CL44 Association & Guppy restoration

[Varipitch]

The CL44 Association is to hold its reunion at the RAF Club London on the 7th and 8th June 2013.
Non members are welcome to apply.
All-to-obvious is the restoration work being carried out not only on the Conroy Guppy (S/N16) at Hurn but also on the Airbus Guppy at Bruntingthorpe.
Given the hundreds of reasons we can think of why the 44 Guppy cannot fly again, the learn-ed members seem to think that both aircraft are being made ready for a tv or film on the type.
Can anyone expand on that theory.

[A30yoyo]

Any chance of reviving the 'Skymonster' name for the Conroy CL-44-O and saving 'Guppy' for the Strat conversion?

[Varipitch]

The Association is in constant touch with Jack Conroy's family in California.Of course, it was Diana Dors who christened her on behalf of dear old Mike Keegan.

[GAZIN]

During the time that I was associated with it in the UK, I didn't ever hear anyone involved with the operation of the CL44-O refer to it as the Skymonster . It was always, sometimes even affectionately!, referred to as 'the guppy'.
Attractive? No. A great propliner? Certainly.

[Varipitch]

Next newsletter carries living proof that work continues on the Guppy to this day.
Tail is swung-still no #1 engine hung though.

[Varipitch]

The Guppy WAS indeed christened Skymonster-written for all to see. We have a photo with Dave Priest plus the one featuring Diana Dors. (There is a website also).

[ErwinS]

Saw the Guppy last week. Is there still any work going on to get her complete/airworthy?

[Newforest2]

Spotter hat on, what new reg? :confused:

[Varipitch]

The CL44 Association comprises of over 150 forty four members drawn from as long ago as Tigers,Slick, RCAF thru Transglobe, Tradewinds, TMAC to Transvalair, Affretair, UAA, Redcoat, and the many American operators.
The Presidents are former Captains from Wrangler and TMAC whilst the Chairman saw a 'bit of service' with Jack Malloch in Rhodesia, UAA in TIP and more recently, with Johnsons Air on the Guppy.
In fact, when the old girl was finally withdrawn to BOH all those years ago, the final owner, sold the aircraft to the Chairman only for the Australian 'gentleman' to come along to declare his intention to return the aircraft to the skies.
Many years have passed since this statement was made and despite the work now being made (both on the aircraft and with various 'bits' of paperwork in the USA, the Chairman and the Association prefers to steer well clear of conjecture, instead noting that when, all those years ago, the centre tank was removed, a major amount of corrosion was very, very evident.
The Grounding Orders, continue to be active whilst the many questions regarding the availability of legitimate parts, together with the identity of crew members is also a matter of discussion.
Commercially, does a market exist for the Guppy or has her day gone?
This Association has written many times to the alleged owner in Australia but to no avail.
The CL44 Association has recently held its reunion in London during which the subject of the Guppy was discussed at length-we, like most others, await the outcome of the current work. In the meantime, should any reader wish to speak with the Chairman, do please note that he can now be found at Brooklands most weekends.

[4 Holer]

I was in the FAA office in Miami and a manager who was a CL44 Captain stumbled onto the subject we were initially talking about my recent 777 type rating. He said the CL44 was going nowhere Anne the FAA have it pending as there is no record of it being Philippine registered and the Ghana documents do not add up. it was being registered to a Harlan guy down in Lady Lakes but the Feds say it's a front, this same Harlan guy was stopped moving a DC3 N65388 out in Australia with no paperwork.

He mentioned the Feds have photos of the people working on it last week and know all t the old engines being installed, props and components run out, corrosion etc.

He laughed said it was very clear in the FAA regs the flight engineer of any aircraft US registered private or otherwise HAS to be current on type ( not so the pilot ) so how they going to do that and there is no FAA or rep involved in this aircraft for maintenance ferry or operations.

I guess the association will in fact end up with her this time complete ?? :ok:

P.S. It was said the UK CAA Gatwick have two orders grounding in place and are working with the Feds

[Varipitch]

Agree with all the points you make-in fact all of the paperwork is on my desk at this minute being acquired shortly before our reunion.
Our 'man on the spot' has taken many photos this past few days and 'yes' we do know the guys who are working on the aircraft.
Of course, several puzzling factors do exist. Firstly-who is paying them?
Secondly, although most of the Association members are engineers, I question the value of the Guppy from a commercial point of view given the Russian equipment now operating.
Thirdly, who WILL train anyone on type? My two Presidents certainly would NOT.
Let us suppose the aircraft does depart BOH !! To what destination and to what Alternate?
We are keeping a daily eye on activity and our next Newsletter will contain photos. It costs only $20 a year to join us and maybe we can initiate some private emails.
I recall clearly that when we were given the a/c by Farhad, the engine in the hold-and well out of hours was given to the New Forest Museum-wonder if they want any more?
Lastly, we have all the Manuals here-they make damn fine chocks !

[Varipitch]

At least, all of the work being done at BOH gives us something to fill the Newsletter with.
Could also write a book (a comedy maybe?) on the Oz who allegedly 'fronts' this operation.
Our USA PR President has written to the individual named on the Bill of Sale in Lady Lake Florida, but so far-no reply.

[spotting]

I must admit that it is quite sad that two individuals here - rrtyne, calling himself chairman of the CL44 association ? and 4holer, are just posting negative and unverified rumours about this unique Canadair CL-44 Guppy currently worked on in Bournemouth. Their motives are highly questionable and personally driven I guess, but this is clearly not what Pprune is made for. And, I guess you are unaware that, in the UK spying on and photographing people unaware is a civil crime, hope they never get their hands on those images.

I guess we all should be very supportive and welcome this new efforts instead of trying to jeopardise this initiative. I hope these gentlemen refrain form further defamation and wait where this all leads. I hope you all agree.

[Shannon volmet]

OOooooooooooooh! Handbags at dawn!

You are new here, aren't you?!

Hang on while I pull up a chair and grab some popcorn:E

[Agaricus bisporus]

Spotting, I suppose you know that there is no such thing in UK as a "civil crime"? Or perhaps you don't...
Either it is either a civil offence or a crime, one or the other.

Also, being a free country there is NO law preventing "photographing people unaware" or virtually every photograph ever taken would be illegal, wouldn't it?

You're not really up on the most basic legal aspects, are you?

Gonna have to do a whole lot better than that for your second post!

[Heavy Cargo]

Aircraft Stripped in 2008 for scrap, all hard time components, engines and props time expired. Structural wing to body casting cracks, spar corrosion in tank 3 and 6, all ADs due, wheels are slave units, no STC for TAWS nor GPS and TCAS not installed.
The airframe has no manufacturer to support it and the CAA have cancelled the RR Tyne type certificate for commercial ( non military ) operators.

No crews etc

The FAA will not have it and the UKCAA have it grounded its not going anywhere, if those who are working on and playing with themselves are happy whatever ???

FAA sent the correct ACTUAL AIRFRAME owner paperwork to review such as a deregistration from Ghana from 1999 yet it was flying 9G till 2003, the false buyer ( Harland ) has signed the sellers bill sale dated 1999 and the name of seller's company with spelling incorrect ?? This Harlan guy signed the bill of sale dated 1999 and ALSO the application to register in his name same signature dated 2013 ( brain surgeon ). This was all done at the direction of a G Leach, but he being a weasel was smart enough to throw the dumb ones under the bus. He won't get stung working on the CL44 that's why the FAA are chasing his robot Alan Rash for his A&P, they are also chasing his front man Harlan for the false application to registry as he is using Harlan as the US citizen component to get around US TSA and FAA ownership requirements := ?? If you put in false documents to the FAA its a Federal offence ? If you work on a US registered aircraft without proper documentation current manuals and approved parts you are going to loose your A&P mechanics license.:D

This is all public record on the FAA website and registry. Its post 9/11 no stealing old airframes and installing dodgy parts .

Just scrap it or give to a museum before the pensioners all end up in jail. :{

[1970s Spotter]

Nicely summarised Heavy Cargo.

[Varipitch]

Recent visitors to Bournemouth and the subsequent issuing of further CAA documentation upon the owners representatives, clearly demonstrate that the aircraft is going nowhere!
The further taking of photographs at Hurn will, no doubt result, in the Tarring and Feathering of the Photographer. Given a liberal coating of those feathers, he stands a much better chance of flying than N447FT.

[4 Holer]

RR,

Had a beer and heard Feds here had ground order issued to the aircraft by UK.Said they continue working on plane and put a fence around to stop "photos" they think pretty funny,4th engine and prop on but they said Fed court here are transferring theCL44 back to Actual owner if registered and when registered by FAA.
Seems they have a big mess your 3 buddy's are working on it.

4holer

[Varipitch]

The progress (?)involving the Guppy at Bournemouth did indeed culminate last week when the CAA issued a further Grounding Order. Whilst we are well aware who was present when this Order was issued, it would be interesting to discover if the new owner in Florida has been made aware of this 'setback'
It is also relevant to clarify here that the aircraft has NOT been re-registered as N447FT-it has simply been ALLOCATED that identity. But lets not get carried away! We could ask hundreds of questions at this point, most of which readers already know the answer to.
In the meantime, Press and Individual Photographers continue to visit the site and take some wonderful photographs-indeed, several colour shots (I am told) will appear in the August edition of the Swingtail Newsletter.
We can reveal that all of the TMAC Spares Manuals (many TMAC guys will recall the size of 'em) are in the possession of an officer of the Association. They make great chocks for doors.

[J31 MAN]

Some very recent pics here (not mine)

Work starts on the CL-44 Guppy - Page 3 (http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?102240-Work-starts-on-the-CL-44-Guppy/page3)

[ErwinS]

'CL-44 engine test bournemouth airport 31-07-2013' bekijken op YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=433xERjcSqo&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[Mister.E]

So were all the engines run or just number 2?
After reading the thread on Key Publishing it is hard to see it leaving under its own power but you never know.

[yorky66]

Whatever the final outcome is you have to admire this unique aircraft..and for the record here are 1 or 2 shots taken yesterday.
The port side is now stripped bare, starboard side just the tail area to do and it was actually out engine running on the old runway...one at a time as far as I know.

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/yorky22/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3118_zps1159c1a7.jpg (http://s795.photobucket.com/user/yorky22/media/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3118_zps1159c1a7.jpg.html)

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/yorky22/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3107_zpsd859fd80.jpg (http://s795.photobucket.com/user/yorky22/media/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3107_zpsd859fd80.jpg.html)

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/yorky22/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3096_zps11dd3c93.jpg (http://s795.photobucket.com/user/yorky22/media/1st%20Feb%20Lotus%20day/Aug%209th%202013/IMG_3096_zps11dd3c93.jpg.html)

..Good luck guys...you deserve it..........

[Rev1.5]

The port side is now stripped bare

Stripped or just given a liberal coat of paint?:eek:

[yorky66]

Appears to be a combination of the two....mainly bare metal.

[Compass Call]

The latest rumour from the tanker drivers at Hurn is that it is going on a one way flight to Germany in the near future:ok:

[ErwinS]

New rumour is that she wil be flown to Texas..... Any thruth in that?

[SpringHeeledJack]

Making the assumption that she would be used commercially, perhaps in the oil support sector, just how long would this venerable old plane be useful for ? That is assuming that all the alleged paperwork issues could be ironed out :rolleyes:



SHJ

[Nineiron]

I've grown fond of that fat old lady. We go back years.

[N707ZS]

Hopefully its going to a museum or we could be back to a Teesside ground-hog day.

[Mister.E]

Really what are the chances of it leaving with a UK CAA grounding order and a FAA condition notice issued against it. Rumour is they have been looking towards Africa for a registration and AOC.

[YODI]

Really like this Aircraft, I've been up to and around it and got a few photos from before the strip down. I see it everyday and see how much attention it draws, always someone snapping pics through the fence

[oftenflylo]

Probably the residents of Parley Cross taking pictures for their house insurance claims!

[Porrohman]

Is there much commonality between the RR Tyne in the CL-44-0 Guppy and those used in the C160 Transall? With lots of Transalls being withdrawn from service and replaced by A400M Atlas, perhaps the availability of spare parts for Tynes will be improved? If engine spares become plentiful, would this make restoring the wings, sorting the paperwork issues and operating the Guppy a more commercially viable proposition? Or is the lack of paperwork / design authority support an insurmountable problem?

I notice that the US register has the aircraft as a CL-44D4 rather than a CL-44-0. Is this an error or is the Guppy still considered to be a CL-44D4 for regulatory purposes?

[Porrohman]

Is there any more news / rumours about the Guppy?

[YODI]

Hasn't moved an inch as of a few days ago

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/rsyodi/Aircraft/20140107_134226_zpshwnvtun9.jpg

[J31 MAN]

Any updates on this please?

[Varipitch]

The CL44 Association kept a close(ish) eye on any activity around the a/c at BOH. Several of our members who were employed by Jack Conroy during the conversion, had been asked by the current owner if they could locate any of the manuals, diagrams and drawings, made or used during the Guppy's birth. It has been reported that when Bombardier was approached
with regard to any of the documents that might have been handed over by Canadair, it was made clear that none WERE tracked down.
Then of course, Rolls Royce withdrew all responsibility for the Tyne and indeed, when the a/c was last used commercially, the RR emblems were removed from the engine cowlings.
Turning to the corrosion problem, it was very evident that when the a/c had
been towed into the hangar at MME and the centre tank removed, the extent of the corrosion was very extension. At BOH, the ground engineer had no problem in writing up the a/c as grounded with the owner, Mr Farhad Azima at ALG. Hence its sale to the Association before the saga of its ultimate disposal to Geoffrey Leach and later Harlan Jordan
But that's another story........

[StallsandSpins]

what ever happened to Geoff and Nick Leach? we knew them many years ago

[norwich]

Quick question .... Is this aircraft standing outside at the moment 06.08.2015 ? and photographable ? as I will be in the area next week and would like to add a few photos if possible ??? Thanks


Keith.

[arthur harbrow]

It was outside two weeks ago and photos could be taken through the fence.

[norwich]

Thank you 'arthur harbrow' ... I should be there on Tuesday armed with camera and steps ..... will post result on here if good enough ??


Keith

[norwich]

Well I made a visit to Bournemouth to get the photo I have wanted for a long time ! Thanks for your help .....


Keith.


http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii58/keithnewsome/Fab%20Boh%20Ltn/2ca0b653-bf64-4012-8f9f-8730b1cae8c5.jpg

[arthur harbrow]

Glad you made the journey, nice photo.
Anyone with stories, anecdotes on this plane?

[SWBKCB]

Being worked on at BOH today

https://www.flickr.com/photos/leeweston/32365392165/in/photostream/lightbox/

[GAZIN]

Never mind the engines, what about the corroded structure!?

[Porrohman]

Never mind the engines, what about the corroded structure!?

It's looking clean again in this photo;
Bournemouth to Kemble Feb 2017 (http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=76265)