Ultralights on my Days Off Effecting my Day Pilot Job

[Ejector]

I am wondering if Ultralights have to be answerable to the same laws as VH registered aircraft?

If you hold a ATPL and screw up but you are in an Ultralight using the RAA license would I be treated as an ATPL holder or as a RAA licensed pilot?

Does private ultralight flights count towards flight and duty in GA? If I flew on my days off privately would that make problem?

[baswell]

1) Yes

2) RA-Aus can suspend your certificate independently. If CASA decides to also take an interest, they could suspend your ATPL. CASA has every right to dish out the same punishment to RA-Aus pilots as they can to those CASA licensed.

3) Not a clue. (The answer probably is "it depends")

What kind of screwing up are you intending, though? :)

[VH-XXX]

A couple of things.

RAA issue "pilot certificates" and not "licences" as such.

That being said as a pilot of an RA-Aus *aircraft* you are required to follow exactly the same CAO's and CAR's as an ATPL, excluding ONLY the exceptions laid out under CAO95.55, but they are mostly around the specific aircraft type and its' exemption from certain requirements and also privelages of the certificate.

Some would argue that an *ultralight* pilot has to know MORE rules and regulations that a GA pilot as the two sets combine.

[djpil]

Refer para 1.3 of CAO 48.0 wrt flight and duty times and then consider that a pilot licence is not exercised in flying RAA aeroplanes.

[T28D]

djpil Good answer that will bring the know it alls to heel

[VH-XXX]

Regardless of the CAO's it may depend on your employer and your contract.... Something to consider.

[Horatio Leafblower]

And just to complicate it further,

the standard exemption my outfit works under (Chapter V GA Charter/instructing) specifically requires "all private flying" to be accounted for in your flight & duties.

You can argue about "private" but you can't argue about the "flying" and to me that means AUF is included.

...hopefully THAT will bring a certain know-it-all to heel :mad:

[Jack Ranga]

You can try and get away with any hours **** you like, I had one mate (CPL) get busted for 10.2 hours for one day's PJE flying.

'When I took off I had 9.8 hours for the day'

'You knew the flight would take more than 0.2 when you took off'

'mmmmmm, yes I did'

GOLDEN RULE.........

[HarleyD]

If you hold a cpl and are 'engaged' in commercial operations ALL private flying counts toward your FDT obligations.

I have been pinged.

I previously understood that pvt needed to be considered but only in respect of its affect on com ops, but it is considered stand alone and if you exceed the commercially applicable limitations even on purely pvt ops while on leave you are nicked mate.

The word engaged has been interpreted to mean employed ie you have a job, not that you are undertaking commercial ops. Completely fukced up in my view but is a result of an administrative appeals tribunal decision that engaged does not mean engaged in, actually doing, commercial operations, it means that someone has engaged you to be a commercial pilot a a job.

Of course if you do not have a cpl, or are unemployed, all bets are off I assume.

I do not agree with this interpretation but it's what you will be assessed under during an audit.

HD

[HarleyD]

I will add that I was told that the AAT finding was made to cover corporate and similar ops where all ops are private even though it is essentially run as a commercial equivalent operation ie cpl pilots 'engaged' and procedurally a commercial operation. That was intent as I understand, but it still covers all private flying.

So, if you are a cpl who is employed as a ferry pilot, and ferrying is a private operation,wait for it...CAO48 applies so I have been told that you will need to land and rest out there in the middle of the blue bits on the map. Maybe the C Against Sensible Aviation will kindly put some aircraft carriers out there for us.

It will make it very hard to do those 16 hour days single pilot, no AP for several consecutive days. War zones, hey no problem I was told, just 36 hours of rest and I can do another 6 hours flying the next day, then land halfway across the bay of Bengal in the worlds most pirate infested waters for a Kip before next duty day.

What a Joke


HD

[clark y]

Ejector,

on a slightly different note, if you have life insurance, loss of license etc, you may want to check with the insurer as they may not cover you should the unfortunate occur. They may require something like VH registered only or non-experimental.

[baswell]

Dunno about loss of license, but if your life insurance mentions flying at all, it's probably time for a different life insurance company... (Zurich did query my flying habits when I disclosed them in the proposal, but the policy has no exclusions regarding flying whatsoever.)

[VH-XXX]

The default on *most* policies talk of not being covered for an aircraft that you are flying versus a passenger on a registered charter flight.

[Brian Abraham]

Ejector, on the advice given seems like you may have to park the utralight. This field is wide open though - I think. No worries about low flying, don't even have to log the hours.

Alexander Polli, Tracksuit, Wingsuit Flying: Reality Of Human Flight - YouTube

[djpil]

Hopefully the new draft FDT rules will be issued soon.

[Ejector]

Looking at the RAA site here (http://www.raa.asn.au/learn-to-fly/recreational-vs-private/)it has disappointed me. It would drive me nuts if I bought a Ultralight registered Jabiru or Skyfox with a transponder and could not enter controlled airspace. Can anyone confirm that this is true? There are claims that RAA have to know more rules than a PPL !

Compared to recreational flying, a private license adds:

Flying in controlled airspace
Fly aircraft with more than two seats
Fly at night (with extra training beyond the PPL)
Fly on instruments / in cloud (with a lot of extra training)
Fly aerobatics (extra training required)

[VH-XXX]

Ejector, if you look closely at 95.55 you will see that with a PPL you can fly an RA-Aus registered FACTORY BUILT aircraft into controlled airspace as long as it it suitably equipped and as long as your PPL allows you to. You can't fly a homebuilt RA-Aus aircraft into CTA (although a tiny number of historical exemptions apply).

Therefore Jabiru or Skyfox with transponder are A-OK.

Under RA-Aus:

Flying in controlled airspace

Yes.

Fly aircraft with more than two seats

No.

Fly at night (with extra training beyond the PPL)

No.

Fly on instruments / in cloud (with a lot of extra training)

No.

Fly aerobatics (extra training required)

No.

Also, you can't fly multi-engine (there's a small disclaimer on that but not relevant to your situation).

[Oracle1]

I did some research into flying a 19 aircraft into controlled airspace and I cant find anything that precludes a 19 aircraft from entering so long as a transponder is on board and the pilot has a PPL. The usual exemptions (glide clear of built up areas still apply for 24 and 19 aircraft) still apply. There is a clause about a suitable aircraft engine, but if its the same engine as a 24 whats the difference. Most builders of 19 aircraft with a PPL would probably have no problem putting there aircraft into VH experimental anyway.

[VH-XXX]

There is a clause about a suitable aircraft engine, but if its the same engine as a 24 whats the difference

There is more than just a "clause" I'm afraid. It is quite clear.

I have a detailed email trail from CASA about how an amateur built RAAus registered aircraft can't be flown into CTA that I am happy to share with you if required.

VH-EXP no worries.

Raaus lost their ability early this year (or possibly sooner) to allow home builts into CTA and now not even CASA will allow it (with some very limited exceptions).

[sprocket check]

xxx you forgot to mention that you can fly RAAus registered into CTA only if you have a PPL with CTA AND an RAAus certificate.

[VH-XXX]

xxx you forgot to mention that you can fly RAAus registered into CTA only if you have a PPL with CTA AND an RAAus certificate.

Good call.

I said:

Ejector, if you look closely at 95.55 you will see that with a PPL you can fly an RA-Aus registered FACTORY BUILT aircraft into controlled airspace as long as it it suitably equipped and as long as your PPL allows you to.

But I didn't say that you need an RA-Aus certificate in ADDITION to your PPL. Good pick-up. I made an assumption regarding the reader and assumptions are the mother of all evil in aviation!

[Ejector]

I kind of assume I would need a RAA certificate.

I assume that 19 is home-built and 24 is factory built ultralights?

Again assuming is dangerous :)

This has been a very helpful thread for me.

I am looking at a Skyfox maybe.

[VH-XXX]

You are safe with a Slyfox. They have been around for a while now (as in aren't a new LSA with associated rego issues) and there are plenty of them getting around inside CTA. Many of them came with transponders too, Bendix Kings. Moderately easy to maintain for a rag and tube and the folding wings are one of the best parts thus making it easy to trailer.

I had one for 2 years and clocked over 500 hours in it, loved it. In the end I wanted to go faster but faster is not always better. The Fox would nearly land anywhere, carry anyone, good luggage space, it's quiet, has a super reliable engine and was easy and fun to fly!