase of a FORD necessitated that"

That's why I drive a Holden :O


Seriously though, half of it is thinking before you drive and how you drive
(on anything, snow, mud, dirt), the only exception being black ice !!!

.

throw a dyce
21st Jan 2013, 13:00
GCPTN,
2WD front wheels.:ok:

G-CPTN
21st Jan 2013, 14:59
2WD front wheels.
Thanks.

Whatever snow we had today (3 or 4 inches) was wet and has steadily melted throughout the day. Roads along the valley are clear but a couple of miles north the A68 road is closed by snow.

It's amazing what difference a couple of hundred feet in altitude can make.

Still +1 deg C but forecast is for -3 deg C (which might not be severe by some standards, but the highways have been washed clean of salt). Could be chaotic tomorrow morning.

All local schools closed by 10.15 am today despite the roads being clear, at least in the valley . . .

500N
22nd Jan 2013, 00:32
At least one school head has the balls to say it.

UK weather: As snow shuts 5,000 schools, head asks: Where's our old British bulldog spirit? | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2265750/UK-weather-As-snow-shuts-5-000-schools-head-asks-Wheres-old-British-bulldog-spirit.html)

Fox3WheresMyBanana
22nd Jan 2013, 01:07
"Everything can and should be done" to keep schools open during the wintry weather, Education Secretary Michael Gove has said He's done some good things, but this is just pointless posturing.

Either it's being done, or it isn't. If it is, shut up. If it isn't, who's fault is that? School maintenance cuts is your fault, Mr Gove, not teachers. Teachers are travelling many miles because they can't afford a house near the school. Who's fault is that? Excessive H&S rules? Not backing teachers when they were making sensible decisions?

d!ckhead.

Krystal n chips
22nd Jan 2013, 01:19
As we know, it has been snowing in the UK and thus most, if not all of the population are aware of this fact.

Enter then, our fearless reporter, determined it seems, to exemplify the courage, tenacity and consumate professionalism that, well, sets him apart from mere mortals in the never ending quest to bring the news to an enrapt nation.....there again, the term daft as a brush also springs to mind...alternative definitions / terms / adjectives are also available of course,

Note our "hero", ( starts about 9mins in) doing a credible impression of a polar bear on two legs.....although the bear would have a valid reason of course...:ugh:

BBC iPlayer - BBC News at Six: 21/01/2013 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01q3rpl/BBC_News_at_Six_21_01_2013/)

Now you might thunk there are many reasons for his appearance...frustrated method actor perhaps, budget cuts at the Beeb and thus only one umbrella ( possibly a useful bit of kit in such circumstances )for the whole of the News teams, heroism in the face of adversity...the list is endless......but you do have to ask, why ?.

Mind you, our " hero" does have a track record with regard to bad weather given that during the Cumbria floods a few years ago, he appeared doing an equally credible impression of a drowned rat...presumablly to let the nation know it was, erm, raining.

All credit to the Beeb however, for this venture into blending the news with light entertainment.... a star is truly born !

stuckgear
22nd Jan 2013, 06:49
and from KnC's link the spokesperson says that schools are being closed for health and safety reasons alone...

500N
22nd Jan 2013, 07:08
OK, that's it, wrap up the whole country in cotton wool :O

Fox3WheresMyBanana
22nd Jan 2013, 10:08
How long does it take to clear the walkways and entrances to all main buildings in a school, when the entire staff is one old guy with a broom? and they won't pay him overtime. Contract cleaners don't have to come out at 0530 hrs, and want paying double-time which the LEA won't authorise
Used to use the groundstaff back in the day, but the playing fields were flogged off.
H&S rules are quite clear, and totally restrictive.


These mass cancellations are the 'perfect storm' result of all the stupid decisions and restrictions put in place over the last 20 years or so.

500N
22nd Jan 2013, 10:42
Fox3
30 years ago they never bothered, only one lane in and one lane out and
all the other snow was piled to the sides.

Playing fields ? Have all the schools seriously sold off all the playing
fields where the kids play sport ?

Just like in Australia.

Argonautical
22nd Jan 2013, 10:50
Another factor for schools closing is because teachers no longer want to live in the town where they teach which means they have long commutes. Seems they don't want to meet their little darlings out of school.

Fox3WheresMyBanana
22nd Jan 2013, 11:25
True Argo. There's an ever-decreasing bunch of schools in the middle where teachers want to live nearby and can afford to.

There's still quite a few schools with playing fields, but the 3 guys in the hut who could have helped with snow clearance were 'cut' by the beancounters a long time ago.

However, Independent schools generally still have them, because they are so useful. Snow clearance, shifting stuff, coping with minor emergencies like burst pipes (try getting a plumber instantly these days).

ricardian
22nd Jan 2013, 13:15
http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/424504_479373512123844_1136099431_n.jpg

hellsbrink
22nd Jan 2013, 16:19
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/22/article-2265750-17166FFE000005DC-548_964x628.jpg

Lightning Mate
23rd Jan 2013, 08:13
The Highways Agency warning said anyone travelling in icy conditions should take
a shovel,blankets,sleeping bag, extra clothing,including a scarf, hat, gloves,
24 hours supply of food and drink, de-icer, rock salt, torch , tow rope, petrol
can, first aid kit, Vodka ??, and jump leads .........

I felt a right idiot in the bus yesterday morning!

throw a dyce
23rd Jan 2013, 09:39
The BAA security didn't allow de-icer,certain food and drink on to their hallowed turf,despite the driving in snow experts saying to keep it in the car.
Anyway BBC/met office yesterday said that the snow would die out in NE Scotland.Well since that bold prediction we have had about 6 inches of snow overnight,and it's still pelting down.:D:D
Thunderbird 4 is doing a grand job ploughing our road.All is well.;)

stuckgear
23rd Jan 2013, 09:53
Bear in mind that the Met Office works in conjunction with Hadley CRU and uses similar data modelling. yes that's right; HadCRUT is compiled by the UK Met Office's Hadley Centre and the Climatic Research Unit (Cru) at the University of East Anglia.

The same Hadley CRU of the 'Climategate' fame.

we're all having siestas because of the heat really...

Fox3WheresMyBanana
23rd Jan 2013, 10:58
My Province has just issued a weather warning, for temps (with windchill) of -35 or below. Anything milder doesn't merit warning status. It was a balmy -28 yesterday.

stuckgear
23rd Jan 2013, 11:37
fox 3.. in honour for your post in the other thread and the subject title of this thread...

aqMTfeT-yC8

Fox3WheresMyBanana
23rd Jan 2013, 11:48
Matt Andersen LRBC 19- 3 of 13 - YouTube

Burnt Fishtrousers
23rd Jan 2013, 12:46
As a nation we are a bunch of lazy shirking bastids who seem to suffer from a defeatist attitude peddled by some media induced hystria over a bit of snow.

Ive travelled throughout the South over the last week and have had no problems.

What with the 13 weeks paid holiday teachers get and all the inset days and now "snow days" they are having i'm surprised there's time for that side issue called education.

Krystal n chips
26th Jan 2013, 05:38
It would seem the Beeb, ever public minded, have elected to continue their well established policy of patronising the great British public....although you could argue they do have point with many....

Thus, I draw( no pun intended ) your attention to the inspirational and creative thinking that resulted in the ever so educational diagram of... a car.

In the same league as the "fearless reporter" who, a couple of years ago whilst offering us similar sage advice duly held up a map / road atlas and informed us, that, if the sat- nav failed, "you will need one of these".....:{ :ugh:

You can though, sense the opportunity here for a series, presented of course by a "celeb" to educate us all regarding cars and driving in snow..in the UK.



BBC News - How to drive in snow and icy weather (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16946762)

stuckgear
26th Jan 2013, 07:43
cheers KnC that was actually quite funny.

battery.. keep topped up. most batteries are sealed these days

locks.. spray with wd40 and heat the key with a lighter.

1. never spray your locks with wd40.. it washes out the grease and will cause locking problems. particularly if the car car is modern one that has sensors in the locking mechanism

2. never use a lighter to heat your key. modern key sare usually plastic mounted and have electronic security in them heating the key will soften the plastic mount and when you turn the ignition can break off at the plastic. also it tends to bugger up rfid and electonics in the key.

anti freeze - keep topped up. only add anti freeze if you know the type alreay in the car. mixing types of anti freeze can cause the mixture to gel. also, over filling the expansion bottle will cause increased pressure and the excess to vent out. coolant should a year round check. not just winter.

TBirdFrank
26th Jan 2013, 09:01
So - last night Mrs TBF and daughter decide to go to the Royal Exchange to see The Accrington Pals. Parking in town is a joke, but we have a brand new park and ride on the brand new Metrolink line to Oldham at J22 of the M60 which we have used a few times - so off they go in the Jeep.

I order in a nice chicken passanda, but for some reason, look at the g & t and decide to refrain - "just in case"

At ten o clock the phone rings.

There are no trams out of Manchester, tickets are transferable to buses, but no, we don't know which bus goes to J22 or which stop it departs from.

They come home by train where I am now waiting in the Jag (useless in snow - front wheel drive X Type)

So I now have to drive up to J22 to collect the ever trusty Jeep and the whole assemblage arrives home at smack on midnight!

When I publish this on a Metrolink forum, do I get an explanation, or even an apology for their incapacity to operate in a mere inch or two of the white stuff - No! I get a rofl smiley!

And they wonder why I despise them, and everything to do with their apology for a public transport system that has been foisted on the good folk of Manchester, and even now is not complete due to the incompetence of Thales (French) who can't seem to do what they have contracted for and are trying to take us for a mere £42m!

Are we daft? Oh yes - we surely are!

throw a dyce
26th Jan 2013, 12:19
TBirdFrank,
Why is a front wheel drive X type Jag useless in snow.:confused:

stuckgear
26th Jan 2013, 12:33
it's a jag.. and more than 0.0001% of moisture in the atmosphere :E

Tableview
26th Jan 2013, 12:40
Reminds me of a Fiat I had in SA. It was more accurate than the met reports, I always knew if there was rain coming about 3 days in advance because the bloody thing wouldn't start with more than 0.000000000001% humidity in the air. And I could estimate the amount of salt in the air by the amount of bodywork that had been eaten away in the morning when I parked it overnight close to the sea.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3490/4003525277_56b5921084_z.jpg

stuckgear
26th Jan 2013, 12:48
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3490/4003525277_56b5921084_z.jpg

a couple of more years of abuse and it'll be worthy of an ET in Harare.

ricardian
26th Jan 2013, 18:03
Looking at the photograph accompanying this report (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-21212792) I'd say the collapse had little or nothing to do with the weight of a bit of snow!

gingernut
26th Jan 2013, 19:06
Dove Holes, Oldham, Thursday.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v617/gingernut123/DSC_0114_zps29192155.jpg

AlpineSkier
26th Jan 2013, 19:18
ginger

It's absolutely bloody pathetic trams couldn't make that gradient..why in your day...... ;)

500N
26th Jan 2013, 19:51
KnC

"held up a map / road atlas and informed us, that, if the sat- nav failed, "you will need one of these"..... "

I have found out over the last few years that maps and the majority
of young people are useless.

They have just become so reliant on electronics, GPS, Sat Navs AND never been taught to use a map.

flying lid
26th Jan 2013, 20:03
Four bloody inches of snow in Wigan last night and

The M6 motorway was shut between Wigan and Preston (amongst many other roads).

The London - Glasgow West Coast main line railway has been shut all day between Wigan and Preston - overhead wires down.

It's not the country that sucks, it's our Government and management of every bloody company on the island.

How much bloody snow do they have in Davos ??.

Stayed in bed this morning, bacon butties for breakfast, cleared the drive (why I don't know), built a snowman with kids, now about to have a beer.

By the way, a neighbour has a 2.5 litre Jag X type - permanent all wheel drive - the bugger sailed up the hill this morning absolutley no trouble.

THIS is how we used to deal with snow on the railway.

Snow (1963) - YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ugIoMD495E

Lid

mike-wsm
26th Jan 2013, 20:07
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02463/satellite_2463064b.jpg

Snow? What snow!

None here in the South West!

Source: Daily Telegraph.

west lakes
26th Jan 2013, 20:35
The London - Glasgow West Coast main line railway has been shut all day between Wigan and Preston - overhead wires down.

If the snow down there was anything like here (we had 1 inch) I'm not surprised the wires came down. The temperature & conditions were right to snap them - and there is little that can be done to really prevent it!

Krystal n chips
27th Jan 2013, 03:53
" I have found out over the last few years that maps and the majority
of young people are useless.

They have just become so reliant on electronics, GPS, Sat Navs AND never been taught to use a map

500 N.....delete young, insert, a couple of generations to be more accurate...then ask them to do a simple time / distance / speed calc. plus fuel consumption when driving, no chance in the main "as the trip computer does it for me". A grid ref. from an OS map would be beyond many therefore as the GPS is just so reliable....until the power fails.

More than a bit alarming really, when you think they can't revert to manual as it were and reminds me, in part at least, of the debate about technology eroding piloting skills.

Dear Mr Lid,
I can see nothing wrong, in principal and practice, with Wigan being cut off from the civilised world by snow....:D:E

500N
27th Jan 2013, 04:13
KnC

Agree.

Re "then ask them to do a simple time / distance / speed calc."

Not sure if it was on PPrune or another forum but their was a video of a girl - effectively a "dumb blonde" being asked about how long it took took to travel 80km if the car was doing 80km / h - and she went into a long ramble without answering the question.

Well, I asked that same question of a few people - and guess what, 0 / 3 could answer it :O


So yep, we have no hope :O

Kulverstukas
27th Jan 2013, 16:34
Snow? Do you really mean "snow"?

http://img1.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/7/96/698/96698175_large_4ak.jpg

flying lid
27th Jan 2013, 17:17
Dear Mr Lid,
I can see nothing wrong, in principal and practice, with Wigan being cut off from the civilised world by snow....:Dhttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

We managed - ate a few young 'uns !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lid

stuckgear
27th Jan 2013, 17:19
kulverstukas.

you'd think they'd stick those on poles; someone could trip over them.

:}

Fox3WheresMyBanana
27th Jan 2013, 17:57
Wigan being cut off from the civilised world by snow

never thought I'd see Wigan and civilised world in the same sentence...

flying lid
27th Jan 2013, 20:02
Mr Banana, you mean THIS Wigan, right ?.

http://i.nona.net/locmap_WIGAN_-135.168X60.53X-134.832X60.77.png

Lid

Fox3WheresMyBanana
27th Jan 2013, 20:45
Nope, that Wigan is only 10 km from a Tim's, and therefore cultured. This might explain the name.

'The Road to Wigan Pier'
Quote:
The Brookers had large numbers of sons and daughters, most of whom had long since fled from home. Some were in Canada

flying lid
28th Jan 2013, 08:52
True in real life also Mr Banana - My brother lives in Whitehorse !!!!

Lid