View Full Version : EMB 170 grounded ?

10th Apr 2002, 21:36

Can anyone confirm that the EMB170 prototype performing the flighttests is grounded due to cracks between wing centerbox and wing ?


11th Apr 2002, 14:12
If true - logical but very sad to hear as it will cause problems and probably not be that easy to fix.

No trace on my sources however - pls. quote your source(s) to help research.


11th Apr 2002, 19:00
Actually the second prototype just flew today...you can see the pictures of him flying in formation with the first prototype by clicking Here (http://www.bol.com.br/folha/noticias/economia/2002/04/10/0053.html), ...news in Portuguese, but I think the pictures say enough. ;)

Tom the Tenor
11th Apr 2002, 21:01
Well done AeroBoero for your timely update on the second flight of the EMB-170. Seeing the photo of the two aeroplanes flying goes a long way to suggest all is okay with Embraer and their fine new product!

12th Apr 2002, 08:18
flat denial from Embraer fyi

12th Apr 2002, 13:35
You'd think that they must have known !!!!

Looks nice in Crossair garb. Who knows perhaps they won't repaint it - just give it as is to Moritz for his new line - he can have the masses of leftover stationary and all the good quality cutlary and crockery. (Much better class than the new Swiss stuff - but that is what you get when you let designers lose - less and worse for more is what you then have to try and sell as better and having moved up market - me skeptical no way - just dissapointed in André and generally in total avoidance mode)

http://www.bol.com.br/folha/noticias/economia/2002/04/10/0053.html (Flight Pics ) :eek: :eek:

12th Apr 2002, 14:21
I think they had the CRX paint on from day one when the prototype was assembled, so well before SR collapsed and things became different in the cheese and bank account land :D .
And why would they change from such nice paintjob (and that's it for what I am concerned) to the boring - sorry guys - SWISS paint job?
The late CRX is/was (who knows what the future holds?) the launch customer for the new Embraer family after all.

TTT - It was pure luck!;) :D

12th Apr 2002, 15:07
Agree that its much more of a professional product than that red cheese new thing will look like- and hats off to Moritz for being willing to take the risks.

But AB, on thinking back, was it really painted before mid October 2001 ! Seems a bit tall. Because since then we've known that its going to be something new and not the Crossair garb.

Anyway, you've convinced me AB - as a tribute to MS - just great - now lets get it certified, homogonised, vulcanised and what ever else it needs and then get it out on the line.:cool: :cool: :cool:

And NO more scares like that guys - I know that its a rumours mill, but we have so much real bad news we need to look for it

12th Apr 2002, 15:28
The second Embaer 170 was already painted in full Crossair colors at the time of the roll-out of the first Embraer 170, on October 29 (I saw it).
Note that the new Swiss name and colors were not announced until the end of January.

12th Apr 2002, 15:30

Few Cloudy
12th Apr 2002, 15:36
Moritz hasn't got anything to do with it anymore - officially.

12th Apr 2002, 15:48
tom the tenor.
" ...a fine product..". You obviously do not fly the ERJ 145.

12th Apr 2002, 16:04
Of course not "officially" silly - he's non-grata in some books.

But seeing him and hearing of his jetting around - and knowing some of his answers to questions - and reading between the lines...........

I can only conjecture what he's up to - but watch this space - its got $'s written all over it.;) ;)


Moritz if your new venture(s) needs some share capital, some PPRuNers might chip in - give us a try ............

brain fade
12th Apr 2002, 22:02
Mialo, you cheeky sod!
There's nowt wrong with the 145. I won't have Barbies name taken in vain!:)

Tom the Tenor
13th Apr 2002, 01:05
Yes, Mialo, tell us more - we are all ears? I mean it too - there are 3 daily ERJ-145 flights from Manchester to Cork everyday so if there is anything to say let us all know. Thank you, TTT.

Ignition Override
13th Apr 2002, 04:05
How many seats will the initial Embraer series have? With scope clauses in so many US airline contracts, will the plane be built with 69 seats or less (for example), or will it be marketed mostly to other countries?

It is interesting how some US airlines are ordering the Canadian CRJ with 44 seats (versus 50), but as to whether they can make money with these, the results might be very confidential for a while. Maybe Embraer will subsidize the operating cost in order to compete here, as the Avro company did, in order to market the RJ-70 in the US.

13th Apr 2002, 06:42
The specs can be found at:
http://www.embraer.com/english/ (Embraer)

Seem to recollect from previous blurb that the sizes were:

170 = 70 Pax
175 = 78 Pax
190 = 95 Pax
195 = 108 Pax

and that the numbers included enough Galley for European operations (the major weakness of the 145 !!).

Perhaps AB has some better pointers ?:)

13th Apr 2002, 20:48

as a regular pax in ERJ-145 flights, I'd be quite interested in hearing your points as well. Anything we should know about this aircraft?


13th Apr 2002, 22:08

No, I haven't better pointers. On a personal opinion (to be corrected if anyone knows better/for sure) I can't see it aimed at the US market. It is offered to airlines as an option under the 100 seat capacity. EU airlines and affiliates (e.g. KLM cityhopper/UK) seems like potential clients as did CRX - that already used aircraft's bigger than the normal RJ family (145/40/35 - CRJ). And with recent developments at Fairchild-Dornier the future seems a bit cloudy with respect to concurrency in this sector.

Embraer is even considering to install a plant in China to gain more market in that region.

16th Apr 2002, 12:34
Embraer (http://www.embraer.com/english/)

or for those of you who are too lazy :o :

São José dos Campos - Embraer today announced that the second EMBRAER 170 prototype, register PP-XJC, successfully made its maiden flight yesterday. Take-off from São José dos Campos airport was at 1:07 pm (16:07 hours UTC/GMT) and the time aloft was three hours and thirty five minutes.
With test flight pilots Luiz Carlos Rodrigues and Otávio Vaz Kovacs, and flight engineer Luiz Vieira Algodoal at the flight deck, the jet perfectly performed trimming and compensation evaluations on the three axis with several flap and landing gear configurations, three APU and two engine re-starts, and complete landing gear and flaps cycling.

Pilot Luiz Carlos Rodrigues confirmed the already-known, positive impressions after 40 flight hours on the first prototype:

“As it has occurred in the first flight of the S/N 0001, the second EMBRAER 170 showed perfect performance and behavior, which confirms the excellence of Embraer design and manufacturing teams”.

The maiden flight of the second EMBRAER 170, just 49 days after that of the first prototype, reaffirms the strength and consistency of Embraer’s actions in developing the new EMBRAER 170/190 family. Until the end of the first semester, nothing less than six prototypes will be in operation as part of the EMBRAER 170 certification program.

Officially launched in June of 1999, the first flight of the 70-passenger EMBRAER 170 was accomplished just 31 months later, in February of 2002. The other models of this family are the EMBRAER 175, 190 and 195, for 78, 98 and 108 passengers, respectively.

The first delivery of the EMBRAER 170 will be to Switzerland’s SWISS, formerly Crossair. The EMBRAER 170/190 family registers 112 firm orders and 212 options.

Somebody has just ordered another 30 - coz the official site with the firm orders still quotess 82 and not 112 !!!:cool: :cool: :cool: