I flew Ryanair and survived

[Espada III]

I flew MAN - DUB - MAN yesterday.

First time on Ryanair.

Dislikes - garish colour scheme of the aircraft interior; complicated and garish website which is clearly designed to confuse the irregular or novice traveller.

Likes - can book luggage one way on a return journey (Jet2 please note); they get you to the gate and on board early so permitting a possible on-time if not early departure (Jet2 please note).

I appreciate that my usual route of MAN - TLV is completely different in terms of passenger profile, route length etc etc, but Jet2 hasn't left the stand on time on any flight since they started the route. Last night we took off from Dublin early and landed at least 30 mins ahead of schedule, which I understand can be a frequent occurrence.

Not convinced I would want to fly a long flight with Ryanair but didn't seem as bad as people suggest.

[Llademos]

A bit harsh, perhaps, Tableview? This forum is for SLF, some of whom have different views and priorities to yours. A comparison of a RYR flight to Jet2 included, and a point for debate as to whether RYR would be OK for a long flight makes this a reasonable post.

Ryanair long haul - don't see a problem myself, as long as I have a decent headset that cuts out all the noise and adverts. What I save on the flight I can spend on better hotels or restaurants.

Ll

[aergid]

I choose to fly FR (Ryanair) ...

Working at a FR hub and seeing the OTP and very low incident level, in my professional opinion FR are 1 of the best Airlines in Europe.

I have not had a bad flight with either FR or ZB (Monarch) but have had dreadful flights with unnamed National Carriers (my compnay handles them :oh:) and EZY (Easyjet).

PS in my profession I fly very frequently both long haul and short haul (although mostly Pan-European).

Although I must admit the Website for FR is full of traps eg Car Hire/Samsonite Suitcase/Travel Insurance pop-ups amonst others....:=

[PAXboy]

As you may know Espada III, the time of leaving the stand is totally irrelevant as the link between it and the take off slot time is not know to pax. The only time that counts is arrival time.

For that RYR, like almost every other carrier these days, ensures that the amount of time allowed in the schedule is so great as to allow most of the delays to be accomodated and STILL arrive on time.

That is not a criticism of RYR, they simply responded to market and govt forces. But don't be takien in by their PR!!

[Espada III]

As you may know Espada III, the time of leaving the stand is totally irrelevant as the link between it and the take off slot time is not know to pax. The only time that counts is arrival time.

Indeed. More importantly thought, it does show the benefits of getting all your passengers sat down well before push back time. Jet2 like other airlines have some slack in their timetable, but their punctuality record for MAN-TLV-MAN is pretty poor and they seem unable to make the simple changes required to improve it.

My experience is that it pushes back at least 30 minutes after the stated departure time, and struggles to land on time, with consequent delays at the turn around. This is partly related to the nature of some passengers who are novice flyers, speaking a foreign language, but simply getting people on board by 09:50 and not 10:10 will mean slots are not lost for a 10:00 push back.

[DaveReidUK]

As you may know Espada III, the time of leaving the stand is totally irrelevant

Depends on your point of view.

Out time is - by definition - the one that's used to determine whether a departure is classed as on time or late in the punctuality stats.

Time on stand (In) at the destination is the one that the pax judge the airline by.

[ExXB]

Regulation 261 where it refers to delays does so in relation to delays in departure, not delay in arrival.

See the EC said it, so it must be correct. They do know our business better than we do. :O

[easyflyer83]

My experience is that it pushes back at least 30 minutes after the stated departure time, and struggles to land on time, with consequent delays at the turn around. This is partly related to the nature of some passengers who are novice flyers, speaking a foreign language, but simply getting people on board by 09:50 and not 10:10 will mean slots are not lost for a 10:00 push back.

The TLV example has nothing to do with language barrier and I wouldn't say the pax profile are more 'novice' than your average flight elsewhere. I think you'd find that your average EK flight would have more infrequent travellers.

[DaveReidUK]

See the EC said it, so it must be correct. They do know our business better than we do.

If you believe that airline delay stats relate principally to arrivals then yes, the EU do know your business better than you do.

[PAXboy]

Irrespective of what the official stats are: Pax only consider the time they are supposed to land. Nothing else enters their brain!

[Espada III]

Not so. Many people get concerned that the aircraft has not moved away from the stand (or is still boarding) at the scheduled time for departure. Of course it is nice to arrive on time, but how much nicer it is to arrive a little earlier.

If you drive from say Manchester to London and anticipate a three hour drive arriving at 15:00, it is great to be able to leave a few minutes early and to arrive after only two and three quarter hours.

Same with air travel. I would love the aircraft to actually leave the stand on time, as it means my overall door to door travel time is reduced, irrespective of whether the plane actually lands on time. Why sit on an aircraft not going anywhere.

[Hotel Tango]

Why sit on an aircraft not going anywhere.

No worse than sitting, or in RYR's case, standing (ready for the frantic race to the a/c) at the gate. But I do agree that delayed departures are frustrating. I fly often with Brussels Airlines and have to say that with very few exceptions my flights with them have pushed back at or before the scheduled (blocks off) departure time.

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

I appreciate that my usual route of MAN - TLV is completely different in terms of passenger profile, route length etc etc, but Jet2 hasn't left the stand on time on any flight since they started the route.

How on earth can you know that:=, I know that you are wrong because I have left the stand on time on the TLV service:ok:. I know it leaves late often unfortunately, the route suffers from slots regularly:rolleyes:, and also suffers from passengers that just wont be rushed and are often late to the gate:ugh::ugh: despite the best efforts of all involved.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Leave 'em behind!

[Espada III]

I agree. But the ones who wont be rushed should be treated like Ryanair treats them. Worry them into getting to the gate on time.

I fly that route often (several times a year) and try my best to chivvy my family to the gate and to sit down quickly. But there is always a small minority who simply do not get it. Drives me mad and I for one wold throw them off the plane or leave them behind.

[lasernigel]

I fly that route often (several times a year) and try my best to chivvy my family to the gate and to sit down quickly. But there is always a small minority who simply do not get it. Drives me mad and I for one wold throw them off the plane or leave them behind.

Totally agree, would be interesting if some stats could be brought into play, on the number of late departures caused by late passenger arrivals and slot times lost.

It's the way they casually get onto the aircraft, then complain when all the overhead bins are full. They can't get their oversized suitcase in there!

Airports/airlines (as I don't know whose responsibility it is) share some blame as gates are only announced 20 mins before boarding. If the plane is at the stand why not put the gate number up???

[ExXB]

Those are UK airports, the rest of the civilised world knows better. They know long in advance but decline to tell you due to shopping. The fools

[Wirbelsturm]

TLV is an interesting one as they often impose inbound slots on arriving aircraft.

To deal with your 'why haven't we pushed yet' query, it is better to take up airborne holding time at the gate from the departure then to have to burn fuel over the eastern Med whilst waiting for you arrival slot into TLV.

Ironically RYR use a +/- 15 minutes punctuality scheme whilst most other airlines use +/- 3 minutes.

Just food for thought.

[Planemike]

Errrrrrrr...........TLV ????

Planemike

[fmgc]

EU261 is based on arrival time.

Airport kept stats are based on off blocks times.

PAX tend to think about boarding on time and arrival time IMHO.

We are not all playing on the same pitch and even if we did it wouldn't be even!

Oh and just because somebody hasn't had an accident, doesn't mean that they aren't going to.

[Shack37]

Oh and just because somebody hasn't had an accident, doesn't mean that they aren't going to.


Maybe we should base all stats on "what might happen" then, a kind of "science by crystal ball" approach.:rolleyes:

[DaveReidUK]

EU261 is based on arrival time.

The definition of delay in EU261 is based solely on departure time.

REGULATION (EC) No 261/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL

Article 6

Delay

1. When an operating air carrier reasonably expects a flight to be delayed beyond its scheduled time of departure

[PAXboy]

Whatever system is put in place there will be different views of the SAME date from:


Regulator
CEO
Chief Operations
Crew
Pax
Not to mention the kids in marketing :}

Planemike the IATA code TLV = Tel Aviv