How would you fly a Track without RNAV on standard SID?

[Turbavykas]

Hello

For example it says turn LEFT, 281 track to NEDAM. NEDAM is defined as VNO R-292/D41. How would you fly for 41 nm tracking 281 to arrive exactly at NEDAM using just VOR/DME without any RNAV equipment?

[mysteryshopper]

This previous thread might help you achieve what you need to without RNAV:

http://www.pprune.org/professional-pilot-training-includes-ground-studies/255352-point-point-navigation.html

The technique gives you a track (not a heading really) so best to estimate the heading to maintain and achieve the track and then alter it (as described) if necessary.

It will keep you busy! Main thing here will therefore be to remember to keep flying the aircraft ie ensure your scan is maintained and you don´t fixate on the navigation.

The technique also gives you distance so you could work out an ETA as well using your estimated ground speed.

A picture of this would really help you but I am not sure how to do that on PPRUNE, sorry.

You could try a google search for point to point navigation using an RMI now you know what it is called.

Good luck.

[ford cortina]

I take it your not a Professional Pilot.

I would buy RANT, or try it on your MSFS

[Turbavykas]

I looked at that link. It's very easy to understand but how accurate it's practically ? It's kind of theoretically possible to do that but I don't imagine it in single pilot C150 at night in the clouds and with turbulence. Also what if points are given from different nav aids? There is RNAV SID overlay for the same departure and it requires P-RNAV/RNP1 authorization. I assume that method it's not so accurate as P-RNAV :)

[Luke SkyToddler]

I used to fly RNAV sids in a hammered old Seneca 1 with no RNAV, fortunately it was equipped with TLAR, a highly accurate nav system that's almost been forgotten about by you modern children of the magenta line ...

"That Looks About Right" :}

[Luke SkyToddler]

Nah seriously,it might be a theoretical problem for student pilots, but in the real world you aren't supposed to do it at all. It'll say on the Jepp plate if RNAV is required or not.

Your options are to either fly the equivalent non-RNAV sid or if there isn't one, tell the ground controller you need a radar heading after takeoff.

[pipersam]

Point to Point is quite daunting when you first think of it and prepare to do it, but once you've practised it a few times it becomes second nature. I believe that it's a requirement to show point to point techniques in the JAR IRT.

[Agaricus bisporus]

Well if it is an RNAV SID you clearly can't do it without suitable area nav, can you?

How would you fly for 41 nm tracking 281 to arrive exactly at NEDAM using just VOR/DME

Who said "exactly"? There's your conceptual problem. Not RNAV, not "exactly". Near enough is good enough. This fanaticism for ultimate precision where it isn't necessary or asked for is a kind of lack of situational awareness.

Err, so, how about lay off drift and fly a heading? How do you go anywhere without RNAV? Set VNO R-292/D41 on your VHF Nav so you know when you're there or thereabouts.

How quickly the most basic skills vanish when that damn magenta line appears. Only 15 years ago we used to get "direct to" clearances to some place over the Alps 100 miles away that was defined as a Brg/Dist from a VOR a hundred odd miles in another direction. We were rarely as much as 5 miles off it on arrival even without a mid-leg correction - ie sticking to first estimate. It's not hard...

Its airmanship.

Oh bugger! I've said it again.

I'll get my reflective road mender's coat.

[maxdrypower]

If this is a question from a ppl then good question , if its from a cpl/ir holder then the response is "Really???"

[Gulfstreamaviator]

I hope that this is a Christmas cracker joke.

Yes in the good old days we always just point ansd shoot, but these days with such congested airspace being only 5 miles off track is a major infringement, ( I know cos I was on wrong sid last week.....parallel SIDS only 10 miles apart....)

[maxdrypower]

hurts dunnit glf :-)

[taxi_driver]

If the plate says RNAV, then you need that capability to fly it.

If you get airborne and your RNAV capability suddenly fails, then you would ask for a radar vector.