CAA ATPL et AL

[Ja]

How many of you are still on the 'old' CAA ATPL syllabus? Training? Exams? Hours building? etc.

Cut off for exams is June! Required hours (plus exams) is July 2002,

??

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VNE or nothing

[Toby Tyke]

Me!
CPL/IR frozen ATPL 500hrs. Dont think I'll make the deadline next year. I honestly think it stinks and something should be done or said. The people at the CAA make it up as they go along.
Are you in the same boat Ja.

rgds
Toby


[This message has been edited by Toby Tyke (edited 16 April 2001).]

[TooHotToFly]

Toby - why are you so bothered about missing the CAA ATPL deadline. What do you need an ATPL for - to sit in the LHS of a multi-crew aircraft. Who's going to give you a job in the LHS unless you've got at least 500 hours in the RHS - so why does it matter that you have to meet the JAA Regs.

[Toby Tyke]

TooHotToFly.
I was told by someone the other day, that if I did not get my frozen ATPL issued before June 2002, I would have to take the JAA ATPL exams.

Is someone pulling my leg? I hope so

rgds
toby

[Tarmach]

Could someone please tell me why sitting the JAA ATPL exams are so bad compared to the CAA ones? Whats the difference? Don't you have to hour build for both anyway?

[TooHotToFly]

Toby - If you fail to achieve the requirements for a CAA ATPL prior to the end of June 2002, you will be unable to gain a CAA ATPL. You can however apply for a JAA ATPL once you meet the requirements using your CAA examination credits - there is no need to redo the ATPL examinations.

[Letdown]

Ja

I'm still in the 'old system' with just Nav. to pass on the 2 May, having got all the Tech's and 8 of the Nav's so far.

I spoke to FCL last week who confirmed that as long as you have a CAA CPL in place by June 2002 your ATPL exam passes will be credited against JAA ATPL's indefinately. Then once you have gained the 500 multi-crew hours you will be intitled to a JAA ATPL licence - once you have an IR in place

FCL are phasing out the old 'Non-approved IR' so unless you have 600 hrs now, you will be unable to start a non-approved IR course, leaving only the JAA modular route @ 55hrs or reduced to 43 with a current IMC.

June 2002 feels closer than 14.5 months away !!!!!!!!!

[This message has been edited by Letdown (edited 17 April 2001).]

[RVR800]

If youre a 'national' frozen ATPL person..

You need the IR passed by June 2002
for the national frozen priveledges
to remain valid past June 2002 for
use in a subsequent JAR ATPL upgrade
after 500 hrs multi crew etc

I have a letter to this effect

[Ja]

If you have got until July 2002 to achieve the requirements for the issue of a CAA ATPL then why have they decided to stop the CAA ATPL Navigation group of examinations after June this year? !!

(450 hours CAA CPL/IR)

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VNE or nothing

[Matt Black]

Same Boat.

Will FCL extend the date for the ATPL passes if we write enough letters to them I wonder?

[Ja]

Matt Black,

That is basically my point. If you read an AIC that says you have until July 2002 to fullfil the requirements to gain a national ATPL then it seems quite reasonable to assume you will be able to sit your last lot of ATPL exams in 2002. (and you happly go off somewhere else in the world for some hours building) I have seen nothing saying that people already 'in the system' should complete all ground examinations before chasing the magic 1500 hours. I know of people who have 'got in the system' a few years back (like me) and allowed the ATPL Navs to sit on the back burner while they spend their hard earned on things like, hour building, instructor rating, IR, GFT etc.

The mechanisms for acquiring the pre-requisites for the initial issue of the CAA ATPL should be available until the actual day that initial licence issue is withdrawn

There must be others out there who think the approach the CAA have adopted here is more than a little unfair??



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VNE or nothing

[james lully]

Letdown-When can you do the CAA Non-approve IR, 600hrs or 700Hrs?

[Captain Spud]

James Lully

I will need shortly to start a NON-Approved IR course. My information is from FAQ on the CAA/SRG web site. I obtained the information on 16/01/01 and as far as I know it is still there.

The FAQ is "Is there still any exepmtion from approved IR training?"

The answer given is "UK liecence holders may still be exepmted from approved IR training during the transitional period which ends 30 June 2002 (fixed wing) or December 2002 (choppers)(why the difference???)

The answer then goes on to say that to be classed as "experienced " you must comply with the experience requirements detailed in CAP 54 chapters 14 & 15.

CAP 54 Chapter 14 states that exemption from approved IR training will normally be given to (amongst others) "experienced pilots" the experince being detailed in chapter 4.

Chapter 4 then basically gives the following hours breakdown.

TT 700hrs
PIC 200hrs
50hrs Xcountry or over seas
300nm Route
10hrs night
40hrs instruments (your IMC hrs will count) 20hrs can be in a sim


Now thats what the book says.

Having spoken to people who havwe done it and got thier CPL/IR via the self improver route they say that they comenced thier non approved IR courses before they had the above experience.

The point is that the FAQ answer refers you to CAP 54 and CAP 54 and its requirements hasn't changed, consequently as far as I can tell the 700hr SELFIMPROVER ROUTE IS ALIVE AND WELL AND "AS YOU WERE" UNTIL JUNE 2002.

I would be please to hear of anybody elses interpretation whether the same or different to mine.

C.S.



[This message has been edited by Captain Spud (edited 20 April 2001).]

[Letdown]

James Lully/Captain Spud

My understanding from both flight schools and people I know who have completed a 'Non-approved' IR is that you can commence the training @ 600 hrs and use the training hours to count towards rating issue at 700hrs.

When I spoke to FCL they informed me that if you don't qualify for Non-approved exemption you can add a JAA IR to a National CPL licence at any stage - pre or post June 2002.